Why is your Tier 5 better than my Tier 9?

I didn't think about the purple patch, so yes the duration is a strong advantage.

But I want to come back to why a change in seeds duration would force a change in other confuses duration. Currently there are some very clear-cut duration times for hard control powers. Let's leave out any kind of pulsing aura, area patches etc. We're just looking at direct controls, single target and ae (i am using unenhanced dominator numbers here):

- Single target hard control has a 17.88s duration. This is true for all holds.
- Area target hard control has a 11.92s duration. Except for Heart of Darkness with 14.9s apparently because it is a pbaoe (although this should actually mean that Cinders and Glacier get bumped up too). This is true for all holds and disorients.

None of this is true for any confuse power. Confuse is hard control and has no disadvantage over other hard controls. Still all confuse powers have a clearly higher duration than other hard controls. Why? I don't know. But it is very clear that it is confuse as a whole that is jumping out of line here and not just one power. Do tell me how you justify these numbers.

/edit: Of course if seeds' duration isn't lowered to other hard control ae durations (but only by the same percentage that other hard control aes are lower than their single target counterpart), then there isn't a need to lower the single target durations (and it can be argued the t9 aes neither because they get an extra bump for being t9). I still don't see why confuse is jumping out like this though.

---

Why confuse powers offer a longer duration is a good question. However, I think the answer to that is tied up in very old design. With only Mind and Illusion having confuse powers, it was easy to cite their lack of every spawn hard control as a consideration. Carrying that duration over for Mass Confusion, I think, was done for a lack of a better idea and it still left MC performing far behind sets that could summon multiple castings of their pets at the time. Then, over time, a variety of changes occurred that boosted MC's relative performance: the loss of multiple pet summons, the nerf to AoE holds' recharge and duration, the introduction of IOs.

Presently, it sits in what I feel is a fairly well balanced position. It's stronger than an AoE hold as expected for a tier 9 power, but it doesn't provide the consistent damage or distraction derived from a pet. It's a tool that I feel is weaker than some pets and stronger than others.

But returning to the question of confuse's duration in the modern game, I do wonder as well if it's fully justified. The decision to add such a power to Dark (with is not lacking in AoE control or damage) seems questionable to me. The ability of perma-doms to permanently confuse AVs is a bit troublesome as well. The other side of the coin, however, is that those confuses compensate for the lack of containment for some controllers. They are certainly powerful, game altering abilities but I believe that is more a result of their general function rather than duration.

---

I was reading patch notes for Issue 5 and it said that Holds, Stuns and Sleeps (as well as a few other powers like Ice Slick and Quicksand) had their durations decreased and recharge increased. The only AoE Confuse was in Mind Control so they most likely justified leaving it alone because Mind doesn't get a pet.

Then came Plant Control with a faster recharging version that lasts just as long. This version should have had the same treatment as the Holds, Stuns and Sleeps because, unlike Mind, it gets its own pets to contribute to damage.

---

There actually isn't a global modifier that makes most Confuses have long duration. The way most Confuses are implemented is by using the Ranged_Immobilized table. The reason they last so long relative to Holds is that each one of them is hand-coded to have a higher Scale.

The Controller AT modifier for Ranged_Immobilize at level 50 is 1.863. We get actual durations by multiplying the modifier by the scale of the power.

• The duration of Seeds of Confusion, Mass Confusion, Confuse, and Deceive is equal to a scale 20 Immobilize. (20 x 1.863 = 37.26)
• The duration of a standard Hold is equal to a Scale 12 Immobilize. = (12 x 1.863 = 22.356)
• The AoE Holds are currently equal to a Scale 8 Immobilize. (1.863 x 8 = 14.904)

Stuns do have a separate table all to themselves. At level 50, the Controller Stun modifier on the Attribute table is 1.863--which is the same as the Immobilize table. The reason Stuns typically last a short time is actually because of how each power is hand coded.

• Flashfire and Stalagmites are a scale 8 Stun. (8 x 1.863 = 14.94)
• Wormhole and Heart of Darkness are a scale 10 Stun. (10 x 1.863 = 18.63)
• Beanbag (Assault Rifle) and Screech (Sonic Attack) are a Scale 10 stun.
• Cosmic Burst (Radiation Blast) is a Scale 8 stun.

Note that not all confuses use the Range_Immobilize table. Arctic Air uses the Ranged_Fear table. And World of Confusion uses the Ranged_Ones table--a table filled completely with 1s that doesn't vary by level or by AT, which is why World of Confusion has the same confuse duration on Blasters, Controllers, and Dominators.

---