Too much repeat Gameplay

I can only speak for myself here, but the trials are already repetitive. Add to that the amount of time involved to Incarnate out 1 toon is not conducive to my altaholic nature.

You know, I got bored of the trials within about a week of playing them with my tank and Mastermind.

I unlocked three slots and had a Tier 3 destiny, T2 Judgement and T3 Interface on my brute who had only set foot in one trial. WSTs are a wonderful thing. If you don't want to do the incarnate trials but want the incarnate goodies, it can be done.

All those defenses of the incarnate rewards system are valid. If you want the rewards, you have to engage in the content. There are other ways to get these rewards, and while they're less efficient, they're not terribly so. If you want to switch alignment, you have to do tips. There are no alternate paths for this. I wonder why hasn't this issue been brought up?

How did you get that out of that quote? I said the total opposite of that.

Look it's simple, the problem is with the game because it should be designed so if you're repeating content it's because you want to repeat that content not because it's the only way to advance in the game. That's how games work is you advance by playing threw ALL the content not just repeating the same thing till you're bored of it. The incarnate system is a form of advancement that requires repeating content to access it. Up till 50 you can advance in the game by doing anything you want and if you repeat any content between 1 and 50 that's your own damn fault for farming when you didn't need to farm. The Incarnate trials are actually designed to be farms as there's nothing else to do to advance in the game without farming them.

So here it is... you seem to have this totally backwards idea that the problem is with me not the game and this totally backwards idea that I want rewards without working for them. But that's not it at all, that's exactly the kind of thing I'm complaining about. That's not how I want the incarnate trials to be that's how they already are. I hate farms, I hate them because I don't like repeating content and because they promote noobs to level 50 who don't know how to play the game.

At no point in here am I asking for faster rewards, only more content giving the same rewards so it's less like a farm and more like a normal part of the game. The problem is with the game.

Whatever Dark Armor sucks.

More seriously, I think admitting its boring and you dont want to play it kind of defeats the point of the argument.

I ran at least 4 a day (two of each trial), sometimes more, for a week solid. That's only two separate events, being repeated at least twice each day for seven days. Take any two roller coasters in the world, ride each of them twice a day for seven days. Eat the same two meals for lunch and dinner each day for seven days.

If anything, that I didn't get bored sooner is a bolster to my argument.

Which is why you don't have to ride the roller coaster 30 times to get to the other attractions.

Basically the trials are the mission equivalent of the old Speed Boost--"balance by frustration." It's not that they are that difficult, they just require a very specific approach to the game. The fact that that the irritation of performing that action is what keeps people in check leads to the predicted outcome: irritated people.

Tell me, how many times do you have to ride the coaster before you win the stuffed animal for knocking down milk jars?

See, I can make bad twisted metaphors too.

Doing the content doesn't unlock any more content. It gives you rewards. If you want those rewards, you have to do that content. It's that simple, and there's nothing wrong with that.

You have alternatives. Unlike side switching.

For now. Let's see what comes out in the future. I'm not interested in ripping on you because I know you're a decent guy. Time will tell what the future brings.

The problem is with you thinking that there will be no more content coming out to progress incarnates. It is being made as we play. It takes time to create content. The devs can not just snap their fingers and make it magicaly appear.

You also do not seem to understand what farming means exactly. Taking a toon from 1-50 in the same mission or set of missions is called pl'ing. Doing the same mission(s) over for a reward is farming. While you may not like it, others do.

I will mimic the others when I say, It is YOUR decission to keep doing the same thing over and over. Take a break and do something else in game so you don't keep getting frustrated.

Again you're assuming things that were never said. That's not the problem as I don't think that way at all. In fact it's the total opposite of what I've actually said just like all your other assumptions.

I had stated in the beginning that if we were going to be limited to do incarnate trials to get threads than they should of launched it with more than 2 trials to begin with. That doesn't mean they can't still make more trials later on. They've already done that with the Keyes trial. What that means it they should of held off on launching the trials till they had more content to give us and worked on other things till that could be finished. The way they did it was basically giving us unfinished content that wasn't really ready for the live servers. And I mean that in more ways than one but the other stuff is a little off topic for this thread.

I know what farming is. Someone early on in the topic had accused me of wanting rewards without working for it which is why I had mentioned farming. But the trials do work like a farm as you stated yourself and actually repeated from me for some reason while saying I didn't know what I was talking about. "Doing the same mission(s) over for a reward is farming." And that's what you do with incarnate trials because there's nothing else to do for the same rewards so you have to farm them, that's what this entire topic is complaining about but yet someone still thinks I want to farm. :P

I will tell you the same thing I tell the others. It is NOT my decision to keep doing the same thing over and over again. There's nothing else to do to get the rewards I need to advance my characters. As for taking a break so I don't keep getting frustrated, I'm already doing that. I had reduced the amount of time I spend in game a week before I even started this topic. It's not helping because the problem isn't me it's the game. I'm playing less because the game wants me to do content that I've already done and I'm getting bored of it but I'm still doing that same content when I do play because I'm still trying to get the rewards. The frustration isn't from my playing or not playing the content it's the lack of content provided.

I actually started playing more again when Keyes first came out and actually managed to complete the trial 3 times out of like 30 failed attempts. (Not that the other two trials were any better when they first came out though the majority of people seem to think so.) Now that everyone has done Lamb and BAF hundreds of times they rarely ever fail and that's the only reason why people seem stuck to them. The only people who seem to want to do Keyes are the ones who are bored like me. Anyway, now it's starting to be just another trial and I'm going back to playing less again. I ran each trial once today and then logged off rather than staying online for the whole day like I use to do repeating them till I'm bored to death. Hint there, if there was more content I'd still be on the game right now instead of making this post.

I rarely ever use the forums unless I see an aspect of the game that needs improving. I'll be very active on the forums for a while till a change is made and the topic isn't needed anymore or I just get tired of all the negative posters who seem to have more issues with me personally than anything I've actually posted. When the game is good I go months, maybe even an entire YEAR without posting a single thing because I'm busy actually playing the game. I don't know why so many people have issues with me, you people don't even know me. If you don't like my ideas I can deal with that, but talk about why you don't like my ideas. Don't just attack me like I'm the root of all evil. My idea, as it stands are simply, there needs to be more incarnate content than there is and some how people are having issues with that like the content is fine the way it is. If you don't want more incarnate content that's your problem, you don't have to do it if you don't want to, you can just stick to running BAF and Lamb over and over but I want more to do.

Of course it is. Maybe you should learn to qualify your statements so they'll make more sense. Or see a professional about addictive behaviour.

Nonsense.

Also of note: Chad never said ADHD was not a disability. He just said it was not a disability that some things in the game will make worse.

That is very much unlike the issue SOnic Resonance used to have, where it would trigger migraine headaches and seizures just by being on the screen.

Repetitive content is not going to cause someone to be unable to sit still. If you have ADHD, you're going to have trouble sitting still whether the content is repetitive or not. The game did not cause that condistion, and it did not cause it to be any worse than it was already.

That's what he meant, his comment wasn't offensive in the slightest.

Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison See, it's gems like these that make me check Claws' post history every once in a while to make sure I haven't missed anything good lately.

Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison See, it's gems like these that make me check Claws' post history every once in a while to make sure I haven't missed anything good lately.

Umm, you've been repeating content since level 1.

Does it really matter that you're defeating Death Head this time instead of Bone Rattler? You're on an identical warehouse map, fighting identical bad guys, one of which happens to have had a different name typed in by the mission writer or randomly generated from a file that has generic villain names in it. For all we know, the Skulls are just 30 dudes and we've been fighting the same guys over and over the whole time.

The entire game is repetitive. You have Defeat a Boss missions, Collect a Glowy missions, Rescue a Hostage missions, and that's pretty much it. The writers and mission designers do a pretty good job at making it not feel like that, but when you strip away all the fluff, you've been running slight variations of the same 3 missions from the day you first logged in.

I find it odd that it took Incarnate Trials before you even noticed any repetitiveness.

Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison See, it's gems like these that make me check Claws' post history every once in a while to make sure I haven't missed anything good lately.

Personally, I'm not looking too deeply into Incarnate Content until it is available in methods I don't require anybody else to do....

incarnate trials are fine for people that have a raiding mentality

but the rest of us solo-ers would like at least the ability to advance in the incarnate mechanics without dealing with the mass PuGs

I went over this in the first post. Threatening someone in order to get them to do something they don't want to do is not the only way to force it onto them. Rewarding someone for doing something they don't want to do works in the same way. That's why people continue to work jobs they hate day after day, because it pays the bills. It's still a type of force.

This is how force works. Threatening force works by "If you do this thing, this other thing won't happen that you won't like." And what you choose to do in this situation is entirely based on which is the lesser of two evils for you in that situation. Technically speaking even if a gun is pointed to your head you still have a choice not to listen to the person holding the gun if you don't mind dieing or if being dead seems like a better option than what you're being forced to do. Rewarding force works on the same principal. "If you do this thing, you get this other thing that you really want." What you do in this case is entirely dependent on weather you think the task handed to you is worth the reward given. And in this case sense the reward given is a requirement for advance in the game then yes it's worth it.

It's the same as working a job you hate doing. As long as you're being paid enough for a job to take care of your bills and keep you from being homeless you'll do anything your boss tells you to do. If offered a good enough reward you'd clean all the bathrooms at your work with a toothbrush not because you really want to clean bathrooms but because you're being paid to do it.

Now by your logic if no one's pointing a gun to your head telling you to clean the bathroom with a toothbrush then you're not being forced to do it at all. You're doing it because you want to and I'm sure it has nothing to do with the pay check you're getting when you're done.

The difference there is that is that you're not doing multiple defeat boss, glowy, hostage, ect. in a row without taking a break to do something else with the same rewards you've been getting for all the defeat boss, glowy, hostage, ect. missions.

There are multiple maps, goals, NPC groups, that are never completely identical to each other unless you choose to run them that way and they all give the same rewards so there's nothing preventing you from running a different mission but you.

Incarnate trials are the same map, the same goals, the same NPCs every time you do them. There's no alternatives for getting the same rewards without doing them so you're stuck running the same identical mission over and over again. That's what makes it so repeatative. The rewards are tied to repeating the same content over and over again.

There are three separate trials, right now. Each of these trials can be run in different ways, for different badges, each with different strategies.

Keep in mind that you can do regular TFs, especially the weekly TF, to progress in these "exclusive rewards."

If that's not enough for you, the devs are adding at least one trial with each new issue. It's simply a matter of development resources right now. You'll have more options in time.

Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison See, it's gems like these that make me check Claws' post history every once in a while to make sure I haven't missed anything good lately.

I'm not quite sure what you're getting at here. I know farming takes many forms that's why I compared trials with farming in the first place. You made it sound like it was just about PLing but I hate all forms of farming because it's repeatative. I have been in a few farms like you describe in your quote here to get defeat badges but I don't run them into the ground. I did a few yesterday in fact but typically I will run the farm mission ONCE run off to work on other badges, come back to the farm, and repeat until I have all the badges I'm trying to get that day. Maybe I won't even get them that day depends on how much progress I have on them already but the point is I don't continue to work on the same badge for the entire time I'm online, I only work on progress. Do it enough to put a dent in the progress and move onto the next one.

More detailed description of what I'm talking about. I had a Shivan farm. I went into the mission, killed a few Shivans till I saw the boss and left as if to reset. Most people when they run a farm will reset the mission and go right back into it. I went to sharkhead and started hunting Scrapyarders and Hellfrosts. Then I went to St. Matrial and killed some Family Bosses. Then I went to Cap to kill some Grimlins. Then I did some TV missions trying to get the Couch Potato Badge. This was all to earn progress on different badges, I didn't unlock any of them the first time I ran threw that list. After I got the Couch Potato badge I went back to hunting this time going threw that list backwards. Also I got lucky and found others working on the same badges the second time I went threw them otherwise I wouldn't of unlocked any of them yesterday, would of just got more progress and logged off for the night.

Anyway this all gave me more to do than just farming shivans till I got the badge because I was working on 6 badges all at the same time. Actually because of one of the teams I joined I also unlocked a 7th badge I needed that I wasn't even working on myself.

Typically badge farms are only repeatative because players choose to make them that way. I don't. There's nothing forcing me to work on one badge over another badge so there's no reason I can't work on them all at the same time to keep it from being repeatative.

To make the badge comparison again sense I'm already on that rant. Before the incarnate system existed the only reward giving content for level 50s was badge hunting and Hami raids or the Statesman and Lord Recluse TFs. Or I should say MAJOR reward giving content, as in Accolade powers and Hamidon Enhancements. And that's what I did with 50's before the incarnate trials and even now... sort of... All my main characters have all their accolades unlocked already so nothing more I can do with them in that respect. As far as Hamis are concerned my Defender is already fully slotted with them. He is 7 years old after all and I was doing Hami raids at least once a week back when MySpace Brian was leading raids. My main villains however... are all Masterminds... I don't know if you've ever tried to get on a Lord Recluse SF with a Mastermind... but it's nearly impossible. I had to form teams myself just to get the badge for defeating the future Freedom Phalanx and the only way I got anyone to join a team with a MM is by telling them we were only doing the badge mission. No one was even willing to try to complete the SF, that's as far as I could get them to go. This is back when the Lord Recluse SF first came out by the way.

As for the villain Hami raid... I was really excited when the devs first announced it but no one ever goes in there! We've had the villain hami raids for at least 5 years now (can't remember exactly when it first came out.) but what good is having the content available if no one is going to use it. First month it came out I went in there expecting to find allot of level 50 villains geared up for the Hami raid... but no... I was the only one there... and I can't solo Hami.

Hero Hami raids are even rare now sense the Statesman TF alternative was introduced. I think the main reason for that is because people who can't handle the graphics of the Hami raids prefer to do the TF and that seems to be the majority of players. Can't say I blame them myself I would of done Statesman and avoided the Hive if I had that option available at the time. I only did Hami raids because the Statesman TF didn't exist yet.

Anyway... with all that content available there was no rewards limiting me to doing any one thing. I could work on one set of rewards one min. and other set the next. I didn't have to do Hami raid after Hami raid, there was enough content that left room for me to do other things like badge hunting. And as previously stated I never focused on one badge at a time. I work on it till I get bored and then work on a different badge. Even with all the badges I don't have to do hami raids all the time. I mean I get the Hami-o after 1 run so I don't need to run it again, I already got the reward. I can get multiple Hami-o's but I'm not trying to fully equip on them in a day.

Incarnate trials work by rewarding you with limited IXP, threads, and components so you only get PROGRESS to a reward, you don't unlock anything new with each trial run. I can't unlock and slot Interface just by 1 run of each trial like I can slot a HO with 1 hami raid. It's like leveling up your character. You can't gain an entire level in only 3 missions. Thus it becomes repeatative because you can't do anything else to get the rewards so you have to run them again regardless of what you actually want to do.

You think the problem is with me. You keep telling me to do something else as if that will solve the problem. But you're not listening to what the problem actually is. As stated multiple times threw out this topic I am doing other things besides these trials. It's only your false assumptions that I'm not doing other things. But I'm also trying to get the rewards for these trials at the same time and even with breaks I'm still required to run trials more than I care to in order to unlock anything.

If it were my choice I'd only run ONE of each trial a day, preferably not even that because I'd like there to be enough trials that I don't have to run the same ones multiple days in a row. However it is not my choice because of programming I have to run these freaking things till I'm bored of them just to unlock one power. That's like the equivalent of running the Hami-raid 8 times just to get one HO. Hami raids don't work that way, you get the HO the first time you run it, not 8 raids later.

I'm doing Trials over and over regardless of weather or not I actually want to because I have to run them or I don't get anything for doing them. That's allot of work for nothing. Though you get progress towards something which would be fine if there were more to do.

You can tell me to do something else all you want but that isn't going to fix the issue. Which the issue is something else is not going to unlock my Incarnate powers. I'm not having issues finding something else to do like you seem to think. I'm having issues finding something else to do AND STILL BE ABLE TO GET INCARNATE POWERS.

You seem to be having issues telling the difference between a complaint about the lack of over all content in the game and what my actual complaint is in this topic, the lack of INCARNATE content in the game.

I keep talking about the incarnate rewards till I'm blue in the face and no one seems to understand what the heck I'm talking about. I'm not speaking another language here am I? The problem is the game not me. It's not my fault that there isn't any other content.

What's really great is you guys talk like it's my fault when you all want the same thing. Look at your quote here.

This is exactly the type of comment this topic was made for. In this one line of dialog you have agreed with everything I said in my first post and contributed something new to discussion. Why can't your entire post be like this instead of focusing on people's assumptions of things I never even said.

BTW it's people like this guy here that I created this topic for. Thanks for chiming in.

Have you ever seen anything saying that advancing your character past level 1 is mandatory or somehow required to play the game?

Your entire argument is based on a contradiction. If you're not advancing in the game then what are you doing in the game? Nothing, you're not even playing it. Advancement in a game is a natural part of playing the game.

I've read this like 5 times now and I still can't figure out what you're talking about. It doesn't make any sense. I assume the one story arc you're referring to is the story arc to unlock the Alpha Slot which has nothing to do with the other 4 incarnate slots. And the two things you originally started to talk about turned into that one story arc some how. I seriously don't have a clue what you're trying to say here. Are the two things you originally mentioned different than the story arc you mentioned at the end, is this just a typing error, what's going on here.

This entire statement is contradicting and confusing.

Advancing my characters is a natural part of playing the game. Playing any game in fact. You play to get better at the game and win the rewards the game offers. Rewards are needed to play the game because they add to the game play. Badges are not needed to play the game because they don't add anything to your character. You're not going to advance your character by having more badges than any other character. But you are going to advance your character by having more incarnate abilities and higher tier abilities than other characters. Saying that it's not needed to play the game is like saying you don't need to level up past level 1 to play the game. It's a part of playing the game, you can't do one without the other.

And this the confusing part. A significant number of things I'd be locked out of if I don't have all 5 incarnate slots? That doesn't make any sense. The 5 incarnate slot are the significant number of things I'd be locked out of if I don't have them. What the heck kinda backwards talk is this? I don't need $10,000 because it's not going to buy me $10,000 if I have it? Why would I need to buy $10,000 if I already had it. You're not making any sense.

Seriously I have no idea what you're saying the entire post is full of contradicting sentences. A paragraph that starts off talking about one thing and never finishes it's point then goes off on something completely different. And the last paragraph is a time paradox apparently. I don't know, how does not unlocking incarnate powers not unlock incarnate powers. I don't understand a word of it.

Yes please.

Nice try.

This....is not true.

However, this IS.


Just because you don't understand something does not mean it doesn't make sense. You just failed to understand it.

I'll put it this way:

Do you need the Incarnate powers? By which I mean, is there anything in the game you cannot do if you don't have them? Content you are not allowed, by the game, to participate in if you do not have those powers?

No, there is no such content in the game. There is nothing at all that you cannot do if you lack those powers. Whether you have Incarnate powers or not has no relevance to your ability to participate in anything a level 50 character can participate in.

Since that is absolutely true, it means you do not need those powers, you want those powers. The game did not make that decision for you, you decided all by yourself that you wanted them.

Since those powers are something you want, and not something you need, there is nothing forcing you to acquire them other than your desire to have them.

Now, is the game putting you into an Incarnate trial automatically the second you log in, without giving you the option of doing something else instead?

No? It's not forcing you to do it then. If you have to actively seek something out to participate in it, you are not being forced into it.

The game is not forcing you to do that content over and over again, you are doing so of your own volition.

Having fun is the point of playing the game. It's the point of playing any game. If dancing in Atlas Park and never gaining so much as a single point of XP is fun for you, then you're doing it right. But I expect you won't understand that either.

Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison See, it's gems like these that make me check Claws' post history every once in a while to make sure I haven't missed anything good lately.