[ QUOTE ]
* 9. Total Focus: The other Harbinger of your Godhood. Slightly less damage than ET, uses more end, but doesn't take health off you. Oh, and almost guaranteed to mez most things of lieutenant class and below. Take this, and your journey to our side will be complete. Slotting: 1 acc, 3 dam, others to taste.
[/ QUOTE ]
10 second disorient duration it says in herobuilder but without question must be good enough to get a good disorient out to buy time to drop a sapper (theoretically to me even without stun unless ya miss) and so makes energy epic an easily takeable thing. Other boss types that you dont want attacking you may require the epic holds from the other epics but its cos of the hold in kob from /ss and the stuns in energy or mace etc that make not having the greater control effects in the okay. Add to that people in the team are there to help and not watch.
i take it this is the one last post here for points of view
from people non energy melee and energy melee alike before posting to the guide section.
Unstop afaik has no boost to health regen.
Energy punch is bread an buttery but i'd personally definately would replace it with air superiority (not saying its a must do). In damage overtime terms they are identical although air sup has a longer action time and more endurance cost but the -fly on an AV if no one else has -fly can be useful for all the grounded melee people to keep attacking. Its a personal preference thing as many people do have -fly anyway just like immobs and holds which are also useful on an AV but the -fly is "OMG" precious to someone like me (If i didnt value hurl id of got fight pool thats how precious). Tactics can change to suit without it though. This sounding rather like a guide other than "this is my build, like it or lump it" like i would do, it maybe worth highlighting for something a little extra and also "-FLY Rawks in pvp" if you cant fly yourself.
Whirling hands, an aoe disorient (even if minor) a hit 10 gauntlet is very "in" the must have section to me too. In terms of survivability (disorientating up to 10 so they do nothing for 5 secs which could be a quarter of the fight duration) and reduces fight duration (you've taken hp of 10 foes and so the group goes down quicker) and gauntlet (its poo in my eyes but i wouldnt want to be without it).
[ QUOTE ]
Speed: Solid travel pool choice. Hasten can counter the tendency of Energy Melee towards longer recharges, but a caveat of this is to find the balance between where you work faster, and where you find yourself sucking air.
[/ QUOTE ]
With haste you not only do that with the attacks, you speed up unstoppable recharge (priceless in RV), you are 1 ab or 1 sb boost away from perma dull pain (again priceless) and you can speed up conserve energy recharging and if you had taken haste then due to the lower fight duration you would have from whirling hands popping back into play fast etc but id strongly suggest 1acc, 1 end, 3 dam (1 rechg on 20sec rechg and the pbaoe attack) to have a good overall endurance economic build whilst fighting (range slots on tp would come out, 2nd end slot on unyielding although more economic on temp invulnerability would move (although not saying its not within reason) the tohit on invincible would come out. Hastes only downfall is its surprise end cost when it drops but atleast it flashes now. I've been doubly detoggled by a rage crash and a haste drop which tells me to never go below a certain amount at a certain time.
I want to find out if when the carnie are arrested and your hovering do you get end sapped or is it only people on the ground? Weave on top of invincible really makes a significant difference to avoiding it but then so should that ever vigilant buffing or debuffing you get from the defenders and/or controllers.
Tip: if someone can give you buffs check for it before every mob and ask for it if you must (which is normally the case:P) and before an AV allow everyone to get buffed. This is also partially because the less def you have not only do you take hits more but you may suffer the secondary effects like -end, -rechg, -def:P, -acc etc to go with it. But if a Firetank can manage then the invuln with a choice or mix of 2 routes def or res can too.
You like your build and happy with it then go with it, i couldnt find anything that wrong with it personally to say "how the hell do you tank with that?" id have to adopt a new playstyle to play it but i think no matter what there is enough there "especially in taunt" that makes it operable and i do like the layout of the guide too, overall a good read.
By the time i decide to write one id be telling everyone how to suck eggs at this rate.
What's that? i already do?
Why i oughtta!
He will honor his words; he will definitely carry out his actions. What he promises he will fulfill. He does not care about his bodily self, putting his life and death aside to come forward for another's troubled besiegement. He does not boast about his ability, or shamelessly extol his own virtues. - Sima Qian.
[ QUOTE ]
Not a lot of ways to go wrong with this, except picking the first attack (yours are much better.)
[/ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Energy punch is bread an buttery but i'd personally definately would replace it with air superiority (not saying its a must do). In damage overtime terms they are identical although air sup has a longer action time and more endurance cost but the -fly on an AV if no one else has -fly can be useful for all the grounded melee people to keep attacking. Its a personal preference thing as many people do have -fly anyway just like immobs and holds which are also useful on an AV but the -fly is "OMG" precious to someone like me (If i didnt value hurl id of got fight pool thats how precious). Tactics can change to suit without it though. This sounding rather like a guide other than "this is my build, like it or lump it" like i would do, it maybe worth highlighting for something a little extra and also "-FLY Rawks in pvp" if you cant fly yourself.
[/ QUOTE ]
Absolutely 110% agree with Shannon on this issue.
When doing the croatoa task force and hunting for Mary MacComber (which is a AV who flies for everyone who hasnt done it btw) there was some trouble finding her for all the earthbound heroes, I found her with Cuffz (whos a flying tank btw) pretty far up and told the rest of them team of her whereabouts.. AS made her drop to the ground as a ton of bricks and let us take care of her.
Another fine point with it is that it gives you an ability to keep a Boss more or less perma 'flipping' in the air with a attack recharge or two, letting you solo purple bosses without them even getting a single scratch on you.
[ QUOTE ]
Whirling hands, an aoe disorient (even if minor) a hit 10 gauntlet is very "in" the must have section to me too. In terms of survivability (disorientating up to 10 so they do nothing for 5 secs which could be a quarter of the fight duration) and reduces fight duration (you've taken hp of 10 foes and so the group goes down quicker) and gauntlet (its poo in my eyes but i wouldnt want to be without it.
[/ QUOTE ]
I like WH as well. When surrounded by a large number of mobs it lets you use Gauntlet on so many more to help maintain aggro.
UNION
Officer Cuffz lvl 50 Inv/Nrg Tank
Badge lvl 50 dwarf/human Peacebringer
Dark Air lvl 50 Ice/Cold Corruptor
Ayre lvl 50 Storm/Elec Defender
Total Cat: @Officer Cuffz
"When I say interview, I mean engage in combat and defeat..." -Laura Brunetti, on how to deal with Warriors.
Opening Thoughts
NB: most of this guide was written from the point of view of a long-term PvE'er and occasional PvP'er, so I beg your indulgence if I occasionally miss a trick or two in that regard.
Invulnerability. While it hasn't seen quite the scale of depowerings and nerfs that regen got, I5 and I6/ED had the effect of ripping out large portions of its resistances, and combined with the AoE limits to taunt, made a tankers life that much more interesting. However, it largely managed to escape I7 unscathed, and, even with everything that has been done to it, still stands tall amongst the tanker sets, and as an example of unbreakability. In the old days, you could turn your toggles on, run around, and coast along; these days you have to do a little more work. However, this is the AT and powerset I took to my first 50, and I wouldn't swap that experience for anything.
Slaps and Bennies (AKA. The Bad, the Good and the Downright Obnoxious)
Bennies
Survivability: Your resists aren't the godlike heights they used to be, but your S/L resistance is still something phenomenal to behold, and everything else isn't too shabby either. Outisde of maybe the first few levels, when everyones a bit squishy, you never really feel fragile. Even when the damage is piling up, you can still work nicely.
Hitpoints: Tankers get the highest hitpoints of any AT. Invulnerability gets the aptly named "Dull Pain." It is your Lord and Master. With it active, a level 50 tank can have over 3000 hit points, which gives you an immediate buffer to work with before you get into danger.
Damage: Broadsword scrappers know a thing or two about big orange numbers and massive damage. Fire tanks do too. Energy Melee is no exception. A nice, high-damage set, with one of the more useful secondary effects, disorient. All of its attacks disorient to some degree, some more than others, and this is helpful for tanking, as a stunned foe isn't hitting your team. However, what energy really has going for it is the twin pair of its 35 and 38 attacks, which leave practically every other set in the shade, Energy Transfer and Total Focus. ET can practically one-shot minions, and TF isn't far behind. ET uses comparatively low end, instead taking a certain amount of your (3000odd) hitpoints, which tends to surprise the empath that's watching your health bar (yes, I know, I'm sorry, I picked up this attack and forgot to warn my favourite empath), and is a liveable side-effect of taking out the foe that quickly. TF does slightly less damage, and costs more, but is practically a one-shot mez against anything short of a boss, and even has a great chance of stunning bosses too. I've even stunned AV's with it before for a few seconds.
Slaps
Psi: This is the big resistance hole. Against Psi damage, you're weaker than a wet fish, and its prevelant in the 40+ game. Your only defence here is your huge hitpoints and the other thing you get in the late game, your huge single-target damage.
Endurance Use: There's no gentle way of saying this, the combination of these two powersets is an absolute hog, never doubt that for a moment. Get stamina. You will need it. Slot those toggles with end reduction. Slot the attacks in the late game, and you'll be a happy munchkin. Get a pet empath to carry around with you, and you will be a God Amongst Mortals.
The Powers
There are other, more mechanistically inclined guides that will tell you exactly what the endurance use per second of each toggle is, or reel off one or another relative measures of what damage each attack does. I'm more going to go through, give impressions, and discuss possible slotting. Hopefully useful.
Invulnerability - or "Pardon me, your forehead dented my battleaxe."
<ul type="square">
[*]1. Resist Physical Damage: First of the trifecta of passives in the set, this is your base S/L resist passive. Comes up first, but not really recommended for level 1, because your toggle is better. Slotting: If you use it, 3 DamRes.[*]2. Temporary Invulnerability: First of the toggle trifecta, your main S/L resist. Pretty much essential. Slotting: 3 DamRes, 1 or 2 EndRed to taste.[*]3. Dull Pain: Woo, yay and hooplah. Two main effects. 1, it's a 40% boost to your maximum HP while it's up, and 2, it also acts as a heal when you activate it, giving you those 40%worth of health, and more, if you slot it with heals. Slotting: 3 recharge, 0-3 heal to taste. I recommend 3.[*]4. Resist Elements: The second of the passive trifecta, this is Fire/Cold resist. There are more bad guys than there used to be that use fire and cold throughout the game than there used to be, but this is one of the ones you can easily put off till later, or skip if you have other plans. Slotting: If you use it, 3 DamRes.[*]5. Unyielding: Second toggle of the set, and the third "must-have" power. This is both your Fire/Cold/Energy/Neg toggle, and your status resist toggle. It as a minor (5%) defense reduction, making you easier to hit, but this is essentially a moot point as far as debating this power is concerned. Take this as soon as you can get it (level 8). Slotting: 3 Damres, 1-2 EndRed to taste.[*]6. Resist Energies: Third of the passives, Energy and Negative Resist. Same theory as for Resist Elements, some people skip these for things like the fighting pool. Slotting: if you use it, 3 DamRes.[*]7. Invincibility: Invulns autotaunt aura, this is kind of an interesting one. When active, not only does it taunt foes in your vicinity, but it also provides a certain amount of defense for every foe in melee range of you, up to a maximum of 10 (thanks to the AoE limits). Fully slotted with defense, the final figure if you're surrounded by the full 10 is not too shabby, and definitely enhances your survivability. The other perk is that it also adds a small ToHit bonus to you for each of those foes. Meaning that in a big mob, they hit you less often, and you hit them more often. What's not to like? I consider this essential. Slotting: 3 DefBuff, 1-2 EndRed, 0-2 ToHitBuff. (see debate below).[*]8. Tough Hide: Your final passive, and an interesting one in that it provides defense, rather than resistance. Many people skip this, and it isn't 100% necessary, especially if you supplement your defense other ways, but feel free to take it. Slotting: 3 DefBuff.[*]9. Unstoppable: Opinions are mixed on this one, 50% hate it, 50% love it. Massive resist boost, tasty endurance regen and health regen boost and extra mez protection for 3 minutes. After 3 minutes, however, you crash to minimal health and end, which usually ends up dropping all your toggles and leaving you vulnerable, which can often be mitigated somewhat by planning ahead, and occasionally, if he drop times right, compared with the endurance recovery tick, you can come out with one or two toggles still up. Made much more manageable by the UI change that flashes power icons before they run out. This is still the "Oh [censored]" power par excellence, and, anyone who has seen an unstoppable inv tank running away, with a mob of about 20 or 30 bad guys all throwing huge attacks at it, with the rest of the team wiped on the floor, is unlikely to forget it. When you hit that button, you have three minutes of virtual godhood. Remember the drop, factor it in, and unstoppable will love you and hug you call you george. If you're still taking huge damage through it, either you're facing an AV, something throwing psi at you, or you're in so much trouble that nothing's going to save you. Slotting: Varies according to taste. It's godlike out of the box, so add 0-3 recharge so you can have it as often as you like. You can slot for other things, like res, but it it's overwhleming unstoppable in the first place, the extra res probably won't be much help.[/list]
Energy Melee - or "Pass me Another Hellion, this one's split."
<ul type="square"> [*]1. Barrage: You don't have any choice but to have this power. Early on, it works as an attack and chain filler, but it's really somewhat subpar damage for its end usage. Slotting: if you want to bother, 1 Acc, 3 damage, others to taste.[*]2. Energy Punch: The first Bread and Butter attack. You can ditch this later on if you want to go for a smaller attack chain, but early on, this is going to be your staple attack. Slotting: 1 Acc, 3 damage, others to taste.[*]3. Bonesmasher: Booyah. This is your first taste of the high life. Slower than energy punch, more draining, but does so much more damage. It also looks far cooler (that two-handed, standing overhead smash animation,) and disorients more often Take it, slot it, never look back. Slotting: 1 Acc, 3 damage, others to taste.[*]4. Taunt. You are a tank. You need to get aggro off foes. This will help you do it. Autohit in PvE, needing accuracy check in PvP, this power will, for a moment, ensure that for the group of bad guys (up to 5) you target, you are the absolute center of attention for a short while. Debate rages about whether a tank needs this or not. I'm saying yes. One caveat is not to overtaunt before you get enough in the way of defenses to survive the attention. Slotting: PvE: 0-2 recharge, Taunt duration, range and endred to taste. PvP: 1-2 Acc, 0-2 recharge, taunt duration, range and endred to taste.[*]5. Whirling Hands: Your PbAoE attack. Does a half-decent amount of damage when slotted, but possibly of more use to spread the punchvoke love far and wide. You can skip this if you must, but I like it. Slotting: 1 Acc, 3 damage, others to taste.[*]6. Stun: Single Target Disorient attack. Minimal damage, but high disorient. It has its uses, (especially in PvP) but it is skippable. In any case, it's not worth using for damage. Slotting: 1 Acc, 1-3 DisorientDur. Others to taste.[*]7. Build up: Extra damage an accuracy for a few moments. Sounds great, doesn't it? And it is. It's an open debate however, as to whether the tank needs this. Skippable, but take it if you have the space. Slotting: 3 recharge.[*]8. Energy Transfer: This is why you put up with Barrage. This is why you waited all that time. Massive (highest in the set) Damage, minimal end use. The only gotcha is that it takes 160hp a shot off you to power it. But You are a tank, and have massive hp. For the most part, your regen rate (especially heath-enhanced) can keep up with this powers cycle rate. Take it, take it now, or you will have learned nothing. Slotting: 1 acc, 3 dam, others to taste.[*]9. Total Focus: The other Harbinger of your Godhood. Slightly less damage than ET, uses more end, but doesn't take health off you. Oh, and almost guaranteed to mez most things of lieutenant class and below. Take this, and your journey to our side will be complete. Slotting: 1 acc, 3 dam, others to taste.[/list]
Power Debates
Taunt: In the first incarnation of this guide, taunt slotting proved to be a lively discussion piece. My original idea used only one recharge for pure PvE, and worked with my play style. Debate on PvE slotting ranges from that up to a suggested 3 recharge, 3 taunt (for level 54 AVs,) although a generally happy medium can be found with 1/2, 2/1 or 2/2 recharge/taunt duration. YMMV, and totally down to playstyle, as well as class of foes to be taunted.
Invincibility: the need (or lack of need) for ToHitBuffs in this was also debated. Again, the best we can say is go with what feels right. Depending on whether you have other sources of accuracy and tohit (eg. Focussed Accuracy) available, you may wish to put those slots elsewhere.
Build Up: Necessary or unecessary? My original arguments about this were base don what I considered the role of a tank to be, to whit, to aggro manage, rather than get massive damage/killcounts. Needless to say, YMMV on this, as factors like play style, whether you'll be primarily soloing or teaming, PvE or PvP, all affect you choice. In the end, I simply didn't have room in my build for it.
The Passives: The other big debate: Taken together, the 3 "Resist X" Passives, fully slotted to ED specs, provide perhaps 12.5% resistanceto all the major types (aside from Psi.) If you wanted to skip a couple of these (mainly Res Elements and res energies, you could, especially (and chiefly) if you had fighting pool to pull out extra defense. Personal choice, really.
Pools
Fighting: Has a lot to offer. One of the more usual permutations on the Inv/En tank drops the latter two res toggles, to get one of the two attacks, and tough, as you can cap out S/L resist with that combination fully slotted. Weave is also another popular choice to supplement the defense of the build. The downside of this approach is that the whole thing becomes a lot more end-heavy, running 4 or 5 toggles rather than 3 can get a bit draining, and you'll find youself sucking air unless you're careful. It also goes without saying that if you get toggle-dropped, the passives will still help you, fighting pool won't. Certainly, if done right, the fighting pool toggles can be a great boon to this tank.
Fitness: Regretably, this is one of those sets where you're going to need Stamina. Pick up health, to give your regen rate enough boost to counter your periodic energy transfer, make your choice of the other two.
Concealment: I must say, I don't see the point, strategically or conceptually, of using this. In all cases, as a tank, it is your role to be seen, to attract aggro and attention. Why interfere with that? I'd imagine it has its uses in PvP, but with a limited number of power slots, you don't really have options to be messing around. Phase shift used to be the main reason for tanks to go through this pool, but since they nerfed it, it's now more or less pointless for what we do.
Fight: Good,solid travel pool choice. Not a lot of ways to go wrong with this, except picking the first attack (yours are much better.)
Leaping: Good, solid travel pool choice. Acrobatics is unecessary because you don't have the status protection holes like Fire, and the actual defence you get from Combat Jumping is minimal, but you can't really go wrong with this, unless you pick the crummy attack.
Leadership: Don't bother. The bonuses from this pool for tanks are minimal at best, and you need all your end for your defenses and attacks. Probably not even worth it for the +perception.
Medicine: Tricky one. I can see where the self-heal would be useful, but you really don't have the power slots to waste once you've dealt with your defenses.
Presence: Another tricky one.Some people take challenge and provoke to supplement their taunting abilities. Neither is as effective as your power pool taunt, but they can still be useful as a backup. If you have the spare power slots, feel free to experiment.
Speed: Solid travel pool choice. Hasten can counter the tendency of Energy Melee towards longer recharges, but a caveat of this is to find the balance between where you work faster, and where you find yourself sucking air. Superspeed is the same as it ever was. Again, I suppose you could take the first attack, but yours do disorient, and are much better.
Teleport: Solid travel pool choice. Recall friend is cool anytime, TP Foe is apparently fun in PvP. The caveat with teleport is that unless you're 100% certain you'll never get lag, you really need to dip into the flight pool for hover to make best use of teleport, which also needs a bit of range/endred slotting to be effective. Group teleport is amusing, finds use as an "oh [censored]" power, but ultimately, isn't worth it for a tank
Epics
In the end, Ice, Fire and Stone Epic are all the same, with different elements, an assortment of minor controllerish powers. These can be useful to have. Energy is the odd bird, no controls, but it has with it the oh-so-useful Focussed Accuracy, and the nice to have Conserve Power. Energy has the best conceptual fit with Inv/Em, but you can feel free to use whatever you like.
My Build
Level: 50
Archetype: Tanker
Primary: Invulnerability
Secondary: Energy Melee
---------------------------------------------
01) --> Resist Physical Damage==> DmgRes(1) DmgRes(13) DmgRes(21)
01) --> Barrage==> Acc(1) Dmg(11) Dmg(29) Dmg(37)
02) --> Temp Invulnerability==> EndRdx(2) DmgRes(3) DmgRes(3) DmgRes(5)
04) --> Energy Punch==> Acc(4) Dmg(5) Dmg(29) Dmg(34) Rechg(42)
06) --> Dull Pain==> Rechg(6) Rechg(7) Rechg(7) Heal(46) Heal(46) Heal(46)
08) --> Unyielding==> EndRdx(8) DmgRes(9) DmgRes(9) DmgRes(11) EndRdx(13)
10) --> Taunt==> Rechg(10) Taunt(23) Taunt(43) Rechg(43)
12) --> Recall Friend==> Rechg(12)
14) --> Teleport==> EndRdx(14) EndRdx(15) Range(15) Range(17)
16) --> Bone Smasher==> Acc(16) Dmg(17) Dmg(31) Dmg(34) Rechg(40)
18) --> Invincibility==> EndRdx(18) DefBuf(19) DefBuf(19) DefBuf(21) TH_Buf(23)
20) --> Hurdle==> Jump(20)
22) --> Health==> Heal(22)
24) --> Stamina==> EndMod(24) EndMod(25) EndMod(25)
26) --> Whirling Hands==> Acc(26) Dmg(27) Dmg(27) Dmg(37) Rechg(40)
28) --> Resist Elements==> DmgRes(28) DmgRes(31) DmgRes(34)
30) --> Resist Energies==> DmgRes(30) DmgRes(31) DmgRes(33)
32) --> Unstoppable==> Rechg(32) Rechg(33) Rechg(33)
35) --> Energy Transfer==> Acc(35) Dmg(36) Dmg(36) Dmg(36) Rechg(37)
38) --> Total Focus==> Acc(38) Dmg(39) Dmg(39) Dmg(39) Rechg(40) EndRdx(43)
41) --> Conserve Power==> Rechg(41) Rechg(42) Rechg(42)
44) --> Focused Accuracy==> EndRdx(44) EndRdx(45) TH_Buf(45) TH_Buf(45) TH_Buf(48)
47) --> Hover==> Fly(47) Fly(48) Fly(48)
49) --> Energy Torrent==> Acc(49) Dmg(50) Dmg(50) Dmg(50)
---------------------------------------------
Options and Thoughts
This build was my final build (ie this is what I specced into at 50, for late-game use) and hasn't seen me far wrong yet. As noted in the above sections, there are any number of places and options where you could change this to suit your own needs, in fact I'd go so far as to suggest that you do so, as this build is rife with my idiosyncratic and prejudiced approach to character building. As is, it's fairly well balanced between team play and soloability throughout its lifespan, but you could tip the balance anywhere you like, substituting in fighting pool, dropping attacks to tighten up the chain, usinbg other travel pools. The upshot is, I make the following recommendations.
Essential:
Inv: Temporary Invulnerability, Dull Pain, Unyielding, Invincibility.
EM: Bonesmasher, Energy Transfer, Total Focus
Nice to Have:
Inv: Resist Physical Damage, Unstoppable.
EM: Energy Punch
Swappable:
Inv: Resist Elements, Resist Energies, Tough Hide
EM: Build Up, Stun, Whirling Hands
Debate of the Century:
Taunt. (Yes, I say its essential, others vary)
I'm afraid you're stuck with:
Barrage.
Final Words
And so, as our putative Inv tank wanders off into the sunset to find more bad guys to arrest, what have we learned from this little exercise. Firstly, that tank building is as individual as the player. These sets lend themselves to a lot of permutations, all of which can be equally valid, as playstyle makes or breaks the build, rather than exactly how many slots you have in invincibility. Secondly, we have learned that, short of skimping on your essential defences, there isn't much of a wrong way to do this. Thirdly, and lastly, we have found that in spite of all the nerfing and meddling, Inv/Em is still a perfectly viable combination for all areas of the game.
Happy Tanking.
Thanks for input go to: Jiaozy, Cuffzter, Unthing, Freedom Falcon, Hammerfall, Shannon, The Private and Andy75.
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.