Dahjee
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Posts
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Joined
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Quote:I wouldn't and didn't say that Mac. I'd say that in an open zone where almost every power is available... that there are temp powers out there that can provide an edge and that many or most skillful PvPers out there usually try to be as sharp as possible, ya dig?Originally Posted by macskull
Ah, so now skill is determined by how many temp powers you use?
My elec/elec brute grinds for a whole 4 min sometimes to get power shield to increase resist by like 3 or 4 more percent. Four whole minutes I know, but nothing I can't manage on my way from the market to RV. Oh and it actually has key binded to use the temp Elec Attack (forget the name) whenever it has it stocked to assist with it's sapping nature. Sure it works without it... but these just kinda fill in some gaps and are easily attaned by me.
and seriously... Flash Arrow> Smoke Bomb> Smoke Bomb... Freaks people out. Good stuff really.
Keep talking arena to me... I think I'm gonna LOL.Quote:Originally Posted by macskull
(Sidenote: I remember fighting a Grav/Therm that pulled a Shivan and Warwolf on me in an arena match and still died in less than 30 seconds lolz) -
Quote:My Yugo kilt a regen once.Originally Posted by macskull
One does not need to own a Yugo to know that a Yugo is a terrible car.
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I like taking the time to think. I'm not clueless. I understand how an Emp can affect K/D ratio so there is hope for me yet. I have hope for you as well.
The point was that a good Emp will have a low K/D ratio personally... due to it's purpose Conflict. I like how viability got twisted into a matter of affecting K/D ratio now... we're making progress.
If you could now somehow seperate the K from the D. You might actually admit that viability in a zone is a matter of either raising the K ratio or lowering the D ratio, and not always a matter of doing both. Again, in arena kills mean victory... In that world Emp >>> Traps I agree. In a zone kills mean you got a kill so what.
In a zone Traps is where an Emp can actually land to buff a team without fear of being AS'ed. Traps is viable not because it does what an Emp can do... it's viable because it serves a unique purpose. One that bottles up everything you need to kill any combination of sets and allows you to spread these powers out over an area of your choosing. Is the set the best at or the greatest of... no. Is it useful to all allies in a zone and effective when played right or multiplied... definately. Is the set capable of surviving as well as the next squishy... well the fact that it doesn't have to constantly stay on he move should make this an obvious yes right?
MM/Traps are cool and all, but once seperated from pets they're either on the run or dead. For a long time the only /Traps even seen in PvP were MMs.Their dependency on Pets along with traps is likely what gives the set such a "stand still" reputation for when it's really more of the case of the MM itself. -
Quote:You speak as though you've leveled and PvP'ed with a Traps Def, MM, and Corr. I have. It's a shame we have to agree to disagree. It's also a shame that you probably haven't leveled and PvPed with all three yet still choose to argue as though you have.Originally Posted by ConFlict
Traps is really only viable in pvp on a mm. Yes it can work on corrs and fenders in certain situations or against sub par opponents in zones. But so can a db/da scrapper, that doesn't mean we should go around talking like people should actually use them if they want to be viable in pvp. And no viable doesn't equal 9 kills in 3 hours on the busiest server in the game.
Viabilty in Zone PvP has nothing to do with K/D ratio. Not when one can simply KS, fly to ceiling, or afk behind a drone. You know this , but I'm sure you won't admit it. Sure a high K/D ratio is often sought, but it's silly to believe one is good simply because they have a high K/D ratio in a zone. I mean if that's the case a Zone Emp must be useless right? Arena yes... Kills = IWin!! Zone, not so much it just means you got a kill.
As mention earlier YMMV with traps in PvP. -
A few things:
1. This was not a Advice thread. It's an OP that poses three basic questions. None of which have really been answered by anyone but me. Simple questions, simple thread, yet the same tired egos showing up to find a way to disagree with a topic even though there's nothing to disagree with....
2. I'm not a subpar player. Anyone who actually knows me know this. Weird PvP toons perhaps, but not a subpar player by far. Those who think this of me are disregarded due to ignorance in my book. Sorry. My rep here (on deh forums) is bad not because I'm bad (to all those who don't actually know) My rep here is bad because I don't do Damage... not yet anyway. I'm saving that for last. I do everything having to do with PvP besides damage. It is my main focus when building and participating in PvP. To make a Stalker/Blaster now would probably bore me right out of the game. I get kills, have fun, stay rich from drops, have fun, find counters for FoTMs, get kills, I die trying a lot, I never rage or disrespect, and I do not require a system to change to enjoy PvP.
3. If those here who have been deemed worthy to post opinions know the most... and have labeled zone PvP as supbar due to the rules and the system and/or the people that PvP in it. How can one turn to the same peeps in terms of guidance here on the boards in terms of what works and what is viable? Hell, Conflict only uses 2 temp powers outta of how many avalable to use in the game while PvPing in a zone???
4. Temp powers used at the right time for the right purpose in a zone are awesome. We all use them when we got them so theres really nothing to disagree about. What it takes to get them and whether it is worth it is different for everyone... the point of the OP was to discuss different temps and their effect in PvP if one so chooses to fetch it or have it drop.
Leave the hate at home people. This thread does not require it. -
Quote:Originally Posted by OPTICAL_ILLUSION
The only things dumb here are your pieces of advice and assumptions that sets and powers have not been used and experimented with. Also, your bad advice could lead to someone wasting their time making something dumb for pvp.
You really have little to no clue about pvp and it shows by your posts and pvp performance. I've seen you in action and I have to be honest and say that one of the most laughable pvpers in RV on Freedom is considerably better compared to you.
Think before you post and say something useful or keep "blah blah blahing" the pvp community who seems to have more of a clue than you and continue looking bad.
All I heard was... "blah blah I hate you cause I can't prove you wrong"
you're off topic btw lol
My advice is bad compared to zone PvP is retarded and only bad players can be good there? Too damn funny. -
Quote:I also PvP while getting nukes, cause it's a PvP zone that most are scurred to go to. oooo warburg!Originally Posted by ConFlict
Please waste to the time to get nukes for zone pvp.
The only two answers to this question that make sense are the fly pack and temp phase. Anything else is more of a gimmick than useful.
Many things can be useful in a zone if used by smart players... having a temp for the right occasion is smart imo. I thought it was a good thing to use all that's offered in PvP. Isn't that the arguement used when the lol cool kids knock the fiteclubbers or no? I'm sure the argument will now change right... "No, we just meant use insps... not everything!"
Oh well. it was worth the inqury.
Jetpack and phase are the only useful Temps... not KB increase or any off the wall shield or -res power or anything. Nope, just jetpack and phase. I wasn't asking if you silly folks thought Temp powers were effective. I already know the answer to that. I was curious as to what temps you find most effective. Your opinions of the best, your favorites and what you consider underrated.I got Jetpacks and Phase from the zone leadr of all Zones except those he won't waste time in: Conflict. Jetpack and Temp Phase
Anyone else care to share their favorite temp powers to use in zone?
I'm starting to think I13 dumbed down PvP'ers moreso than PvP. The excuses used to justify what some consider ineffective or lol "bad" is getting very sad to read. I've been around long enough to know that what's being considered this way is being done so without actually trying... [Of course will follow the tale of that guy who had every single temp power in the game all the time years ago and died twice so temp powes = Bad!]
My apologies you are correct. I was mistaken with the temp power gained from valentines. I actully did grind the Ouros once to get Force of the earth. I forgot however about it's limited usage.Quote:Originally Posted by Necrotech_Master
the force of the earth power ONLY works on devouring earth, it doesnt work like nectar from the spring fling/valentines event -
Quote:lolOriginally Posted by Terror1
Yeah no traps are bad. Not having mobility sucks even in zones. Unless you are teaming with 3-4 MM´s(pain/storm/therm) and dont have to do much but jump around and KS'ing.
So how did we get to Traps not having mobility? Either you misunderstood or you're just trying to twist things around as expected by many here on the boards.
Everyone waits for Mac to respond first so they can feel safe disagreeing with me lol. Too cute are these here forums.
Moving around in a zone isn't mandatory... it's simply required by most builds because they lack the defensive strategies or actual defense to stand still. Assuming one has to constanly keep moving is yet another carry-over from arena to zone, where the timers ticking and everything must happen in 10 mins.
I agree that multiple MMs can provide a safe way for teams to stay together. Multiple Trappers could do the same, and if they're non-MM Trappers... they'd actually have more mobility and survivabilty because of it. -
Hey all. Your neighborhood unique snowflake reinventor of the wheelie crazy guy Dahjee here to promote the use of Temp powers in PvP. I know arena has 7 or so to choose from, but I wanted to focus on the many temps available for use in zone PvP. I love the fact that IO bonuses still affect powers that we can't slot, like temp powers. Range and Rechage bonuses come to mind. I also like that you can carry multiples of the same temp power depending on where you got them from.
Ok so the obvious comes to mind first with mobilty temps like jetpack, and temp web grenade is likely a must for many... some temps are easy to get, some are harder while some are a complete grind. But what to you all is worth the effort to keep or save or grind for often so that it's with you in the zone? What are some of your favorite temps? What would you all consider the best? Which temps do you all consider quite underrated for PvP? I'm talking anything from powers you can craft to those made in base to those randomly picked up, to temp pets like shivans and heavies, to those you can Ouros back to get over and over.
I'd say my favorite is smoke bomb. Most of my PvP toons focus on mitigation or disruption, and stacking -percerption debuffs and lowering someone below the perception cap can go along way in a zone.
The best IMO has got to be the Chemical Nuke from Warburg. A five minute super debuff! Timed right and used against as many peeps as possible.
Lastly, I'd vote for redside's Force of the Earth Temp as most underrated. An AoE ranged confuse. It's pretty amusing when my brute runs into a group with this ready to spam once or twice. It's saved my butt on a lot of toons in the past but I rarely take the time to go back and get a fresh set.
Anyone else care to share? -
Quote:That strategy actually works in a zone. The part about people coming to you... cause like it's PvP and they want to kill you when they see you.Originally Posted by macskull
No target is going to stay in range long enough for you to get great mileage out of one Acid Mortar, let alone two. I mean, sure, you could have two debuffing the target at once if you set them up and someone happens to wander near you while they're both up, but this is one of those "how intelligent is the person I'm fighting?" questions. There's a reason Traps isn't a good PvP set, and that's because it almost completely lacks mobility. It offers decent debuffs and has some neat tricks, but the killer is that it relies on the fight coming to you, and can't move with you if the fight moves.
Just because something works doesn't mean it only works against bad or dumb players. It's absurd to keep stating things like that. You're confusing mobility with defense and they are not the same. Having good offense with good mobility is all you may need in arena cause that's all peeps build for. In a zone it is very possible to switch from an offensive approach to a defensive one. Certain powersets thrive in such situations.
Traps is a great teaming set in a zone once a team learns that they too have less of a reason to run around scared for their lives. If the only argument against Traps is that no one will come near you and those around you... well I'd consider that viablity, because there is a reason no one will want come around you. -
Having multiple traps affect the same target is pretty much the point of traps. Acid mortar is no different. If both mortars are in range of a target, they will both attack and affect that target.
Quote:You can't depend on /Traps' defense in PvP. Trip mine is fun in PvP too. Theres a difference between PvPing with /Traps and actual trapping in PvP. The route you choose will determine just how much fun you have with the set... it's a YMMV kinda thing I suppose.Originally Posted by Predatoric
see im currently deciding between /ice corr and /traps. I like traps defence and trip mine is fun in pve, but i dont want to suck in pvp too
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The -Res and -Def debuff is applied per target per mortar. It is possible to get three out although two at a time is more common and reliable. Throw in the achilles -res proc which would stack per mortar as well and you'd be looking at a significant chunk of of debuffage.
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I was curious actually if Chem Ammo's -Damage debuffs might synergize with other -Damage debuffs from a secondary to make some noticable impact on Aim/BU and other high powered attack chains. I'm not really sure of the numbers though.
No, I don't see DP as a viable awesome set. It's just that so far, this is the only primary set I can think of capable of debuffing damage with most attacks. (with Chem ammo slected) For a /TA, who's primary purpose may not be to get kills but disrupt, this specialty could in fact stack with something like Posion Gas Arrow to turn someone's 10 secs of spike damage into poo.
Just asking really. Leave the hate at home guys. -
Arguing from a pespective that has used SS/SJ on every toon since way back when... shouldn't be enough to verify what teleport is capable of without using it first.
I look at incoming hit rolls as well. I also keep my TP power button on my tray to see when it's available or know when it is not. I know that some poweers will supress me for up to 8 seconds... I learned that toggling on invis reduces that time to about 4 seconds... I started dong the same kinda tests for over a year with other powers and their TS durations. What affected them and what powers didn't and for how long. Thanks though for explaining the way TS works. I'm sure it has been helpful to many.
Thanks for listening too. I'll come back to this when you all are ready. btw go verify some ****. Stop riding on old credentials. -
Quote:No, it doesn't. Unless someone allows it too.Originally Posted by macskull
HaHaHaHaHaHa.
It does, actually. Same two seconds as any other attack thrown your way. A better example, though, would've been "toggle debuff = no TP."
You really should at least understand how the wheel works before you try reinventing it.
A better example is a power that neither Grav/ nor /TA has Mac? Stop talking and go verify some ****. -
Quote:HaHaHaHaHaOriginally Posted by Xanatos
Experience counts and theirs much outweighs yours.
also Acid Arrow, does not stop TP... at all. -
Quote:For healers and support, this loophole works just as well actually with SS/SJ because most are trying to get away more than attack. Just have invis recharged fast enough for use in between heals and suppression will be cut in half. It's like an on/off switch for TS.Originally Posted by macskull
If you have any insights on how to reduce 2 or 4 seconds (standard fixed duration of suppression for being attacked or activating a heal, for example) to "less than a second," I'm all ears.
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Quote:Powers that affect self, as well as other powers can reduce TS time attained from both attacking and getting hit. TS time from attacking is much much shorter than the time supressed from being attacked. With enough recharge on Invis or PFF for example, TS doesn't really threaten a good teleporter unless they're up against 10+ in a zone or something. Assuming they can stay in the air of course. Attack, invis, suppression over in less than a second.Originally Posted by _Lith_
How do you reduce travel suppression? Its a fixed number.
TS does not stack like effects do. Getting hit with 3 powers in a row or DoT means that TS ends after the first application of TS, it doesn't continue until the 3rd power's TS duration ends or for the duration of a DoT... Another round of TS will be applied if this small window of no TS isn''t taken advantage of though, so it is often missed when using any other form of travel, and is often why I don't recommend TP to those brand new to PvP. It does take practice.
[EDIT:] To clarify. The hardest part of this appoach can be having the patience to NOT attack when attacked/webbed/outnumbered (and outnumbered) so that you don't create more TS. Waiting 2 secs for that window can be very difficult and/or fatal at times. -
Quote:This suppression can be reduced to less than a second. Teleport benefits from the powers that reduce TS more so than any other Travel.Originally Posted by macskull
Teleport is completely disabled when under the effects of travel suppression (attack or get attacked? can't TP).
Teleport works best when paired with a travel that allows you to stay in the air. Hover > fly. Or alone as an alternative to Hibernate when it's time to get away. -
Quote:Nah... that just makes you a winner! lol grats?Originally Posted by macskull
I'm sorry, I was under the impression that playing without the ridiculous zone handicaps (hello, TS and HD) made you a better player.
You're right. It's not easy.Quote:Originally Posted by macskull
"Combat teleport" would imply that you are using teleport while in combat.
"Combat Teleport" involves using both the first and second recticle offered while teleporting as options when engaged in combat. It invloves getting to places quickly that allow you to attack while others can't attack you and getting out of places quickly when you can't attack... like countering a droner for example. Combat Mac, invovles both offense and defense ya know.
I'm usually on topic until I speak of something not written down in the cookie book... or when responding to someone here who has a hard time setting the book down.Quote:Originally Posted by macskull
Guess I have to give you props for throwing off just about every thread you post in by giving bad advice and then defending yourself when everyone who knows better says you're wrong. -
Quote:Imposible. You have been limited to a fewer situations than I it seems. My sig is sigworthy too. Been there for years you should read it again and again and again.Originally Posted by macskull
Why would I waste a build on TP/Fly when SS/SJ is better for almost every possible situation?
Take the Build in question. (Here ya go X)
Almost every power in the Primary/ has inhernent -Fly attached whilie /TA is infamous for it's ability to disrupt SS/SJers (not TP'ers) by removing -jump and -fly.
Still with me. We can agree so far right?
This makes for some pretty good mitiagtion for jumpers and flyers, yet offers very little to stop a runner, even with all the slows. So, like other SS/SJers that try and control/mitigate a battlefield... they have to keep moving. Choose a set/set combo that keeps everyone else on the ground... and choose a travel combo that keeps you there with them? Watch out for web grenades! lol funny logic.
TP/Hover (not TP/Fly!!!) on the other hand, would offer a safer, more reliable, and better oppurtunity to CC/Mitigate others for the sake of team/kills. Hovering in one spot from above you're likely to be able to get the jump on several players from above and prevent them from doing anything about it so long as you have the +range to manage aggro. In a world of SS/SJ'ers and loljetpacks... a Grav/TA could spam attacks left an right to drop anyone who approahes them.
At best... is webnade which can be countered about 95% of the time with TP/Hover without phase or Hibernate when you have decent +range attached. Having phase IMO is a much better option because it leaves room for different epic options and because concealment with this playstyle is encouraged.
Now, if we go back to the sic range this build is capable of via +range bonuses, and consider also that TP would be affected by such bonuses as well as TP Foe, (if chosen)
we'd end up with a toon that could reduce peception, Hold, ground, placate 1 third of, (PG Arrow) wormhole, and Phase out not just one... but multiple people and npcs (heavies) in a zone while outranging them all and/or dropping them from the skies before they can do anything. As well as being able to gtfo of dodge when 16 people all decide to go after them at once.
You win Mac because TP/Hover couldn't survive alone in the arena when others are all SS/SJ.
You lose because SS/SJ is simply easier in a zone (and offers hasten and acro lol) but not better on all toons reagrdless. You assume that from the arena. Stop dripping your arena mentality into zone PvP. Lrn2z0ne perhaps. I can Use SS/SJ with the best of them Mac... Can you Combat TP?
Ask another question. -
pew pew pew run hib pew pew run hib pew kill run run hib pew pew hib. = deh awsome pvPr
LotsoKills = all that is neded to be gud in zone PvP.
Run from PvE in PvP zone... EBs are scary, bad odds are scary, and dying can hurt ur fellings.
multiply the pew pew kill hib pew run run pew pew pew run hib approach by teaming with others who do the same just like you.
There. Now I've simplified advice given by everyone except me about zone PvP all the times. Copy/Paste. should be easy for the noobies here these days.
Remember Con, I'm just changing the tread too. Heads up people! Good players used to try to reinvent the wheel. They remained open minded at most times, found holes,weaknesses etc... died a lot trying new things, very seldom discredited good info because of the source, became experienced and good in the process. Good players didn't get good from copy/paste. The people they coached and/or taught became good from copy/paste, and because of it stayed stuck on the process long after those good players left the game and left these boards with watered down versions of the originals who've run out of new material.
The Good players of long ago didn't allow their subjects to try and do the same as them... it's how they kept them bad. <--- Profound. It's how noubs and vets of today are kept bad as well. Get out of the box people. -
Quote:Well you make it sound bad, but the recharge can be made decent and it doesn't crash a toon. Communicate to a team what's happening and I'm certain something can be made to happen in the 15 seconds without regen to follow.Originally Posted by Terror1
A 4 second hold with -regen that has 300s base recharge and has a really bad crash.
No thanks
Glad Nets are pretty cheap too... a pretty interesting build considering it could have the abilty to easily add 40% range in PvP without even having to invest in Glad Strikes as well as around 10 more max end. I mean, beeing able to mitiagate many even mases of folks with heavies in tow (AoEs) from that far way can often reduce the need for many things including KB res. and more HPs. (Keep in mind that EMP Arrow's range is NOT enhancable except from range bonuses...for a reason just like flash arrow) -
Quote:I don't care about this at all really. any of it.Originally Posted by _Lith_
I didn't say he didn't. I said Id take it over the, what, maybe 4 second hold from EMP arrow.
I dont think he needs three holds. Especially if one stops your end recov. Seems like a waste.
Some may find a use for a ranged AoE 4 sec hold that stops regen... some won't. I have toons that take it and some that don't. I feel my MM gets the best use out of the effect.
just sayin that the mez + -regen is kinda unique and is what can make this power have its place in PvP. (I thought you genuinely didn't know why. (I'm no troll, even though it seems that I make people erage hard)
Who are you? person that has ben temp banned and is using another account.Quote:Originally Posted by paranoir
Post Deleted
Who are you? to assume someone in PvP would spam Wormhole and EMP together so that one suppresses the other.
Who are you? without knowing anything of Grav/s with 3 singularities around them perma holding all those nearby.
It's funny you should mention mez suppression and Grav/ sucking before I13 in the same post. It offers insight into the possible fact that you PvP'ed just long enough to accept and listen to someone tell you what works and what doesn't and beleive them without actually knowing a damn thing yourself.
It also shine s a light on who you are....
(You know, just because I'm kinda arrogant on the boards and have really good comebacks, doesn't mean I'm bad or dumb or disrespectful... Please let the Hate go.) -
Quote:lol you guys are cute thinking you know me and stuff.Originally Posted by paranoir
exactly what i was gonna say.
when sentry4, dahjee or zen shadow say do something: just don't.
I didn't say do anything... I gave an explanation to help someone understand. I'm good for it.
If I was anywhere close to being bad at PvP in this game guys... you all wouldn't rage at me so much for doing things you can't lol.
lol, what's really sad is I got the same kinda crap years ago for talking about Grav/ in PvP o.O!
Glad to it's viable now in the cookie book. hfgl.
Um, He has both... Grav/Ta.Quote:Originally Posted by _Lith_
Decent hold what? Ill take a Wormhole for the retardly long stun thanks.