-
Posts
1895 -
Joined
-
To remove the disincentive that unachievable rewards can be to newcomers.
-
[ QUOTE ]
In my workplace, there are people who started here a lot earlier than I, who will eventually get a 30 year retirement package. I will never get that much, I worked a few other places.
[/ QUOTE ]
You could work 30 years, and get the 30-year retirement package. If the company has a required retirement age, that's an entirely different issue.
It's not like the company will have a 60-year retirement package after you've put in your 30 years that you still don't qualify for. Your analogy isn't really analogous.
[ QUOTE ]
Go to work for a company and ask for a 20 year pension on your first day. Go into the military service and ask for an honorable discharge on your first day.
[/ QUOTE ]
This isn't even close to what I'm asking for. What I'm asking for is for either the goal posts to stop moving, or for a mechanism to compensate for the head start if they won't. -
If your problem is "impatient players", how about they just stop adding new Veteran's Reward after the 72-month mark (or some other, near-future cap)? Then newcomers and returning players can eventually earn all the rewards, after staying subscribed for a period of time. That alternative appeals to me as well.
Your alternative does not, because the issue is not wanting a reward sooner, but wanting all of them eventually. So long as new rewards are added, the current system will never allow that. -
[ QUOTE ]
Your enthusiasm aside, the proposed system faults on the following points:
1. The proposal offers a weighted bias on "newcomer" players vs veteran players, insamuch that it negates the concept of "veteran" player and replaces it with "economically-well-endowed" player.
[/ QUOTE ]
The "economically-well-endowed" player still needs to subscribe for long periods to garner any rewards. To get three years of reward, they will still have put in two years of time.
[ QUOTE ]
2. The proposal also has no effective way of determining who's a newcomer, and who's an oldbie who unsubscribed for a period of time and is rejoining. That's a lot of account work for the Devs to do to figure out who should get what benefit.
[/ QUOTE ]
Why differentiate? Returning or new, the benefit to NCSoft, the game population, and the community are the same.
[ QUOTE ]
3. There's no real explanation as to why offering "accelerated" benefits to lesser-subscribed players is an actual benefit to the gaming populace.
In short: It's decidedly one-sided in approach, because it focuses on benefiting the "new" player while disregarding the veteran player, which is exactly what "veteran rewards" is designed to reward, impartially and wide-field, in the first place.
[/ QUOTE ]
The entire system already benefits the veteran player. Does the fact that some other players might, in three years, enjoy the same benefits you enjoy right now, while you continue to get three more years of benefits, really bother you that much? -
[ QUOTE ]
It is far cheaper to retain a customer than to win a new one or to bring back a lapsed customer. That's basic marketing.
[/ QUOTE ]
In some businesses. I'm not sure it applies to this one, because the things done to retain customers are pretty much the exact same things done to attract new customers and returning customers - new updates, new content, new options. The continuing issues serve dual role at retaining and attracting customers.
The Veteran's Rewards can serve the same purpose.
[ QUOTE ]
For those worried that they can never "catch up" to the older vets, they should hope that's the case. Because holding on to the older vets helps ensure the game continues for the newer players.
[/ QUOTE ]
A MMO, like a country, needs both to retain as much of its current population as possible while also attracting as many newcomers as possible. A MMO, unlike a country, cannot count on the birth of new customers to retain its numbers.
Attracting new customers - and at the very least not driving them away - is more important than retaining existing customers.
[ QUOTE ]
Also, some new players may be more likely to go to soon-to-be released Cox competitors. [...] [S]ome vet players may drift away from CoX for those online competitors ... so its not a given that they will be around forever so that newer players can never catch up.
[/ QUOTE ]
Unless every Veteran player leaves, creating Veteran Rewards for which there are no recipients, newcomers will not "catch up".
I'll also point out that your statement here: "Newcomers will leave, and veterans will leave" pretty much puts both groups in the same boat, making retaining either one equally important.
[ QUOTE ]
You MUST reward those who stick with you. As a company, they are your bread and butter.
[/ QUOTE ]
And I'm not saying they shouldn't. I'm saying they shouldn't do so in such a way that disincentises new players.
TL;DR section -
A suggestion: morph the Veteran's Rewards so that they reward both newcomers and veteran players. Continue adding new rewards every three months so that the long-standing players continue to reap benefits for their continued subscription. But instead of leaving the system as it is, thus ensuring that newcomers will have benefits and options forever denied them, implement some kind of dedication reward for those that joined later and stuck with the game.
After a year's subscription, or with a year's subscription, or some similar mechanism that demonstrates a newcomer's dedication to the game, offer double Veteran's Reward credit; thus if you pay for a year's subscription, over that year you will accumulate two years of Veteran's Rewards. Of course, this will cap out once you've "caught up" with the existing veterans. This will allow dedicated newcomers to eventually earn the same benefits as long-standing players, while allowing the incentives to continue accruing for the existing veterans.
Surely the number of veterans who find this scheme wholly unfair and untenable will be small enough to be absorbed by the newcomers and returning customers it will attract. -
Two highly successful raids were run this weekend, dropping large numbers of Rikti dropships. I think you've overestimated the allure of AE, Smurch.
Aaaaaand, Ara beat me to it. Good job organising those, BTW Ara. Wish I could've joined. -
I'm paid up for the next year. I have my subscription set to auto-renew. I'm more than willing to wait and pay for the next four years to hit the five-year rewards.
I'm annoyed that, by the time I do, there will be nine-year rewards that I still won't have.
Because I didn't subscribe to the game from the day it launched, I will never have all the veteran rewards, no longer how long I play. I will never be able to "show the dedication and earn them" enough, because there will always be four years of rewards that I will not have.
Why is this so hard to understand? Anyone joining the game right now will have five years of rewards they will never have. Someone joining a year from now will have six years of rewards they will never have. The longer the Veteran's Rewards program continues adding new rewards, the more rewards will be forever out of the reach of new players.
A game cannot continue on the back only of continuing players. Without new players, the game will inevitably stagnate and die. The longer the Veteran's Rewards program adds options and perks that new players will never gain, the greater a disincentive it will become for new players.
Imagine the game continues for another five years as it is now, and a new player comes along thinking they might want to play. Can you imagine how learning that there are forty items - costumes, powers, base options, pets, everything that makes the game great - they will never receive simply because they hadn't heard about the game ten years ago (or are too young to have ever possibly played the game ten years ago) might be discouraging, enough that they might decide to try a different game instead? -
In what way are the continued rewards fair to dedicated newcomers?
-
[ QUOTE ]
You know, being #1/Best/First/Most/Uberest/The Alpha is really not necessary for EVERYONE. You CAN have them all. You just may not be able to have them all at the same time some other people do.
[/ QUOTE ]
If they never stop adding new rewards, I cannot have them all. This is a simple fact. It shouldn't be hard to grasp. -
[ QUOTE ]
The real purpose of VRs is to entice players to keep paying and playing.
Every player knows that in less than 3 months, there is another little perk waiting for them, if they stay.
[/ QUOTE ]
Actually, the fact that I will never get all the Veterans Rewards, that there will always be another reward out there that I'll want and will never get to makes the Veteran's Rewards completely ineffective as incentive. "Collect them all!" is a pretty enticing idea, but when collecting them all becomes impossible, it loses its appeal.
As such, the idea of losing Veteran Rewards has absolutely zero effect whatsoever on my choice to stay subscribed. I play the game because I have fun with it and enjoy my VG, not because I have another Veteran Reward coming around the corner.
They might entice five-year veterans, but at this point, the already four+ years of rewards that I won't have for X amount of time has completely removed any ability for the system to entice me at all. Now, I am simply annoyed that, in a game whose primary strength over its competitors is the creativity and customisation of its character creation (and base editor), there are options that, for completely arbitrary reasons, I cannot use for another year or more. -
[ QUOTE ]
A) buy the Valk pack and wait like the rest of us did to get the angel wings. there is NO costume that will be completely ruined if you have to use valk wings instead of angel wings. Big feathered wings are big feathered wings whether armored or not.
[/ QUOTE ]
You completely failed to address bat wings, while bringing up all the points I already mentioned.
[ QUOTE ]
B)the base parts are so much less than a big deal beacause all you need to do is have another SG mate put in a weapons displayproblem solved
[/ QUOTE ]
And if I am in a solo SG, or have no veterans in my SG?
[ QUOTE ]
C) the 60 month isn't an extra power slot it's early access to a power. Again no big deal
[/ QUOTE ]
The ability to pick Fly without having to pick Hover is an extra power slot. Whether you feel the defence bonus of Hover or the attack power of Air Superiority is worth having isn't the issue; that they are no longer required means you are getting a free power, which would allow you to decide between, say, Hover and Conserve Energy.
[ QUOTE ]
i have several friends who were behind me in vet rewards who saw my Nem Staff the 1st time i pulled it out and they were like "OMG I CAN'T WAIT until I hit 33 months!!" so the arguement that the VR disheartens other players is crap!
[/ QUOTE ]
"I can't wait" means, literally, "I am incapable of waiting long enough".
[ QUOTE ]
Bottom line is that you WILL eventually get these rewards when you EARN them... like the rest of us have
[/ QUOTE ]
Did you earn them with time, or with money? Is your time worth more than $15 a month? Is it worth more to NCSoft?
Continually advancing benchmarks create systems where it is impossible to catch up, and thus impossible to "eventually" get anything, because by the time to get to the old benchmark, there's a new one and thus more things you cannot have and must "eventually earn", and so on in a never ending cycle.
By the time I "eventually" get the 60-month rewards, there will be 108-month rewards out there that I must still wait for and "eventually" earn, and "eventually" will never come.
I'm not asking to get them for free. I'm asking that, after five years, there be some system other than mere simple subscription to gain access to them. -
[ QUOTE ]
They're just something nifty to have. A minor reward, nothing that will give you a massive advantage over those folks that haven't been around as long. They're never supposed to be a big deal.
[/ QUOTE ]
The 15-month award wings, while just a costume piece, are pretty vital for some character concepts from an aesthetic point of view. And while the Valkyrie wings compensate a bit for the angel wings, the dragon wings aren't really bat wings.
Another reward that is huge, aesthetically speaking, are the base parts, especially the weapon displays. As a base-builder, not having access to those is a big deal to me.
The way things look does matter to some people (like me), and having so many options locked away for such a long time is intensely frustrating.
And the 60-month reward, early travel powers? That's not just a minor reward. That's a big deal. That's a free power slot. -
[ QUOTE ]
So...what would be the point of having them in the first place? If everyone has them, it's not a special reward.
There's *plenty* in the first year that's good. I don't think that veteran rewards that aren't *that* significant are going to be what causes people to leave.
[/ QUOTE ]
I still have to wait another week to get angel wings. I've been playing over a year and I still can't even make a character with basic feathered wings yet.
I stopped playing three years back (as the reg date of my account will verify) before there were veteran rewards, so I didn't even have a chance to know that I'd get something for staying subscribed.
If I pay $10-15 extra dollars a month, why shouldn't I get double credit for veteran rewards? Or just a flat $15 a month to "catch up"?
What exactly is so threatening about allowing people that haven't been playing for five years some way to compensate NCSoft to receive the same benefit as those that have? -
Veteran Rewards for your long-time customers are nice and all, but sometimes seeing the rewards is pretty disheartening for your newer customers, especially those that are returning customers who unsubscribed before there were veteran rewards.
I have no idea how it would work, but it sure would be nice to have some mechanism to allow newer customers to "catch up". -
The new character creation is only character creation, Xad. You can't switch your 50 from Inv/SS to WP/Axe or anything like that.
-
-
[ QUOTE ]
Now im wondering with the color customization, is that per set or per power?
[/ QUOTE ]
According to the write-up, it's per power. -
I never once thought their power customisation would be per power. That is seriously awesome. It might even make up for AE being an issue short.
I'm bummed that they still refuse to push Illusion Redside, though. Illusion is a total Villain power! I suppose they're just expecting us to take our Ill Trollers red when GR comes out. -
[ QUOTE ]
I've recently been approached and been talking with a VG named the Supreme Society, anyone know anything good or bad aboot them? o.o They wanted have us be the good guys and them be the bad guys. Seems like a nice set of folks ^_^
[/ QUOTE ]
It's all a ruse. We're really right bastards. Seriously. Can't trust the lot of us. Everything we say is a lie.
-
[ QUOTE ]
Maybe I can actually play some tonight. >_> If I do, come play with me! I'm sick and tired of playing with boring people who have no idea how to play!
[/ QUOTE ]
Hey, you could've come to the meeting last night and yelled at everyone, but you didn't. We know how to play. It's your own fault you didn't come play with us. -
Eiko was on a rampage, but today's rampage was specialised. Paragon City never liked seeing her Bots shut down a street - it usually meant trouble, often with several deaths and several dozen bank accounts drained. But today was no simple theft; she was on a mission.
Eiko was robbing newstands, taking all their fashion magazines. While not the oddest crime Paragon City had ever experienced, it was up there.
Back in Aeon City, Eiko spread the magazines over her floor, cutting pages here, splicing images there. She was going to have a fashion contest, because only the best dressed villain could pull off a cape. -
*waddles in with her walker and, for some reason, a cane, which she starts shaking*
In my day, slavers were run by a bald badass named Metzger, not some wannabe pimp, and they didn't kidnap children. And if those little bastards threw rocks at you, you could shoot them!
And we liked it!