New Non-IO Enhancement Types Desired
By
Bowfling,
Posted on: 2009-05-17 07:07 in Suggestions and Ideas
There are already slow *resist* IOs out there... Some of these, I *believe* (I'd have to go digging) had already been covered by the devs as "not possible at this time," though. (Like I said, I believe that's the case with things like your knockback reduction. Not 100% on that though.) Others are part of powers or IO set bonuses.
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There are already slow *resist* IOs out there... Some of these, I *believe* (I'd have to go digging) had already been covered by the devs as "not possible at this time," though.
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While Im not a programmer, since we already know that the coding exists to INCREASE the knockback of a power, I can't imagine any logical reason why you couldn't DECREASE it as well. For example, if the power has in its coding knockback = .27, and adding an SO +knockback enhancement increases that coding to knockback = .3059 (.27 increased by 33%) then what would stop there from being an ehancement that changes the codiing to knockback=.18 (33% reduction)? Then to deal with the +primary portion, you simply take the .1809 percentage of knockback reduction and transfer it to a +dmg of .1809 additional smashing dmg. granted these numbers are totally fudged for discussion's sake.
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(Like I said, I believe that's the case with things like your knockback reduction. Not 100% on that though.) Others are part of powers or IO set bonuses.
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While there are powers that boost damage, and also IO set bonuses that boost damage, we still have +damage enhancements, so I fail to see why that would matter. Secondly, the entire point is to tailor your OWN powers, not rely on others' powers. Some people have +slow resist, but what does that have to do with my desire to not have my powers slow others down, or speed up, etc. as much as they do.
Enhancements, to me at least, seem like a way to tailor your powers more to your liking and play style by increasing damage, or reducing their end cost, or quickening their recharge time, or boosting their accuracy, or increasing their endurance modification, increasing their taunt effects, or increasing their knockback. Im simply asking for more choices, like reducing some of the above that you can only currently increase, and increasing some of the above that you can, currently, only reduce.
Since this was originally entered in two seperate forums, I'm copying and pasting the responses from the original forum (Powerset discussion) into this one for consistency.
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Being able to turn KB into KD by the use of new IOs or enhancements would be brilliant.
I sign^^
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This would be a really neat trick for DOs and would make them more interesting and more useful for longer. slightly better at one thing for a slight reduction in another.
Some would be really nice like + dam/- KB for some moves. others would make you think, like a +rech/-range or +hold/+end or something like that.
don't expect it to happen though.
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There are already slow *resist* IOs out there... Some of these, I *believe* (I'd have to go digging) had already been covered by the devs as "not possible at this time," though.
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While Im not a programmer, since we already know that the coding exists to INCREASE the knockback of a power, I can't imagine any logical reason why you couldn't DECREASE it as well.
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Arcanaville - who, outside of the dev team itself, is probably the most knowledgable about how this game works (and tends to discuss things with them as it is) said something about this - roughly, "If you think you know how the game works, you're wrong. If you're a programmer and have worked on these, bringing your experience on other things to the table, you're really wrong."
(Which is not to put you down, mind - just to point out that things in this game are, apparently, worked out *really* strangely.)
My reply, like I said, was from recollection that there were issues about doing it. *shrug*
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(Like I said, I believe that's the case with things like your knockback reduction. Not 100% on that though.) Others are part of powers or IO set bonuses.
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While there are powers that boost damage, and also IO set bonuses that boost damage, we still have +damage enhancements, so I fail to see why that would matter. Secondly, the entire point is to tailor your OWN powers, not rely on others' powers. Some people have +slow resist, but what does that have to do with my desire to not have my powers slow others down, or speed up, etc. as much as they do.
Enhancements, to me at least, seem like a way to tailor your powers more to your liking and play style by increasing damage, or reducing their end cost, or quickening their recharge time, or boosting their accuracy, or increasing their endurance modification, increasing their taunt effects, or increasing their knockback. Im simply asking for more choices, like reducing some of the above that you can only currently increase, and increasing some of the above that you can, currently, only reduce.
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See, here's another issue, though. I'd much rather have controls like that (that can affect other players, that is) on the recipient's side. You know a baseline of what to expect as, say, a Kinetics defender. SB will do this much, or more. Your Recovery will go up THIS much, or more. If I were a Stone tank and invited a Kin who had SB slotted with -runspeedenh x3, so it's only boosting END mod and barely touching speed... that kin is much less useful to me. (On top of it, that's quite likely also going to affect recharge times - so that kin is, for my characters, much less useful overall.)
Yeah, things like Knockback are a different issue, and one I'd put into personal taste. But when you're affecting a teammate - I'd say leave the choice in their hands.
But that's already "out of their hands" so to speak. For example, I can slot Speed Boost with INCREASE run speed, something that might be equally as annoying to someone.
What you're arguing isn't, in my experienced, how ehancements currently work. I might slot one teammate buff (say Accelerate Metabolism) with a heavy emphasis on end modification, while you slot it with a heavy emphasis on recharge and increased speed since you often team with a stone tanker. Likewise, you slot Speed Boost with +Speed while I slot it for + End Mod. You slot ID with +Resist while I slot it with an end cost reduction, etc.
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But that's already "out of their hands" so to speak. For example, I can slot Speed Boost with INCREASE run speed, something that might be equally as annoying to someone.
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You missed what I was saying.
First, again, things like KB that only affect you and your enemy - fine, go nuts. However, using the Kinetics example again, and specifically Speed Boost:
I invite a Kin/ to my team. "Cool, speed boost!" I'm expecting, assuming they *use* the power, a level of Recovery, Recharge, and Movement speed buffs. At least a baseline of that. It's what Speed Boost does. I most *certainly* want that movement speed boost if I'm facing, say, Earth Thorn Casters, anything with Caltrops, Glue Arrow, or opposing Kinetics users (like Blue Ink men.) Even if I'm not running a Stone tank or brute.
Going to pause at this point and say, yes, I know not everyone likes the speed boost movement speed increase, and it's possible that having it complained about is the reason for you making this thread. But here's the difference between that reduction on a team buff being in your hands, versus the control of a the recipient -
In your hands:
Now, you decide you don't want it to affect speed, and throw three "slow" enhancements in it, negating the runspeed (and, conincidentally, recharge) - Speed Boost is now just a Recovery boost. We hit anything that does slows (see list above.) Where Speed Boost would let me just ignore that - I'm now slowed badly.
Alternately, I'm running a Fire aura tank. We hit Crey - lots of Cryo tanks and scientists. They debuff both speed and recharge.
Your speed boost is now *worthless* to me. My END isn't the problem, the speed and recharge are - and they're a good part of the reason I went looking for a kin. And I, when going through and looking for a Kin, have to ask "Have you reduced your speed in speed boost at all?" instead of knowing there's a baseline to expect.
In the recipient's hands:
We have players A, B, and C. We invite player D, a Kinetics user, to a team.
Player A likes speed boost, no matter what. Cave map, Shadow shard, open ground, he'll take it and he loves it.
Player B likes it, but not in caves. When going into a cave, he goes into "Options" and reduces his maxrunspeed, or just puts in "Decline" for this mission.
Player C doesn't like it at all, and has it set to not accept speed increases at all.
Player D still gives a baseline of the buff, the expected buff, and each player gets to decide if they accept it or not. That Stone tank isn't going to complain, and always knows that a Kin with SB is going to work well with him. I know that those Cryo tanks and scientsts aren't going to bother my tank at all. Caltrops are now countered... *unless the player chooses not to accept.*
The player's game experience, regarding external buffs, is now in their own hands and better overall for everyone.
And again, currently not every personl playing a powerset takes all of the powers of said powerset, so you theoretically have to ask "have you taken speed boost" or "Have you taken your rez power" etc. In other words, as I said before, you're saying it would cause a situation which already occurs.
For the record, I have three different level 50 kins, and LOVE speed boost, so that's not the issue. I have been on teams, however, where kins have either not taken speed boost because of its need to be spammed, or said "I don't speed boost." And I was annoyed, sure, but in the end it was their character, and I still had every power and ability on my character that I came into the team with, so I really had no reason to complain.
The game experience regaring external buffs isn't in anyones hands but the buffers, even as things are now. They decide whether to take a power or not, they decide when and how to use a power or nor (who hasn't teamed with someone who either doesnt announce their use of AM, or conversely doesn't have a power you think they should, etc.) and how to slot said power.
We're just going to have to agree to disagree here.
I'd much rather have external buff effects put in the hands of the recipient, not play the "What is this person's version of the power going to do" crapshoot. People who want it will know what they're getting when it's applied, people who don't can tone it down or refuse it.
All I can say is that if the OP's idea were put into effect I would stop teaming with buffers altogether.
If they make any kind of new enhancements, these are the ones I think are reasonable:
This is the seventh in a series of By Popular Request articles, which reviews commonly requested player suggestions that have strong positive support, and reviews the implications and considerations that would need to be considered if these suggestions were to be implemented.
This weeks subject New Enhancements:
Many forum posters have offered suggestions as to what kinds of new enhancements could be added to the game. Status effect Magnitude increase would make it possible to get a successful status effect on a critter where, ordinarily, effects must be stacked. Buff Duration increase, perhaps the most often requested, would increase the length of time a particular buff is in effect. Another popular one is Area of Effect Impact radius Increase. This would make the cone of a cone attack wider, or the radius of an AoE wider. Reduce Activation Time would decrease the time a power takes to activate, although this particular enhancements may be significantly harder to code. For some players, knockback is a negative, so the Knockback Reduction enhancement would reduce the knockback potential of an attack, potentially turning knockback into just knock down. There might also be an enhancement that increases the number of ticks of damage a damage-over-time attack has, which would differs from a damage enhancement that increases the amount of damage done by each tick.
An interesting new form of enhancements might be a hybrid enhancement. Unlike HOs or multi aspect IOs, these enhancements would have both positive and negative effects. For instance, one might be a +40% accuracy buff, greater than a normal SO, but suffer a -10% damage reduction. A very likely hybrid that incorporates some of the above ideas would be Increase buff duration/Increase recharge time, since this would help insure powers that are not desired to be permanent remain so, even with a buff duration increase. If nothing else, hybrid enhancements would give players even more flexibility in maximizing the aspects of their powers to their own liking.
For those arguing that "If SB didn't boost my speed I'd just skip teaming with kins altogether" I offer you the following thread.
https://boards.cityofheroes.com/showflat...;gonew=1#UNREAD
The bottom line: You have zero control over how buffs from other players work anyway, so including a -speed increase +end increase (or other) enhancement probably wouldn't have the DOOOM factor you're saying it would anyway.
Ok, I have long wanted some new types of enhancements introduced into the game. Not necessarily IO enhancements, but general effects that currently aren't offered.
I started thinking this way back while levelling my first 50. It was an energy/fire blaster. What I'd like to see is a MINUS knockback effect enhancement for powers. In other words, if you want to use energy blast, but don't want to deal with all of the constant knockback and positioning, use these for a reduction in the amount of knockback. If the coding would work, powers that traded damage for different secondary effect like knockback could simply see a slight increase in damage and reduction of knockback. The coding SHOULD work since we already have both Hami-O's that effect more than one aspect of a power (say damage and range) and also already have +knockback enahancements.
This got me thinking...what other enhancements could people want to deal with annoying secondaries in certain powers or powersets?
Im going to start a thread asking for ideas and lists. The + primary means that it will increase whatever the main effect of the power is (damage, -acc, sleep, etc.)
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New Enhancements We'd Like To See
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1: Knockback Effect Reduction: (-knockback, +primary)
2: Taunt Reducation: (- taunt)
3: End Drain Reduction: (-end mod, + Primary)
4: Damage Reduction: (-Dmg, + Primary) -say for Sonic's sleep, to remove aggro affect, etc.?
5: Slow Effect Reduction: (-slow, + Primary) -ID, stealth, etc. ?
6: Enhance Speed Reduction: (- +speed, + Primary) -Imagine it in Speed Boost, still able to boost people whose computers and lag can't handle the increased movement but would love the increased recharge, etc.)
7: Stealth Reduction: (-Stealth, + seconday) -want to keep the bonuses from Shadowfall but not be saddled with problems leading out captives? Want the +def from grant invis but not the actual invis?
Can anyone think of any others? Do these sound interesting to anyone else?