St_Angelius

Although the only wizards explicitly named or mentioned in the books are the Istari, there are several allusions to there being many other, lesser wizards in Middle-earth, just as "magic rings" are treated as much more commonplace than the Rings of Power, although none are actually seen.

The 'Wizards' were Istari, who were an organization of Maiar spirits sent to aid the Free Peoples of Middle-earth against the return and rise of Sauron. They just took the form of old men. Wizard was just how they explained away thier powers.

Gandalf wasn't a wizard, he was a Maiar, same as Sauron and the Balrog.

I agree as an option, but as a blanket change, I hate it. Neo Chamber was built around the KB, as he is thowing around pure bio-kinetic force. But on other characters on other AT's or power sets, I could do with less KB

At last, been waiting for this since i started playing!

really hope the KB bug isn't to stay though. will spell death to KB centric toons, like my main, an energy blaster.

I wish, not clever enough to up with gimmick builds, just non FOTM builds.

There is so much in this game, other than costumes, that you can can have as unique a gaming experience as you wish. The only person stopping you from having a unique character build or gameplay experience, is you.

You build your characters in such a way because you concider certain powers and slotting options as nonsensecal, where others do not. I have had a fair few toons in my very nearly 4 years in this game, even though i've only got 4 of them to 50 so far, (Damn my altism). I have tried a few of each AT, but mostly I seem to end up enjoying blasters the most. Because of that about 40%, (give or take a bit) of my toons are blasters. and each one of them, pre and post Inherant Fitness, have had very different builds and had very different gaming experience. If you haven't that is more about you than what the game has to offer.

Not misleading for the perpose of figuring number of characters, on average, in game. As anyone with a second account, at least prior to freedom, are not likely to have done so for 1 or 2 character slots.

Wow, I'd play it.

Hell, I'd be more of an altist in that game than I am here trying out all the different professions.

Meaningful choice versus pointless gimmick huh? well, lets see shall we?

Pointless gimmick. Nothing meaningful about "complete Mission X unlock power set Y." Ever the "Sacrifice" made in you're suggestion is no actual sacrifice, It's just a gimmick to make people run it more.

Another Gimmick. Infact, 2 of them. First we have street hunting to eliminate a faction from a zone for a week, great idea, except 1 small problem. You go into PP and start taking out the Trolls and expell them from the zone for a week. Now I get a Mission to kill trolls in perez park. Guess I'm out of luck, for a week. It may have improved your gaming experience, but lowered that of anyone with a street hunt mission in that zone. I spot an oppotunity for greifing there too.

Next gimmick is "complete task X to spawn GM Y or gain temp power Z" both example already in the game and both gimmick no more meaningful that spawning babbage during the synapse TF, the Kronos Titan in in Crimson's arc
or warwolf whistle in Stephanie Peebles arc just to name a few.

Yet more gimmicks to make missions harder. what's the meaning there? enemies hiding behind oject can't be shot at, AOE defence bonus is that case is pointless. I've also had mobs run and return with back-up more annoying than anything.


Not a meaningful choice, just punishment for players that don't take powers x,y or z in their build. Oh, doesn't that have negative impact on build diversity too?

This already exists. Master illusionists going in and out of phase, Rikti Guardians buggling allies, Arachnos scouts and widows going in and out of stealth etc. Still just a gimmick to make missions harder.

So, you want the whole threat mechanic thrown out the window for this gimmick which is nothing more that making enemies iggnore the agro manager and target the squishy. How is this even fair let alone meaningful?


I actually like this idea. But even when used in single player games is still just a gimmick. Only choice is is complete task A for reward X or task B for reward Y. The decission come less to what choice the character would make and more what reward the player wants.


Gimmick giving no meaningful choice to the players, and just as annoying as the portals that randomly spread players around Oranbega maps.

Was a gimmick when the competition did it and still is in your suggestion. Customized Nemisis would be open to abuse just as custom mobs are in AE. Got a toon with capped S/L resistance, have the nemesis only deal S/L damage. The idea of missions tailored to you're character is brilliant, except the sheer amount of permutations of different character would mean the amount of different tailored missions the devs would have to create to give every differen't type of character a different mission would be larger than the amount of content added in any previous expansion and would take years to produce. If nothing else, It would be nice to have more missions tailored to the stalker AT. Less heat seeking ambushes, less escorts, less kill alls etc. but the amount of work needed would be enough to almost make a whole new expansion on it's own. To do each AT and power type would be enough content for a whole new game.

Another interesting idea, but to have any meaning you would have to completely rework the day job system so charaters can only have one day job, which would only serve to punish those who spent all that time getting all the day job badges.


Gimmicks to make missions harder by by taking tactical targeting choices away from players and turning missions into farm by virtue of endless respawning enemies. I've also not noticed a lack of AOE's used by enemies.

Gimmick, would also mean you would have to allow players to take powers to prevent the theft, thus giving players more powers they have to take, dropping build diversity again. Only choice without that is fight BP or don't fight BP.

Anoying when it happens in the pokemon games, why would it be more meaningful here? and gives no meaningful choice to the player. You can't control when enemies use what powers. Multiple such enemies in a spawn could render a character defensless in a matter of seconds. no more meaningful that a pair of sappers in a Malta spawn, with pretty much the same consequence. With little choice for the player to defend against it.

A gimmick as used in the missions currently, is a gimmick by your suggestions. only meaning is isolating players from the rest of thier team with half a mapful of enemies between the imprisoned player and their team. Adding a puzzle aspect is still a gimmick. A puzzle is only a chalenge the first time you encounter it, the 10th time is a chore, the 50th time is just annoying.

Choice in games is a gimmick, even in single person games, more so in MMO's. Freedom of choice in any game is an illusion. There will always a finite number of paths with their own rewards. Most players will still plan their path through the game for the best rewards for them rather that a path that would be more apropriate to their character.

*SPOILER ALERT*

Consequence is also a gimmick, unless it is truely punitive. Any consequence that isn't permanent is pointless. A choice of certain death means nothing if it doesn't actually result in death. Mass Effect for example has a true choice with a true consequence. Save team mate A team mate B dies, Permanently, save team mate B team mate A dies, permanently. And even then for many players the choice comes down to which team mate is more used to the player. Overlord 2 you get to choose a First Misteress, the consequence is what mount is availible for your minions in the final battle. The choice is again, what reward makes most sence to your play style not what is more immersive to the story.

Bottom line a gimmick is a gimmick irrespective of the illusion of choice it gives the player. The draw to the gimmick isn't the gimmick itself but the reward. That isn't immersion building that is immersion breaking.

ok, let's do some math...

I have 3 blasters at L50.
Neo Chamber is Energy/Energy/Force
Tess Trueshot is Archery/Energy/Munitions
Psi is Fire/Mental/Fire

Pre inherant fitness and excluding temp, vet and booster pack powers character would reach 27 powers in total, that is inhreants like brawl, rest and sprint, primary, secondary, pool and epic powers.

Neo and Tess , who shared thier secondary pools, had 11 powers in common, this made them 40.74% alike.

Neo and Psi had 12 powers making them 44.44% alike.

Tess and Psi had 9 powers in common making them 33.33% alike

Based soley on these 3 characters the average similarity was 39.5%.

After inherant fitness characters would reach L50 with 31 powers, excluing temp, vet and booter pack powers.

Neo and Tess share 14 common powers making their similarity 45.16%. this is a net change of 4.42%.

Neo and Psi share 15 powers giving a similarity of 48.38% which is an overall change of 3.94%

Tess and Psi share 12 powers making them 38.70% giving a change of 5.37%


Clearly, with the bigest chage being less that a 6% change in likeness makes their drop in difference not just small, but minscule. You could argue thast this change is a drop in diversity, but cannot argue that it is anything but bearly noticable.

The Average similarity between the characters is now 44.08% this is an overall increase in similarity of 4.58%. less than a 5% drop in diversity of my 3 toons alone. That's less, on average, of being 2 powers more alike, that is after being given 4 more powers in common, in a single AT That is hardly a "Decimated" by any stretch of the imagination. If anything is is miniscule.

Now lets add Gun Gal to the mix. She was rolled after inherant fitness and is AR/Dev/Munitions. she has in her build only 3 pools and no travel powers.


She shares 9 powers with Neo. That's a 29.03% similarity.
She shares 13 powers with Tess. That's a 41.94% similarity.
She shares 11 powers with Psi. That's a 35.48% similarity.

That is a 39.78% average similarity. and increase of 0.28% similarity. and that is just between 4 characters. Now how about I add in the build I did for my partners Electric/Mental/Electric blaster. she shares 14 powers with Psi Fire due to shared secondary, 10 with Tess but only 9 with both Neo and Gun Gal. That is only 1 power in common beyond the inherant powers. that brings the average similarity down to 36.77%.

That, by my calculation, is an increase in diversity, with a slight decrease with a more limited selection of toons. The problem you see simply does not exist. If I had managed to get round respeccing all my toons to inherant fitness I can garentee there would be and even smaller cross over between all characters.

I'm sure given enough time and data points Arcarnaville could do a much better job of what I just did than me, but have at least shown that my own toon, as well as the builds I did for my partner, are mor different, on average, than they would have been before inherant fitness. To say otherwise is the same as claiming day is night.

Again wrong, the build already had SJ and SS, I gained 3 powers from fighting and repulsion bomb from the Force Mastery epic pool, as this particular toon had all 4 fitness powers I also swapped out power boost, as I found out it did not effect knockback as the power description suggested. I replaced it with boost range. Kick from fitness is a bearly used prerequisite power, as would be obvious but the single acc enhancement.

So, please tell me again how you did not say this!

Your claim is inherant fitness made us both near identical in powers and play style, which is patently false.



But Banshee can already fight with his bear hands, it's only his sonic attack's that are "ranged" attacks. Psylock could also have attacked at range before, Sai are throwable weapons. The fact that they both now fly does not make them suddenly so much similar. They both still perform vastly different function in whichever X group they are now affilliated with.

I could easily have taken more leadrship power with that toon, and did with another L50 blaster, I could have taken from the concealment pool, as I did with another L50 blaster, I could have taken from medicine, I could have taken from the teleport pool without adding another power, I could have taken more from the speed or leaping pools. That is all more choice than I had before there was inherant fitness. Some of my lower leveled toons, which have yet to be specced into IF, will be taking from those pools. That is something that simply wasn't posible before.


And as was pointed out earlier, peoples definition of what is a gimmick and what isn't differs wildly amoung the player base. some of what you concider as gimmick other players concider core to the game.

Everything you listed is just as much of a gimmick as anything Commander listed. Strip all gimmick from this game and all you will get is "click button to kill enemies" which is the core gameplay that makes all MMO's, hell, 90% of all game in general have, it's the "gimmick" that give the game an identity to seperate it from other games. This thread was started saying "less gimmicks please" you on the other hand are saying "More gimmick please. But only the one's I like."

And yet again you call the constant boost in costume options as a useless gimmick Which is essensially saying, "there should be less costume options because they have no impact on gameplay" when the games genre is all about having distinct costumes from everyone else. It add's to the character's diversity, that you claim to be calling for more of.

Paranoia online is a great idea. Anyone who donesn't think so must be commie mutant traitor scum and must die!!


"Die commie mutant traitor scum!"
*Pulls out experimental killzap pistol, sets to instant death ray setting and fires at Montaugh, instantly vapourizing self*

Damnit!

No, it did not support you theory, as you postulated that the both became more generlized, which was totally wrong. Arcarnaville's build became more of a close range specialist and my build became more of a long range specialist, not generalist's like you insist.

As I said, you are only seeing what you want to see whether it's there or not. You have you're veiws as to what are valuable powers in the pools and AT sets, as has already been proven, other players place different values on the pools and powers avalible than you do. That is another flaw in your logic, that given 3 more power picks everyone will take from that same limited pool of what you concider "useful powers" .

Yes, min/maxers will all gravitate to the same few powers, was true before inherant fitness as it is true now, but those players are not the majority of the player base. players that build to theme or concept wikk still take powers outside of what you would concider the logical choice, just as much as they did before. Even if you add in 5 new pools, the min/max minority will still all end up taking the same powers.

You say you aren't a fringe case yet still insist the new cossie options are useless fluff, which is also counter you all the people complaining in the new cossie option threads that there aren't enough in them as well as all the people in the costume request thread. All you keep demonstrating is that you have very narrow views as you what is good and what is bad, and people time and time again show how much they disagree which your definition of what is good and bad and the only argument you can come up with is they are fringe cases and not representitive of the player base as a whole. well tell me, what make you and your ideas more representitive of the player base?

You are still seeing what you want to see in my build rather than what is actually there. Before inherant fitness My energy blaster was a long range specialist. the only melee attacks he had were brawl and power thrust. After inherant fitness he became a long range specialist with greater range, more survivability and 1 more melee power, kick, which barely gets used as it was a prerequist for tough and weave. What inherant fitness did for me was make me more of a specialist, not less of one.

As for 2 travel powers, SJ gave me good verticle movement while SS gave me great horizontal movement, 35ft of stealth, 100% threat reduction, which is much more use in the heat of battle on a team than stealth as it gives a blaster 0% threat generation, and a mule for a 20% slow resist. SS is always on because it is more than just a travel power, SJ is my primary travel method.

And Obitus, no need to appologize, I explained the diff Arcarnaville's build and mine as I knew you were unable to view them at the time.