How do you feel about joining Arachnos? It's easy to hit 75% damage resistance using Sonic Dispersion, Tough and one of the epic power pool shields.
However, for best survival, I would leave your resistance at the 50% level and concentrate on defense. With Scorpion Shield, Weave, Maneuvers, Combat Jumping and creative use of set bonuses, you could soft-cap your Smashing and Lethal defenses.
This is not a whole build, just a framework for the sort of investment this could involve.
The wanna-be Brute should also have hit points. I'd try to slot your ranged attacks with Devastation to get the 2.25% hit point bonus.
Hero Plan by Mids' Hero Designer 1.956
http://www.cohplanner.com/
Click this DataLink to open the build!
Tough Sonic Guy: Level 49 Technology Defender
Primary Power Set: Sonic Resonance
Secondary Power Set: Sonic Attack
Power Pool: Fighting
Power Pool: Leaping
Ancillary Pool: Mace Mastery
Hero Profile:
Level 1: Sonic Siphon -- Acc-I(A)
Level 1: Shriek -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Scream -- Empty(A)
Level 4: Howl -- Empty(A)
Level 6: Boxing -- KntkC'bat-Acc/Dmg(A), KntkC'bat-Dmg/EndRdx(7), KntkC'bat-Dmg/Rchg(7), KntkC'bat-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(11)
Level 8: Combat Jumping -- LkGmblr-Def(A), LkGmblr-Rchg+(9)
Level 10: Shockwave -- Empty(A)
Level 12: Sonic Dispersion -- RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx(A), RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(13), RctvArm-ResDam(13), RctvArm-EndRdx(15)
Level 14: Tough -- RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx(A), RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(17), RctvArm-ResDam(19), RctvArm-EndRdx(19)
Level 16: Shout -- Empty(A)
Level 18: Weave -- LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx(A), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(21), LkGmblr-Def(23), LkGmblr-Rchg+(23)
Level 20: [Empty] -- Empty(A)
Level 22: Amplify -- Rec'dRet-ToHit/Rchg(A), Rec'dRet-Pcptn(25)
Level 24: [Empty]
Level 26: [Empty]
Level 28: [Empty] -- Empty(A)
Level 30: [Empty]
Level 32: Liquefy -- SipInsght-ToHitDeb(A), SipInsght-Acc/ToHitDeb(33), SipInsght-Acc/Rchg(33), SipInsght-ToHitDeb/EndRdx/Rchg(33), SipInsght-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg(34)
Level 35: Screech -- Empty(A)
Level 38: Dreadful Wail -- Empty(A)
Level 41: Scorpion Shield -- LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx(A), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(42), LkGmblr-Def(42), LkGmblr-Rchg+(42)
Level 44: [Empty] -- Empty(A)
Level 47: [Empty]
Level 49: [Empty]
Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Dash -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Slide -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Quick -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Rush -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Surge -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Vigilance
Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
Level 4: Ninja Run
Level 4: Swift -- Empty(A)
Level 4: Health -- Empty(A)
Level 4: Hurdle -- Empty(A)
Level 4: Stamina -- Empty(A)
------------
Code:
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I posted a build in this thread....
http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showthread.php?t=291121
for a sonic/sonic that should be very sturdy. Like bill says, you could go for more Resistance to s/l but going for soft capped s/l/e Defense and than sitting at 50% s/l seemed a smarter way to go for a really durable build.
This build adds in plenty of mez/soft control to acts as further mitigation, and also has several heal procs to keep topping up the health while you just do your thing. It's built to be able to solo fine, but still have all the tools expected out of a sonic/sonic when teaming. But it is pretty expensive.
Here is the data chunk again...
| Copy & Paste this data into Mids' Hero Designer to view the build |
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Quote:
I didn't really address what to shoot for... Most every Brute player (heck, every melee player) will tell you the best way to get real durability, is to be really good at one aspect of survivability, and then layer on other forms of protection. High Resist types always want to add defense, and maybe regen, too, for example. It's often a lot harder to that with the 'squishie' types. Often, all you can do is to me good at one thing. Defenders (and Corrs) often have more options, by being able to use a debuff consistently and layering that with a high def or high resistance. Sonic/ however, doesn't offer any defensive debuffs unless you count those in Liquify, which you shouldn't, as it's not up often enough (don't disregard or ignore Liquify, tho, as often, it'll get ya outta a mess). What Sonic/ brings is several forms of mez, and a big extra boost to resistance. But, if you go for resistnace, you'll probably not end up with def to any large degree, and vice versa. Given that def helps a bit more, and also that def also aids vs mezzes, I'd build for def first then resistance, then mez tools, then healing in this case. For most non-melee types I'd go def first, then other stuff, but a different set may make self heals a bigger priority. |
Originally Posted by UtahDemocrat
Hey there, was having an interesting conversation with a fellow defender who says she built her defender to be a mini brute with the -res and some solid defense. Just wanted to get an idea of a good build to shoot for.
Thanks in advance! |
Bottom line, try to get as many types of survivability tools as you can for real toughness. Then get one of them, really high. I prefer Defense as the priority on squishies for several reasons, but mez and debuff are certainly among them. If you have great tohit debuff tools, you could easily flip this, and got for decent Defense, great resistance, and rely on the debuff to keep you as safe as if you had a high end def. Sonic/sonic doesn't have that option, tho.
Quote:
There is a lot of good advice in this. |
Originally Posted by Madadh
I didn't really address what to shoot for... Most every Brute player (heck, every melee player) will tell you the best way to get real durability, is to be really good at one aspect of survivability, and then layer on other forms of protection. High Resist types always want to add defense, and maybe regen, too, for example. It's often a lot harder to that with the 'squishie' types. Often, all you can do is to me good at one thing. Defenders (and Corrs) often have more options, by being able to use a debuff consistently and layering that with a high def or high resistance. Sonic/ however, doesn't offer any defensive debuffs unless you count those in Liquify, which you shouldn't, as it's not up often enough (don't disregard or ignore Liquify, tho, as often, it'll get ya outta a mess). What Sonic/ brings is several forms of mez, and a big extra boost to resistance. But, if you go for resistnace, you'll probably not end up with def to any large degree, and vice versa. Given that def helps a bit more, and also that def also aids vs mezzes, I'd build for def first then resistance, then mez tools, then healing in this case. For most non-melee types I'd go def first, then other stuff, but a different set may make self heals a bigger priority.
|
One thing to look at in particular that was not addressed is the end usage. When on teams you will be pushed particularly hard on end drain. Madadhs sample build is very nice in most respects and even addresses that issue pretty well, but it is something any Sonic/Sonic has to bear in mind while on teams. Cardiac Core is a very nice choice to help with this.
Another think I think is a good point for a Sonic/ build is that you have two long recharge get out of jail free cards to play. Liquefy is the one every talks about and they should, it's great. The other is Sonic Cage. It's a power you can get creative with and find some very good uses for. Solo you can Cage a boss, sleep with Siren's Song and single target most of the mob to great effect. On STF, I've been told it is useful on the pylons. It's another card that you can use to leverage your toughness and effectiveness.
The other useful tool left out in Madadh's build was Shockwave. I've left it out of my Sonic/Sonic, but if I were predominantly a solo player, I would have it in. The KB is a bit of a pain but can be worked around and it's great mitigation.
and personally, I would use hover over combat jumping (both ideally) as being above your prey is its own form of mitigation.
For "sturdy" I'll direct the OP to the build I posted in the thread linked to above:
http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showp...37&postcount=4
This is a hovering toon with soft-capped ranged def, respectable psi mitigation, via def and resists (usually a huge gaping hole for Sonics) and hard-capped s/l resists.
There is more than one way to skin a cat and I have no doubt other builds shown have extreme survivability. Personally, this has proven to be my toughest squishy and would be in the upper tier of my non-squishies too.
Global = Hedgefund (or some derivation thereof)
Quote:
One thing I worry about with the build you posted is the lack of endurance gain. As a guide I used your build, switched some slots and powers around but got a bit of a better endurance gain. Now, to be fair I did use the Shield Wall proc to hit 75% s/l resist but you could forgo that and toggle on tough but have less endurance gain. Also, I break the rule of 5 in Mind over Body but I really wanted the extra psi def/resistance.|
Originally Posted by Deacon_NA
For "sturdy" I'll direct the OP to the build I posted in the thread linked to above:
http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showp...37&postcount=4 This is a hovering toon with soft-capped ranged def, respectable psi mitigation, via def and resists (usually a huge gaping hole for Sonics) and hard-capped s/l resists. There is more than one way to skin a cat and I have no doubt other builds shown have extreme survivability. Personally, this has proven to be my toughest squishy and would be in the upper tier of my non-squishies too. |
Build Below:
Hero Plan by Mids' Hero Designer 1.957
http://www.cohplanner.com/
Click this DataLink to open the build!
Sonic_Sonic_SonicRemedy: Level 50 Natural Defender
Primary Power Set: Sonic Resonance
Secondary Power Set: Sonic Attack
Power Pool: Flight
Power Pool: Leaping
Power Pool: Fighting
Power Pool: Leadership
Ancillary Pool: Psychic Mastery
Hero Profile:
Level 1: Sonic Barrier -- ImpArm-ResDam(A), ImpArm-ResDam/EndRdx(3), ImpArm-ResDam/Rchg(3), ImpArm-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(5)
Level 1: Shriek -- Thundr-Acc/Dmg(A), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx(5), Thundr-Dmg/Rchg(7), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(7), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(9), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(9)
Level 2: Sonic Haven -- ImpArm-ResDam/EndRdx(A), ImpArm-ResDam(11), ImpArm-ResDam/Rchg(11), ImpArm-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(13)
Level 4: Scream -- Thundr-Acc/Dmg(A), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx(17), Thundr-Dmg/Rchg(19), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(19), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(21), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(21)
Level 6: Howl -- SDefendersB-Acc/Dmg(A), SDefendersB-Dmg/Rchg(23), SDefendersB-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(23), SDefendersB-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(25), SDefendersB-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(25), SDefendersB-Rchg/Heal%(27)
Level 8: Disruption Field -- EndRdx-I(A), EndRdx-I(27)
Level 10: Hover -- Zephyr-Travel/EndRdx(A), Zephyr-Travel(29), SW-ResDam/Re TP(33)
Level 12: Sonic Dispersion -- ImpArm-ResDam/EndRdx(A), ImpArm-ResDam(29), ImpArm-ResDam/Rchg(31), ImpArm-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(31), S'fstPrt-ResDam/Def+(31)
Level 14: Combat Jumping -- LkGmblr-Rchg+(A), Ksmt-ToHit+(33), Zephyr-ResKB(33)
Level 16: Boxing -- Empty(A)
Level 18: Tough -- ImpArm-ResDam/EndRdx(A), ImpArm-ResDam(34), ImpArm-ResDam/Rchg(34), ImpArm-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(34)
Level 20: Weave -- GftotA-Run+(A), GftotA-Def(36), GftotA-Def/EndRdx(36), GftotA-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(36), LkGmblr-Rchg+(37)
Level 22: Maneuvers -- LkGmblr-Rchg+(A), GftotA-Run+(37), GftotA-Def(37), GftotA-Def/EndRdx(39), GftotA-Def/Rchg(39)
Level 24: Tactics -- AdjTgt-ToHit/Rchg(A), AdjTgt-ToHit(39), AdjTgt-ToHit/EndRdx/Rchg(40), AdjTgt-EndRdx/Rchg(40), AdjTgt-ToHit/EndRdx(40)
Level 26: Clarity -- EndRdx-I(A)
Level 28: Vengeance -- LkGmblr-Rchg+(A)
Level 30: Amplify -- GSFC-Build%(A)
Level 32: Liquefy -- Cloud-ToHitDeb(A), Cloud-Acc/ToHitDeb(42), Cloud-Acc/Rchg(42), Cloud-ToHitDeb/EndRdx/Rchg(42), Cloud-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg(43), Cloud-%Dam(50)
Level 35: Screech -- Stpfy-Acc/Rchg(A), Stpfy-EndRdx/Stun(43), Stpfy-Acc/EndRdx(43), Stpfy-Stun/Rng(45), Stpfy-Acc/Stun/Rchg(45), Stpfy-KB%(45)
Level 38: Dominate -- Thundr-Acc/Dmg(A), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx(46), Thundr-Dmg/Rchg(46), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(46), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(48), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(48)
Level 41: Mind Over Body -- ImpArm-ResDam/EndRdx(A), ImpArm-ResDam(48), Aegis-Psi/Status(50), ImpArm-ResPsi(50)
Level 44: Fly -- EndRdx-I(A)
Level 47: Afterburner -- LkGmblr-Rchg+(A)
Level 49: Sonic Siphon -- Acc-I(A)
Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Dash -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Slide -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Quick -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Rush -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Surge -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Vigilance
Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
Level 4: Ninja Run
Level 2: Swift -- Flight-I(A)
Level 2: Health -- Numna-Regen/Rcvry+(A), Mrcl-Rcvry+(13)
Level 2: Hurdle -- Jump-I(A)
Level 2: Stamina -- P'Shift-End%(A), Efficacy-EndMod(15), Efficacy-EndMod/Acc(15), Efficacy-EndMod/Rchg(17)
Level 50: Cardiac Core Paragon
------------
Code:
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Dreaded Wail hits things freakin' hard.. i like to hit things freakin' hard... so.. id go Wail... SAVE THE WAILS!!!! - Solar_Lunata
I have Cardiac at T4. Endurance is absolutely not an issue, based on actual gameplay, even with Disruption.
Global = Hedgefund (or some derivation thereof)
Quote:
Fair enough, I just never feel comfortable without atleast an end return of 2 or more from personal experience.
|
Originally Posted by Deacon_NA
I have Cardiac at T4. Endurance is absolutely not an issue, based on actual gameplay, even with Disruption.
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Dreaded Wail hits things freakin' hard.. i like to hit things freakin' hard... so.. id go Wail... SAVE THE WAILS!!!! - Solar_Lunata
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Shadey_NA
There is a lot of good advice in this.
One thing to look at in particular that was not addressed is the end usage. When on teams you will be pushed particularly hard on end drain. Madadhs sample build is very nice in most respects and even addresses that issue pretty well, but it is something any Sonic/Sonic has to bear in mind while on teams. Cardiac Core is a very nice choice to help with this. Another think I think is a good point for a Sonic/ build is that you have two long recharge get out of jail free cards to play. Liquefy is the one every talks about and they should, it's great. The other is Sonic Cage. It's a power you can get creative with and find some very good uses for. Solo you can Cage a boss, sleep with Siren's Song and single target most of the mob to great effect. On STF, I've been told it is useful on the pylons. It's another card that you can use to leverage your toughness and effectiveness. The other useful tool left out in Madadh's build was Shockwave. I've left it out of my Sonic/Sonic, but if I were predominantly a solo player, I would have it in. The KB is a bit of a pain but can be worked around and it's great mitigation. and personally, I would use hover over combat jumping (both ideally) as being above your prey is its own form of mitigation. |
I agree totally. Feel slightly foolish I didn't, but am glad someone did. End drain for a sonic is pretty bad, and with the granted -res aura, can get downright brutal. Learn to toggle it, as needed. And pack some blues. Temping though it may be, don't withhold shields so as to lower the average health score so as to leverage the Def inherent, tho... (joking, mostly, though, I'm sure someone has done it). I'm pretty sure in the build I posted, I suggested Cardiac, but if I didn't, I should have. Cardiac was made for Sonic/ defs...
Sonic cage, too, I'm sorry I neglected to mention. It's a great power, but oh, so situational. For solo use, tho, spectacular. On the STF I prefer to see it used to neutralize LR while killing the pylons. Many uber-AVs are resistant to everything heavily except caging. It's nice to be able to just make LR 'go away for a while, and we'll get to you when we're ready and feel like it..' I'm sure with reative use there are plenty of spots where this power can shine, but it takes crafty thinking..
Personally, not a shockwave fan, but I admit, that it has it's uses, if you have the playstyle to get good mileage out of it. I often forget about it since I don't, but that doesn't make it a poor option. And I'd agree, if you plan to use it, hovering is a very nice way to go..
Quote:
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Originally Posted by SonicRemedy
Fair enough, I just never feel comfortable without atleast an end return of 2 or more from personal experience.
|
In general, this is my rule, too. However, Cardiac really does make it a non-issue. The thing to keep in mind, however, is how much you exempt below Incarnate powers levels, and which toggles you might lose access to (and therefore won't be running) when you do. I exemp a lot, and even more so on my 'fenders, so exempling is a BIG consideration for me... But if you don't, Cardiac makes a lot of shaky end builds very viable... And the slots not spent on end control are for sure spent elsewhere.. Having played it both ways on offenders, I feel it's all in what ya wanna do..
Quote:
I just wanted to comment here briefly to say... Dang, I wish I could make a decent hover build. Or rather, play a decent hover alt. I can't hover blast in the big huge outdoor maps, let alone council caves, etc... I just plain do not have the skill to make that work. So, if you ever see a build of mine, I probably totally disregarded the hover blast style as an option, out of hand, because of a player based limitation...|
Originally Posted by Deacon_NA
For "sturdy" I'll direct the OP to the build I posted in the thread linked to above:
http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showp...37&postcount=4 This is a hovering toon with soft-capped ranged def, respectable psi mitigation, via def and resists (usually a huge gaping hole for Sonics) and hard-capped s/l resists. There is more than one way to skin a cat and I have no doubt other builds shown have extreme survivability. Personally, this has proven to be my toughest squishy and would be in the upper tier of my non-squishies too. |
But it is a very effective approach, and is often easier to build for. So one should always keep hover builds in mind. Some power-sets work less effective with them, but some work better. So if you can do both, learn to pick and choose...
Hey there, was having an interesting conversation with a fellow defender who says she built her defender to be a mini brute with the -res and some solid defense. Just wanted to get an idea of a good build to shoot for.
Thanks in advance!