Only thing i could answer, is no, still cant soft cap a fire tank 
@MachineSlave | Infinity Server | Deepdown Traumahounds Supergroup | Co-Founder
Tankers : Ice/Ele, Fire/SS, Fire/DM, Invul/Fire, Ele/Stone Corrupter : Arch/TA
Scrappers : DM/DA, Kat/SR Brutes : Fire/Shield, Ele/Fire(Villian)
Controllers : Fire/Kin, Ele/Rad, Earth/Cold
The main issue with a Fire Tank is that it doesnt have a defense powerbuilt in that will help it softcap easier like many other sets do. My fire tank sits very firmily at 35% melee defense and beteen a massive heal that is up every 15-20 seconds ( and only going to get better with Spiritual Alpha ), and Lots of AoE Damage, I survive quite well.
I have some very very serious concerns about the " soft cap " going forward. I full expect to see more and more mobs that cut right through defense or whittle it down to nothing and people who are reliant on the soft cap for defense are going to suffer.
My focus is to look at what the character I am building does well. Go with that.. and then try to shore up what he doesnt do well WITHOUT sacrficing what he already does well.
For example I have seen build that left out key powers. Builds that took something and slotted it ridiculously just to get 1.88 defense in that last slot.. things like that..
Yet they have endurance issue and do less damage...
Fire/Fire Tank IMO are the... Ill get you before you get me tank... The ability for a Fire/Fire to take down a mob quickly is very functional to his survival, as is the ability to get that mssive heal up ASAP. I wont sacrifice that for a wee bit more defense.
The hard things I can do--- The impossible just take a little bit longer.
If numbers are so much more important than a teammate who is fun to play with, forget about the game altogether and go play with a calculator instead. -Claws and Effect-
I went to 32.5% typed defense to s/l/e/n damage (and less to f/c). Positoinal melee defense would probably be stronger, but I was able to get typed defense without six-slotting entire sets, so I was better able to keep my enhancement values as high as I liked on my attacks. And the attacks are a big part of Fire/Fire/Pyre.
If we are to die, let us die like men. -- Patrick Cleburne
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The rule is that they must be loved. --Jayne Fynes-Clinton, Death of an Abandoned Dog
Quote:
Actually this is incorrect. It IS possible to soft-cap a fire/tank to at least S/L.|
Originally Posted by MachineSlave
Only thing i could answer, is no, still cant soft cap a fire tank
|
However the build tends to be severely compromised in other areas.
Hero Plan by Mids' Hero Designer 1.92
http://www.cohplanner.com/
Click this DataLink to open the build!
Level 50 Mutation Tanker
Primary Power Set: Fiery Aura
Secondary Power Set: Fiery Melee
Power Pool: Fighting
Power Pool: Leaping
Hero Profile:
Level 1: Blazing Aura -- Empty(A), Empty(3), Empty(3), Empty(5), Empty(5), Empty(7)
Level 1: Scorch -- KntkC'bat-Dmg/Rchg:35(A), KntkC'bat-Acc/Dmg:35(7), KntkC'bat-Dmg/EndRdx:35(9), KntkC'bat-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg:35(9), Mako-Acc/Dmg:50(46)
Level 2: Fire Shield -- RctvArm-ResDam:40(A), RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx:40(11), RctvArm-ResDam/Rchg:40(11), RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg:40(13), S'fstPrt-ResDam/Def+:30(13)
Level 4: Healing Flames -- Empty(A), Empty(15), Empty(15)
Level 6: Combustion -- Oblit-%Dam:50(A), Oblit-Dmg:50(17), Oblit-Acc/Rchg:50(17), Oblit-Dmg/Rchg:50(19), Oblit-Acc/Dmg/Rchg:50(19), Oblit-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg:50(21)
Level 8: Temperature Protection -- RctvArm-ResDam:40(A), RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx:40(21), RctvArm-ResDam/Rchg:40(23), RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg:40(23), GA-3defTpProc:50(42)
Level 10: Consume -- Empty(A), Empty(25), Empty(25)
Level 12: Taunt -- Mocking-Taunt:50(A), Mocking-Taunt/Rchg:50(27), Mocking-Taunt/Rchg/Rng:50(27), Mocking-Acc/Rchg:50(29), Mocking-Taunt/Rng:50(29), Mocking-Rchg:50(31)
Level 14: Plasma Shield -- RctvArm-ResDam:40(A), RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx:40(31), RctvArm-ResDam/Rchg:40(31), RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg:40(33)
Level 16: Boxing -- KntkC'bat-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg:35(A), KntkC'bat-Acc/Dmg:35(33), KntkC'bat-Dmg/EndRdx:35(33), KntkC'bat-Dmg/Rchg:35(34), Mako-Acc/Dmg:50(46)
Level 18: Tough -- RctvArm-ResDam:40(A), RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx:40(34), RctvArm-ResDam/Rchg:40(34), RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg:40(36)
Level 20: Weave -- HO:Enzym(A), HO:Enzym(36)
Level 22: Build Up -- GSFC-ToHit:50(A), GSFC-ToHit/Rchg:50(36), GSFC-ToHit/Rchg/EndRdx:50(37), GSFC-Rchg/EndRdx:50(37), GSFC-ToHit/EndRdx:50(37), GSFC-Build%:50(39)
Level 24: Burn -- Oblit-Dmg:50(A), Oblit-Acc/Rchg:50(39), Oblit-Dmg/Rchg:50(39), Oblit-Acc/Dmg/Rchg:50(40), Oblit-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg:50(40), Oblit-%Dam:50(40)
Level 26: Fiery Embrace -- Empty(A), Empty(42)
Level 28: Fire Sword Circle -- Empty(A)
Level 30: Combat Jumping -- HO:Enzym(A), HO:Enzym(42)
Level 32: Super Jump -- Empty(A), Empty(43)
Level 35: Incinerate -- KntkC'bat-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg:35(A), KntkC'bat-Acc/Dmg:35(43), KntkC'bat-Dmg/EndRdx:35(43), KntkC'bat-Dmg/Rchg:35(45), Mako-Acc/Dmg:50(48)
Level 38: Rise of the Phoenix -- Empty(A)
Level 41: Greater Fire Sword -- KntkC'bat-Acc/Dmg:35(A), KntkC'bat-Dmg/EndRdx:35(45), KntkC'bat-Dmg/Rchg:35(45), KntkC'bat-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg:35(46), Mako-Acc/Dmg:50(48)
Level 44: Acrobatics -- EndRdx-I:50(A)
Level 47: [Empty]
Level 49: [Empty]
------------
Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Gauntlet
Level 1: Sprint -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
Level 4: Ninja Run
Level 2: Swift -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Health -- Empty(A), Empty(50), Empty(50)
Level 2: Hurdle -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Stamina -- Empty(A), Empty(48), Empty(50)
------------
Set Bonus Totals:
- 8.5% DamageBuff(Smashing)
- 8.5% DamageBuff(Lethal)
- 8.5% DamageBuff(Fire)
- 8.5% DamageBuff(Cold)
- 8.5% DamageBuff(Energy)
- 8.5% DamageBuff(Negative)
- 8.5% DamageBuff(Toxic)
- 8.5% DamageBuff(Psionic)
- 33.5% Defense(Smashing)
- 33.5% Defense(Lethal)
- 10.38% Defense(Fire)
- 10.38% Defense(Cold)
- 12.25% Defense(Energy)
- 12.25% Defense(Negative)
- 6% Defense(Psionic)
- 27.25% Defense(Melee)
- 11% Defense(Ranged)
- 10.06% Defense(AoE)
- 1.8% Max End
- 17.5% Enhancement(RechargeTime)
- 18% Enhancement(Accuracy)
- 5% FlySpeed
- 147.58 HP (7.875%) HitPoints
- 5% JumpHeight
- 5% JumpSpeed
- MezResist(Held) 2.75%
- MezResist(Immobilize) 15.4%
- MezResist(Stun) 4.4%
- 2.5% (0.042 End/sec) Recovery
- 5% RunSpeed
------------
Set Bonuses:
Kinetic Combat
(Scorch)
- MezResist(Immobilize) 2.75%
- 28.11 HP (1.5%) HitPoints
- 3.75% Defense(Smashing,Lethal), 1.875% Defense(Melee)
(Fire Shield)
- MezResist(Immobilize) 1.1%
- 1.25% Defense(Energy,Negative), 0.625% Defense(Ranged)
- 1.25% Defense(Smashing,Lethal), 0.625% Defense(Melee)
(Fire Shield)
- 3% Defense(Melee), 3% Defense(AoE), 3% Defense(Ranged), 3% Defense(Smashing), 3% Defense(Lethal), 3% Defense(Fire), 3% Defense(Cold), 3% Defense(Energy), 3% Defense(Negative), 3% Defense(Psionic)
(Combustion)
- MezResist(Stun) 2.2%
- 3% DamageBuff(All)
- 9% Enhancement(Accuracy)
- 5% Enhancement(RechargeTime)
- 3.75% Defense(Melee), 1.875% Defense(Lethal), 1.875% Defense(Smashing)
(Temperature Protection)
- MezResist(Immobilize) 1.1%
- 1.25% Defense(Energy,Negative), 0.625% Defense(Ranged)
- 1.25% Defense(Smashing,Lethal), 0.625% Defense(Melee)
(Temperature Protection)
- 3% Defense(Melee), 3% Defense(AoE), 3% Defense(Ranged), 3% Defense(Smashing), 3% Defense(Lethal), 3% Defense(Fire), 3% Defense(Cold), 3% Defense(Energy), 3% Defense(Negative), 3% Defense(Psionic)
(Taunt)
- 1.8% Max End
- MezResist(Held) 2.75%
- 2.5% Defense(Smashing,Lethal), 1.25% Defense(Melee)
- 3.125% Defense(Fire,Cold), 1.563% Defense(AoE)
- 7.5% Enhancement(RechargeTime)
(Plasma Shield)
- MezResist(Immobilize) 1.1%
- 1.25% Defense(Energy,Negative), 0.625% Defense(Ranged)
- 1.25% Defense(Smashing,Lethal), 0.625% Defense(Melee)
(Boxing)
- MezResist(Immobilize) 2.75%
- 28.11 HP (1.5%) HitPoints
- 3.75% Defense(Smashing,Lethal), 1.875% Defense(Melee)
(Tough)
- MezResist(Immobilize) 1.1%
- 1.25% Defense(Energy,Negative), 0.625% Defense(Ranged)
- 1.25% Defense(Smashing,Lethal), 0.625% Defense(Melee)
(Build Up)
- 5% JumpSpeed, 5% JumpHeight, 5% FlySpeed, 5% RunSpeed
- 35.14 HP (1.875%) HitPoints
- 2.5% (0.042 End/sec) Recovery
- 2.5% DamageBuff(All)
- 2.5% Defense(Melee), 1.25% Defense(Lethal), 1.25% Defense(Smashing), 2.5% Defense(Ranged), 1.25% Defense(Energy), 1.25% Defense(Negative), 2.5% Defense(AoE), 1.25% Defense(Fire), 1.25% Defense(Cold)
(Burn)
- MezResist(Stun) 2.2%
- 3% DamageBuff(All)
- 9% Enhancement(Accuracy)
- 5% Enhancement(RechargeTime)
- 3.75% Defense(Melee), 1.875% Defense(Lethal), 1.875% Defense(Smashing)
(Incinerate)
- MezResist(Immobilize) 2.75%
- 28.11 HP (1.5%) HitPoints
- 3.75% Defense(Smashing,Lethal), 1.875% Defense(Melee)
(Greater Fire Sword)
- MezResist(Immobilize) 2.75%
- 28.11 HP (1.5%) HitPoints
- 3.75% Defense(Smashing,Lethal), 1.875% Defense(Melee)
Code:
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Clicking on the linked image above will take you off the City of Heroes site. However, the guides will be linked back here.
Any tank can softcap to S/L. Fire Armor seems to have the hardest time getting there, but in the end it's just a matter of influence.
Mains (Freedom) @Auroxis
Auroxis - Emp/Rad/Power Defender Pylon Video Soloing an AV
Pelvic Thunder - SS/Elec/Mu Brute
Sorajin - Elec/Nin Stalker
Neuropain - Sonic/Mental/Elec Blaster
Quote:
It's fairly easy to softcap a Fire/Fire tank to S/L damage. The problem with this and any Resistance-based build is that there's no Defense Debuff Resistance -- when you do get hit by a defense debuff, you can lose a significant amount of defense very quickly.|
Originally Posted by Gunslinger71
Now with IOs and alphas, can a FireFire tank acquire a build that gets him/her to soft cap def? And what def values does a fire/fire tank want to concentrate on improving (Defense: Melee as opposed to Defense: Smashing)?
|
The build below softcaps S/L to 47%, while providing a good single-target attack chain and four AoE attacks. The only thing I feel like I sacrificed on was leaving Blazing Aura out, and I may yet swap that back in, but I'm still not sure what to give up.
As to whether Melee or Smash/Lethal is better, I'd say S/L is better. I soft-capped an Electric/Electric brute to melee as an experiment (relatively cheap to do this). I wasn't very happy with it. I changed the build to be soft-capped to S/L and I liked the result much better. Things like Malta gunmen just shredded me with melee defense; with S/L it's definitely better (though they still are very annoying).
Hero Plan by Mids' Hero Designer 1.91
http://www.cohplanner.com/
Click this DataLink to open the build!
Fiery Wrath: Level 50 Mutation Tanker
Primary Power Set: Fiery Aura
Secondary Power Set: Fiery Melee
Power Pool: Leaping
Power Pool: Fighting
Ancillary Pool: Pyre Mastery
Hero Profile:
Level 1: Fire Shield -- RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx(A), RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(3), RctvArm-EndRdx(3), RctvArm-ResDam(5), S'fstPrt-ResKB(5)
Level 1: Scorch -- KntkC'bat-Acc/Dmg(A), KntkC'bat-Dmg/EndRdx(7), KntkC'bat-Dmg/Rchg(7), KntkC'bat-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(9), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(9)
Level 2: Healing Flames -- Dct'dW-EndRdx/Rchg(A), Dct'dW-Heal/Rchg(11), Dct'dW-Heal/EndRdx/Rchg(11), Dct'dW-Heal(13), Dct'dW-Rchg(13)
Level 4: Combustion -- Oblit-Dmg(A), Oblit-Acc/Rchg(15), Oblit-Dmg/Rchg(15), Oblit-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(17), Oblit-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(17), Oblit-%Dam(19)
Level 6: Combat Jumping -- Krma-ResKB(A)
Level 8: Fire Sword -- KntkC'bat-Acc/Dmg(A), KntkC'bat-Dmg/EndRdx(19), KntkC'bat-Dmg/Rchg(21), KntkC'bat-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(21), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(23)
Level 10: Temperature Protection -- S'fstPrt-ResDam/Def+(A)
Level 12: Plasma Shield -- RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx(A), RctvArm-ResDam/Rchg(23), RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(25), RctvArm-ResDam(25), S'fstPrt-ResKB(27)
Level 14: Super Jump -- Winter-ResSlow(A)
Level 16: Boxing -- Empty(A)
Level 18: Burn -- Oblit-Dmg(A), Oblit-Acc/Rchg(27), Oblit-Dmg/Rchg(29), Oblit-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(29), Oblit-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(31), Oblit-%Dam(31)
Level 20: Tough -- RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx(A), RctvArm-ResDam/Rchg(31), RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(33), RctvArm-ResDam(33)
Level 22: Weave -- LkGmblr-Rchg+(A), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx(33), LkGmblr-Def(34), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(34)
Level 24: Consume -- Mocking-Acc/Rchg(A), Mocking-Taunt/Rchg/Rng(34), Mocking-Rchg(36), Mocking-Taunt/Rchg(36)
Level 26: Fiery Embrace -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(36), RechRdx-I(37)
Level 28: Fire Sword Circle -- Oblit-Dmg(A), Oblit-Acc/Rchg(37), Oblit-Dmg/Rchg(37), Oblit-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(39), Oblit-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(39), Oblit-%Dam(39)
Level 30: Taunt -- Mocking-Taunt(A), Mocking-Taunt/Rchg(40), Mocking-Taunt/Rchg/Rng(40), Mocking-Taunt/Rng(40)
Level 32: Build Up -- Rec'dRet-Pcptn(A), Rec'dRet-ToHit/Rchg(42)
Level 35: Incinerate -- KntkC'bat-Acc/Dmg(A), KntkC'bat-Dmg/EndRdx(42), KntkC'bat-Dmg/Rchg(42), KntkC'bat-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(43), F'dSmite-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(43)
Level 38: Greater Fire Sword -- KntkC'bat-Acc/Dmg(A), KntkC'bat-Dmg/EndRdx(43), KntkC'bat-Dmg/Rchg(45), KntkC'bat-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(45), F'dSmite-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(45)
Level 41: Ring of Fire -- Enf'dOp-Acc/EndRdx(A), Enf'dOp-Immob/Rng(46), Enf'dOp-Acc/Immob/Rchg(46), Enf'dOp-Acc/Immob(46)
Level 44: Char -- HO:Endo(A)
Level 47: Fire Ball -- Posi-Acc/Dmg(A), Posi-Dmg/EndRdx(48), Posi-Dmg/Rchg(48), Posi-Dmg/Rng(48), Posi-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(50)
Level 49: Rise of the Phoenix -- Dmg-I(A)
------------
Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- Run-I(A)
Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Gauntlet
Level 4: Ninja Run
Level 2: Swift -- Run-I(A)
Level 2: Hurdle -- Jump-I(A)
Level 2: Health -- Mrcl-Rcvry+(A)
Level 2: Stamina -- EndMod-I(A), EndMod-I(50), P'Shift-End%(50)
Code:
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It seems worth mentioning if you're just bringing back a old F/F tank: going dark side and doing a patron arc to pick up soul mastery and the tasty tasty darkest night might be valueable. -20% incoming damage, -16% to-hit on the enemies.
Combine that with a very-reasonable 30 to 35% defense build and you're effectively at softcap since you can cast DN from around a corner via cast-jumping if you do it right. Or just cast on the way in -- it'll probably be up before anything big hits you.
Plus it nets you a ranged ST attack, and has the possibility of another AoE, this time ranged. Nice for pulling ambush aggro to you before it sees the rest of your party. And for added fun both of those also have more -to-hit in them which you can stack with DN.
Quote:
this|
Originally Posted by Auroxis
Any tank can softcap to S/L. Fire Armor seems to have the hardest time getting there, but in the end it's just a matter of influence.
|
my fire tank IS soft capped.the issue is money.but thanks to incarnates you can help that out alittle. nerve has a defense bonus and with the lvl shift it makes your defene even higher..not much but enough. take advantage of these things to help it out
also use hero merits if you dont have the influnece..since the weekely strike target is out you can also use reward merits to fuel your hero merits to get even more what you want.
there simply isnt an issue to make what ever build you want . unless your just plain lazy
if you wanna be lazy then play a invul and not a fire tank.
Now with IOs and alphas, can a FireFire tank acquire a build that gets him/her to soft cap def? And what def values does a fire/fire tank want to concentrate on improving (Defense: Melee as opposed to Defense: Smashing)?