Has nobody factored in elusivity?>
Blasters and defenders dont get elusivity?
So a scrapper in elude does get a powerful bonus to his defence while a blaster in pff just has basic defense?
I am still not totally up to date with elusivity but I thought this was the case?
Do VEATs get elusivity too?
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No .. where did I say opposite ?
Don't believe at any point I said that PFF was easier to hit through than PVP elude levels?
Fahie
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"
Because phase means you really can't be hit and PFF means you are *unlikely* to be hit.
I've lost count of the number of times I've been hit through PFF both PVE and PVP. A few faceplants here and there
Back on subject, PFF is not even close to impossible to hit through. FA/yellows/no- acc-check debuffs ... all will see that PFF looking a bit tame very quickly.
PS *is* impossible to hit through, obviously.
Besides, if PFF's overpowered then I hate to know what you think of elude"
"
Remember ? 
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I think you should learn to read Moghedien. Fahie simply stated that he/she would hate to know what you thought of elude. That is not the same as saying that PFF is easier to hit through than elude.
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@Sweet Chilli
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I think you should learn to read Moghedien. Fahie simply stated that he/she would hate to know what you thought of elude. That is not the same as saying that PFF is easier to hit through than elude.
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Fahie said in one thread that forts and nw are almost impossible to hit, while she says here that its not very hard to hit through PFF which offers way more defense than nw or forts can get.
So its either the one or the other.....
Granted maybe i have trouble to understand everything or arguing effective, since its not my native language, but i am always polite ... <removed by mod>
I might disagree with Fahie often but i like arguing with her cause shes nice (most of the time ^^)
She pointed out i misunderstood something and i accept that.
<removed by mod>
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I think you should learn to read Moghedien. Fahie simply stated that he/she would hate to know what you thought of elude. That is not the same as saying that PFF is easier to hit through than elude.
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Fahie said in one thread that forts and nw are almost impossible to hit, while she says here that its not very hard to hit through PFF which offers way more defense than nw or forts can get.
So its either the one or the other.....
Granted maybe i have trouble to understand everything or arguing effective, since its not my native language, but i am always polite ... <removed by mod>
I might disagree with Fahie often but i like arguing with her cause shes nice (most of the time ^^)
She pointed out i misunderstood something and i accept that.
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Please show a link to the thread where Fahie said that forts and nw are almost impossible to hit.
She has already stated that you have mis-understood. <removed by mod>
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@Sweet Chilli
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Please show a link to the thread where Fahie said that forts and nw are almost impossible to hit.
She has already stated that you have mis-understood. <removed by mod>
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Maybe take a look at the:
"PvP problems and solutions thread" and actually read her posts before you post any more <removed by mod>?
Dont pretend you cant find the posts where she says forts and nw are godlike and almost unkillable, she posted several of them.
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Saying something is Godlike and almost unkillable IS NOT the same as saying something is hard to hit!
Can you grasp that very simple concept because everyone else can! Its not that hard...just try.
@Sweet Chilli
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Saying something is Godlike and almost unkillable IS NOT the same as saying something is hard to hit!
Can you grasp that very simple concept because everyone else can! Its not that hard...just try.
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Considering forts and nws dont have anything apart from def, no res no heals no nothing, any other AT cant get, your statement is very funny.
What is it that makes them godlike and unkillable then if notthe fact they are hard to hit ?
Interpret whatever you like :-)
They have res to psi.
Heroes: Phobos-, Protector-Bot, Shadow of Ra, Bionic Eye, Entropic Chaos, Strike-Freedom.
Villains: Necron Phobos, Khorne-Berzerker, Full Metal Panic, Smasher Devourer, Degrees Kelvin.
Co-Leader of The Echelon
Visit us at http://www.theechelon.eu
Must admit PFF can be pretty annoying.
Doesnt seem to work with i13's tru warrior revamp.
Basically just bob around. Pop out when u see someone on low health and ignoring you after being in PFF for 5 minutes. Start attacking, then as soon as you take any damage pop PFF back on.
And the worst culprits are bots/ff mm's who just stay in pff practically all the time clustered up with their heavies.
I dont see that it is a problem as such more just irritating that phase got hammer nerfed while PFF just carries on as normal.
Just one more out of kilter aspect of the mess they made of pvp in i13.
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Saying something is Godlike and almost unkillable IS NOT the same as saying something is hard to hit!
Can you grasp that very simple concept because everyone else can! Its not that hard...just try.
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Considering forts and nws dont have anything apart from def, no res no heals no nothing, any other AT cant get, your statement is very funny.
What is it that makes them godlike and unkillable then if notthe fact they are hard to hit ?
Interpret whatever you like :-)
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Other AT's can get def. Your question is dumb. And I never said they were hard to kill. Why not ask the person who did?
@Sweet Chilli
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Other AT's can get def. Your question is dumb. And I never said they were hard to kill. Why not ask the person who did?
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Havent seen any posts about SR beeing overpowered yet, or energy armor.
If you dont think they are hard to kill why do you agree with others who claim they are ?
And i ask you because you claim to know what Fahie said.
Mabye my posts are weird sometimes but yours are even more so ....
I have not agreed with Fahie on any of her points.
Honestly - you need to get an adult to sit down and explain to you where you are going wrong with all your points.
You're like some kind of little mental kid that just doesn't get logic.
@Sweet Chilli
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I have not agreed with Fahie on any of her points.
Honestly - you need to get an adult to sit down and explain to you where you are going wrong with all your points.
You're like some kind of little mental kid that just doesn't get logic.
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Since you contradict yourself more and more with every post and get more and more absurd, its futile to reply to you anymore.
You talking bout logic is very funny......
Talking bout adults, obviously there was none around to teach you manners and logic when you neeed it.
Very mature to post insults and attack people personally without ading anything to a conversation, just because you get some weird kind of fun from it.
Since you dont agree with Fahie but defend her statements, its obious all you wanna do is troll.
At least i know how to admit when i said or did something wrong thats why i have no probs in the real world, something you still need to learn.
And therefore i withdraw from replying to you, cause i am mature enough to do so, i highly doubt you are.......
Have a nice day.
Only started to read this thread then had this idea - sorry if it's already been suggested;
While a player is using PFF in pvp their 'speed' is reduced to one quarter (over and above suppression). They will still benefit from the 'safe' bubble but will find it hard to run away. Something akin to Granite Armour speed debuff?
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I have not agreed with Fahie on any of her points.
Honestly - you need to get an adult to sit down and explain to you where you are going wrong with all your points.
You're like some kind of little mental kid that just doesn't get logic.
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Since you contradict yourself more and more with every post and get more and more absurd, its futile to reply to you anymore.
You talking bout logic is very funny......
Talking bout adults, obviously there was none around to teach you manners and logic when you neeed it.
Very mature to post insults and attack people personally without ading anything to a conversation, just because you get some weird kind of fun from it.
Since you dont agree with Fahie but defend her statements, its obious all you wanna do is troll.
At least i know how to admit when i said or did something wrong thats why i have no probs in the real world, something you still need to learn.
And therefore i withdraw from replying to you, cause i am mature enough to do so, i highly doubt you are.......
Have a nice day.
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Mog you need to calm down. I dont believe you are attempting to troll as such but you seem to be overly pedantic about every issue and very aggressive.
Surely you notice that every pvp related topic you enter or instigate descends into arguing about specific statements taken out of the wider context and forumites who are generally quite even tempered or at worst a little arrogant start to flame you.
Somebody making conflicting observations or opinions does not make their whole stance untenable. CoX as a whole and pvp in isolation have huge amounts of variables that only a handful of ppl can claim to have complete knowledge of. And while arguing over the numbers and mechanics does have value there is just as much, if not more value in first hand experience of those numbers and mechanics in action.
And there are only really a handful of us eu players who enjoy pvp left who are still active on the forums. Cant we just agree to disagree and make the best of a bad situation? I find chilli quite obnoxious tbh but I respect he is a good pvp player and has a good knowledge of pvp mechanics. And I like having grudges in the zones :P
As I said earlier I do actually agree with your sentiments about PFF. It is irritating. But I dont think it is OP as such. It is working more or less as intended. Maybe a little tweak would make it fairer but imo isnt a priority pvp problem.
Even though we disagreed on some things in the past, i appreciate your posts, since hey are informative and objective and written nicely.
I do even agree with many things you say :-)
I admit i gereralise pretty often, but often just to start an argument.
Some ppl act like i attacked or insulted them in real life just because i post my views of a stupid computergame.
I accept different opinions and sometimes i see i was wrong.
What i dont accept are insulting posts of some players who add absolutely nothing to an argument, and just post to attack ppl personally, and then i get aggressive, no matter if they insult me or others.
I can oly show respect for a person and how he/she acts in real life and how she/he behaves towards other people because that is what matters, not if someone can play a computer game well.
If ppl show me why they have a different opinion or think of something a certain way like you and some others do i appreciate it very much since i can think about the different views.
Just posting no sry you are wrong, an idiot and stupid and an idiotic child is hardly enough to argue without showing their point of view.
I wonder if those ppl act like that in real life too, since its an attitude that doesnt go well with society.
Boss:
"What is your opinion on our new product is it good or does it need more development?"
Employee:
" Your an idiot and immature and you have no sense of logic"
......... 
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I have not agreed with Fahie on any of her points.
Honestly - you need to get an adult to sit down and explain to you where you are going wrong with all your points.
You're like some kind of little mental kid that just doesn't get logic.
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Since you contradict yourself more and more with every post and get more and more absurd, its futile to reply to you anymore.
You talking bout logic is very funny......
Talking bout adults, obviously there was none around to teach you manners and logic when you neeed it.
Very mature to post insults and attack people personally without ading anything to a conversation, just because you get some weird kind of fun from it.
Since you dont agree with Fahie but defend her statements, its obious all you wanna do is troll.
At least i know how to admit when i said or did something wrong thats why i have no probs in the real world, something you still need to learn.
And therefore i withdraw from replying to you, cause i am mature enough to do so, i highly doubt you are.......
Have a nice day.
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I have never said that I don't agree with Fahie.
What a mook!
@Sweet Chilli
I think making PFF susceptible to detoggles through mez again would be a neat solution.
(QR)
Yesterday I got the opportunity to test a few things against a Forcefield Controller in the Arena.
As before, I was running Rage and Focused Accuracy. Both are slotted for ToHit using two HOs.
Unlike the results against FF Masterminds or Dominators in Recluse's Victory, my net to hit chance was not floored:
- Using LBE (full purple set) and most other attacks, net chance to hit sat at 20%.
- KO blow with it's inherent accuracy bonus sat at roughly 25%.
Further:
- The Controller's defense values while in PFF was slightly above 20%, due to Diminishing Returns.
- My ToHit, as reported by the Combat attribute monitor, was about 97% (though this would be against PvE targets, so I assume in PvP it should be 25% lower).
- My Global accuracy was 1.57 (i.e. +0.57 from set bonuses and Focused Accuracy).
The only way the numbers would match up is due to significant Elusivity. Without PFF but with all other shields and defense powers the Controller had 17% def, for which I had from 75%-95% net chance to hit depending on which power I used (KO blow again being the most accurate). The extra defense from having PFF on as well, +3%, can't account for that kind of drop in net chance to hit.
While I did not have any chance of taking him out, given that he had both Aid Self and Hibernate, the large difference in net to hit compared to the Masterminds and Dominators I've fought (where I've so far been floored) was very noticeable. Whether this is due to a higher effective "DR-cap" for defense for those two ATs compared to Controllers, or some other factor I'm not certain.
Does anyone know whether the patron power pool shield powers grant extra Elusivity? And if so, does it stack with what PFF grants?
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(QR)
Yesterday I got the opportunity to test a few things against a Forcefield Controller in the Arena.
As before, I was running Rage and Focused Accuracy. Both are slotted for ToHit using two HOs.
Unlike the results against FF Masterminds or Dominators in Recluse's Victory, my net to hit chance was not floored:
- Using LBE (full purple set) and most other attacks, net chance to hit sat at 20%.
- KO blow with it's inherent accuracy bonus sat at roughly 25%.
Further:
- The Controller's defense values while in PFF was slightly above 20%, due to Diminishing Returns.
- My ToHit, as reported by the Combat attribute monitor, was about 97% (though this would be against PvE targets, so I assume in PvP it should be 25% lower).
- My Global accuracy was 1.57 (i.e. +0.57 from set bonuses and Focused Accuracy).
The only way the numbers would match up is due to significant Elusivity. Without PFF but with all other shields and defense powers the Controller had 17% def, for which I had from 75%-95% net chance to hit depending on which power I used (KO blow again being the most accurate). The extra defense from having PFF on as well, +3%, can't account for that kind of drop in net chance to hit.
While I did not have any chance of taking him out, given that he had both Aid Self and Hibernate, the large difference in net to hit compared to the Masterminds and Dominators I've fought (where I've so far been floored) was very noticeable. Whether this is due to a higher effective "DR-cap" for defense for those two ATs compared to Controllers, or some other factor I'm not certain.
Does anyone know whether the patron power pool shield powers grant extra Elusivity? And if so, does it stack with what PFF grants?
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Must be a bug, cause the 70 % defense from PFF, will never just result in 3% def even with diminishing returns.
Even more so since dr dont really kick in big time at 17% def
I am not familiar with the DR limits for the different ATs, although I do know they differ. I know that for Tanks, it allows you to reach 30%+ defense fairly easily. 45% is achievable with Eye of the Magus running.
I could not check the Controller values first hand, it was what he told me that he saw. I was somewhat surprised as well, as I thought a Controller could get more than 20% def.
To clarify in case there was a misunderstanding, the 3% defense was the increase from 17% to 20% seen by the Controller when he activated PFF. He was well above 3% total defence the entire time.
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You made it seem psi mez is autohit.
But the thread was nerf PFF because you can't work around it, sorry.
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Psi mezz isnt better than any other mezz vs PFF, i thought you meant its better against PFF because its has no positional component.
PFF grants positional and typed def all the same value, so it has same psi def aswell.