Yet Another Ill/Rad


Fuzzitron

 

Posted

Horrible, horrible build. 97.5% global recharge (with Coercive). Phantom Army's only at +80% damage so that I can keep their recharge down to 60.9s. Don't think I can do any better without a total redesign or eventually getting more purples. Capped on the 6.25% recharge sets, too. Posi's proc in Ice Storm is going to be switched for an Acc/Rech of some sort one of these days (only there because I needed a placeholder when assembling the set in order to get to the 5, then dropped the final piece on the remaining SO out of habit)

Anyone got any suggestions on how to tweak it for better performance/better PA damage/a bit more recharge without a total tear-down? (sorry about the IOs all being at L33 - in reality, they're all levels 30-35, but I can't figure out how to get Mids to let me specify individual levels for the IOs and the TINY level numbers for IOs on the management screen makes an accurate reproduction of my IOs next to impossible anyways :/)

Hero Plan by Mids' Hero Designer 1.803
http://www.cohplanner.com/

Click this DataLink to open the build!

Ulterion: Level 50 Mutation Controller
Primary Power Set: Illusion Control
Secondary Power Set: Radiation Emission
Power Pool: Fitness
Power Pool: Speed
Power Pool: Leaping
Power Pool: Leadership
Ancillary Pool: Ice Mastery

Hero Profile:
Level 1: Spectral Wounds

  • (A) Decimation - Accuracy/Damage: Level 33
  • (3) Decimation - Chance of Build Up: Level 33
  • (3) Decimation - Damage/Recharge: Level 33
  • (5) Decimation - Accuracy/Endurance/Recharge: Level 33
  • (5) Decimation - Accuracy/Damage/Recharge: Level 33
  • (7) Damage Increase IO: Level 35
Level 1: Radiant Aura
  • (A) Doctored Wounds - Heal/Endurance: Level 33
  • (25) Doctored Wounds - Endurance/Recharge: Level 33
  • (25) Doctored Wounds - Heal/Recharge: Level 33
  • (27) Doctored Wounds - Heal/Endurance/Recharge: Level 33
  • (27) Doctored Wounds - Heal: Level 33
Level 2: Blind
  • (A) Basilisk's Gaze - Accuracy/Hold: Level 30
  • (7) Basilisk's Gaze - Accuracy/Recharge: Level 30
  • (9) Basilisk's Gaze - Recharge/Hold: Level 30
  • (9) Basilisk's Gaze - Endurance/Recharge/Hold: Level 30
  • (11) Damage Increase IO: Level 35
  • (11) Damage Increase IO: Level 35
Level 4: Radiation Infection
  • (A) Dark Watcher's Despair - To Hit Debuff: Level 33
  • (29) Dark Watcher's Despair - To Hit Debuff/Recharge: Level 33
  • (29) Dark Watcher's Despair - To Hit Debuff/Recharge/Endurance: Level 33
  • (31) Dark Watcher's Despair - Recharge/Endurance: Level 33
  • (31) Dark Watcher's Despair - To Hit Debuff/Endurance: Level 33
Level 6: Deceive
  • (A) Coercive Persuasion - Confused: Level 50
  • (13) Coercive Persuasion - Confused/Recharge: Level 50
  • (13) Coercive Persuasion - Accuracy/Confused/Recharge: Level 50
  • (15) Coercive Persuasion - Accuracy/Recharge: Level 50
  • (15) Coercive Persuasion - Confused/Endurance: Level 50
Level 8: Superior Invisibility
  • (A) Endurance Reduction IO: Level 35
  • (17) Endurance Reduction IO: Level 35
  • (17) Endurance Reduction IO: Level 35
  • (19) Luck of the Gambler - Recharge Speed: Level 33
Level 10: Hurdle
  • (A) Jumping IO: Level 35
  • (42) Jumping IO: Level 35
Level 12: Accelerate Metabolism
  • (A) Recharge Reduction IO: Level 35
  • (31) Recharge Reduction IO: Level 35
  • (34) Recharge Reduction IO: Level 35
Level 14: Health
  • (A) Healing IO: Level 35
  • (37) Healing IO: Level 35
Level 16: Hasten
  • (A) Recharge Reduction IO: Level 35
  • (37) Recharge Reduction IO: Level 35
  • (37) Recharge Reduction IO: Level 35
Level 18: Phantom Army
  • (A) Recharge Reduction IO: Level 35
  • (19) Recharge Reduction IO: Level 35
  • (21) Recharge Reduction IO: Level 35
  • (21) Brilliant Leadership - Accuracy/Damage: Level 33
  • (23) Blood Mandate - Accuracy/Damage: Level 33
  • (23) Blood Mandate - Damage: Level 33
Level 20: Stamina
  • (A) Endurance Modification IO: Level 35
  • (40) Endurance Modification IO: Level 35
Level 22: Lingering Radiation
  • (A) Tempered Readiness - Accuracy/Slow: Level 33
  • (34) Tempered Readiness - Accuracy/Endurance: Level 33
  • (34) Tempered Readiness - Range/Slow: Level 33
  • (36) Tempered Readiness - Endurance/Recharge/Slow: Level 33
  • (36) Tempered Readiness - Accuracy/Damage/Slow: Level 33
Level 24: Combat Jumping
  • (A) Defense Buff IO: Level 35
  • (42) Luck of the Gambler - Recharge Speed: Level 33
Level 26: Super Jump
  • (A) Jumping IO: Level 35
  • (46) Jumping IO: Level 35
Level 28: Spectral Terror
  • (A) Glimpse of the Abyss - Accuracy/Recharge: Level 33
  • (45) Glimpse of the Abyss - Endurance/Fear: Level 33
  • (45) Glimpse of the Abyss - Accuracy/Endurance: Level 33
  • (45) Glimpse of the Abyss - Fear/Range: Level 33
  • (46) Glimpse of the Abyss - Accuracy/Fear/Recharge: Level 33
Level 30: Enervating Field
  • (A) Endurance Reduction IO: Level 35
  • (36) Endurance Reduction IO: Level 35
Level 32: Phantasm
  • (A) Expedient Reinforcement - Accuracy/Damage: Level 33
  • (33) Expedient Reinforcement - Damage/Endurance: Level 33
  • (33) Expedient Reinforcement - Accuracy/Damage/Recharge: Level 33
  • (33) Expedient Reinforcement - Endurance/Damage/Recharge: Level 33
  • (50) Blood Mandate - Accuracy/Damage: Level 33
Level 35: Mutation
  • (A) Recharge Reduction IO: Level 35
Level 38: EM Pulse
  • (A) Efficacy Adaptor - EndMod: Level 33
  • (39) Efficacy Adaptor - EndMod/Recharge: Level 33
  • (39) Efficacy Adaptor - EndMod/Accuracy/Recharge: Level 33
  • (39) Efficacy Adaptor - Accuracy/Recharge: Level 33
  • (40) Efficacy Adaptor - EndMod/Accuracy: Level 33
  • (40) Efficacy Adaptor - EndMod/Endurance: Level 33
Level 41: Ice Blast
  • (A) Decimation - Accuracy/Damage: Level 33
  • (42) Decimation - Damage/Endurance: Level 33
  • (43) Decimation - Damage/Recharge: Level 33
  • (43) Decimation - Accuracy/Endurance/Recharge: Level 33
  • (43) Decimation - Accuracy/Damage/Recharge: Level 33
Level 44: Frozen Armor
  • (A) Endurance Reduction IO: Level 35
  • (46) Luck of the Gambler - Recharge Speed: Level 33
Level 47: Ice Storm
  • (A) Positron's Blast - Accuracy/Damage: Level 33
  • (48) Positron's Blast - Damage/Endurance: Level 33
  • (48) Positron's Blast - Damage/Recharge: Level 33
  • (48) Positron's Blast - Damage/Range: Level 33
  • (50) Positron's Blast - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance: Level 33
  • (50) Positron's Blast - Chance of Damage(Energy): Level 33
Level 49: Maneuvers
  • (A) Luck of the Gambler - Recharge Speed: Level 33
------------
Level 1: Brawl
  • (A) Damage Increase IO: Level 35
Level 1: Sprint
  • (A) Endurance Reduction IO: Level 35
Level 2: Rest
  • (A) Recharge Reduction IO: Level 35
Level 1: Containment
Level 6: Ninja Run
------------
Set Bonus Totals:
  • 97.5% Enhancement(RechargeTime)


 

Posted

Try this:

Hero Plan by Mids' Hero Designer 1.803
http://www.cohplanner.com/
Click this DataLink to open the build!
Ulterion: Level 50 Mutation Controller
Primary Power Set: Illusion Control
Secondary Power Set: Radiation Emission
Power Pool: Fitness
Power Pool: Speed
Power Pool: Leaping
Power Pool: Leadership
Ancillary Pool: Ice Mastery
Hero Profile:
Level 1: Spectral Wounds -- Decim-Acc/Dmg(A), Decim-Build%(3), Decim-Dmg/Rchg(3), Decim-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg(5), Decim-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(5), Dmg-I(7)
Level 1: Radiant Aura -- Dct'dW-Heal/EndRdx(A), Dct'dW-EndRdx/Rchg(25), Dct'dW-Heal/Rchg(25), Dct'dW-Heal/EndRdx/Rchg(27), Dct'dW-Heal(27)
Level 2: Blind -- BasGaze-Acc/Hold(A), BasGaze-Acc/Rchg(7), BasGaze-Rchg/Hold(9), BasGaze-EndRdx/Rchg/Hold(9), Dmg-I(11), Dmg-I(11)
Level 4: Radiation Infection -- DarkWD-ToHitDeb(A), DarkWD-ToHitDeb/Rchg(29), DarkWD-ToHitdeb/Rchg/EndRdx(29), DarkWD-ToHitDeb/EndRdx(31)
Level 6: Deceive -- CoPers-Conf(A), CoPers-Conf/Rchg(13), CoPers-Acc/Conf/Rchg(13), CoPers-Acc/Rchg(15), CoPers-Conf/EndRdx(15)
Level 8: Superior Invisibility -- RedFtn-Def/EndRdx(A), RedFtn-EndRdx/Rchg(17), RedFtn-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(17), LkGmblr-Rchg+(19), RedFtn-Def(31), RedFtn-EndRdx(40)
Level 10: Hurdle -- Jump-I(A)
Level 12: Accelerate Metabolism -- Efficacy-EndMod(A), Efficacy-EndMod/Rchg(31), Efficacy-EndMod/Acc/Rchg(34), Efficacy-Acc/Rchg(34), Efficacy-EndMod/Acc(34), Efficacy-EndMod/EndRdx(36)
Level 14: Health -- Numna-Regen/Rcvry+(A), Numna-Heal(37), Mrcl-Rcvry+(42)
Level 16: Hasten -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(37), RechRdx-I(37)
Level 18: Phantom Army -- ExRmnt-Acc/Rchg(A), ExRmnt-Acc/Dmg(19), ExRmnt-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(21), ExRmnt-EndRdx/Dmg/Rchg(21), C'Arms-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(23), C'Arms-EndRdx/Dmg/Rchg(23)
Level 20: Stamina -- EndMod-I(A), P'Shift-End%(36), P'Shift-EndMod/Acc(40)
Level 22: Lingering Radiation -- Acc-I(A)
Level 24: Combat Jumping -- LkGmblr-Rchg+(A)
Level 26: Super Jump -- Jump-I(A)
Level 28: Spectral Terror -- Abys-Acc/Rchg(A), Abys-Fear/Rng(40), Abys-Acc/Fear/Rchg(42), Abys-EndRdx/Fear(45), Abys-Acc/EndRdx(45)
Level 30: Enervating Field -- EndRdx-I(A), EndRdx-I(36)
Level 32: Phantasm -- ExRmnt-Acc/Dmg(A), ExRmnt-Dmg/EndRdx(33), ExRmnt-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(33), ExRmnt-EndRdx/Dmg/Rchg(33), BldM'dt-Acc/Dmg(50)
Level 35: Mutation -- RechRdx-I(A)
Level 38: EM Pulse -- BasGaze-Acc/Hold(A), BasGaze-Acc/Rchg(39), BasGaze-Rchg/Hold(39), BasGaze-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg/Hold(39)
Level 41: Ice Blast -- Empty(A), Empty(42), Empty(43), Empty(43), Empty(43)
Level 44: Frozen Armor -- LkGmblr-Rchg+(A), RedFtn-Def/EndRdx(45), RedFtn-EndRdx/Rchg(46), RedFtn-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(46), RedFtn-Def(46), RedFtn-EndRdx(48)
Level 47: Ice Storm -- Posi-Acc/Dmg(A), Posi-Dmg/EndRdx(48), Posi-Dmg/Rchg(48), Posi-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(50), Posi-Dam%(50)
Level 49: Maneuvers -- LkGmblr-Rchg+(A)
------------
Level 1: Brawl -- Dmg-I(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- EndRdx-I(A)
Level 2: Rest -- RechRdx-I(A)
Level 1: Containment
Level 6: Ninja Run


LOCAL MAN! The most famous hero of all. There are more newspaper stories about me than anyone else. "Local Man wins Medal of Honor." "Local Man opens Animal Shelter." "Local Man Charged with..." (Um, forget about that one.)
Guide Links: Earth/Rad Guide, Illusion/Rad Guide, Electric Control

 

Posted

Ah, yes. I see the main spot where I went wrong there, completely forgetting that EM Pulse could be slotted as a Hold, and thus take Basilisk's Gaze. Thanks, Local.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by JD_Gumby View Post
Ah, yes. I see the main spot where I went wrong there, completely forgetting that EM Pulse could be slotted as a Hold, and thus take Basilisk's Gaze. Thanks, Local.
One change i forgot to note: Replace the Confuse in Deceive with the Contagious Confusion proc. It turns the single target Deceive into an AoE confuse power some of the timeo . . . it is a great addition.


LOCAL MAN! The most famous hero of all. There are more newspaper stories about me than anyone else. "Local Man wins Medal of Honor." "Local Man opens Animal Shelter." "Local Man Charged with..." (Um, forget about that one.)
Guide Links: Earth/Rad Guide, Illusion/Rad Guide, Electric Control

 

Posted

Nah. Not worth the cost for that - I find that I rarely need to use Decieve as it is, and when I do it's as a surgical strike. Thanks for the suggestion, though.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by JD_Gumby View Post
Nah. Not worth the cost for that - I find that I rarely need to use Decieve as it is, and when I do it's as a surgical strike. Thanks for the suggestion, though.
You'd be surprised at how effective it is. When you can take 5 guys from the next spawn out of fight even before it begins . . . with one quick shot that recharges quickly, it is very effective control. Illusion is somewhat lacking in AoE control, and that proc turns a single target control into an AoE control power. I tend to use Deceive at the start of most battles to take out problem foes, and often hit a bunch more.


LOCAL MAN! The most famous hero of all. There are more newspaper stories about me than anyone else. "Local Man wins Medal of Honor." "Local Man opens Animal Shelter." "Local Man Charged with..." (Um, forget about that one.)
Guide Links: Earth/Rad Guide, Illusion/Rad Guide, Electric Control

 

Posted

Deceive is great and all for solo play. On Virtue, my ILL/Rad controller couldn't get on a team for a week after using deceive during a TF the week before. I was nearly begging someone for an invitation who was building a team for Moonfire a few weeks ago. He told me "I heard you use deceive and we don't want that!"

I told him, "If someone had a problem with me using it, they could have at least said something about it to me. I have powers of illusion not mind reading but I can read. Tell ya what, I'll take the power off the tray if that will work for you." He said 'okay' and we had a blast on Moonfire. My character is actually sought after now that people know I won't use Deceive on teams.

I know this won't sway your opinion about the power, Local Man, but know that some people are like that soup chef in a certain Seinfeld episode.

BTW, I've been using your guide to level my ILL/Rad and it's been fun so far. Thanks for sharing it.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fuzzitron View Post
Deceive is great and all for solo play. On Virtue, my ILL/Rad controller couldn't get on a team for a week after using deceive during a TF the week before. I was nearly begging someone for an invitation who was building a team for Moonfire a few weeks ago. He told me "I heard you use deceive and we don't want that!"

I told him, "If someone had a problem with me using it, they could have at least said something about it to me. I have powers of illusion not mind reading but I can read. Tell ya what, I'll take the power off the tray if that will work for you." He said 'okay' and we had a blast on Moonfire. My character is actually sought after now that people know I won't use Deceive on teams.

I know this won't sway your opinion about the power, Local Man, but know that some people are like that soup chef in a certain Seinfeld episode.

BTW, I've been using your guide to level my ILL/Rad and it's been fun so far. Thanks for sharing it.

I have never heard anything like this before. If people are not using Confusion powers on teams that's quite the surprise to the Plant and Mind Controllers who have AoE Confuses.

Deceive is arguably best single target mezz in the game. And on a Task Force? One of the best powers you could possibly have in your arsenal. Take it, slot it, use it, love it. Since you are on Virtue, you may also need some info on private channels for finding teams. Send me a private message if you need that info.


 

Posted

Many times in your life you will once again confirm the people are stupid. Ignore the stupid ones. Deceive is one of the best controls in the game. Fairly cheaply purple-able. The contagious confusion proc is amazing. I'm happy some people hate confuse and deceive powers in a way. It makes them rarer and thus the IO recipes cheaper. So just avoid playing with people that tell you how to play and have fun deceiving!


@SBeaudway on Pinnacle, TaskForce Titans Supergroup.

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fuzzitron View Post
Deceive is great and all for solo play. On Virtue, my ILL/Rad controller couldn't get on a team for a week after using deceive during a TF the week before. I was nearly begging someone for an invitation who was building a team for Moonfire a few weeks ago. He told me "I heard you use deceive and we don't want that!"

I told him, "If someone had a problem with me using it, they could have at least said something about it to me. I have powers of illusion not mind reading but I can read. Tell ya what, I'll take the power off the tray if that will work for you." He said 'okay' and we had a blast on Moonfire. My character is actually sought after now that people know I won't use Deceive on teams.

I know this won't sway your opinion about the power, Local Man, but know that some people are like that soup chef in a certain Seinfeld episode.

BTW, I've been using your guide to level my ILL/Rad and it's been fun so far. Thanks for sharing it.
This is why I wrote the long section on Confuse powers in my Ill/Rad guide, hoping to inform the ignorant. The one or two times I have come across people who think Confuse is bad, I challenge them to read the section on my guide, and then read several of the other guides showing that Confuse powers actually increase the speed at which you gain XP. If the person continues to refuse to see reason, I make a note of them and never team with them again.

I was on a team a while ago with a Plant Controller in the mid-20's, who didn't have Seeds of Confusion. I asked him, and he said he doesn't like confuse powers. I tried to discuss it with him, but he didn't care. I made a note and moved on as soon as I could.


LOCAL MAN! The most famous hero of all. There are more newspaper stories about me than anyone else. "Local Man wins Medal of Honor." "Local Man opens Animal Shelter." "Local Man Charged with..." (Um, forget about that one.)
Guide Links: Earth/Rad Guide, Illusion/Rad Guide, Electric Control

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fuzzitron View Post
On Virtue, my ILL/Rad controller couldn't get on a team for a week after using deceive during a TF the week before.
I don't believe you.

There, someone said it.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fuzzitron View Post
Deceive is great and all for solo play. On Virtue, my ILL/Rad controller couldn't get on a team for a week after using deceive during a TF the week before. I was nearly begging someone for an invitation who was building a team for Moonfire a few weeks ago. He told me "I heard you use deceive and we don't want that!"

I told him, "If someone had a problem with me using it, they could have at least said something about it to me. I have powers of illusion not mind reading but I can read. Tell ya what, I'll take the power off the tray if that will work for you." He said 'okay' and we had a blast on Moonfire. My character is actually sought after now that people know I won't use Deceive on teams.

I know this won't sway your opinion about the power, Local Man, but know that some people are like that soup chef in a certain Seinfeld episode.

BTW, I've been using your guide to level my ILL/Rad and it's been fun so far. Thanks for sharing it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hart View Post
I don't believe you.

There, someone said it.
Yeah, I didn't want to call him on it when he said something nice to me at the end, but I didn't buy it either. Virtue and Freedom are the most populated servers, and it is hard to imagine how a "reputation" could get around an entire server. And even harder to imagine how a "reputation" for using Deceive would be viewed as a negative by any but the most uninformed players.

I can't tell you how many times I have responded to a global channel call for TF players, and I offer to bring any of a bunch of characters, that I get a request for the Ill/Rad. Most competant players know how good an Ill/Rad can be, even using Deceive.

I guess the folks who hate confuse powers are going to refuse to team with Illusion Controllers and Mind, Plant and Electric Controllers and Dominators? Illusion's confuse power is only single target, while the others all have AoE confuse powers.


LOCAL MAN! The most famous hero of all. There are more newspaper stories about me than anyone else. "Local Man wins Medal of Honor." "Local Man opens Animal Shelter." "Local Man Charged with..." (Um, forget about that one.)
Guide Links: Earth/Rad Guide, Illusion/Rad Guide, Electric Control

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Local_Man View Post
Yeah, I didn't want to call him on it when he said something nice to me at the end, but I didn't buy it either....
Some still believe the world is flat simply because they haven't crossed the street! I can only tell you what happened to me. I'm happy for you if you haven't met any power anal jerks yet. They're out there. Heck, I might be one or else I wouldn't be looking at guides in an attempt to turn my controller into a wrecking machine with feet.

I run with min-maxed steamroller teams every so often (a friend calls me when the usual suspects are forming up). These are the guys doing speed ITFs and LGTFs on max difficulty. They don't need deceived enemies because everything is dead in seconds up to a minute (including cyclops and minotaurs). If using Deceive is going to drive a wedge between me and those teams, then I'll gladly avoid using Deceive on "those" teams.

But again, I like the Deceive/Confuse power myself and don't mind the 10% - 15% of xp I might not get on low damage teams. When I'm bored and take a random PUG invite from casual players (or people who are having trouble taking down an AV), yeah I'll use confuses, holds, my grandma's wig and anything else I can throw at it. I'm not at all opposed to it. I'm just telling you that there are more than five people in the game (and on Virtue) who won't call you back if you use it. I'm only saying this as advice for the OP of this thread to think about.

I think people need to take a team's destructive level into account when talking about what powers to use. I'm better off casting Blind or Spectral Wounds when teamed with several maxed out /SD scrappers and SS/ brutes. If the team is full of mezz prone characters, a confuse or terrorize power is a no brainer for an opener (and of course that sweet Phantom Army).

And by the way, most of the calls I get to help on a team are for my debuff toggles to use on an AV, not for Deceive or even the area heal. A lot of the people I normally team with have known each other in this game for half a decade. They tend to end up on the same teams and do trade war stories about how someone slowed down the team last night and what not.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fuzzitron View Post
Some still believe the world is flat simply because they haven't crossed the street! I can only tell you what happened to me. I'm happy for you that you haven't met any XP nazis yet.

I run with min-maxed steamroller teams every weekend when I'm home. These are the guys doing speed ITFs and LGTFs on max difficulty. They don't need deceived enemies because everything is dead in seconds up to a minute (including cyclops and minotaurs). If using Deceive is going to drive a wedge between me and those teams, then I'll gladly avoid using Deceive on "those" teams.

But again, I like the Deceive/Confuse power myself and don't mind the 10% - 15% of xp I might not get on low damage teams. When I'm bored and take a random PUG invite from casual players (or people who are having trouble taking down an AV), yeah I'll use deceive, seeds of confusion, confusion auras, etc. I'm not at all opposed to it. I'm just telling you that there are more than five people in the game (and on Virtue) who won't call you back if you use it.

I think people need to take a team's destructive level into account when talking about what powers to use. I'm better off casting Blind or Spectral Wounds when teamed with several maxed out /SD scrappers and SS/ brutes. If the team is full of mezz prone characters, a confuse or terrorize power is a no brainer for an opener.
I have no doubt that there are plenty of misinformed and hard-headed folks out there -- I have run into my fair share, both in game and out. I'll also agree that single target confuse powers (Deceive and Confuse) are not needed much on fast-moving "steamroller" teams -- Generally they are doing damage so fast that hardly any mez powers do much. You run in to hit Flash . . . and before you can do much else, the entire spawn is defeated, so your mez powers didn't do much. If you have those kinds of teams, Deceive isn't active long enough for the confused foe to do hardly any damage, so it really makes no difference. You are better off spending your time using your debuffs and then single target damage attacks. The only time Deceive might be useful is to take out a foe who has strong debuffs. And on the ITF, you generally have to stack Deceive so it is less useful. (On the Lady Grey, however, you can Deceive Guardians to get some free AM.)

Remember that you don't "lose" XP from confuse powers. If the confused foe kills off a foe, it is like that foe never spawned. You don't get any XP because you didn't earn any -- at most, you could say that you lost "potential XP." HOWEVER, as long as you do some of the damage to foes being attacked by a confused foe, you actually get BONUS XP that you did not earn. If you do 50% of the damage, you get 80% of the XP. So, you actually got a 60% bonus in that case. If you do 25% of the damage, you get 50% of the XP, or a 100% bonus. Since you do less damage to kill a foe, you spend less time doing it. So using Deceive, you can get more XP over time even if you get a little bit less XP per mission or per foe, because you defeat foes faster.

Your estimate of 10%-15% is way off. Try running Herostats, and compare your XP/hour using Deceive and not using it. It has been a while since I did it, but my XP per hour was greater (but not by a whole bunch) using Deceive than not using Deceive.


LOCAL MAN! The most famous hero of all. There are more newspaper stories about me than anyone else. "Local Man wins Medal of Honor." "Local Man opens Animal Shelter." "Local Man Charged with..." (Um, forget about that one.)
Guide Links: Earth/Rad Guide, Illusion/Rad Guide, Electric Control

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Local_Man View Post
Since you do less damage to kill a foe, you spend less time doing it. So using Deceive, you can get more XP over time even if you get a little bit less XP per mission or per foe, because you defeat foes faster.
Yes, that may be true for solo or low damage teams. However if I deceive something that hits another enemy just before three AoE team mates decent from the ceiling to wipe out the entire spawn a second later, we just missed out on some xp that we'd have acquired had my confused enemy not hit his buddy. If you can explain that one away, then I'll try to take that explanation to convince some of my sometime steamroller buddies to be less rabid toward confuse powers. I'm on your side man.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Local_Man View Post
Your estimate of 10%-15% is way off. Try running Herostats, and compare your XP/hour using Deceive and not using it.
I was making a blind statement regarding the numbers as I am at work and can not install any extra programs on this machine. I remembered reading something about only receiving 80% if I damaged an enemy that a confused foe finished off. I didn't remember what the best and worst case numbers were.

EDIT:

I'm sure the monstrous guys I've teamed with wouldn't care to expend the extra effort to get free AM from a Rikti Guardian but I know I would. I wonder if I can get more people to appreciate confuse powers now that we have to deal with level 53 Resistance fighters. That enemy group is nasty at high levels.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fuzzitron View Post
Yes, that may be true for solo or low damage teams. However if I deceive something that hits another enemy just before three AoE team mates decent from the ceiling to wipe out the entire spawn a second later, we just missed out on some xp that we'd have acquired had my confused enemy not hit his buddy. If you can explain that one away, then I'll try to take that explanation to convince some of my sometime steamroller buddies to be less rabid toward confuse powers. I'm on your side man.
Notice I said "can" and not "will." It depends on the situation. In the situation you described, I probably would not use Deceive if I knew that my teammates could wipe out the entire spawn with a couple of AoEs -- but keep in mind that the "missed out upon" XP is going to be miniscule in that situation. The Deceived Foe will probably only get one hit in before everyone is wiped out.

On the other hand, you could deceive a Sapper just before he hits one of your teammates. If he had hit one of your teammates, that teammate would not be able to do as much damage. Deceiving a Master Illusionist causes her to turn on her own pets. You could deceive some Knives of Artimis before they throw their Caltrops. You could Deceive that DE crystal guy before he lays down his huge Quartz defense debuff, or the DE Herder before it lays down that little tree that helps them Regen. All of those will help your team go FASTER and SAFER. All of these are things you run into in the high level Tip Missions.

Deceive is a control power, so it CAN help your team depending on how you use it.



Quote:
I was making a blind statement regarding the numbers as I am at work and can not install any extra programs on this machine. I remembered reading something about only receiving 80% if I damaged an enemy that a confused foe finished off. I didn't remember what the best and worst case numbers were.

EDIT:

I'm sure the monstrous guys I've teamed with wouldn't care to expend the extra effort to get free AM from a Rikti Guardian but I know I would. I wonder if I can get more people to appreciate confuse powers now that we have to deal with level 53 Resistance fighters. That enemy group is nasty at high levels.
Deceive isn't needed for the easy stuff on a fast team, only the tough stuff.


LOCAL MAN! The most famous hero of all. There are more newspaper stories about me than anyone else. "Local Man wins Medal of Honor." "Local Man opens Animal Shelter." "Local Man Charged with..." (Um, forget about that one.)
Guide Links: Earth/Rad Guide, Illusion/Rad Guide, Electric Control

 

Posted

Little update: Got my final piece of the second Basilisk's Gaze set (to toss in EM Pulse; yay, alignment merits! ) and am now officially among the ranks of the Perma-PAs with 58.86s - under ideal circumstances, anyways. :P Now to grind and grind and grind and grind until I can start affording more purples [think I can get 3 of the other sets in] to make the timing a little more forgiving.

Thanks for the tune up, Local Man.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by JD_Gumby View Post
Little update: Got my final piece of the second Basilisk's Gaze set (to toss in EM Pulse; yay, alignment merits! ) and am now officially among the ranks of the Perma-PAs with 58.86s - under ideal circumstances, anyways. :P Now to grind and grind and grind and grind until I can start affording more purples [think I can get 3 of the other sets in] to make the timing a little more forgiving.

Thanks for the tune up, Local Man.
Gratz! and you are welcome.

I'm finding that my Ill/Rad handles Tip missions better than any of my other characters -- even the softcapped BS/Shield scrapper who I thought would be fastest. With stealth, debuffs, Spooky to set up a control zone and PA to draw the aggro, he plows through the missions very fast. He can even handle those missions that everyone complains about with the continual spawns. Perma PA, Phantasm and Spectral Terror draw the aggro before it gets to me. I deceive the Sappers and then can wipe out the guys pretty quickly.

I found it interesting that my buddy and ultimate tank authority, Call Me Awesome, was also saying that his perma-PA Ill/Rad handled Tip missions best, too.


LOCAL MAN! The most famous hero of all. There are more newspaper stories about me than anyone else. "Local Man wins Medal of Honor." "Local Man opens Animal Shelter." "Local Man Charged with..." (Um, forget about that one.)
Guide Links: Earth/Rad Guide, Illusion/Rad Guide, Electric Control

 

Posted

Hmm. Decieving the Sappers. Now there's an idea. I normally just panic and Blind 'em.

This is the first character I've upped the level difficulty on. Currenly +2/x1 and I'm seriously considering just going to +4/x1 since +2 for tips has proven insanely easy (the lack of EBs in tips is probably the reason).


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by JD_Gumby View Post
Hmm. Decieving the Sappers. Now there's an idea. I normally just panic and Blind 'em.

This is the first character I've upped the level difficulty on. Currenly +2/x1 and I'm seriously considering just going to +4/x1 since +2 for tips has proven insanely easy (the lack of EBs in tips is probably the reason).
Always consider Deceiving foes that give you a problem -- since they will usually give the same problem to their buddies. Of course, the nice thing about using Deceive is that it draws no aggro, so you can take them out of the fight and let them start to do stuff to their buddies before you show yourself with an attack. You can also handle several problem foes instead of being limited to one, or you can stack Deceive on bosses.

Sappers are one of my favorites to Deceive -- they are so widely hated, and for good reason. I love to turn them on the other Malta. It is so much fun to see a Zeus drained dry of endurance by his own Sapper -- and since that doesn't do damage, there is no effect on XP.

There are some exceptions: Many of the exceptions are foes who drop a pet or pseudopet -- it is usually better to hold them before they drop the pet rather than Deceive them. Deceiving the DE who drop those buff and debuffs does NOT turn them the other way, it only neutralizes them, and only as long as the guy who dropped them stays alive. (My understanding is that the DE buffs only affect DE, so you can't get the benefit.) When a Vahz Mortifier rezes a Cadaver, the Mort will then attack the Cadaver to kill it, and then rez it again. (It won't rez your teammates because the rez only works on Cadavers.) Deceiving a Sky Raider who drops the FF Generator will give your team defense, but only as long as that guy lives. When the pet caster dies, the pets usually turn on you.


LOCAL MAN! The most famous hero of all. There are more newspaper stories about me than anyone else. "Local Man wins Medal of Honor." "Local Man opens Animal Shelter." "Local Man Charged with..." (Um, forget about that one.)
Guide Links: Earth/Rad Guide, Illusion/Rad Guide, Electric Control

 

Posted

Local Man - I looked at your proposed build - why are there 5 empty slots in Ice Blast?
Thanks.

edit: looks like theres a bug in MIDs? Ice blast is classified as ranged aoe?


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Spike Night View Post
Local Man - I looked at your proposed build - why are there 5 empty slots in Ice Blast?
Thanks.

edit: looks like theres a bug in MIDs? Ice blast is classified as ranged aoe?
Yep, there is a bug in Mids.


LOCAL MAN! The most famous hero of all. There are more newspaper stories about me than anyone else. "Local Man wins Medal of Honor." "Local Man opens Animal Shelter." "Local Man Charged with..." (Um, forget about that one.)
Guide Links: Earth/Rad Guide, Illusion/Rad Guide, Electric Control