Amygdala

Come on, Hawk. You know you want to.

Seriously though, you should try the lowbie stuff. No experience is required, just the expectation to kill lots and be killed lots.

Some great ideas in there! I've been thinking of other themed nights, e.g. all Defenders, where the bubble idea would really work nicely. Warburg would be nice, except for the level range. I want to try to keep it low level as an equalizer between players, since there are already more dedicated PvP events out there. Something to think about though.

No I haven't tried it yet. It was just an idea that was rolling around in my head for a while, but couldn't settle on the rules mostly because I was trying to adapt the classic version of it (where you would have to get the flag from the opposing side and bring it back to your side) to a PvP match. I thought of using a map like the Cargo Ship map, and one player from each team stays at spawn point while the the other team tries to reach the other side and kill them. Once killed, the 'flag' would have to put the person that killed them on follow until they reached the other side.

Though I thought all that to be slightly too complicated. Your idea would be much simpler, if we could have whoever defeats the flag to announce it in Broadcast, then the other team knows who to target to get it back.

Maybe we could give it a try this week with melee ATs, because I think it would work well with them, as you would have to sprint and tackle people type thing.

I knew I forgot something...

When

Sunday, July 25th @ 7:30pm EST in Pocket D

Format

Three 10 minute matches minimum set up between melee ATs! This includes Scrappers, Tankers, Stalkers, and Brutes. (Yes I know other ATs have melee powers, but we're looking for classic melee ATs). Matches will be set to the usual level range of 6 to 11 (Flyweight) and include the following settings:

- No Travel Suppression
- No Heal Decay
- No Travel Powers
- Small Inspirations Only

As always, you don't actually have to be level 6 to 11. Level 50 characters are more than welcome, since the event will exemplar you.

Admission to the event will be on an invite only basis, as we don't want non-melee sneaking in! To join, simply show up and request an invite on your character by sending a tell to @Amygdala.

Hope to see you then.

I hear that. I've definitely found some new interests and projects due to the raid break, namely PvP. (Woot!) Now that I have a couple toons properly set up for it, it's a lot more fun. Hope to see more people get involved in this aspect of the game as well.

It was due to a variety of reasons. For one, it was the same group running them weekly or twice a week for over a year. That's a rather large commitment and a cause for burn out. Some of us had RL things come up that took priority. Part of it was that drama in general seemed to increase near the end and it was wearing on everyone, raid leaders and raiders alike. All things considered, it seemed like a good time to take a break and see if others might be interested in leading.

To say people are being punished though, that we're intentionally 'ruining the good time of the entire server', is a bit much. None of us are obligated to keep running them, as it's not a job. Anyone who has participated in raid leadership has done so because he or she volunteered. As ElectroHawk said, anyone is able to raid Hami. Having left the schedule open provides a great opportunity for that.

No one really intended for them to stop completely. That's why we took a hiatus, and instead of a regular schedule, had a few raids here and there to help lessen the burn out. It's been about 2 months, and lately some people have voiced interest. So I figured it would be a good time to find out what people liked about the old raids, what they didn't like, if they're even interested in them, and if others would be interested in leading them. For some people, Hami isn't their cup of tea, and that's cool. I'm just trying to spark some discussion so we can learn from the pros and cons of our past raid experience and move forward with it.

Personally, I'd love to see raids lead by the Champion server, and not just the same people every week. It might not happen, but so far a few people have voiced interest in this thread and in tells.

This is a good point and you're right, several raids have gone on regardless of a few hecklers, precisely because 40+ people were contributing. The only raid that was ever put on hold was one I lead, and I did so because at the time there were approximately 34 people in zone, 8 of which were on a mixed team and had ATs that were needed on other teams. At the time I was also getting tells from people on that team saying they were new and didn't know what was going on. That left only 26 people potentially supporting the raid. So the logical choice at the time given the circumstances was to get those people on proper teams and have the teams properly supported. I wouldn't have gone ahead with a raid when the important teams weren't filled up anyways, because I think doing that would ruin the fun times for everyone else who was there to give it an honest effort. That was the only instance a raid was put on hold, and every other raid has gone ahead as planned when there were enough people in the important raid positions.

I did talk to one raid leader who said his SG raids privately with 25 people, but these people have toons IOd specifically for this purpose, something you wouldn't necessarily get at any given raid. Otherwise, I haven't heard of other servers completing small raids of 10-15 people or how long it took them, but when we did it it took us an hour and 42 minutes. I've been operating under the assumption that the majority of raiders would rather not spend that much time at a raid if it can be done faster. I'll use Neuronia as an example of this:

Some folks simply do not want to spend that much time or can't. This is why we try to get them done fast.

It's possible the raid might not fail completely due to a few rogues, but there's no arguing that when people work together and are on the same page, things get done faster. Also, I don't think the 16 or so people carrying the raid would appreciate the rest of the raiders doing whatever they wanted.


Why is it then, that I've heard from people recently that some servers still cannot complete raids, or their raids take them 3-4 hours on top of taking an hour to form up? Again, there's a big difference between success/failure and an efficient raid.

It seems that the people who take issue with how the raids are done take issue with the fact that they are structured. At least, this is what I am getting from this thread and conversations I've had. The structure is simply in place with the intention of helping people and helping the raid go smoothly. For example, I once went to a raid on another server and asked the team leader what was going on and some basic questions. Their response was to ask the raid leader, and they were unwilling to help me out. This was the type of situation I wanted to avoid for new raiders.

When I first started leading raids, I took a look at how previous raid leaders had done them. I saw that Kat's raids were very organized and considered this a strength to the raid. In pre i9 raids, it was also quite common to have AT themed teams, such as the Blaster team. This is not unlike how we have it set up now.

Ultimately, I think structure, while not needed is extremely valuable. However, the goal behind the raids is to make them enjoyable for people. If folks believe we are at the point where structure is no longer desired, perhaps I will take the initiative and look into strategies involving free form teams.

18 minute Hami Raid April 18th, 2010 Champion Server

The other issue with Saturdays would be the weekly PvP matches hosted by PVPEC. However, you make a good point about raiding on other days of the week.

Technically speaking, the raid doesn't necessarily need designated team leaders for it to be successful. However, there's a big difference between a successful raid and an efficient raid, which is why I've used team leaders for each team. Some of the benefits of having people do this are as follows:

- minimizes start up time because invites are sent as soon as people arrive or shortly thereafter. Team leaders know exactly what ATs to invite and how many, so that shuffling people after teams are formed is minimized. For important support ATs like Emps, it's easier to keep track of how many are on each team.

- keeps the actual number of teams to a minimum. Less teams means easier recovery if something were to cause us to retreat. It's also important if we decide we don't have the yellow taunt strength to do an evac-less raid and will have to TP out. The more packed the team is, the higher chances of someone with TP or vet TP. In the case of an evac-less raid, it allows people to exchange EoEs amongst their team mates quickly. It also speeds up communication if something needs to be passed down from the raid leader.

- targets damage to appropriate targets. The way we have the raid set up is that there is a Scrapper team for the yellow mitos (+/- support), a Blaster team for the blue mitos (+/- support), and 2 teams for the green mitos, one filled with Controllers and one with mixed damage types. Although it is possible to add a targetter to your Friends list and target through them from a mixed team, it is much easier to be able to target through your team leader. Also, having the second green team of mixed damage allows us to take down the greens almost as fast as the other mitos during most raids so that we can take one sweep around the bowl and nearly all the mitos are down, if not all. It would be difficult during a mixed team raid to tell some of the Blasters to shoot the blues while some to help with the greens.

- designates a person on team to answer questions from new raiders. I know a lot of us know what we're doing, but I think a raid format that's new raider friendly is beneficial for the several people that show up for their first raid and have questions. Having team leaders willing to do this also keeps the tells off the raid leader.

Those are just some of the reasons why I think the set up we've used has been useful and efficient. It's supposed to be geared towards the raiders' convenience, so they can just come and join the raid and know we'll be in and out of there quickly.

Ultimately, I am asking these questions because I'd like to get people other than the "Hami-Lead" crew involved. They've been doing raids for a long time and overall, have done a great job. But if there are people interested and willing to help out in this regard, I think it would benefit the server and build a stronger knowledge base when it comes to raiding.

Since this Saturday is an off week for redside Hami raids, I'd be willing to come early and help do a trial run to confirm it will work. I'm sure some others might be willing to as well. If not, we can always try the dice.

I did a small scale test this afternoon, and it doesn't seem that it will overfill a colour past the team number set. I filled the red team deliberately to see if it would add people past 3, but it didn't. Instead, it just filled the other teams. It also doesn't appear that it will allow people in the event past the max number you set per team times the number of teams. I had 2 teams of 2 full, and my 5th person could not get in the match once those teams were full.

Anyways, food for thought. Admittedly my experience in large scale Arena events is lacking, but I thought it was worth exploring a little. I think it's great you have some other ideas in the works for random team generation in game, where people can verify the process. Hopefully this will keep some of the drama down.

I bet he thinks that song is about him.