Few people to engage with in PvP means less of a reason to devote development resources to fixing it. Not fixing it means fewer people engage in it. Vicious cycle.
Mighty Isis and Stoney have a Thursday night fights thing going. check that out this week. it is a melee thing in the arena this week. tanks scrappers and brutes only. most of the time though they hold ffa's in the zones. you can find the thread in the servers section for Infinity.
Quote:
PvP in any game that is fun to PvP in has relatively balanced character types. In those situations, skills as well as luck play a part.|
Originally Posted by Radium
Few people to engage with in PvP means less of a reason to devote development resources to fixing it. Not fixing it means fewer people engage in it. Vicious cycle.
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The ATs in CoH were created with an intentional imbalance. There really is no way to correct that.
The game was created and then later on down the road, the DEVs added PvP because players requested it. So it was never thought about during the initial development of the game.
Characters with Mezs don't like not being able hold the enemy and get beat down by them any more than Tanks/Brutes don't like getting held by Mezers and slowly crushed to death. Mezs were nerfed and the ATs that were already resistant to Mez's didn't have their Defs or Resistance nerfed. That's just one type of example.
The best attempt that I have seen from the DEVs for PvP was the Gladiator system, but that is inherently imbalanced as all players don't have the pick of all the gladiators to make their teams from. They can only used the ones that they have earned. Of course, some have earned more than others, and it should be obvious to those that have played gladiator battles which enemies are the most powerful.
I think it would take much more time than it is worth to balance out the AT's enough to make PvP fun for all players - and many would be upset that they couldn't use any enhancements at all in PvP (you'd really need to implement a no enhancement rule to have any chance of making it balanced). Of course, changing the AT's that much means that you would need to redo PvE as well if you are going to have PvE enemies in a PvP zone - so then you are looking at is making a completely different game from scratch.
When you have players that are way more powerful than other players that then mock the opponent that they have easily defeated, it is easy to see why players don't enjoy being "schooled" by someone that thinks that they are L337 in a PvP zone.
PvP will be fun in CoH when it plays like X-Men vs. Streetfighter ... in 3-D - I'm not seeing this happen any time soon.
Quote:
Simplest way to fix all the problems with PvP is to go back to the old system and then add the good aspects of I13 into the system instead of trying to hack more stuff into the hacked-on system we've got now. It's simple, really, but it would require the admittance of a mistake on the parts of the developers, which with a change this big is extremely unlikely to happen. Unfortunately even if things did change back I don't see many of the old guard PvPers coming back.|
Originally Posted by The_Alt_oholic
PvP in any game that is fun to PvP in has relatively balanced character types. In those situations, skills as well as luck play a part.
The ATs in CoH were created with an intentional imbalance. There really is no way to correct that. The game was created and then later on down the road, the DEVs added PvP because players requested it. So it was never thought about during the initial development of the game. Characters with Mezs don't like not being able hold the enemy and get beat down by them any more than Tanks/Brutes don't like getting held by Mezers and slowly crushed to death. Mezs were nerfed and the ATs that were already resistant to Mez's didn't have their Defs or Resistance nerfed. That's just one type of example. The best attempt that I have seen from the DEVs for PvP was the Gladiator system, but that is inherently imbalanced as all players don't have the pick of all the gladiators to make their teams from. They can only used the ones that they have earned. Of course, some have earned more than others, and it should be obvious to those that have played gladiator battles which enemies are the most powerful. I think it would take much more time than it is worth to balance out the AT's enough to make PvP fun for all players - and many would be upset that they couldn't use any enhancements at all in PvP (you'd really need to implement a no enhancement rule to have any chance of making it balanced). Of course, changing the AT's that much means that you would need to redo PvE as well if you are going to have PvE enemies in a PvP zone - so then you are looking at is making a completely different game from scratch. When you have players that are way more powerful than other players that then mock the opponent that they have easily defeated, it is easy to see why players don't enjoy being "schooled" by someone that thinks that they are L337 in a PvP zone. PvP will be fun in CoH when it plays like X-Men vs. Streetfighter ... in 3-D - I'm not seeing this happen any time soon. |
AT balance in PvP was achieved by the rock/paper/scissors aspect many PvP games have - if a particular player was giving you trouble you brought along the counter to that. Unfortunately it took some small level of cognitive function to determine what these counters were, so rather than have to *gasp* actually think, players whined and PvP was changed to cater to them. The current system essentially reworks the rock/paper/scissors system in an effort to balance the ATs with each other on even terms, but fails pretty simply by virtue of the fact that not all ATs were designed with that in mind - trying to shoehorn functionality into a system that wasn't built for it often ends in problems and that's exactly what happened with I13.
If players go into a PvP zone and get mad because they keep losing, they have two options: they can either find out what their opponent is doing and learn from their own mistakes in order to become a better player, or they can rage, leave the zone, and come whine about how PvP is unfair and unbalanced. Unfortunately people would rather not have to learn how to do something so we're stuck in our current situation.
Lastly, lol @ alt coming into the PvP section.
@macskull, @Not Mac | XBL: macskull | Steam: macskull | Skype: macskull
"One day we all may see each other elsewhere. In Tyria, in Azeroth. We may pass each other and never know it. And that's sad. But if nothing else, we'll still have Rhode Island."
"One day we all may see each other elsewhere. In Tyria, in Azeroth. We may pass each other and never know it. And that's sad. But if nothing else, we'll still have Rhode Island."
I had some awesome PvP this morning. A rift opened up and a ton of Asmodians, er nevermind.
Infinity and Victory mostly
dUmb, etc.
lolz PvP anymore, Market PvP for fun and profit
I went into RV today. This was my first visit since I16 came out. I checked out the zone looking for someone to fight. Nobody there. I decided to grab a heavy and work on some pillboxes. On the way to the pb there was a group of 6 longbow standing in the street. Sent the heavy in and jumped in myself. In the middle of the fight I saw the heavy go down. I was really surprised. I grabbed another heavy and sent him toward a group. A warden came out to meet him and killed him. It was then that I found the heavy was only a lvl 50. Pillboxes too are only lvl 50.
I know what a PvP zone is. PvP stands for Player verses Player. But street hunting has always been a fun thing to do when no other players are in the zone. The ever present danger of getting attacked by another player adds to the fun. I don't mind getting rid of the heavies. Lets do it. But at the same time, how about giving us PvP'ers the same level of difficulty on the npc's that players in other zones face. It is far far harder to take down a longbow in RV than it is in a comparitable non-PvP zone. Why is that? Without the heavies I would think it should be the same.
I realize that this might not be a problem on other servers with larger populations of PvP'ers. On the less busy servers there is a lot of waiting around. Before we could grab a heavy and street hunt while we waited. We still could street hunt without a heavy but only if the difficulty of the npc's is made comparable to non pvp zones.
I've spoken to others who are leaving Infinity. Some are leaving for other games, and some are heading toward one of the more PvP orientated zones. Infinty is barely populated as it is but I think that heading for a new server may be the way to go. At least it is if you like PvP.