Build help - sustainable endurance problem


Bill Z Bubba

 

Posted

First I'd like to say thanks for helincarnate who laid out a huge chunk of the build, which I've been playing and have made some of my own tweaks to.

Second, I'll probably post this in the scrapper forums as well, to try and get as much help as I can.

Now the problem.

I'm currently playing my SS/WP brute on live with Mu mastery and I'm planning a respec into Soul Mastery.

The problem is I want Gloom, Dark Oblit & Darkest Night.

I did a respec on the training room server, but it required a heavy sacrifice - I had to cut STA out of the build. Madness, I know.

What I'm looking for is to maintain the build's current 1200% regen, 30% Def vs. SM/L/F/C.

I'd also like to avoid drastic changes, as I have 90% of the IO's already slotted.

But I'd also like to fit darkest night into the build and have it be somewhat sustainable, which at the moment it isn't.

Between the end cost of SS attacks, rage crash, hasten crash, the cost of constantly cycling Footstomp & Dark Oblit, 7 toggles and now Darkest Night's high end cost it just isn't very sustainable at all.

I'm not opposed to using blues here and there to keep the whole thing running, but all of my test drives have me needing a blue nearly every pack of mobs (+1x8 solo)


Why did I cut stamina? The only other possible cuts were Combat Jumping & SoW.

CJ is my 4th LoTG 7.5. My recharge isn't so great to begin with and I personally enjoy being very mobile so Hurdle + CJ is a must. Losing this is a last ditch option.

SoW would be easier to cut out and I'm sure I could find a slot somewhere to stick the steadfast into HPT. However I use it fairly often though and wanted to keep it.

Sta seemed like an easier option as I already have QR. But this build is pretty END intensive, and now I'm not so sure.


Here's the build.


Villain Plan by Mids' Villain Designer 1.601
http://www.cohplanner.com/

Click this DataLink to open the build!

Level 50 Magic Brute
Primary Power Set: Super Strength
Secondary Power Set: Willpower
Power Pool: Speed
Power Pool: Fitness
Power Pool: Leaping
Power Pool: Fighting
Ancillary Pool: Soul Mastery

Villain Profile:
Level 1: Punch -- KntkC'bat-Acc/Dmg:35(A), KntkC'bat-Dmg/EndRdx:35(3), KntkC'bat-Dmg/Rchg:35(5), KntkC'bat-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg:35(7), C'ngImp-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg:50(31)
Level 1: High Pain Tolerance -- Numna-Heal:50(A), Numna-Heal/EndRdx:50(23), Numna-Heal/Rchg:50(23)
Level 2: Haymaker -- KntkC'bat-Acc/Dmg:35(A), KntkC'bat-Dmg/EndRdx:35(3), KntkC'bat-Dmg/Rchg:35(5), KntkC'bat-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg:35(7), C'ngImp-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg:40(34), Mako-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg:50(40)
Level 4: Fast Healing -- Numna-Heal:50(A), Numna-Heal/EndRdx:50(25), Numna-Regen/Rcvry+:50(25), Mrcl-Rcvry+:40(43), Mrcl-Heal:40(43), RgnTis-Regen+:30(43)
Level 6: Mind Over Body -- RctvArm-ResDam:40(A), RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx:40(11), RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg:40(11), RctvArm-ResDam/Rchg:40(37)
Level 8: Knockout Blow -- KntkC'bat-Acc/Dmg:35(A), KntkC'bat-Dmg/EndRdx:35(9), KntkC'bat-Dmg/Rchg:35(9), KntkC'bat-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg:35(31), C'ngImp-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg:50(31), Mako-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg:50(40)
Level 10: Indomitable Will -- LkGmblr-Rchg+:50(A), LkGmblr-Def:50(13), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx:50(13), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx/Rchg:50(37)
Level 12: Hasten -- RechRdx-I:50(A), RechRdx-I:50(15), RechRdx-I:50(15)
Level 14: Super Speed -- Zephyr-Travel:50(A), Zephyr-Travel/EndRdx:50(27)
Level 16: Rise to the Challenge -- Numna-Heal:50(A), Numna-Heal/EndRdx:50(17), Numna-Heal/Rchg:50(17), HO:Golgi(19)
Level 18: Rage -- Rec'dRet-ToHit:20(A), Rec'dRet-ToHit/Rchg:20(19)
Level 20: Quick Recovery -- P'Shift-EndMod:50(A), P'Shift-EndMod/Rchg:50(21), P'Shift-EndMod/Acc:50(21), P'Shift-End%:50(46)
Level 22: Hurdle -- Jump-I:50(A)
Level 24: Health -- Numna-Heal:50(A), Numna-Heal/Rchg:50(27), Numna-Heal/EndRdx:50(34)
Level 26: Combat Jumping -- LkGmblr-Rchg+:50(A)
Level 28: Heightened Senses -- LkGmblr-Rchg+:50(A), LkGmblr-Def:50(29), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx:50(29), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx/Rchg:50(37)
Level 30: Boxing -- Empty(A)
Level 32: Foot Stomp -- Oblit-Dmg:50(A), Oblit-Acc/Rchg:50(33), Oblit-Dmg/Rchg:50(33), Oblit-Acc/Dmg/Rchg:50(33), Oblit-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg:50(34), FrcFbk-Rechg%:50(40)
Level 35: Tough -- RctvArm-ResDam:40(A), RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx:40(36), RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg:40(36), RctvArm-ResDam/Rchg:40(36)
Level 38: Weave -- LkGmblr-Rchg+:50(A), LkGmblr-Def:50(39), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx:50(39), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx/Rchg:50(39)
Level 41: Gloom -- Dev'n-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg:50(A), Dev'n-Dmg/EndRdx:50(42), Dev'n-Dmg/Rchg:50(42), Dev'n-Acc/Dmg/Rchg:50(42), DarkWD-ToHitdeb/Rchg/EndRdx:50(46), DarkWD-Rchg/EndRdx:50(50)
Level 44: Dark Obliteration -- Posi-Acc/Dmg:50(A), Posi-Dmg/EndRdx:50(45), Posi-Dmg/Rchg:50(45), Posi-Dmg/Rng:50(45), Posi-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx:50(46), RechRdx-I:50(48)
Level 47: Darkest Night -- DarkWD-ToHitdeb/Rchg/EndRdx:50(A), DarkWD-Rchg/EndRdx:50(48), DarkWD-ToHitDeb/EndRdx:50(48), DarkWD-ToHitDeb:50(50), EndRdx-I:50(50)
Level 49: Strength of Will -- S'fstPrt-ResDam/Def+:30(A)
------------
Level 1: Brawl -- RechRdx-I:50(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- Run-I:50(A)
Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Fury
------------
Set Bonus Totals:

  • 6% DamageBuff(Smashing)
  • 6% DamageBuff(Lethal)
  • 6% DamageBuff(Fire)
  • 6% DamageBuff(Cold)
  • 6% DamageBuff(Energy)
  • 6% DamageBuff(Negative)
  • 6% DamageBuff(Toxic)
  • 6% DamageBuff(Psionic)
  • 18.6% Defense(Smashing)
  • 18.6% Defense(Lethal)
  • 3% Defense(Fire)
  • 3% Defense(Cold)
  • 7.06% Defense(Energy)
  • 7.06% Defense(Negative)
  • 3% Defense(Psionic)
  • 10.8% Defense(Melee)
  • 7.38% Defense(Ranged)
  • 3% Defense(AoE)
  • 45% Enhancement(Accuracy)
  • 46.3% Enhancement(RechargeTime)
  • 5% FlySpeed
  • 337.3 HP (22.5%) HitPoints
  • 5% JumpHeight
  • 5% JumpSpeed
  • MezResist(Immobilize) 10.5%
  • MezResist(Stun) 2.2%
  • 10% (0.17 End/sec) Recovery
  • 90% (5.63 HP/sec) Regeneration
  • 1.58% Resistance(Fire)
  • 1.58% Resistance(Cold)
  • 5% RunSpeed



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Posted

Heh, surprised no one else has come along yet. I've spent the last 20-30 minutes working on some numbers for your build, as well as some changes to slotting that I'd make.

I'll post my rework of your build in a minute, but first, some numbers:

Your build is pretty solid. With all of your toggles running, not counting Darkest Night, you can go from 0-full endurance in 44.6s. With DN active, you go 0-full in 51.4s. Considering that base recovery is 0-full in 60s, you are already ahead of the curve with all toggles running with the way you are slotted. That you are having endurance issues, then, must come from the combination Rage/Hasten crashes and also from subpar slotting of end redux.

I've noticed a trend in your build, to focus on enhancing the recharge values of powers to the detriment of endurance reduction. Even more damning of this approach is that with your global recharge and Hasten, the minor increase you get by enhancing recharge hurts your sustainable endurance when compared to slotting for more end redux. You just aren't getting that much of a value slotting so heavily for recharge in powers that already have a relatively low recharge. Take Punch, for example. Punch's base values for recharge and endurance are 4 seconds and 5.2 endurance. A 25% reduction in recharge will net you a .82s reduction, while a 25% reduction in endurance cost will get you a 1.06% reduction. The reduction in recharge will make no major functional difference in your damage over time (especially as you gain more recharge from Hasten and set bonuses), while reducing the endurance cost of a fast firing attack will drastically reduce the amount of endurance consumed over time. Also, almost every AT looks for enough recharge, from set bonuses/hasten and slotting, to make for a sustainable attack chain. Any more recharge than that, and you will be likely to have powers recharged while you are using other powers, which is just wasted recharge. With longer recharging powers like KO Blow, Foot Stomp, and Dark Obliteration, having more recharge is better because it gives them a better damage over time, but even then, endurance reduction should not be sacrificed for recharge, because having it faster and costing more will cost you more endurance than having it a little slower and costing less.

So what I basically went about doing was changing some of your enhancements to lower the endurance cost of them without majorly impacting recharge. With your current build you have a static 46.3% recharge, which is pretty solid. It's not uber, but it isn't piddly-squat, either. With it (and Hasten) you really only need to leverage about 40% recharge enhancement from slots to maintain a solid attack chain. All of your powers have 60% or more recharge slotted. Again, for the heavy hitters like KO and FS, that isn't necessarily a bad thing, but not at the cost of endurance reduction. So I went around and swapped some enhancements for others. Know what happened? In FS and KO's case, you lose about 1-2s on recharge, while gaining a pretty significantly lower cost, especially for FS.

I also swapped out CJ for Stamina. The way you have CJ slotted, it was giving you a grand total of 2.2% defense. Now, if you were going to soft-cap your defense, then 2.2% being the difference between 42.8% and 45% would be significant. But you aren't going for the soft-cap. You want to keep around 30%, and that 2.2% just isn't making as big a difference for you. Someone could come along and give better numbers that could say that it does make a huge difference, but in my experience, it doesn't. Especially where endurance management is considered. If you don't like my build, then swap out SoW for CJ and you'll get your defense back. The 7.5% recharge? Yeah, its great if you don't have any other recharge, or if you are looking to get Hasten permanent, but from the looks of your build, you have plenty of recharge and aren't going for perma-Hasten. Dropping it added a whole 3 seconds to the recharge of Hasten, and you still have perma-Rage. On other powers, again, it only cost you ~0.5-1s in recharge, not a major loss.

I swapped out the Res/Rech in Tough for a Ribosome. This significantly lowers the endurance cost, and only cost you 1.25% S/L defense, again, a small number compared to better endurance management. I'm sure the Ribo will be expensive, especially redside, but you can probably swing it if you decide to sell the LotG you get from swapping CJ for Stamina. I don't know the prices off the top of my head, but I imagine the LotG will be worth more than the Ribo on the BM.

Are you ready to see the build? Then here we go!

Villain Plan by Mids' Villain Designer 1.601
http://www.cohplanner.com/

Level 50 Magic Brute
Primary Power Set: Super Strength
Secondary Power Set: Willpower
Power Pool: Speed
Power Pool: Fitness
Power Pool: Fighting
Ancillary Pool: Soul Mastery

Villain Profile:
------------
Level 1: Jab
(A) Kinetic Combat - Accuracy/Damage
(3) Kinetic Combat - Damage/Endurance
(5) Kinetic Combat - Damage/Recharge
(7) Kinetic Combat - Damage/Endurance/Recharge
(31) Crushing Impact - Damage/Endurance


Level 1: High Pain Tolerance
(A) Numina's Convalescence - Heal
(23) Numina's Convalescence - Heal/Endurance
(23) Numina's Convalescence - Heal/Recharge


Level 2: Haymaker
(A) Kinetic Combat - Accuracy/Damage
(3) Kinetic Combat - Damage/Endurance
(5) Kinetic Combat - Damage/Recharge
(7) Kinetic Combat - Damage/Endurance/Recharge
(34) Crushing Impact - Damage/Endurance
(40) Mako's Bite - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance/Recharge


Level 4: Fast Healing
(A) Numina's Convalescence - Heal
(25) Numina's Convalescence - Heal/Endurance
(25) Numina's Convalescence - +Regeneration/+Recovery
(43) Miracle - +Recovery
(43) Miracle - Heal
(43) Regenerative Tissue - +Regeneration


Level 6: Mind Over Body
(A) Reactive Armor - Resistance
(11) Reactive Armor - Resistance/Endurance
(11) Reactive Armor - Resistance/Endurance/Recharge
(37) Steadfast Protection - Resistance/Endurance
(40) Steadfast Protection - Resistance/+Def 3%


Level 8: Knockout Blow
(A) Kinetic Combat - Accuracy/Damage
(9) Kinetic Combat - Damage/Endurance
(9) Kinetic Combat - Damage/Recharge
(31) Kinetic Combat - Damage/Endurance/Recharge
(31) Crushing Impact - Damage/Endurance/Recharge
(39) Mako's Bite - Damage/Endurance


Level 10: Indomitable Will
(A) Luck of the Gambler - Recharge Speed
(13) Luck of the Gambler - Defense
(13) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Endurance
(37) Luck of the Gambler - Endurance/Recharge


Level 12: Hasten
(A) Recharge Reduction IO
(15) Recharge Reduction IO
(15) Recharge Reduction IO


Level 14: Super Speed
(A) Blessing of the Zephyr - Run Speed, Jump, Flight Speed, Range


Level 16: Rise to the Challenge
(A) Numina's Convalescence - Heal
(17) Numina's Convalescence - Heal/Endurance
(17) Numina's Convalescence - Heal/Recharge
(19) HamiO:Golgi Exposure


Level 18: Rage
(A) Rectified Reticle - To Hit Buff
(19) Rectified Reticle - To Hit Buff/Recharge


Level 20: Quick Recovery
(A) Performance Shifter - EndMod
(21) Performance Shifter - EndMod/Recharge
(21) Performance Shifter - EndMod/Accuracy
(40) Performance Shifter - Chance for +End


Level 22: Hurdle
(A) Jumping IO


Level 24: Health
(A) Numina's Convalescence - Heal
(27) Numina's Convalescence - Heal/Recharge
(27) Numina's Convalescence - Heal/Endurance


Level 26: Stamina
(A) Endurance Modification IO
(50) Endurance Modification IO


Level 28: Heightened Senses
(A) Luck of the Gambler - Recharge Speed
(29) Luck of the Gambler - Defense
(29) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Endurance
(37) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Endurance/Recharge


Level 30: Boxing
(A) Empty


Level 32: Foot Stomp
(A) Scirocco's Dervish - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance
(33) Scirocco's Dervish - Damage/Endurance
(33) Cleaving Blow - Damage/Endurance
(33) Cleaving Blow - Damage/Recharge
(34) Obliteration - Accuracy/Damage/Recharge
(34) Force Feedback - Chance for +Recharge


Level 35: Tough
(A) Reactive Armor - Resistance
(36) Reactive Armor - Resistance/Endurance
(36) Reactive Armor - Resistance/Endurance/Recharge
(36) HamiO:Ribosome Exposure


Level 38: Weave
(A) Luck of the Gambler - Recharge Speed
(39) Luck of the Gambler - Defense
(39) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Endurance


Level 41: Gloom
(A) Devastation - Accuracy/Damage
(42) Devastation - Damage/Endurance
(42) Devastation - Damage/Recharge
(42) Devastation - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance/Recharge
(46) Dark Watcher's Despair - To Hit Debuff/Endurance
(46) Dark Watcher's Despair - To Hit Debuff/Recharge


Level 44: Dark Obliteration
(A) Positron's Blast - Accuracy/Damage
(45) Positron's Blast - Damage/Endurance
(45) Positron's Blast - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance
(45) Positron's Blast - Damage/Recharge
(46) Positron's Blast - Damage/Range
(48) Dark Watcher's Despair - To Hit Debuff/Recharge


Level 47: Darkest Night
(A) Dark Watcher's Despair - To Hit Debuff/Recharge/Endurance
(48) Dark Watcher's Despair - Recharge/Endurance
(48) Dark Watcher's Despair - To Hit Debuff/Endurance
(50) Dark Watcher's Despair - To Hit Debuff
(50) Endurance Reduction IO


Level 49: Strength of Will
(A) Resist Damage IO


------------
Level 1: Brawl
(A) Recharge Reduction IO


Level 1: Sprint
(A) Run Speed IO


Level 2: Rest
(A) Empty


Level 1: Fury
------------
Set Bonus Totals:
3% DamageBuff(Smashing)
3% DamageBuff(Lethal)
3% DamageBuff(Fire)
3% DamageBuff(Cold)
3% DamageBuff(Energy)
3% DamageBuff(Negative)
3% DamageBuff(Toxic)
3% DamageBuff(Psionic)
16.1% Defense(Smashing)
16.1% Defense(Lethal)
3% Defense(Fire)
3% Defense(Cold)
5.5% Defense(Energy)
5.5% Defense(Negative)
3% Defense(Psionic)
9.56% Defense(Melee)
4.25% Defense(Ranged)
3% Defense(AoE)
27% Enhancement(Accuracy)
33.8% Enhancement(RechargeTime)
5% FlySpeed
337.3 HP (22.5%) HitPoints
5% JumpHeight
5% JumpSpeed
MezResist(Immobilize) 10.5%
12.5% (0.21 End/sec) Recovery
100% (6.26 HP/sec) Regeneration
1.58% Resistance(Fire)
1.58% Resistance(Cold)
5% RunSpeed



------------
Set Bonuses:
Kinetic Combat
(Jab)
MezResist(Immobilize) 2.75%
22.5 HP (1.5%) HitPoints
3.75% Defense(Smashing,Lethal), 1.88% Defense(Melee)


Numina's Convalescence
(High Pain Tolerance)
12% (0.75 HP/sec) Regeneration
28.1 HP (1.88%) HitPoints


Kinetic Combat
(Haymaker)
MezResist(Immobilize) 2.75%
22.5 HP (1.5%) HitPoints
3.75% Defense(Smashing,Lethal), 1.88% Defense(Melee)


Numina's Convalescence
(Fast Healing)
12% (0.75 HP/sec) Regeneration
28.1 HP (1.88%) HitPoints


Miracle
(Fast Healing)
2.5% (0.04 End/sec) Recovery


Reactive Armor
(Mind Over Body)
MezResist(Immobilize) 1.1%
1.25% Defense(Energy,Negative), 0.63% Defense(Ranged)


Steadfast Protection
(Mind Over Body)
1.5% (0.03 End/sec) Recovery
3% Defense(All)


Kinetic Combat
(Knockout Blow)
MezResist(Immobilize) 2.75%
22.5 HP (1.5%) HitPoints
3.75% Defense(Smashing,Lethal), 1.88% Defense(Melee)


Luck of the Gambler
(Indomitable Will)
10% (0.63 HP/sec) Regeneration
16.9 HP (1.13%) HitPoints
9% Enhancement(Accuracy)
7.5% Enhancement(RechargeTime)


Numina's Convalescence
(Rise to the Challenge)
12% (0.75 HP/sec) Regeneration
28.1 HP (1.88%) HitPoints


Rectified Reticle
(Rage)
1.88% Defense(Smashing,Lethal), 0.94% Defense(Melee)


Performance Shifter
(Quick Recovery)
5% JumpSpeed, 5% JumpHeight, 5% FlySpeed, 5% RunSpeed
28.1 HP (1.88%) HitPoints
2.5% (0.04 End/sec) Recovery


Numina's Convalescence
(Health)
12% (0.75 HP/sec) Regeneration
28.1 HP (1.88%) HitPoints


Luck of the Gambler
(Heightened Senses)
10% (0.63 HP/sec) Regeneration
16.9 HP (1.13%) HitPoints
9% Enhancement(Accuracy)
7.5% Enhancement(RechargeTime)


Scirocco's Dervish
(Foot Stomp)
10% (0.63 HP/sec) Regeneration


Cleaving Blow
(Foot Stomp)
1% (0.02 End/sec) Recovery


Reactive Armor
(Tough)
MezResist(Immobilize) 1.1%
1.25% Defense(Energy,Negative), 0.63% Defense(Ranged)


Luck of the Gambler
(Weave)
10% (0.63 HP/sec) Regeneration
16.9 HP (1.13%) HitPoints
7.5% Enhancement(RechargeTime)


Devastation
(Gloom)
12% (0.75 HP/sec) Regeneration
33.7 HP (2.25%) HitPoints
3% DamageBuff(All)


Dark Watcher's Despair
(Gloom)
22.5 HP (1.5%) HitPoints


Positron's Blast
(Dark Obliteration)
2.5% (0.04 End/sec) Recovery
1.58% Resistance(Fire,Cold)
9% Enhancement(Accuracy)
6.25% Enhancement(RechargeTime)


Dark Watcher's Despair
(Darkest Night)
22.5 HP (1.5%) HitPoints
2.5% (0.04 End/sec) Recovery
5% Enhancement(RechargeTime)

All told, you lose 3% damage, 9% accuracy, about 5% S/L/E/N defense and gain 7% regen. Your new recovery will get you from 0-full in 35.6s with DN on, and 32.1s without DN. I don't see the loss of defense as a major issue. You are still getting hit a lot less than you would without any defense, let alone 25% S/L, you still have 50% S/L resistance and you still have a great amount of regeneration, not to mention all the mitigation tricks that Super Strength has, as well as the -tohit of DN, Gloom, and Dark Obliteration. You also have SoW still, so you can pop that to up your resistances even more for more survivability. What you really gain is nigh-unlimited endurance. Your attacks will barely dent your bar, and your recovery is much better than your current build's.

As always, I'd advice you to go to the Test server to swap builds around before doing it on live, although availability of the new enhancements may mean that's not possible. Of course, you can always buy them on live, have them in your tray when you copy the character over, and then respec them into place. If you don't like it, don't respec on live and just resell the Enhancements. Won't have too much of a loss, and you may just be able to make a profit.

Good Luck, and I really hope this helps you! If you have any questions, post em up here or send me a tell in game @W Peace.

~WP


Just my opinion, feel free to disregard...

 

Posted

There is no link or data chunk included in W Peace's post/build ... and I was curious and had the time. So I believe the following is as intended or at least very close:

Villain Plan by Mids' Villain Designer 1.601
http://www.cohplanner.com/

Click this DataLink to open the build!

SS_WP_W Peace (v1.00.i16 non-purpled): Level 50 Magic Brute
Primary Power Set: Super Strength
Secondary Power Set: Willpower
Power Pool: Speed
Power Pool: Fitness
Power Pool: Fighting
Ancillary Pool: Soul Mastery

Villain Profile:
Level 1: Jab -- KntkC'bat-Acc/Dmg(A), KntkC'bat-Dmg/EndRdx(3), KntkC'bat-Dmg/Rchg(5), KntkC'bat-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(7), C'ngImp-Dmg/EndRdx(31)
Level 1: High Pain Tolerance -- Numna-Heal(A), Numna-Heal/EndRdx(23), Numna-Heal/Rchg(23)
Level 2: Haymaker -- KntkC'bat-Acc/Dmg(A), KntkC'bat-Dmg/EndRdx(3), KntkC'bat-Dmg/Rchg(5), KntkC'bat-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(7), C'ngImp-Dmg/EndRdx(34), Mako-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(40)
Level 4: Fast Healing -- Numna-Heal(A), Numna-Heal/EndRdx(25), Numna-Regen/Rcvry+(25), Mrcl-Heal(43), Mrcl-Rcvry+(43), RgnTis-Regen+(43)
Level 6: Mind Over Body -- RctvArm-ResDam(A), RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx(11), RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(11), S'fstPrt-ResDam/EndRdx(37), S'fstPrt-ResDam/Def+(40)
Level 8: Knockout Blow -- KntkC'bat-Acc/Dmg(A), KntkC'bat-Dmg/EndRdx(9), KntkC'bat-Dmg/Rchg(9), KntkC'bat-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(31), C'ngImp-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(31), Mako-Dmg/EndRdx(39)
Level 10: Indomitable Will -- LkGmblr-Rchg+(A), LkGmblr-Def(13), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx(13), LkGmblr-EndRdx/Rchg(37)
Level 12: Hasten -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(15), RechRdx-I(15)
Level 14: Super Speed -- Zephyr-Travel(A)
Level 16: Rise to the Challenge -- Numna-Heal(A), Numna-Heal/EndRdx(17), Numna-Heal/Rchg(17), HO:Golgi(19)
Level 18: Rage -- Rec'dRet-ToHit(A), Rec'dRet-ToHit/Rchg(19)
Level 20: Quick Recovery -- P'Shift-EndMod(A), P'Shift-EndMod/Rchg(21), P'Shift-EndMod/Acc(21), P'Shift-End%(40)
Level 22: Hurdle -- Jump-I(A)
Level 24: Health -- Numna-Heal(A), Numna-Heal/EndRdx(27), Numna-Heal/Rchg(27)
Level 26: Stamina -- EndMod-I(A), EndMod-I(50)
Level 28: Heightened Senses -- LkGmblr-Rchg+(A), LkGmblr-Def(29), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx(29), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(37)
Level 30: Boxing -- Empty(A)
Level 32: Foot Stomp -- Sciroc-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(A), Sciroc-Dmg/EndRdx(33), C'ngBlow-Dmg/EndRdx(33), C'ngBlow-Dmg/Rchg(33), Oblit-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(34), FrcFbk-Rechg%(34)
Level 35: Tough -- RctvArm-ResDam(A), RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx(36), RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(36), HO:Ribo(36)
Level 38: Weave -- LkGmblr-Rchg+(A), LkGmblr-Def(39), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx(39)
Level 41: Gloom -- Dev'n-Acc/Dmg(A), Dev'n-Dmg/EndRdx(42), Dev'n-Dmg/Rchg(42), Dev'n-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(42), DarkWD-ToHitDeb/Rchg(46), DarkWD-ToHitDeb/EndRdx(46)
Level 44: Dark Obliteration -- Posi-Acc/Dmg(A), Posi-Dmg/EndRdx(45), Posi-Dmg/Rchg(45), Posi-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(45), Posi-Dmg/Rng(46), DarkWD-ToHitDeb/Rchg(48)
Level 47: Darkest Night -- DarkWD-ToHitdeb/Rchg/EndRdx(A), DarkWD-Rchg/EndRdx(48), DarkWD-ToHitDeb/EndRdx(48), DarkWD-ToHitDeb(50), EndRdx-I(50)
Level 49: Strength of Will -- ResDam-I(A)
------------
Level 1: Brawl -- RechRdx-I(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- Run-I(A)
Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Fury


 

Posted

Yep, that build is what I worked up and posted. Odd that it didn't do the link or chunk, considering I set it to do that. Maybe I set it the wrong way without realizing it. Thanks for redoing it and posting the link for me.

~WP


Just my opinion, feel free to disregard...

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by W Peace View Post
Heh, surprised no one else has come along yet. I've spent the last 20-30 minutes working on some numbers for your build, as well as some changes to slotting that I'd make.

I'll post my rework of your build in a minute, but first, some numbers:
I just want to say thanks for all the work, I really appreciate the response.


Quote:
Originally Posted by W Peace View Post
...That you are having endurance issues, then, must come from the combination Rage/Hasten crashes and also from subpar slotting of end redux.

I've noticed a trend in your build, to focus on enhancing the recharge values of powers to the detriment of endurance reduction. Even more damning of this approach is that with your global recharge and Hasten, the minor increase you get by enhancing recharge hurts your sustainable endurance when compared to slotting for more end redux. You just aren't getting that much of a value slotting so heavily for recharge in powers that already have a relatively low recharge.
Really good points here.



Quote:
Originally Posted by W Peace View Post
Take Punch, for example. Punch's base values for recharge and endurance are 4 seconds and 5.2 endurance. A 25% reduction in recharge will net you a .82s reduction, while a 25% reduction in endurance cost will get you a 1.06% reduction. The reduction in recharge will make no major functional difference in your damage over time (especially as you gain more recharge from Hasten and set bonuses), while reducing the endurance cost of a fast firing attack will drastically reduce the amount of endurance consumed over time. Also, almost every AT looks for enough recharge, from set bonuses/hasten and slotting, to make for a sustainable attack chain. Any more recharge than that, and you will be likely to have powers recharged while you are using other powers, which is just wasted recharge.
For future reference, how do you calculate how much recharge is "just enough" for attacks/attack chain? I'm not really a numbers guy when it comes to the fine details like this, I'm fine with overall build numbers - but when it comes to things like attack chains it's a bit over my head.


Quote:
Originally Posted by W Peace View Post
Good Luck, and I really hope this helps you! If you have any questions, post em up here or send me a tell in game @W Peace.

~WP
Thanks! It's a huge help.

There's so much info in the post that I want to take a bit of time to load up the build and digest it all. Even if I don't end up using all of the suggestions, there's definitely some great ideas there that I think will definitely improve the build.

I'll probably buy all the IOs on live then do a copy to test to play around with it.

As a side note, where are the emoticons on these boards O.o


Quote:
Originally Posted by Doomguide
There is no link or data chunk included in W Peace's post/build ... and I was curious and had the time. So I believe the following is as intended or at least very close:
Thanks Doomguide! You saved me the effort ;p


 

Posted

Question: How do you calculate the endurance per second cost of an attack chain?


 

Posted

Quote:
how do you calculate how much recharge is "just enough" for attacks/attack chain?
I am by no means an expert at that. Maybe we can summon TopDoc to come along and help with that. But basically, you have to add the cast time of the power with the recharge time, then try to figure out a sequence of attacks that will allow you to have a steady attack chain with powers ready as soon as you need them. One thing to remember is that the recharge of a power can *never* be lower than the cast time of the power, regardless of how much recharge you have. Keep this in mind to prevent over slotting recharge into powers, because you can end up with wasted recharge enhancement if you have a significant amount of global recharge.

Quote:
Question: How do you calculate the endurance per second cost of an attack chain?
Again, I'm by no means an expert, but what I like to do is take the Damage Per Activation and divide that by the endurance cost of the power. This should give you the Damage per endurance point spent. The higher you can get this number, the better (by lowering the endurance cost and raising the damage). How to figure that out as an Endurance per Second is more complex, and for the life of me I can't think of a way to do that right now, lol. Again, TopDoc will likely have the answers for both these questions. Perhaps someone should send him a PM about this thread and see what he says...

Anyway, hope this helps you further,

~WP


Just my opinion, feel free to disregard...

 

Posted

To calculate attack chain DPS:

Add up all damage done by chain and divide by sum of cast times.

To calculate chain EPS:

Add up end costs of attack chain and divide by sum of cast times.

It'd be nice if it was that simple, but it isn't.


Cast times aren't accurate. The best we can get is to recalculate cast times using what has been termed arcanatime. Arcanaville gave us the following equation:

(ROUNDUP((CastTime/0.132),0)+1)*0.132

So... take claws swipe. It has a stated cast time of .83 seconds.

.83/.132 = 6.28787~
Round that up to 7
+1 = 8
8*.132 = 1.056

1.056 is the cast time we need to use for calculated DPS and EPS if we were to use swipe in a claws attack chain.

The attack chain Followup, Slash, Focus, Strike has a posted total cast time of 4.5 seconds. The closer to actual time is 5.28 seconds.

To get the damage for each attack you'll have to start averaging out. I use 90% fury.

Total damage = base damage *(1+buffs)

So if you have 95% damage enhancement slotted and add in fury it works out to:

Total Damage = base * (1+1.8+.95)

Hope that helps some.


Be well, people of CoH.

 

Posted

Thanks Bill Z! [ ]

Quote:
Originally Posted by W Peace View Post
I am by no means an expert at that. Maybe we can summon TopDoc to come along and help with that. But basically, you have to add the cast time of the power with the recharge time, then try to figure out a sequence of attacks that will allow you to have a steady attack chain with powers ready as soon as you need them. One thing to remember is that the recharge of a power can *never* be lower than the cast time of the power, regardless of how much recharge you have. Keep this in mind to prevent over slotting recharge into powers, because you can end up with wasted recharge enhancement if you have a significant amount of global recharge.
Ok, so taking what Bill Z laid out for me, this is what I came up with for a ST/AoE mixed attack chain. I left out KO Blow and Gloom as those I use situationally, and less as any part of a consistent chain as both are a waste on minions IMO.

I calculated using arcanatime, and active hasten. I didn't calculate for the FF proc, as I wouldn't know where to begin.

If some math guru 8-| wants to figure out what the average overall rech boost the FF proc would give, assuming 8 mobs in range of footstomp on a constant cycle with a casttime+rech of 9.33s I won't complain... :P


So does this chain look about right?

Foot Stomp > Dark Oblit > Punch > Haymaker > Punch




Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Z Bubba View Post
To calculate chain EPS:

Add up end costs of attack chain and divide by sum of cast times.

It'd be nice if it was that simple, but it isn't.
So now that I've adjusted for arcanatime, do I add up the end cost of the chain and divide by the sum of the cast times + rech or just cast times?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Z Bubba
To get the damage for each attack you'll have to start averaging out. I use 90% fury.

Total damage = base damage *(1+buffs)

So if you have 95% damage enhancement slotted and add in fury it works out to:

Total Damage = base * (1+1.8+.95)

Hope that helps some.
It helps alot Bill, thanks.

Do I need to work out the damage for each attack individually, or can I just set fury to 90% in mids and trust the numbers it gives me?


 

Posted

Alright, I've come up with a revision. Beware, wall of text incoming.



I wanted to keep Combat Jumping. Combined with Hurdle it's basically a mini-travel power and was part of my compromise from one of my much earlier build versions (the one I'm playing on live) that will see me losing my beloved Super Jump - pure fun factor, trading it out for performance.



I also chose CJ over SoW as I became fixated on 30% Def vs. SM/L/Fire/Cold, and because the only reason I use SoW is during Cascading Def Failure moments - which is the main reason I wanted Darkest Night in the first place. It's not a perfect, or total solution vs. Def Failure, but it does help significantly from my test runs on test vs. +0x8 Cims.


Seeing as it's only significantly useful against SM/L, can basically be made up for with judicious use of med oranges (plentiful and cheap) and often gets me into as much trouble as it gets me out of with it's crash - I decided I'd remove that instead and keep my extra mobility and defense.


The recovery component is largely superfluous, or at least should be with this build.

However that meant I needed to shave more another slot to squeeze in the Steadfast 3%.

I like W_Peace's slotting of HPT better than mine, but I just couldn't make it work.

I focused on more End Discount slotting as W_Peace recommended in my attacks and other places, though I haven't worked out the numbers for the new attack chain yet.

Although I kept Oblit slotted in Foot Stomp, I'll frankenslot it the way W_Peace did if it seems to be an issue when I get this on the test server.



I don't think the attack chain will be dramatically different and I think I have a solid gap between my End Recovery and End Drain (gap of 3.21) with all toggles active, including Darkest Night (gap of 2.88). Although it's not as good a gap as W_Peace had slotted (3.45 & 3.12 w/ Darkest Night - an advantage of .24 per second), the advantage in his build comes primarily from more outright recovery (difference of .23) than from overall better End Drain (difference of .01).

I could probably squeeze out even more, Weave for example could get a slightly different slotting, but I'm not sure it's necessary and I'll wait til I try this build on test to see how it works out.

My only lingering question is how to slot STA. I only allocated one slot, a straight L50 End Mod IO (as I have it slotted now) or a Perf'Shifter proc?

I have the proc already, but I don't know which is better.


Here's the build:

EDIT Oct 8th: Swapped out the DEF/END LoTG in Weave & Heightened Senses for Cytoskeleton Exposure. It increased the gap between my End Drain and End Recovery to a total of 2.91. I figured I should be alright without the accuracy from the 4th LoTG due to rage and the other accuracy bonuses I have.

Whether I can actually get my hands on them redside is another story entirely, I'm also not convinced they'll be worth the cost - anywhere from 15 - 100 million per single Cytoskeleton Exposure for a reduction of .03 end drain.



Villain Plan by Mids' Villain Designer 1.601
http://www.cohplanner.com/

Click this DataLink to open the build!

Maelgrim SS_WP w Soul revision 2: Level 50 Magic Brute
Primary Power Set: Super Strength
Secondary Power Set: Willpower
Power Pool: Speed
Power Pool: Fitness
Power Pool: Fighting
Power Pool: Leaping
Ancillary Pool: Soul Mastery

Villain Profile:
Level 1: Punch

  • (A) Kinetic Combat - Accuracy/Damage: Level 35
  • (3) Kinetic Combat - Damage/Endurance: Level 35
  • (3) Kinetic Combat - Damage/Recharge: Level 35
  • (5) Kinetic Combat - Damage/Endurance/Recharge: Level 35
  • (5) Mako's Bite - Damage/Recharge: Level 50
Level 1: High Pain Tolerance
  • (A) Numina's Convalescence - Heal: Level 50
  • (7) Numina's Convalescence - Heal/Endurance: Level 50
  • (7) Numina's Convalescence - Heal/Recharge: Level 50
  • (37) Steadfast Protection - Resistance/+Def 3%: Level 30
Level 2: Haymaker
  • (A) Kinetic Combat - Accuracy/Damage: Level 35
  • (9) Kinetic Combat - Damage/Endurance: Level 35
  • (9) Kinetic Combat - Damage/Recharge: Level 35
  • (11) Kinetic Combat - Damage/Endurance/Recharge: Level 35
  • (11) Crushing Impact - Damage/Endurance/Recharge: Level 50
  • (36) Force Feedback - Recharge/Endurance: Level 50
Level 4: Fast Healing
  • (A) Numina's Convalescence - Heal: Level 50
  • (13) Numina's Convalescence - Heal/Endurance: Level 50
  • (13) Numina's Convalescence - +Regeneration/+Recovery: Level 50
  • (15) Miracle - Heal: Level 40
  • (15) Miracle - +Recovery: Level 40
  • (17) Regenerative Tissue - +Regeneration: Level 30
Level 6: Mind Over Body
  • (A) Reactive Armor - Resistance: Level 40
  • (17) Reactive Armor - Resistance/Endurance: Level 40
  • (19) Reactive Armor - Resistance/Endurance/Recharge: Level 40
  • (19) Reactive Armor - Endurance: Level 40
Level 8: Knockout Blow
  • (A) Kinetic Combat - Accuracy/Damage: Level 35
  • (21) Kinetic Combat - Damage/Endurance: Level 35
  • (21) Kinetic Combat - Damage/Recharge: Level 35
  • (23) Kinetic Combat - Damage/Endurance/Recharge: Level 35
  • (23) Crushing Impact - Damage/Endurance/Recharge: Level 50
  • (25) Force Feedback - Recharge/Endurance: Level 50
Level 10: Indomitable Will
  • (A) Luck of the Gambler - Recharge Speed: Level 50
  • (25) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Endurance: Level 50
  • (27) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Endurance/Recharge: Level 50
Level 12: Hasten
  • (A) Recharge Reduction IO: Level 50
  • (27) Recharge Reduction IO: Level 50
  • (29) Recharge Reduction IO: Level 50
Level 14: Super Speed
  • (A) Blessing of the Zephyr - Run Speed, Jump, Flight Speed, Range: Level 50
  • (29) Blessing of the Zephyr - Run Speed, Jump, Flight Speed, Range/Endurance: Level 50
Level 16: Rise to the Challenge
  • (A) Numina's Convalescence - Heal: Level 50
  • (31) Numina's Convalescence - Heal/Endurance: Level 50
  • (31) Numina's Convalescence - Heal/Endurance/Recharge: Level 50
  • (31) HamiO:Golgi Exposure
Level 18: Rage
  • (A) Rectified Reticle - To Hit Buff: Level 20
  • (33) Rectified Reticle - To Hit Buff/Recharge: Level 20
Level 20: Quick Recovery
  • (A) Performance Shifter - EndMod: Level 50
  • (33) Performance Shifter - EndMod/Recharge: Level 50
  • (33) Performance Shifter - EndMod/Accuracy: Level 50
  • (34) Performance Shifter - Chance for +End: Level 50
Level 22: Hurdle
  • (A) Jumping IO: Level 50
Level 24: Health
  • (A) Numina's Convalescence - Heal: Level 50
  • (34) Numina's Convalescence - Heal/Endurance: Level 50
  • (34) Numina's Convalescence - Heal/Recharge: Level 50
Level 26: Stamina
  • (A) Endurance Modification IO: Level 50
Level 28: Heightened Senses
  • (A) HamiO:Cytoskeleton Exposure
  • (36) Luck of the Gambler - Defense: Level 50
  • (36) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Endurance: Level 50
  • (50) Luck of the Gambler - Recharge Speed: Level 50
Level 30: Boxing
  • (A) Recharge Reduction IO: Level 50
Level 32: Foot Stomp
  • (A) Obliteration - Damage: Level 50
  • (37) Obliteration - Accuracy/Recharge: Level 50
  • (37) Obliteration - Damage/Recharge: Level 50
  • (39) Obliteration - Accuracy/Damage/Recharge: Level 50
  • (39) Obliteration - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance/Recharge: Level 50
  • (39) Force Feedback - Chance for +Recharge: Level 50
Level 35: Tough
  • (A) Reactive Armor - Resistance: Level 40
  • (40) Reactive Armor - Resistance/Endurance: Level 40
  • (40) Reactive Armor - Resistance/Endurance/Recharge: Level 40
  • (40) Reactive Armor - Endurance: Level 40
Level 38: Weave
  • (A) HamiO:Cytoskeleton Exposure
  • (42) Luck of the Gambler - Defense: Level 50
  • (42) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Endurance: Level 50
  • (42) Luck of the Gambler - Recharge Speed: Level 50
Level 41: Gloom
  • (A) Devastation - Damage/Endurance: Level 50
  • (43) Devastation - Damage/Recharge: Level 50
  • (43) Devastation - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance/Recharge: Level 50
  • (43) Devastation - Accuracy/Damage/Recharge: Level 50
  • (45) Dark Watcher's Despair - Recharge/Endurance: Level 50
  • (45) Dark Watcher's Despair - To Hit Debuff/Recharge/Endurance: Level 50
Level 44: Dark Obliteration
  • (A) Positron's Blast - Damage/Endurance: Level 50
  • (45) Positron's Blast - Damage/Recharge: Level 50
  • (46) Positron's Blast - Accuracy/Damage: Level 50
  • (46) Positron's Blast - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance: Level 50
  • (46) Positron's Blast - Chance of Damage(Energy): Level 50
  • (48) Dark Watcher's Despair - Recharge/Endurance: Level 50
Level 47: Darkest Night
  • (A) Dark Watcher's Despair - To Hit Debuff: Level 50
  • (48) Dark Watcher's Despair - To Hit Debuff/Recharge/Endurance: Level 50
  • (48) Dark Watcher's Despair - Recharge/Endurance: Level 50
  • (50) Dark Watcher's Despair - To Hit Debuff/Endurance: Level 50
  • (50) Endurance Reduction IO: Level 50
Level 49: Combat Jumping
  • (A) Luck of the Gambler - Recharge Speed: Level 50
------------
Level 1: Brawl
  • (A) Recharge Reduction IO: Level 50
Level 1: Sprint
  • (A) Empty
Level 2: Rest
  • (A) Empty
Level 1: Fury
------------
Set Bonus Totals:
  • 6% DamageBuff(Smashing)
  • 6% DamageBuff(Lethal)
  • 6% DamageBuff(Fire)
  • 6% DamageBuff(Cold)
  • 6% DamageBuff(Energy)
  • 6% DamageBuff(Negative)
  • 6% DamageBuff(Toxic)
  • 6% DamageBuff(Psionic)
  • 18.6% Defense(Smashing)
  • 18.6% Defense(Lethal)
  • 3% Defense(Fire)
  • 3% Defense(Cold)
  • 7.06% Defense(Energy)
  • 7.06% Defense(Negative)
  • 3% Defense(Psionic)
  • 10.8% Defense(Melee)
  • 7.38% Defense(Ranged)
  • 3% Defense(AoE)
  • 18% Enhancement(Accuracy)
  • 46.3% Enhancement(RechargeTime)
  • 5% FlySpeed
  • 337.3 HP (22.5%) HitPoints
  • 5% JumpHeight
  • 5% JumpSpeed
  • MezResist(Immobilize) 10.5%
  • MezResist(Stun) 2.2%
  • 10% (0.17 End/sec) Recovery
  • 90% (5.63 HP/sec) Regeneration
  • 1.58% Resistance(Fire)
  • 1.58% Resistance(Cold)
  • 5% RunSpeed
------------
Set Bonuses:
Kinetic Combat
(Punch)
  • MezResist(Immobilize) 2.75%
  • 22.5 HP (1.5%) HitPoints
  • 3.75% Defense(Smashing,Lethal), 1.88% Defense(Melee)
Numina's Convalescence
(High Pain Tolerance)
  • 12% (0.75 HP/sec) Regeneration
  • 28.1 HP (1.88%) HitPoints
Steadfast Protection
(High Pain Tolerance)
  • 3% Defense(All)
Kinetic Combat
(Haymaker)
  • MezResist(Immobilize) 2.75%
  • 22.5 HP (1.5%) HitPoints
  • 3.75% Defense(Smashing,Lethal), 1.88% Defense(Melee)
Numina's Convalescence
(Fast Healing)
  • 12% (0.75 HP/sec) Regeneration
  • 28.1 HP (1.88%) HitPoints
Miracle
(Fast Healing)
  • 2.5% (0.04 End/sec) Recovery
Reactive Armor
(Mind Over Body)
  • MezResist(Immobilize) 1.1%
  • 1.25% Defense(Energy,Negative), 0.63% Defense(Ranged)
  • 1.25% Defense(Smashing,Lethal), 0.63% Defense(Melee)
Kinetic Combat
(Knockout Blow)
  • MezResist(Immobilize) 2.75%
  • 22.5 HP (1.5%) HitPoints
  • 3.75% Defense(Smashing,Lethal), 1.88% Defense(Melee)
Luck of the Gambler
(Indomitable Will)
  • 10% (0.63 HP/sec) Regeneration
  • 16.9 HP (1.13%) HitPoints
  • 7.5% Enhancement(RechargeTime)
Blessing of the Zephyr
(Super Speed)
  • 3.13% Defense(Ranged), 1.56% Defense(Energy), 1.56% Defense(Negative)
Numina's Convalescence
(Rise to the Challenge)
  • 12% (0.75 HP/sec) Regeneration
  • 28.1 HP (1.88%) HitPoints
Rectified Reticle
(Rage)
  • 1.88% Defense(Smashing,Lethal), 0.94% Defense(Melee)
Performance Shifter
(Quick Recovery)
  • 5% JumpSpeed, 5% JumpHeight, 5% FlySpeed, 5% RunSpeed
  • 28.1 HP (1.88%) HitPoints
  • 2.5% (0.04 End/sec) Recovery
Numina's Convalescence
(Health)
  • 12% (0.75 HP/sec) Regeneration
  • 28.1 HP (1.88%) HitPoints
Luck of the Gambler
(Heightened Senses)
  • 10% (0.63 HP/sec) Regeneration
  • 16.9 HP (1.13%) HitPoints
  • 7.5% Enhancement(RechargeTime)
Obliteration
(Foot Stomp)
  • MezResist(Stun) 2.2%
  • 3% DamageBuff(All)
  • 9% Enhancement(Accuracy)
  • 5% Enhancement(RechargeTime)
Reactive Armor
(Tough)
  • MezResist(Immobilize) 1.1%
  • 1.25% Defense(Energy,Negative), 0.63% Defense(Ranged)
  • 1.25% Defense(Smashing,Lethal), 0.63% Defense(Melee)
Luck of the Gambler
(Weave)
  • 10% (0.63 HP/sec) Regeneration
  • 16.9 HP (1.13%) HitPoints
  • 7.5% Enhancement(RechargeTime)
Devastation
(Gloom)
  • 12% (0.75 HP/sec) Regeneration
  • 33.7 HP (2.25%) HitPoints
  • 3% DamageBuff(All)
Dark Watcher's Despair
(Gloom)
  • 22.5 HP (1.5%) HitPoints
Positron's Blast
(Dark Obliteration)
  • 2.5% (0.04 End/sec) Recovery
  • 1.58% Resistance(Fire,Cold)
  • 9% Enhancement(Accuracy)
  • 6.25% Enhancement(RechargeTime)
Dark Watcher's Despair
(Darkest Night)
  • 22.5 HP (1.5%) HitPoints
  • 2.5% (0.04 End/sec) Recovery
  • 5% Enhancement(RechargeTime)
Luck of the Gambler
(Combat Jumping)
  • 7.5% Enhancement(RechargeTime)



Code:
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Some other thoughts.

1) When I rage crash, I continue to cycle foot stomp for the mitigation when it's necessary and I then chain Brawl & Punch. I have brawl slotted with rech rdx, and thought it's ridiculously minimal, are there any procs I would be better off using for Brawl? Perhaps something I could even work into my regular chain?

2) I changed the slotting on Dark Oblit, and took the proc from positron and dropped the damage/range as damage was capped and Dark Oblit will be used point blank nearly all of the time anyway.

3) I think I would be able to (with a bit of work) aquire at least one purple set. My candidate would be Foot Stomp, Gloom or Dark Oblit. Would it be worth it?


Looking back, I don't think I actually changed too much from my first build (sorry W_P), but I was convinced that I do need STA in the build. I'll take it for a test drive, and see if it needs more work from there.


 

Posted

Okay, personally, I think your recharge between IOs and Hasten is perfectly fine. As such, I'd pull out the Force Feedback proc, and the Golgi in RTTC.

Drop both slots into Stamina and put common EndMod IOs in there. That'll significantly boost your recovery, and more than offset the loss of the Golgi.

As for the loss of FF proc, I'd say that it doesn't fire off regularly enough to really account for the slot it consumes.

The extra recovery should help offset the rage and hasten crashes while your recharge stays decent.



Clicking on the linked image above will take you off the City of Heroes site. However, the guides will be linked back here.

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hyperstrike View Post
Okay, personally, I think your recharge between IOs and Hasten is perfectly fine. As such, I'd pull out the Force Feedback proc, and the Golgi in RTTC.

Drop both slots into Stamina and put common EndMod IOs in there. That'll significantly boost your recovery, and more than offset the loss of the Golgi.
I went and pulled out the Golgi and added a second L50 End Mod IO to STA in Mids to see how it worked out.

I gained .16/s recovery and lost 4 hp per second regen. Depending on which you prize more, it seems like a wash. I suppose I'll choose between the two after I play on test with both and see which I prefer.

If my current planned build allows for sustained AoE attacks with all toggles running, I'll probably stick with the extra regen as small as it may be.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Hyperstrike View Post
As for the loss of FF proc, I'd say that it doesn't fire off regularly enough to really account for the slot it consumes.

The extra recovery should help offset the rage and hasten crashes while your recharge stays decent.
You wouldn't be the first person to tell me that. I've had my own doubts about it's overall effectiveness.

I will say that the times when I use it, is when I'm totally surrounded by enemies. Which is the prime focus of this build.

On solo maps at +1 or +2 x8 I find the proc goes off quite regularly as I'm generally surrounded by 10~16 enemies nearly constantly (I solo with extremely low downtime).

In groups it tends to be a similar situation, however there are more incidences where the group is fighting a single target (AV/Hero) where obviously it doesn't come into play at all.

Again, I think I'll see how the build performs before I fully decide. That being said, if I were to drop the FF proc, wouldn't I get more mileage out of slotting Oblit's 6th slot with a straight End Rdx?


EDIT: build updated.


 

Posted

Thought I'd give a bit of an update.

Adding STA back into the build, with a single L50 End Mod IO, alleviated nearly all of the issues I was having running Darkest Night.

Dropping a Resistance/Rech out of both sets of Reactive Armor and going with Reactive Armor: End Rdx also helped.

I still have a bit of worry when I rage/hasten crash, but it's manageable.


I took the build out against +1x8 Cims.

Darkest Night often provided solid mitigation, but it's not fool proof and death is but a single slip up away. Footstomp and Dark Obliteration need to be kept on a constant cycle to make the whole thing work - even then it's not enough.

Rage Crash:

I'm considering foregoing rage against cims when I'm running about on my own with no support (speed run ITFs or should I feel masochistic and farm cim mishes for drops). The rage crash got me killed almost every time. I'm not sure why, as I have it on 103s rech and it should give me just enough double stack to avoid the def drop.

Am I expecting too much from WP? I want this build to have no fear facing entire rooms of cims, but it just isn't happening. I died at least 3 times in my handful of test runs.

I'm kind of disappointed that even with 2500+ HP, nearly 50% resistances to SM/L, and something like 130-150 hp per second regen, with Darkest Night running + the To Hit Debuffs from RttC & Dark Oblit that I still have trouble when my defenses crash.

I suppose I'll just have to suck it up, as I'm not prepared to make dramatic offensive sacrifices to push closer to softcap.

Thoughts?


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Deus_Otiosus View Post
Thought I'd give a bit of an update.

Adding STA back into the build, with a single L50 End Mod IO, alleviated nearly all of the issues I was having running Darkest Night.

Dropping a Resistance/Rech out of both sets of Reactive Armor and going with Reactive Armor: End Rdx also helped.

I still have a bit of worry when I rage/hasten crash, but it's manageable.


I took the build out against +1x8 Cims.

Darkest Night often provided solid mitigation, but it's not fool proof and death is but a single slip up away. Footstomp and Dark Obliteration need to be kept on a constant cycle to make the whole thing work - even then it's not enough.

Rage Crash:

I'm considering foregoing rage against cims when I'm running about on my own with no support (speed run ITFs or should I feel masochistic and farm cim mishes for drops). The rage crash got me killed almost every time. I'm not sure why, as I have it on 103s rech and it should give me just enough double stack to avoid the def drop.

Am I expecting too much from WP? I want this build to have no fear facing entire rooms of cims, but it just isn't happening. I died at least 3 times in my handful of test runs.

I'm kind of disappointed that even with 2500+ HP, nearly 50% resistances to SM/L, and something like 130-150 hp per second regen, with Darkest Night running + the To Hit Debuffs from RttC & Dark Oblit that I still have trouble when my defenses crash.

I suppose I'll just have to suck it up, as I'm not prepared to make dramatic offensive sacrifices to push closer to softcap.

Thoughts?
You could have 50% def to sm/l and it wouldn't be much better than the 30% you have now due to the def debuffs. WP just doesn't have enough def debuff resistance, and once a large mob of cims start wailing on you, it's not long before all of your defense is gone, and even with a lot of res and regen, a large mob of cims will put you down relatively quickly. Too bad there's no way to build up def debuff resistance.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyber_naut View Post
You could have 50% def to sm/l and it wouldn't be much better than the 30% you have now due to the def debuffs. WP just doesn't have enough def debuff resistance, and once a large mob of cims start wailing on you, it's not long before all of your defense is gone, and even with a lot of res and regen, a large mob of cims will put you down relatively quickly.
That's actually the conclusion I've come to in the past few weeks.


Popping purples, gets me to softcap and has in no way alleviated cascading defense failure, and then shortly after - death.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyber_naut View Post
Too bad there's no way to build up def debuff resistance.

I think it's more of a balance issue with Cims, and to a lesser extent how strongly things are skewed towards DEF.

A secondary that relies almost entirely on passive regeneration and resistances for it's survival, should actually be able to rely on those to survive.

But that's just not how it works in game.


I read a lot on the forums on how /WP is apparently awesome with just SOs. That's not my experience however, not in groups or facing large spawns alone.

Before I built for +30% def vs. SM/L on this character, unless I had considerable support (and that, generally meant +DEF buffs), acting as the armored speartip for groups meant death.



I don't like it, but I've come to accept it.

I don't solo content with debuffs that you have absolutely no way of building or defending against unless you play very specific secondaries, and on teams with defensive debuffs I'm borderline unkillable.

On teams with little buffing, particularly the ITF, I just expect at least a handful of deaths as no amount of spamming inspirations, or use of darkest night will save me.