Spines/Willpower scrapper: Fighting or Leadership?
By
Besserwisser,
Posted on: 2009-05-25 16:53 in Scrappers
With QR and Stamina, the extra end cost of leadership over tough/weave might not be a problem, and any team you find yourself on certainly won't gripe about the extra buffs.
And you have the dual build option to lean on as well.
My only concern would be the lack of tough backing your s/l damres. But if you can get that high enough from other sources, go for it!
Be well, people of CoH.
My DM/SD Scrapper is running Maneuvers, Tactics and Vengeance. I would run Assault instead of Tactics, but I needed a place a full Gaussian set for when I do my stupid solo stuff. Those two and Grant Cover makes me rather nice to have around. I'm not sure Willpower can survive tanking without Tough though.
I've got a 50 Spines/WP that I've put through a few different builds for fun, and I stayed away from Tough/Weave and took Aid Other/Aid Self.
The big hole in /WP being no self heal. I ran mine to 50 with neither Aid Self, Tough or Leadership, as I never cared for Leadership or Tough's rather smallish bonus, and never have taken Aid-Self because of the interrupt.
But now that I've respecced into Aid Self, I have noticed its benefits are actually quite strong. First, you only have to take 2 powers in the pool to get it, and you can ignore slotting or even using Aid Other, which is nice. So that's two powers versus three, and only having to slot and use the one. So you've "wasted" a power pick (pretty typical of Pool Powers), but saved a power and slots.
Basically, my build is all of the Spines powers but Confront (I wish I could take it with the -Range, but single target...meh) and all of the /WP powers except Resurgence. Hasten, Aid Other/Aid Self, Hurdle/Health/Stamina, Focused Accuracy, travel power.
I also built for set bonuses that focus on +Max Health and + Regen have made this the best toon I've ever made, hands down.
I got my Spines/WP to 50 back in December. I focused on Regen, HP, Defense, and Accuracy.
Hero Plan by Mids' Hero Designer 1.401
http://www.cohplanner.com/
[u]Click this DataLink to open the build![u]
Level 50 Mutation Scrapper
Primary Power Set: Spines
Secondary Power Set: Willpower
Power Pool: Speed
Power Pool: Fitness
Power Pool: Fighting
Ancillary Pool: Darkness Mastery
Hero Profile:
Level 1: Lunge -- C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg(A), C'ngImp-Dmg/EndRdx(3), C'ngImp-Dmg/Rchg(7), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(15), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(36)
Level 1: High Pain Tolerance -- Numna-Heal/EndRdx(A), Numna-Heal/Rchg(11), Numna-Heal(13), TtmC'tng-ResDam(37), TtmC'tng-ResDam/EndRdx(37), TtmC'tng-ResDam/Rchg(37)
Level 2: Spine Burst -- Sciroc-Acc/Dmg(A), Sciroc-Dmg/EndRdx(3), Sciroc-Dmg/Rchg(7), Sciroc-Acc/Rchg(13), Sciroc-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(36)
Level 4: Fast Healing -- Numna-Heal/EndRdx(A), Numna-Heal/Rchg(5), Numna-Heal(5), RgnTis-Regen+(46)
Level 6: Hasten -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(11)
Level 8: Impale -- Dev'n-Acc/Dmg(A), Dev'n-Dmg/EndRdx(9), Dev'n-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(9), Volly-Acc/Dmg(15), Volly-Dmg/EndRdx(36)
Level 10: Indomitable Will -- EndRdx-I(A)
Level 12: Hurdle -- Jump-I(A)
Level 14: Super Speed -- EndRdx-I(A)
Level 16: Rise to the Challenge -- Numna-Heal/EndRdx(A), Numna-Heal/Rchg(17), Numna-Heal(17), Tr'ge-Heal/EndRdx(40), Tr'ge-Heal/Rchg(50)
Level 18: Quills -- Erad-Dmg(A), Erad-Acc/Rchg(19), Erad-Dmg/Rchg(19), Erad-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(34), EndRdx-I(46)
Level 20: Quick Recovery -- Efficacy-EndMod(A), Efficacy-EndMod/Rchg(21), Efficacy-EndMod/Acc(21), Efficacy-EndMod/Acc/Rchg(43)
Level 22: Health -- Numna-Regen/Rcvry+(A), Numna-Heal/Rchg(23), Numna-Heal(23), Heal-I(50)
Level 24: Stamina -- P'Shift-EndMod(A), P'Shift-EndMod/Acc(25), P'Shift-EndMod/Rchg(25), P'Shift-EndMod/Acc/Rchg(50)
Level 26: Ripper -- Sciroc-Acc/Dmg(A), Sciroc-Dmg/EndRdx(27), Sciroc-Dmg/Rchg(27), Sciroc-Acc/Rchg(31), Sciroc-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(31)
Level 28: Heightened Senses -- LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx(A), LkGmblr-Def(29), LkGmblr-Def/Rchg(29)
Level 30: Mind Over Body -- RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx(A), RctvArm-ResDam/Rchg(31), RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(34), RctvArm-ResDam(39)
Level 32: Throw Spines -- Posi-Acc/Dmg(A), Posi-Dmg/EndRdx(33), Posi-Dmg/Rchg(33), Posi-Dmg/Rng(33), Posi-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(34)
Level 35: Boxing -- KntkC'bat-Acc/Dmg(A), KntkC'bat-Dmg/EndRdx(40), KntkC'bat-Dmg/Rchg(40), KntkC'bat-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(48)
Level 38: Tough -- RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx(A), RctvArm-ResDam/Rchg(39), RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(39), RctvArm-ResDam(43)
Level 41: Torrent -- SipInsght-ToHitDeb(A), SipInsght-Acc/ToHitDeb(42), SipInsght-Acc/Rchg(42), SipInsght-ToHitDeb/EndRdx/Rchg(42), SipInsght-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg(43)
Level 44: Dark Blast -- SipInsght-ToHitDeb(A), SipInsght-Acc/ToHitDeb(45), SipInsght-Acc/Rchg(45), SipInsght-ToHitDeb/EndRdx/Rchg(45), SipInsght-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg(46)
Level 47: Weave -- LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx(A), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(48), LkGmblr-Def/Rchg(48)
Level 49: Strength of Will -- S'fstPrt-ResDam/Def+(A)
------------
Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Critical Hit
------------
[u]Set Bonus Totals:[u]<ul type="square">[*]16.8% Defense(Smashing)[*]16.8% Defense(Lethal)[*]6.13% Defense(Fire)[*]6.13% Defense(Cold)[*]8.63% Defense(Energy)[*]8.63% Defense(Negative)[*]3% Defense(Psionic)[*]9.88% Defense(Melee)[*]5.81% Defense(Ranged)[*]9.25% Defense(AoE)[*]1.8% Max End[*]11.3% Enhancement(RechargeTime)[*]52% Enhancement(Accuracy)[*]13% FlySpeed[*]286.1 HP (21.4%) HitPoints[*]13% JumpHeight[*]13% JumpSpeed[*]MezResist(Immobilize) 7.15%[*]MezResist(Sleep) 2.2%[*]6.5% (0.11 End/sec) Recovery[*]118% (6.6 HP/sec) Regeneration[*]1.58% Resistance(Fire)[*]1.58% Resistance(Cold)[*]6.25% Resistance(Negative)[*]13% RunSpeed[*]4% XPDebtProtection[/list]
<font class="small">Code:[/color]<hr /><pre>| Copy & Paste this data into Mids' Hero Designer to view the build |
|-------------------------------------------------------------------|
|MxDz;1397;701;1402;HEX;|
|78DAA5935B4F1341188667BB0B4BDB2D6D2DE550A0B5E5DCC 2426F0C6AA217A2098|
|94D0A55F08060292B6C6CB64D7739694C8CDEA2316ABC331A 45FE808A31FE220FFF|
|01BFC3B4375EBA69DF67E6EBBBF37E3BD32DECCD19423CBE2 894CE4BD5B2EBAE952|
|A8D72BD6E353A0ADB5ED9B36B8ED08510F16679AD60552DCB 5CD8B6AB5537D1AACE|
|59F72CC7B5CC6528D76BBB56233AEF6C590DCBF1CCE62050A CD5AA66A96E591B060|
|DAFD89E63B96E484E36B73CDBD98CD26CDED9B15D7BDDAEDA DE7EFC72DDAE9873E5|
|C67D74AF15CAAE6735F67BA1A909F8BEC3EEE83AD1C45D405 EF8CA84F6754267853|
|0B4415842BB42F636B1A06029502218D709C32623CBC811DE EBF226085176386497|
|43F608C63E873C20DC00BBCA21AACA211A87681C327501302 832E06B639FD296A35|
|B038C0FF08B2E03F58F54EA38641CF1533D11B8C2D053C24D F0FA7921E14F03C644|
|3B9482B2141CE7EEA01492A5509A4AB7A0145614CA0973A71 1EE34C29D8E9DA14EF|
|3B38443B04779052DFAD387A553BF18BF09E93F84295EFD36 D863721F62073E2C75|
|3D63BC20649F1374F0C5A52FBE44B9DDDC453777911FE6670 75F8FF4F5BCA45B7BD|
|F305E11F2AF099FC0D72777AF8F8F2BC1C795E0E34AF27125 F9B856C0DECFCBFAFA|
|231438D0C5881296C130287307930A6E6F324548A709A319C 211F8523237F599D63|
|EFD85F195714C487F232860CFB05DCD14054EC616188B84E9 124105DF888C1FE1F8|
|518E1FE5F82CC73F54851897F1E3BA8A11131D0C3F2340C80 6098F4073D29E63FB2|
|4DB27D93E897638CC2041832E4CB94B26EFD2748CC1BBB40A 86195E4FCCF4D0FF65|
|406BBD9CF0814B5CFDA752D45AEF9650A892D25AEFE87F5DD F8DE63AFEC500E8359|
|42288B284A315943B385DC5511947EB28159C9EFC309A9D86 67B1A1B328E750CEA3|
|1CA0490F8204510C94104A274A1825821243E94649A0BC453 9F90BF043F49F|
|-------------------------------------------------------------------|</pre><hr />
This is the build order and some of the sets I planned on ultimately getting:
Hero Plan by Mids' Hero Designer 1.401
http://www.cohplanner.com/
[u]Click this DataLink to open the build![u]
Betsy Ross - Simple: Level 50 Magic Scrapper
Primary Power Set: Spines
Secondary Power Set: Willpower
Power Pool: Flight
Power Pool: Fitness
Power Pool: Fighting
Ancillary Pool: Darkness Mastery
Hero Profile:
Level 1: Lunge -- C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg(A), C'ngImp-Dmg/EndRdx(3), C'ngImp-Dmg/Rchg(3), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(13), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(42), Acc-I(43)
Level 1: High Pain Tolerance -- Heal-I(A), Heal-I(5), Heal-I(15)
Level 2: Spine Burst -- Sciroc-Acc/Dmg(A), Sciroc-Dmg/EndRdx(5), Sciroc-Dmg/Rchg(11), Sciroc-Acc/Rchg(15), Sciroc-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(40), Acc-I(42)
Level 4: Fast Healing -- Heal-I(A), Heal-I(7), Heal-I(7)
Level 6: Air Superiority -- C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg(A), C'ngImp-Dmg/EndRdx(9), C'ngImp-Dmg/Rchg(43), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(46), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(50), Acc-I(50)
Level 8: Build Up -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(9), RechRdx-I(13)
Level 10: Indomitable Will -- EndRdx-I(A), EndRdx-I(11)
Level 12: Swift -- Run-I(A)
Level 14: Fly -- Flight-I(A), Flight-I(48)
Level 16: Rise to the Challenge -- Numna-Heal/EndRdx(A), Numna-Heal/EndRdx/Rchg(17), Mrcl-Heal(17), DarkWD-Slow%(43), DarkWD-ToHitDeb/EndRdx(46), Taunt-I(48)
Level 18: Health -- Heal-I(A), Heal-I(19), Heal-I(19)
Level 20: Quick Recovery -- EndMod-I(A), EndMod-I(21), EndMod-I(21)
Level 22: Stamina -- EndMod-I(A), EndMod-I(23), EndMod-I(23)
Level 24: Mind Over Body -- ImpArm-ResDam/EndRdx(A), ImpArm-ResDam/Rchg(25), ImpArm-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(25), ImpArm-ResDam(40)
Level 26: Ripper -- Sciroc-Acc/Dmg(A), Sciroc-Dmg/EndRdx(27), Sciroc-Dmg/Rchg(27), Sciroc-Acc/Rchg(31), Sciroc-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(37), Acc-I(39)
Level 28: Quills -- M'Strk-Acc/Dmg(A), M'Strk-Dmg/EndRdx(29), M'Strk-Dmg/Rchg(29), M'Strk-Acc/EndRdx(34), M'Strk-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(39), M'Strk-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(39)
Level 30: Heightened Senses -- GftotA-Def/EndRdx(A), GftotA-Def/Rchg(31), GftotA-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(31), GftotA-Def(40)
Level 32: Throw Spines -- Posi-Acc/Dmg(A), Posi-Dmg/EndRdx(33), Posi-Dmg/Rchg(33), Posi-Dmg/Rng(33), Posi-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(34), Acc-I(34)
Level 35: Impale -- Thundr-Acc/Dmg(A), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx(36), Thundr-Dmg/Rchg(36), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(36), Thundr-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(37), Acc-I(37)
Level 38: Boxing -- Acc-I(A)
Level 41: Tough -- ImpArm-ResDam/EndRdx(A), ImpArm-EndRdx/Rchg(42), ImpArm-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(45), ImpArm-ResDam(46)
Level 44: Weave -- GftotA-Def/EndRdx(A), GftotA-EndRdx/Rchg(45), GftotA-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(45), GftotA-Def(48)
Level 47: Strength of Will -- S'fstPrt-ResDam/Def+(A)
Level 49: Petrifying Gaze -- G'Wdw-Acc/Rchg(A), G'Wdw-Acc/EndRdx(50)
------------
Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Critical Hit
<《 New Colchis / Guides / Mission Architect 》>
"At what point do we say, 'You're mucking with our myths'?" - Harlan Ellison
[ QUOTE ]
On the other hand, this scrapper so far is nowhere near the efficiency of my Fire or even Martial Arts or Broadsword scrappers at single target damage, and needs a team to excel.
[/ QUOTE ]
You just picked out Spines' weakness: its single target damage. If you're going to compare Spines to Fiery Melee, Martial Arts, or Broadsword in terms of single target, Spines will always look bad. But, its AoE potential in unrivaled.
Consider placing your difficulty on Unyielding when solo and herd a bit. Or, spend times in hazard zones when soloing.
In regards to Fighting versus Leadership, I have to give the nod to Fighting. Really, the only perk you lose with Leadership is not getting the +Damage from Assault, which can be made up with IOs. The +Defense of Weave is stronger than that of Maneuvers. I often solo as my Spines/Willpower, so devoting a power slot to Vengeance would be wasted in my case. With Fighting, unfortunately, you need to learn either Boxing or Kick (I learned Kick just to dump a Force Feedback proc). But, getting the Smash/Lethal resists and the stronger +Defense are worth it to me. Also, with MoB, Tough, and SoW, you can cap your Smash/Lethal resists should that need arise.
Rising to the Challenge: Spines/Willpower
One of my current projects is a Spines/Willpower scrapper. Spines, because I never tried it before; Willpower, because I know you can make a fairly tough scrapper that way. I had originally intended this scrapper to be a light tanking scrapper; even given the weakness of Willpower's aura, I know I can hold aggro if I need to with Spines.
Since I wanted a tough scrapper, I had originally intended to pick up Fighting pool somewhere down the line, usually late in the build instead of investing deeply in an ancillary pool. On the other hand, this scrapper so far is nowhere near the efficiency of my Fire or even Martial Arts or Broadsword scrappers at single target damage, and needs a team to excel.
So I started thinking: why not Leadership instead of Fighting? Leadership will not make me as tough as Tough and Weave will. On the other hand, the pool has an immediate payoff, and does not require that I take a crap power just to be in the pool. Maneuvers or Assault both have obvious payoffs. And I could go into Tactics and Vengeance, or instead go deeper into one of the epic pools, probably the Dark one. With Tactics, I might be able to remove one Accuracy from each attack, and replace it with an endurance reduction, and still have enough accuracy and endurance to get by with.
Has anyone else tried such a plan? Is it doomed, like everything else?
<《 New Colchis / Guides / Mission Architect 》>
"At what point do we say, 'You're mucking with our myths'?" - Harlan Ellison