Back after a year - Tweaking my Mind/NRG Dream Build.
By
BlackBellatrix,
Posted on: 2011-01-05 22:25 in Dominators
I've seen Defense builds before, but from what I have seen, everyone that's ever tried them out tend to say it wasn't worth running all the toggles because of the fact that your holds make defense superfluous, so the toggles end up draining endurance that you could be using for other things. That's an impressive amount of defense, yeah, but you'll still need your holds for everything that's not Energy, Negative, or Ranged, and unfortunately, you've weakened your ST Hold considerably by 4-only slotting it with Basilisk's. Yeah, Basilisk's are great for the set bonuses, but you still want to fill two more slots with other sets to amp up its hold duration and recharge to max.
If you're dead set on a no-hasten permadom with Defense, go for it, it's your game, your money, your time, etc. I advise against it, however, since this is not only a very expensive build, requiring many purples, it's a sub-optimal build. Look at what you had to give up: you gave up Total Focus, Bone Smasher, Poisonous Ray, Tactics is sitting there useless, your ST Hold and AoE Hold are both woefully underslotted, Fly is overslotted, and worse yet, your defense against Melee and AoE, as well as everything that's not Energy and Negative, is not going to do you a whole lot of good against higher-level mobs. Arachnoids will eat you alive.
Also, I have a Performance Shifter Chance For +end in my Stamina. I barely notice it. It's not worth giving up a second EndMod IO.
Thanks for your input. I'm not sure that you noticed, but my S/L Defense on that build is also 39, so the only thing that would be a huge concern is non-ranged Fire and Cold damage.
As far as underslotting my holds, keep in mind that I am planning on going Nerve for my Alpha Slot, which will give me +33% to my Accuracy and Hold Duration, to begin with, until the Rare and Very Rare are available.
I also understand that with my control, the defense seems superfluous but I plan on running many TFs with this toon and like to not have to completely rely on my Holds landing.
Anyway, thanks for the input, I am considering moving some slots around. I've also been playing with the idea of going for Mind/Fire instead, as it has a ranged AoE, but we'll see.
My main is also Mind/Energy. I've also played many many Controllers and Masterminds, so I have some good perspective and thoughtful insight in to how the game plays out, and how various powers work strategically both solo and in groups.
I'll second everything that Vid said. I read your post yesterday, and everything that Vid said was exactly what was going through my mind:
1. High defense builds for a Dom really aren't worth it.
There's a trend where people try to build their Dom like they build like other ATs, with defense. The problem is that you're not going to get defense to appreciable levels to make a much of a difference. When you go against +2 or higher mobs or certain mob types, the defense won't even be noticed.
Your controls are your and your team's survivability. Work to make those available as often as you can. The controls are far superior to defense anyways. If you have them up frequently, use them smartly and play strategically, you will only very rarely ever get hit. Especially with Mind, you have a phenomenal toolkit available to play strategically.
The mindset of a Dominator is strategic, smart play. If your mindset is a high defense build for survivability, you will be disappointed with Dominator -- you would be much happier with another AT, like Tank, Scrapper, or Brute.
2. All of the toggles in the build are going to suck endurance away like mad. Even if you stick to just the +Def toggles, it's still going to be super Endurance hungry. Even if you slot Incarnate with endurance reduction, it's still going going to heavily suck Endurance.
3. Not taking Hasten is a huge mistake. Hasten is a must for an effective Dom. Here's why:
- Hasten will allow your AoE controls, which are on a long recharge, to refresh much faster.
In the build, I see that Mass Confusion and Total Domination are refreshing in about 88 seconds -- that's a terrible refresh, to be frank. Since Mind lacks a fast recharging AoE stun or confuse like most of the other control sets, it has to use staggered Mass Confusion and Total Domination to make up for it.Just as you can measure a Damage Dealer's output in terms of Damage Per Second (DPS), you can measure a Control Primary in terms of Control Per Second. The control output of this build is really, really bad -- Hasten fixes that.
- If you go against enemy types that have a -recharge power -- which you will encounter frequently in the 40+ range -- your tiny margin for Perma-Dom will vanish. Hasten provides a nice buffer for that.
- I see in the build that Domination is recharging in 88 seconds, only a 2 second gap. With that small of a gap, you're going to have to watch it like a hawk to recast it. If you set it on auto-cast, the problem then is that it won't recast when you have a enemy targeted -- which will happen very frequently with only a 2 second margin.
- In addition to your control powers, hasten will also allow your damage dealing powers to refresh much faster too. Power Boost, which is a key to the build, will refresh faster as well.
- The Alpha Incarnate slot won't affect Domination.
- Hasten will allow you to reach perma-Dom much more quickly and cheaply.
I know that you said that the build is expensive, and that you're fine with that. But, I'm not sure if you realize just how expensive the purple sets are these days (prices have inflated quite a bit in the last year). Each individual recipe for most of the Purple sets will run about 300-500 million. To get 5 recipes for a single set will cost 1.5 to 2.5 billion. The rare salvage also costs a lot on top of that, as the ones that are needed for the purple sets are in very high demand.
Even if you do wind up spending the many billions to achieve this build, it will be, to re-emphasize what Vid said, sub-optimal.
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I would advise against Mind/Fire, or Mind/anything that doesn't have Power Boost in the secondary.|
Originally Posted by BlackBellatrix
I've also been playing with the idea of going for Mind/Fire instead, as it has a ranged AoE, but we'll see.
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When you're against higher level mobs, the duration of your control powers will be reduced. The Incarnate missions in particular are always against +4 level mobs, which trivializes the duration to laughably short times.
Power Boost corrects that by doubling the duration of your controls.
Maybe I misinterpreted the AT, then. I had felt, from playing up to 30 so far, that Dominators were at least as much about dealing damage as they are about their control.
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imo, power boost starts to become superfluous once you are able to achieve perma-dom. i have a mind/psi that doesn't have it and doesn't need it... even for apex/tin man.
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Originally Posted by Excelsio
I would advise against Mind/Fire, or Mind/anything that doesn't have Power Boost in the secondary.
When you're against higher level mobs, the duration of your control powers will be reduced. The Incarnate missions in particular are always against +4 level mobs, which trivializes the duration to laughably short times. Power Boost corrects that by doubling the duration of your controls. |
SG: Guadians of Paragon - VG: Paragon's Darkness
The Usual Suspects: Fimboolvetr (Icer Tank), Tsukiyomi (Mind/Psi/Ice Dom), Smiting Dragon (Dm/Sr Scrap), Widow Mortis (NW)
Up and Comers: Ameterasu (Km/Reg Scrap), Arrhymian (Elec/Nin Stalk), TDMKII (Bot/Traps MM)
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Damage dealers on teams are common. What a Dominator brings to the table that's uncommon is added team survivability through control. Perma-doms bring something to teams that no other AT can offer: double-mag control, which will take out bosses with one application.|
Originally Posted by BlackBellatrix
Maybe I misinterpreted the AT, then. I had felt, from playing up to 30 so far, that Dominators were at least as much about dealing damage as they are about their control.
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A Blaster will do better damage than a Dom -- the damage scale is slightly better. A Blaster also has a Tier 9 nuke which Doms lack.
A Kin Defender or Corrupter, or Fire/Kin Controller will also easily out-damage a Dom, assuming the Dom doesn't have a Kin on their team -- if you are a Kin, you always have the powerset with you.
In particular, Fire/Kin Controllers are still the gold-standard for farming, because of the combination of really sick damage (that far exceeds any Dom solo), plus great survivability against anything that's affected by the fast-recharging Flashfire. Containment, which doubles damage after Fulcrum Shift has been applied, causes an entire group of +1/x8 to melt in just a few seconds. I know, because I have a Fire/Kin.
Kins also greatly boost the output of the entire team: Fulcrum Shift caps damage; Speed Boost speeds up recharge of teammates' powers plus provides hefty endurance recovery; Transference provides basically endless endurance for everyone; and Transfusion is a very strong and fast recharging melee heal. Siphon Speed relieves a lot of the need to have to stack global recharge, allowing a lot more build freedom to go after other set bonuses. Transference also allows a Kin to run a lot of toggles.
Compared to a Dom who's not in Domination, a Kin controller is a much better team contributor and is also more survivable than a Dominator: all of the same controls are available and they last longer than a Dom outside of Domination. The Kin's powers are also there enhancing everyone's effectiveness. And if you're a Fire/Kin Controller, you offer all of that plus better damage than a Dom. In every measurable way, better.
It's only when a Dom is in Domination that they will pull ahead and offer something unique to the team. That's why Perma-Dom is so greatly sought after.
Quote:
Right. But you're sacrificing both in this build, all so you can have defense. I think you've underestimated just how much you're giving up. We went over controls mostly because we want to stress that those are your Primary powers, which make Defense unnecessary, and which you are going to be using anyway, but I now want to stress the fact that you're also giving up your big damage powers completely. Without Total Focus, or Bone Smasher, or even Poisonous Ray, your DPS is going to be that of an all-range build. An all-range build with end problems. Nothing is worse for your DPS than an empty blue bar. That's why I went Cardiac. You actually have more at stake than I do, though, because your defense relies on your blue bar as well. At least when I run out of end, it's just irritating.|
Originally Posted by BlackBellatrix
Maybe I misinterpreted the AT, then. I had felt, from playing up to 30 so far, that Dominators were at least as much about dealing damage as they are about their control.
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Speaking of which, why even take Tactics with the build you have? All it's doing is wasting a massive amount of endurance, which you already can't spare. Take Vengeance and give it a LotG. You have Assault and Maneuvers, you have a 66% global accuracy buff, and Tactics is being single-slotted. Only reason to have tactics is the Adjusted Targeting bonus, which you're not using it for.
Just to hit home how much end you're going to be using up, I went Cardiac Incarnate, and the only toggles I run are Combat Jumping (which uses almost 0 end), Tactics (5-slotted and using up very little end), and Maneuvers. I have Stamina slotted with two Lv50 Common EndMod IOs, plus a Performance Shifter Chance for +End. I still run out of endurance in long fights, and I run dry very quickly if I forget to turn off Super Speed. My Total Focus and Energy Transfer use up maybe 7 Endurance a pop because there's so much end redux in my powers. If you ran two-slotted Telekinesis permanently, that's how much end per second you're using up, and once you run out, your defense all disappears.
But if you really want this build, I shall reiterate, go for it, but you wanted feedback, so you got feedback.
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I appreciate it. Sorry if it sounded otherwise. I think I am going to take a step back and go with a less expensive build for this toon, anyway, since I just remembered how much I love my SS/Shield Brute. I'll tweak up a less expensive build, probably with Hasten, and throw it up in a little while.|
Originally Posted by Vidszhite
But if you really want this build, I shall reiterate, go for it, but you wanted feedback, so you got feedback.
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I am thinking, however, that I will lose the Scorpion PPP and go Fire. I plan on keeping my Ranged Def, because currently, at level 30, I'm liking the Hover and blow **** up style of build, but I think I'll focus less on getting Perma-Dom without Hasten. I have 30 Def on my current build and doubt, with good recharge and control, that I'll really need much more. One luck from soft-cap is probably plenty, in most cases. Especially if I stay airborne and stealthed.
So, really, yeah, thanks for the help!
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Anytime. We wish you well. |
Originally Posted by BlackBellatrix
I appreciate it. Sorry if it sounded otherwise. I think I am going to take a step back and go with a less expensive build for this toon, anyway, since I just remembered how much I love my SS/Shield Brute. I'll tweak up a less expensive build, probably with Hasten, and throw it up in a little while.
I am thinking, however, that I will lose the Scorpion PPP and go Fire. I plan on keeping my Ranged Def, because currently, at level 30, I'm liking the Hover and blow **** up style of build, but I think I'll focus less on getting Perma-Dom without Hasten. I have 30 Def on my current build and doubt, with good recharge and control, that I'll really need much more. One luck from soft-cap is probably plenty, in most cases. Especially if I stay airborne and stealthed. So, really, yeah, thanks for the help! |
So I let my subscription lapse over a year ago now and, finally, nostalgia has sucked me back in. After taking a couple days to relearn the game and get used to the changes (Fitness as an inherent! Who would have thought?), I have been working on tweaking some of my old builds to fit the new game. I have a Mind/Energy Dom who isn't even 50 yet, but I enjoy playing her a ton and really like the build I dreamed up.
It's a build where I'm going Perma-Dom without Hasten with also going high defense (39 S/L, 43.5ish Ranged, 50+ Energy, 40s Negative and only 20 F/C but that's ok.)
As for my Alpha Slot, I am planning on going Nerve with an eye towards going Radial Paragon once they release it.
So, here is the build. Thanks in advance for anyone who looks at it. (Yes, I know it'll be very expensive, that's fine.)
Edit: While I know Cold Mastery would probably be superior, I'm not sure how I can justify taking it, character concept wise. The toon is basically an evil genius type who built her own power suit to amplify her own latent mental powers as well as give herself blasts. I'm sure I could add /Cold in as an added tech but it seems to be a little lame as far as her concept goes.
Villain Plan by Mids' Villain Designer 1.91
http://www.cohplanner.com/
Click this DataLink to open the build!
Level 50 Magic Dominator
Primary Power Set: Mind Control
Secondary Power Set: Energy Assault
Power Pool: Flight
Power Pool: Concealment
Power Pool: Leadership
Power Pool: Fighting
Ancillary Pool: Mace Mastery
Villain Profile:
Level 1: Mesmerize -- FtnHyp-Sleep/Rchg(A), FtnHyp-Acc/Sleep/Rchg(3), FtnHyp-Acc/Rchg(27), FtnHyp-Sleep/EndRdx(27), FtnHyp-Plct%(37)
Level 1: Power Bolt -- Thundr-Acc/Dmg(A), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(19), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx(37), Thundr-Dmg/Rchg(40), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(42), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(43)
Level 2: Dominate -- BasGaze-Acc/Rchg(A), BasGaze-Rchg/Hold(3), BasGaze-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg/Hold(21), BasGaze-EndRdx/Rchg/Hold(43)
Level 4: Power Push -- Apoc-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(A), Apoc-Dmg/Rchg(5), Apoc-Acc/Rchg(5), Apoc-Dam%(11), Apoc-Dmg/EndRdx(34)
Level 6: Hover -- LkGmblr-Rchg+(A), Zephyr-Travel/EndRdx(7), Zephyr-Travel(7)
Level 8: Mass Hypnosis -- CSndmn-Heal%(A), CSndmn-Acc/EndRdx(9), CSndmn-EndRdx/Sleep(9), CSndmn-Acc/Sleep/Rchg(11), CSndmn-Acc/Rchg(19)
Level 10: Stealth -- LkGmblr-Rchg+(A)
Level 12: Power Blast -- Thundr-Acc/Dmg(A), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx(13), Thundr-Dmg/Rchg(13), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(15), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(15), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(17)
Level 14: Assault -- EndRdx-I(A)
Level 16: Fly -- Zephyr-ResKB(A), Zephyr-Travel(17)
Level 18: Power Boost -- RechRdx-I(A)
Level 20: Tactics -- AdjTgt-ToHit/EndRdx(A)
Level 22: Whirling Hands -- Armgdn-Dmg/EndRdx(A), Armgdn-Dmg/Rchg(23), Armgdn-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(23), Armgdn-Acc/Rchg(25), Armgdn-Dam%(25)
Level 24: Kick -- KntkC'bat-Knock%(A)
Level 26: Terrify -- Ragnrk-Dmg/Rchg(A), Ragnrk-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(37), Ragnrk-Acc/Rchg(48), Ragnrk-Knock%(48), Ragnrk-Dmg/EndRdx(48)
Level 28: Confuse -- CoPers-Conf(A), CoPers-Conf/Rchg(29), CoPers-Acc/Conf/Rchg(29), CoPers-Acc/Rchg(31), CoPers-Conf/EndRdx(31), CoPers-Conf%(31)
Level 30: Tough -- S'fstPrt-ResDam/Def+(A), GA-3defTpProc(46)
Level 32: Mass Confusion -- Mlais-Acc/Rchg(A), Mlais-EndRdx/Conf(33), Mlais-Acc/EndRdx(33), Mlais-Conf/Rng(33), Mlais-Acc/Conf/Rchg(34), Mlais-Dam%(34)
Level 35: Weave -- LkGmblr-Rchg+(A), RedFtn-Def/EndRdx(36), RedFtn-EndRdx/Rchg(36), RedFtn-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(36), RedFtn-Def(42), RedFtn-EndRdx(42)
Level 38: Power Burst -- Thundr-Acc/Dmg(A), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx(39), Thundr-Dmg/Rchg(39), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(39), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(40), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(40)
Level 41: Maneuvers -- LkGmblr-Rchg+(A), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx(43), LkGmblr-Def(46)
Level 44: Scorpion Shield -- RedFtn-Def/EndRdx(A), RedFtn-Def/Rchg(45), RedFtn-EndRdx/Rchg(45), RedFtn-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(45), RedFtn-Def(46)
Level 47: Personal Force Field -- LkGmblr-Rchg+(A)
Level 49: Total Domination -- BasGaze-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg/Hold(A), BasGaze-Acc/Rchg(50), BasGaze-Rchg/Hold(50), BasGaze-EndRdx/Rchg/Hold(50)
------------
Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Domination
Level 4: Ninja Run
Level 2: Swift -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Hurdle -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Health -- Mrcl-Rcvry+(A)
Level 2: Stamina -- P'Shift-End%(A), P'Shift-EndMod(21)