Trying to Get ready for GR on a Budget...
By
Bill Z Bubba,
Posted on: 2009-12-13 16:19 in ALL ACCESS Gameplay Technical Issues Bugs
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Originally Posted by Bill Z Bubba
While I realize that the following isn't that popular an option, if you find that the stock cooler is too loud/doesn't cool enough, back when I bought my ati x1950xtx, before I ever installed it, I yanked the stock cooler off and replaced it with a Zalman VGA cooler and placed tiny heatsinks on all the memory chips.
It was quiet and cool and ran like a champ for a long time. Still have it sitting on a shelf waiting to be used somewhere else. Cracks me up comparing that card to the 5850 I'm looking at now. |
I've had two fans go out on nvidia cards over the years and i've replaced them out of necessity, but never as part of a plan. I might consider doing it at some point, but at this point given the fanage in my planned system, i'm REALLY not thinking I'll be needing more air cooling. Though given that I have 2 dogs and one cat i might consider swapping to liquid cooled at some later point. Help keep the dust and hair issues at a minimum. But for now, I'm good with the stock cooler on the GPU
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Why waste the time and money with water? Are you overclocking?|
Originally Posted by corridor
Though given that I have 2 dogs and one cat i might consider swapping to liquid cooled at some later point. Help keep the dust and hair issues at a minimum. But for now, I'm good with the stock cooler on the GPU
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If not, using fan filters is a FAR more economical means of keeping the inside of your case clean.
Clicking on the linked image above will take you off the City of Heroes site. However, the guides will be linked back here.
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That's actually true. The "vapor chamber" works the same was as the "heat pipes" adopted in recent years for CPU cooling . A heat pipe is a hollow tube of thermally-conductive material with an inner coating of some sort of "wicking" material that absorbs liquids. The inside of the tube is at a very low vapor pressure and the wicking material is moistened with a tiny amount of liquid with high thermal capacity (often just plain water). A slight addition of heat on one end of the tube will cause the liquid to boil at the low internal pressure. The liquid vapor travels to the far end of the heat pipe and condenses on the relatively-cooler surface there; depositing its heat. The wicking material causes the liquid to be carried back to the hot end of the heat pipe to replace liquid boiling away there. So long as the temperature difference from one end to the other can be maintained, the pipe will conduct heat more efficiently than a bar of solid copper of equal size.|
Originally Posted by corridor
ANYWAY, Yeah the Sapphire and XFX cards were the ones I was eyeing. Other than the cooler though I can't see what the difference is between these two...
SAPPHIRE 100283L Radeon HD 5770 (Juniper XT) 1GB 128-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready CrossFireX Support Video Card - Retail and SAPPHIRE Vapor-X 100283VXL Radeon HD 5770 1GB 128-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready CrossFireX Support Video Card - Retail *EDIT* What little I can find looks like it's a slightly (VERY slight) overclocked 5770 with a funky "vapor chamber technology" cooler which Sapphire says is more effective than the original fully ducted one. No clue it that's true. |
A "vapor chamber" is the same idea, except in a box form rather than a tube. Sapphire's marketing material draws a comparison to a boiling skillet with a lid on it. Added to the vapor chamber is a larger total heat sink surface-area than in the standard cooler and a larger, much quieter fan. The Vapor-X editions of Sapphire's cards have proved very popular.
It does vent into your case rather than out the back, but then the standard 5770 doesn't breath that well. It has partially obscured venting because of the second DVI port on the back; this is the same for all the 5xxxs, save the upcoming Eyefinity Edition with six mini-displayport connectors.
If you got the Vapor-X, it would either be for overclocking headroom or the (significantly) lower noise signature. (Or just for owning smexy engineering that someone has put a lot of thought into, which is a factor for me ^.^)
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| I like the idea of it not dumping more heat into the case, although honestly with all that ventilation it probably wouldn't really be an issue. i also suspect I'll already be screwed noise-wise with all of those fans going. I'm hoping that, since I'll have so MUCH airflow, I can keep them set to low. I guess we'll see. |
It would be a work-in-progress because Scythes cost about $12 apiece, and Noisblockers $25 apiece; you get what you pay for here. (Noctuas are also high-quality fans, but they'll cost you about as much as the Noiseblockers while performing about like the Scythes =P.) You could have a quiet, multi-fan case, but it would be a conscious investment to that purpose. On the other hand, the quality fans all have significant warranties and Noiseblocker claims a Mean Time Between Failures for their fan bearings of about twenty years =P. So if you made the investment you could pass those quiet fans on to other systems for the next decade-plus.
For later replacement of the CPU cooler, you might look for a design something like the Scythe Mugen 2 or Noctua NH-U12P. The Scythe is definitely the cheaper version and arguably the better performing one. Both coolers are designed with a push-pull fan arrangement in mind, but the Mugen 2 has five thermally-separated fin arrays that allow air to pass between them at lower static pressure. What that means (and has been mentioned in most every review I've read of the cooler, despite the reviewers not making a big deal of it) is that the Mugen 2 will operate at about the same level with two fans running in silent push-pull as it will with a single fan running at maximum speed. The Noctua just goes the route of having less cooling area to push air past and two quality fans in the box. If you wanted to go this route later, note that the Mugen 2 currently doesn't yet have a Socket 1156 compatible version.
So a quiet computer isn't out of the question for you in the future.
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*nod-nods* All water coolers have a radiator in there somewhere. So water cooling eventually turns into air cooling and you still have to deal with the air turbulence and potential mechanical noise in the end. You also have to content with potential pump noise if you're working with cheap water cooling parts.|
Originally Posted by Hyperstrike
Why waste the time and money with water? Are you overclocking?
If not, using fan filters is a FAR more economical means of keeping the inside of your case clean. |
Water cooling is a good idea if you're going to have a whole-lotta heat to deal with at once; as in overclocking or dual-chip graphics cards.
Just remember to clean the filters often when dealing with lots of pet hair.
Let me point out here that the Cooler Master RC-690 has a ton of optional mounting locations for fans that could be acting as intake vents into the case (two top, one bottom, a second on the left side and one low profile one on the right side behind the CPU). The PSU has its own vent on the bottom of the case and all of the drive bay covers are meshed. You can't say that this case isn't well ventilated.
You may want to block off some of the unused ones or consider placing filters in front of them as well considering your dog/cat hair situation no to mention dust bunnies. And you only really need filters on the front and side intake fans.
Father Xmas - Level 50 Ice/Ice Tanker - Victory
$725 and $1350 parts lists --- My guide to computer components
Tempus unum hominem manet
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Brilliant. I had no idea these even existed, but of course they do. Noob moment for me there. Nah probably no serious overclocking. Maybe mess with it a tad when I'm bored, but I generally rather my hardware has a longer life rather than a 5% gain now....|
Originally Posted by Hyperstrike
Why waste the time and money with water? Are you overclocking?
If not, using fan filters is a FAR more economical means of keeping the inside of your case clean. |
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Originally Posted by Human_Being
That's actually true. The "vapor chamber" works the same was as the "heat pipes" adopted in recent years for CPU cooling . A heat pipe is a hollow tube of thermally-conductive material with an inner coating of some sort of "wicking" material that absorbs liquids. The inside of the tube is at a very low vapor pressure and the wicking material is moistened with a tiny amount of liquid with high thermal capacity (often just plain water). A slight addition of heat on one end of the tube will cause the liquid to boil at the low internal pressure. The liquid vapor travels to the far end of the heat pipe and condenses on the relatively-cooler surface there; depositing its heat. The wicking material causes the liquid to be carried back to the hot end of the heat pipe to replace liquid boiling away there. So long as the temperature difference from one end to the other can be maintained, the pipe will conduct heat more efficiently than a bar of solid copper of equal size.
A "vapor chamber" is the same idea, except in a box form rather than a tube. Sapphire's marketing material draws a comparison to a boiling skillet with a lid on it. Added to the vapor chamber is a larger total heat sink surface-area than in the standard cooler and a larger, much quieter fan. The Vapor-X editions of Sapphire's cards have proved very popular. It does vent into your case rather than out the back, but then the standard 5770 doesn't breath that well. It has partially obscured venting because of the second DVI port on the back; this is the same for all the 5xxxs, save the upcoming Eyefinity Edition with six mini-displayport connectors. If you got the Vapor-X, it would either be for overclocking headroom or the (significantly) lower noise signature. (Or just for owning smexy engineering that someone has put a lot of thought into, which is a factor for me ^.^) |
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Originally Posted by Father Xmas
Let me point out here that the Cooler Master RC-690 has a ton of optional mounting locations for fans that could be acting as intake vents into the case (two top, one bottom, a second on the left side and one low profile one on the right side behind the CPU). The PSU has its own vent on the bottom of the case and all of the drive bay covers are meshed. You can't say that this case isn't well ventilated.
You may want to block off some of the unused ones or consider placing filters in front of them as well considering your dog/cat hair situation no to mention dust bunnies. And you only really need filters on the front and side intake fans. |
Again my heat management paranoia comes from living in Florida. I try to keep my apartment a stable 75 degrees, but since I'm on the Eastern side of my building it can get pretty warm in here while the Air Conditioner struggles to keep up. It's mostly paranoia from my college apartment no climate control and little room ventilation days.
I will add swapping out the low end fans I can afford now for some nicer ones later. Sounds good.
I must say. The Slot 1156 cpu coolers all look uncomfortably complicated to put on. From the pictures anyway. I'm not really looking forward to that.
I also wish that PSU had modular cords on it, but Man I'm NOT willing to pay the price difference for the equivalent one that does. Maybe nother brand pSU. I really don't want to go very low on the PSU quality though. I suppose I'd rather have wires than a crappy modular PSU
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Regardless of Socket type, any CPU cooler large enough to matter these days basically has two possible mounting schemes: "pain in the butt yet secure" or "snap-simple but insecure".|
Originally Posted by corridor
I must say. The Slot 1156 cpu coolers all look uncomfortably complicated to put on. From the pictures anyway. I'm not really looking forward to that.
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Also, if you're planning on putting in both side-fans, you might want to break out a ruler before shopping for a replacement CPU cooler. Some are pretty tall.
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| I also wish that PSU had modular cords on it, but Man I'm NOT willing to pay the price difference for the equivalent one that does. Maybe nother brand pSU. I really don't want to go very low on the PSU quality though. I suppose I'd rather have wires than a crappy modular PSU |
If the power supply is going to be "eating off the floor", remember to get a filter for it, too.
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Yeah, but it's a bit irritating. Ahh well it is what it is.|
Originally Posted by Human_Being
Regardless of Socket type, any CPU cooler large enough to matter these days basically has two possible mounting schemes: "pain in the butt yet secure" or "snap-simple but insecure".
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| Also, if you're planning on putting in both side-fans, you might want to break out a ruler before shopping for a replacement CPU cooler. Some are pretty tall. |
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| Corsair is a solid power supply brand. There are better ones I could recommend to you, but there are none better that are cheaper. |
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| If the power supply is going to be "eating off the floor", remember to get a filter for it, too. |
Thanks for all the help so far folks. I really appreciate it all!
Ok, new topic for discussion. Fan placement.
The case has 120mm ports on the: Front, Back, Bottom, Top, and two on the open side (upper and lower). and one 80 MM on the back side of the motherboard. Any opinions on which ports I should use and which fans should be in and which out? I'll have 5 120mm fans and 1 80mm (This doesn't count the fans on the PSU)
I'm thinking Front 120mm: In, Open Side Lower 120mm: in Bottom 120mm: In Back 120mm: Out, Top 120mm: Out, and backside 80mm: out?
Or should maybe the side fan be blowing out rather than in since I seem to be drawing in more air than I'm removing. this Does leave the top open side port open so the CPU cooler has space.
Or am I overdoing it on the fans? Opinions?
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A slight positive pressure inside your case is better than a slight negative pressure; especially since the intakes will be covered with filters. It keeps particulates from seeping into the case and gives the internal fans something to work with.|
Originally Posted by corridor
Ok, new topic for discussion. Fan placement.
The case has 120mm ports on the: Front, Back, Bottom, Top, and two on the open side (upper and lower). and one 80 MM on the back side of the motherboard. Any opinions on which ports I should use and which fans should be in and which out? I'll have 5 120mm fans and 1 80mm (This doesn't count the fans on the PSU) I'm thinking Front 120mm: In, Open Side Lower 120mm: in Bottom 120mm: In Back 120mm: Out, Top 120mm: Out, and backside 80mm: out? Or should maybe the side fan be blowing out rather than in since I seem to be drawing in more air than I'm removing. this Does leave the top open side port open so the CPU cooler has space. Or am I overdoing it on the fans? Opinions? |
Also keep in mind that any top fan looks to be heavily baffled by the chassis, so it won't be evacuating as much air as another fan.
I would definitely keep at least one of the side fans facing inward; it's there to feed fresh, cool air to the CPU cooler and graphics card. You have a front fan, but it's got this stupid chunk of metal blocking its airflow, not that the HD cage needs to be that solid, so it doesn't push air into the motherboard cavity as well as it could. Yet if the front fan wasn't there, you'd have your HDs sitting in a dead spot =P. (Sorry, I have objections to common case-airflow designs that basically aren't addressed by anyone on the market.)
If you get a tower CPU cooler, which all the designs discussed in this thread are, that upper side-fan isn't going to earn you much since it will be blowing against the flat top of the cooler.
I'm not sure if having the 80 mm fan facing outward is going to get you much either. It certainly won't contribute to motherboard cooling very much; which is what it's placed there for. But then you probably aren't going to need extra rear-cooling for the CPU and motherboard. You could try it that way and see what happens.
Short version: I don't think you're "over doing it" since you won't be getting full effect from many of the fans to begin with. And your climate concerns are certainly understandable.
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Cool. Good to know. That was more or less my original thinking. |
Originally Posted by Human_Being
A slight positive pressure inside your case is better than a slight negative pressure; especially since the intakes will be covered with filters. It keeps particulates from seeping into the case and gives the internal fans something to work with.
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| Also keep in mind that any top fan looks to be heavily baffled by the chassis, so it won't be evacuating as much air as another fan. |
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| I would definitely keep at least one of the side fans facing inward; it's there to feed fresh, cool air to the CPU cooler and graphics card. You have a front fan, but it's got this stupid chunk of metal blocking its airflow, not that the HD cage needs to be that solid, so it doesn't push air into the motherboard cavity as well as it could. Yet if the front fan wasn't there, you'd have your HDs sitting in a dead spot =P. (Sorry, I have objections to common case-airflow designs that basically aren't addressed by anyone on the market.) |
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If you get a tower CPU cooler, which all the designs discussed in this thread are, that upper side-fan isn't going to earn you much since it will be blowing against the flat top of the cooler. I'm not sure if having the 80 mm fan facing outward is going to get you much either. It certainly won't contribute to motherboard cooling very much; which is what it's placed there for. But then you probably aren't going to need extra rear-cooling for the CPU and motherboard. You could try it that way and see what happens. |
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| Short version: I don't think you're "over doing it" since you won't be getting full effect from many of the fans to begin with. And your climate concerns are certainly understandable. |
Anyone have any other thoughts on things? Opinions, etc?
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I meant the 80 mm wouldn't be doing much to cool the motherboard blowing outward vice blowing inward. It's the air being pushed against the surface and smeared around that carries away heat. If you're purposing the fan as a generic exhaust and aren't concerned about motherboard overheating anyway (which you shouldn't need to be), then it might do what you want blowing outward.
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Originally Posted by corridor
it's not really much of a fan anyway. i just figured evacuating the little bit of heat that'll accumulate back there in the area back behind the motherboard might help a bit with the longevity.
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True enough. Besides if it's blowing in it'll help carry some of that heat up to that only middling effective top fan, thus making it a bit more useful.
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Originally Posted by Human_Being
I meant the 80 mm wouldn't be doing much to cool the motherboard blowing outward vice blowing inward. It's the air being pushed against the surface and smeared around that carries away heat. If you're purposing the fan as a generic exhaust and aren't concerned about motherboard overheating anyway (which you shouldn't need to be), then it might do what you want blowing outward.
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I'd only really recommend filters for air INTAKE fans. Putting them out evac fans will simply cause turbulence and more noise.|
Originally Posted by corridor
Yup, adding filters for everything.
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| it'll be on a desk behind my monitor anyway. In a pet household putting the PC on the floor is just asking for trouble. |
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| The case has 120mm ports on the: Front, Back, Bottom, Top, and two on the open side (upper and lower). and one 80 MM on the back side of the motherboard. Any opinions on which ports I should use and which fans should be in and which out? I'll have 5 120mm fans and 1 80mm (This doesn't count the fans on the PSU) |
If you're actually going to mount ALL of them, I'd go for variable speed fans and keep them all on low. ESPECIALLY the 80mm. Don't go for the highest CFM fans you can find. With as much ventilation as you're putting in, you don't really need it. Unless you want the thing to double as a hovercraft...
Years ago, I had a case with a 40mm fan spot in back over the expansion bays. I went out and bought a 40x40x40mm fan that was quiet enough outside the case. When I put it in, it had such a high throughput and so much oscillation that it sounded like I'd hooked up a Dustbuster to the thing.
Even with rubber grommets it still was noisy as hell.
The smaller the fan, the faster it has to turn (or the thicker the fan has to be to scallop the blades more) to move more air. And because it's moving more air through the same aperture, it's going to be louder, because turbulence is higher.
Any really high-CFM fans should be buried inside the case (not in the front, not in the back, not on the doors, not on the top. Usually this is some sort of internal mount (like the secondary fan in the old Antec Sonata cases) or on the CPU cooler itself. This way the case itself acts as a noise baffle.
As others have said, make sure that you have slight positive pressure. This prevents the case from vacuuming up dust and debris from around the door seals. Excessive positive pressure will get you turbulence-induced noise and the case randomly puffing out what dust it DOES collect and can prematurely kill your fans).
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| I'm thinking Front 120mm: In, Open Side Lower 120mm: in Bottom 120mm: In Back 120mm: Out, Top 120mm: Out, and backside 80mm: out? |
Front: In
Open Side Lower: Either
Open Side Upper: Either
Back: Out
Bottom: Out
Top: Out
Backside 80mm: Out
You do NOT want a bottom fan pulling in. It'll just hoover dust up. I'd recommend leaving the bottom one out if you're leaving anything out.
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| Or am I overdoing it on the fans? Opinions? |
Realistically, I'd say:
1: Front (In)
1: Back (Out)
1: Door (In)
1: Top (Out)
Plus, remember you're going to have a fan on your CPU cooler too (or are you? It's late and my brain is malfunctioning).
Clicking on the linked image above will take you off the City of Heroes site. However, the guides will be linked back here.
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Modular cords are nice and all. Don't get me wrong. But you get cleaner signal off hardwired PSUs. Every interface adds a bit of line noise. Just take extra care routing your cables and be meticulous about bundling up and routing/hiding the ones you don't use and it'll look just fine. You may have to play with it a little, but it'll be ok.|
Originally Posted by corridor
I also wish that PSU had modular cords on it, but Man I'm NOT willing to pay the price difference for the equivalent one that does. Maybe nother brand pSU. I really don't want to go very low on the PSU quality though. I suppose I'd rather have wires than a crappy modular PSU
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Here's a picture of a rough cable job I did on a workhorse box I put together at work (dual quad xeons FTW!)
Wish I had some pics of my cable routing in my current case (my last case was somewhat messier than I wanted because I was still using the dinky Sonata cases). But I had to put it together and get it into service too fast to take good pics of the inside (and I don't want to pull it open right now).
Clicking on the linked image above will take you off the City of Heroes site. However, the guides will be linked back here.
The behind the motherboard low profile 80mm intake fan is basically pointless except for the few motherboards that have a heatsink mounted under the CPU socket. The epoxy/fiberglass material that circuit boards are made of aren't really great conductors of heat so blowing air on it isn't really going to dissipate a lot of heat.
The 2nd side fan mount is located above the video card toward the rear of the case next to the rear exhaust fan. I personally would look at blocking this opening to ensure the exhaust fan is blowing warm air out of the case and not simply sucking it in through the side vent.
The side fan is located either above or just below the video card slots. This combined with the air from the front fan should provide the video card with a nice supply of cooler outside air to use which is why I don't think you need a bottom fan.
As for the two top fan mounts, I'm of two thoughts about this. Either add an intake fan to the front mount, supplying cool air to the CPU cooler and ram or an exhaust fan at the rear mount to assist in removing the hot air from the CPU cooler and voltage regulator heatsinks from the case.
I was going to include pictures of the airflow with little arrows but I don't feel like playing with GIMP right now. However let me include these two pictures so you get a sense where the side fans line up relative to the guts of the case. Tab between them to see get an idea where they link up.
Outside Inside
However experimenting to find the best mix of open vent, closed vent, intake fan and exhaust fan on the optional fan locations for the best temperature distribution is half the fun. 
Father Xmas - Level 50 Ice/Ice Tanker - Victory
$725 and $1350 parts lists --- My guide to computer components
Tempus unum hominem manet
Excellent stuff guys. Thanks a bunch.
I only meant that i was going to put filters on the intakes. Not EVERYTHING, everything... 
Wait there are TWO top fan ports? Good grief. This case is like swiss cheese.
Ok, I've found some good pictures on Overclock.net to help me see where all of the fan locations on this case are. Though the guy with the pictures seems to have gone a bit off the deep end, fanwise...
According to him it's got,
2x80-140mm Door
2x80-140mm Roof
1x80-140mm Floor
1x80-140mm Front
1x80-140mm Front
1x80mm in the Back Panel
Good grief! What have I gotten myself into?
Ok so I'm not thinking I'll be buying THAT many fans. Since any overclocking I'd do would be minimal anyway I'll never NEED that many fans. I guess I'm going to need to block up some ports (Top side and bottom). Sheesh. What sort of thing is safe to use for that? Some carefully cut cardboard and tape or just leave them be?
He certainly seems to like the case though, And it sounds like cable management will be a snap with a little fiddling. Though as much work as he's put into the fans and such, you'd think he'd put a black faceplate on that DVD drive...
Guess I'll skip the 80mm. Maybe (MAYBE) throw another pair of 120mm's in there to fill out the 2 front, 1 Side, 1 Back, and 2 Top. (Comes with 3 and I can buy 3 more) But, then I'll have more or less equalized air pressure. My sense of symmetry HATES the idea of using one top fan but not both. :P
Ok this is going TOO far. 2 Front, and 1 side blowing in and one Back and one top blowing out. Filters for the ones going in and the PSU. That does bring be back to what to do with the extra fan ports. What's safe to block them with?
Oh, and Father Xmas, regarding your sig... "Be rary of wousing a rizard's wrath - rousing a rizard's - Be wary of making a magician angry!"
Great book AND movie...
Well I have the manual right here (downloaded the pdf when I first switched to this case for the $1200 build wishlist).
Top Fan x 2 - Supports 80/90/120/140mm fans (optional)
Rear Fan x 1 - Supports 80/90/120mm fans (120mm fan installed)
Front Fan x 1 - Supports 80/90/120mm fans (120 mm fan installed)
Bottom Fan x 1 - Supports 120/140mm fans (optional)
Left Fan x 2 - Supports 80/90/120/140mm fans (one 120mm fan installed, one optional)
Right Fan x 1 - Supports 80x15mm fan (optional)
Note that most case fans are 25mm (1 inch) thick so the behind the motherboard (right fan) is thinner than standard (15mm thick). You can see in this picture of the rear fan and this picture of the left side fans the mounting holes for all the different fan sizes.
BTW the front fan and the bottom fan location already have fine mesh filters.
And yes the top is a grill as well. It's plastic hiding the metal top of the case.
Oh and those pics are from a review of the case at TechPowerUp. Lots of pictures including all the fan locations, the bottom fan filter and the PSU vent.
And my favorite exchange from the movie.
"What is the use of wizardry if it cannot save a unicorn?"
"That is what heroes are for."
Father Xmas - Level 50 Ice/Ice Tanker - Victory
$725 and $1350 parts lists --- My guide to computer components
Tempus unum hominem manet
Man, as nice as that hard drive tray looks it's GOT to do some pretty serious airflow restriction from the front of the case. It looks like a wall. I'm beginning to wonder if that bottom mounter fan spot really SHOULD be filtered and used as an intake.
Nice. It's a VERY positive review. Looks like we've picked a great case. I'm a bit concerned by that front end constriction, but i figure if I mount two fans up front, and the lower one on the side filtered and drawing in, and use the back and rear top for pushing the air out, block off the lower and upper side ports and just leave the other top port open to let the positive pressure encourage a bit more heat to rise out, everything should work out nicely. I'm still tempted to stick an outblowing fan on that 80mm back of the mobo spot, to help encourage a negative pressure in the upper back quadrant of the case to encourage draw from the higher pressure lower front quadrant, but i suppose I probably won't bother, though i doubt I'll block off that port..
The bit about the optical drive bay only having clips on the open side of the case and needing screwed in on the other side is a bit vexing, but a small price to pay. i REALLY like how nicely bundled up and clipped down all of the case wires are. I'm going to have to REALLY do a job on the power cables just to maintain that nice clean appearance.
I'm still a bit fuzzy on how to block off those unused fan ports. I suppose i'll just use a dark colored piece of heavy gage glossy paper and some decent tape.
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You can mount fan filters over them. Either the plastic ones or the metal ones you saw in my link to newegg earlier in the thread. It won't create a solid barrier, but for the most part, if you have positive case pressure, you shouldn't need it.
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Originally Posted by corridor
I'm still a bit fuzzy on how to block off those unused fan ports. I suppose i'll just use a dark colored piece of heavy gage glossy paper and some decent tape.
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Clicking on the linked image above will take you off the City of Heroes site. However, the guides will be linked back here.
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Makes sense. Stupid little buggers are adding up though. :P|
Originally Posted by Hyperstrike
You can mount fan filters over them. Either the plastic ones or the metal ones you saw in my link to newegg earlier in the thread. It won't create a solid barrier, but for the most part, if you have positive case pressure, you shouldn't need it.
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Worth it.
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MWAHAHAHA, break out a Dremel tool and remove it! >:] Then, replace it with one of Theeese! >:] (Have I mentioned I dislike the layout design-decisions in most cases on the market? |
Originally Posted by corridor
Man, as nice as that hard drive tray looks it's GOT to do some pretty serious airflow restriction from the front of the case. It looks like a wall. I'm beginning to wonder if that bottom mounter fan spot really SHOULD be filtered and used as an intake.
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)If you found you suddenly needed a 4-drive Raid array, you could screw the HD cage back in any time. But right now ou've only got one HD, and if you added a second it could be mounted in another Novibes attached to the bottom of the optical drive cage. This gets obstructions out of the way of the front fan, dramatically increases actual cooling airflow (plus plain old convection) around the HD, and shuts down propagation of seek/read noise by mechanically isolating the drive. You should only have significant motor noise, which is minimal in a well-made drive these days.
You get the benefits of an "added fan" plus additional noise management for the price of one of the Noiseblocker Multiframe fans ($25) and some elbow grease.
(Yeah yeah, I know; this is something that appeals to just me isn't it?
.)
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Originally Posted by Human_Being
MWAHAHAHA, break out a Dremel tool and remove it! >:] Then, replace it with one of Theeese! >:] (Have I mentioned I dislike the layout design-decisions in most cases on the market?
)<break> (Yeah yeah, I know; this is something that appeals to just me isn't it? .) |
Ha, no that's pretty awesome. I especially like anything involving bungie cords.
Sadly my Dremel is busted. (In reality, I won't touch case modding with a 10ft pole.
)I particularly like this phrase from your link:
"Therfore it is required that the rubbers are checked every 12-18 month for signs of wear&tear. Replacement rubbers are available at a nominal fee or even free of charge at your NoiseMagic dealer."
Yeah, my old college used to give em away free too...
Anyway, it DOES seem a bit counterintuitive. i mean i like the thought that the old HD bays were a royal pain to work with, but I'm not really sure blocking the front fan airflow was the fix for this.
Strike two Case manufacturers! Please knock it out of the park on the third pitch!
Quote:
Oh I'd love for some manufacturer to work through the thought problem and solve all the issues I have with common cases. But no one has despite the simple change that would solve pretty much all of them...|
Originally Posted by corridor
Anyway, it DOES seem a bit counterintuitive. i mean i like the thought that the old HD bays were a royal pain to work with, but I'm not really sure blocking the front fan airflow was the fix for this.
Strike two Case manufacturers! Please knock it out of the park on the third pitch! |
The source of the problem is the positioning of the optical drive bay and the CPU cooler. The drive mounting cage is where it is for entirely valid ergonomic reasons. If the computer is on the floor, you don't want the optical drive at the bottom because then you have to reach all the way down to use it. If the computer is on a desk, it's likely you could have something on the desk in the way of the disk tray opening if it was at the bottom. Putting the optical drive(s) at the top-front of the case is the logical place. But if you have the cage there, it's difficult to have a fan feeding air directly to the CPU also.
Lots of case designs try to work around this via a Rube Goldberg arrangement of fans that have right-angled turns in air flow and serpentine pathways for cool air to reach hot components. Many of these end up recycling their exhaust air back in after it's been heated. Others lower the motherboard down somewhat and place the power supply at the top. This, however, puts two of the three hottest components right next to each other (CPU and Power Supply; GPU being the third) and makes the CPU and GPU compete for the same partial airstream from a front-middle fan (a bottom fan only blowing over the expansion slots).
There is a fix for this though, and it's really simple, nay, obvious: flip the motherboard upside down and mount it on the opposite wall of the case. In that arrangement, you have the case component which consistently eats the most power sitting at the bottom of the chassis, being fed fresh, cool air in a straight line from the front fan(s), and immediately exhausting that air out the back as soon as it's heated.
Three elaborations are needed to fully flesh out the design. Firstly, you need to have the HD cage be either A) open enough that it doesn't obstruct airflow or B) modular and removable so that some or all of the bays can be taken out of the air-path. Secondly, you need a second fan, even if a smaller one, above the lower front fan to feed air to the graphics card without it having to scavenge from the CPU cooler. Thirdly you need enough perforations in the front and back of the case so that heated air can move out of the case easily rather than having to be squeezed through a single, constricted "exhaust port".
The power supply, which has its own fan anyway, will act to exhaust any ambient heat that wasn't exhausted by the CPU and GPU coolers rising inside the case.
Uncomplicated, elegant, and efficient.
I've seen exactly three cases that even try to address the design issues this way, and two of them screw it up. The first one was a "gamer" design that mounted the motherboard on the left wall, but also rotated it 90 degrees. Once again the CPU is in a "dead spot" behind the optical drives, there's kink in the airflow, and now the case expects all heated air to be exhausted out the top of the case - making it unsuitable for placing under a table or desk. The second one also had the inverted format, but had a solid front wall and barely enough perforations in the back wall for a puppy to breath through.
But what about that third case? Yes, there exists a chassis that satisfies all the design criteria I outlined above. However, you can't buy the thing. Furthermore, it's not being manufactured anymore. And finally, the corporate division that designed it in the first place no longer exists
! It was the chassis for the Dell XPS 630 =P.Intel designed the BTX case format earlier in the decade in an attempt to address the thermal buildup and airflow problems that had appeared with more modern, high-power components being put in the legacy ATX case layout. The BTX format put the CPU in the front-center, right behind a ducted fan so that it received fresh air. The design failed in part of its intentions though by also placing the GPU right behind the CPU, feeding off its exhaust. Furthermore, no one wanted to abandon the ATX standard for the all new BTX one (predictably). So Dell themselves abandoned BTX after briefly using it in their XPS 4xxs.
However, they kept the ideas from the BTX format and even improved on them when designing the cases for the XPS 6xx and 7xx "gaming" computers. They used a standard ATX specification, but simply flipped it over to the opposite wall. They also made the HD cage both ventilated and modular so it could be removed; partially or entirely. The front had two fans and the back was heavily perforated to allow easy air-draft.
You can't buy an XPS case by itself because Dell is afraid of someone filling the chassis with low-quality components and then selling it with their name on it (marinate in the irony of that statement for a moment =P). Furthermore, the XPS 6xx and 7xx computers are no longer manufactured at all. And finally, all "gaming" designs are now the responsibility of the Alienware division of the company, with XPS now being a type of low-end machine using cheaper, industry-standard chassis for home/business use.
*head-desk* *head-desk* *head-desk*
Another problem with the original BTX design was the layout didn't favor AMD processors with their integrated memory controller, BTX being designed to help the Pentium IV heat problems.
Anywho do you want to see a case that takes compartmentalizing components with their own cooling to the extreme?
Meet the Thermaltake Level 10 case, designed in conjunction with BMW DesignWorks. Only $850 at NewEgg, well not really, it's only available as part of a $4700 list (save over $500) of top end parts.
There's a review of it over at PC Perspective. Every component group has it's own enclosure. The motherboard enclosure (with removable motherboard tray) includes a 140mm front and 120mm rear fan and a side vent. Each hard drive has it's own little case but the column of HD bays are cooled by two 60mm fans. All the cables are run within the common "wall" that all the individual enclosures are attached to.
At least it comes with a handle if you want to haul it somewhere. It's made out of aluminum but still weighs close to 50 lbs empty.
Father Xmas - Level 50 Ice/Ice Tanker - Victory
$725 and $1350 parts lists --- My guide to computer components
Tempus unum hominem manet
While I realize that the following isn't that popular an option, if you find that the stock cooler is too loud/doesn't cool enough, back when I bought my ati x1950xtx, before I ever installed it, I yanked the stock cooler off and replaced it with a Zalman VGA cooler and placed tiny heatsinks on all the memory chips.
It was quiet and cool and ran like a champ for a long time. Still have it sitting on a shelf waiting to be used somewhere else. Cracks me up comparing that card to the 5850 I'm looking at now.
Be well, people of CoH.