Moghedien_EU

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Good to know that you cant post your opinions on certain things without ppl making fun of you or attacking you :-)

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Part of the problem is that you have often been stating things as facts - not as opinions. And the facts have been false, and when challenged on their veracity you've evaded/diverted attention rather than either provide authentication or concede that you were wrong.

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Have fun, till the next one posts an opinion which isnt yours, then you can start all over again :-)

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Anyone merely naysaying just because the opinion isn't their own isn't being a constructive poster.

Anyone stating rubbish as fact and getting upset/evasive when called on that isn't either.

I'm sure that most people will happily attack false info posted here. And obviously the people who do attack false info didn't believe that info themselves, as they knew it to be false. The people attacking your opinion are doing so not so much because it's your opinion as that it's wrong.

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Good to know that you cant post your opinions on certain things without ppl making fun of you or attacking you :-)

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Part of the problem is that you have often been stating things as facts - not as opinions. And the facts have been false, and when challenged on their veracity you've evaded/diverted attention rather than either provide authentication or concede that you were wrong.

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Have fun, till the next one posts an opinion which isnt yours, then you can start all over again :-)

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Anyone merely naysaying just because the opinion isn't their own isn't being a constructive poster.

Anyone stating rubbish as fact and getting upset/evasive when called on that isn't either.

I'm sure that most people will happily attack false info posted here. And obviously the people who do attack false info didn't believe that info themselves, as they knew it to be false. The people attacking your opinion are doing so not so much because it's your opinion as that it's wrong.

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An opinion can never be wrong.....
It might be unpopular and not shared but it cant be wrong.

I was wrong bout some things i claimed as facts i admit that.
But there were several things i said, ppl said i was wrong just because i cant prove it, but they cant prove their side either, so who can say whos wrong or right ?
You cant say someone wrong cause he cant prove his views when you cant prove yours either... at least thats how i see it....

Its like someone saying he thinks there are aliens, and everyone says hes nuts and he needs to prove it first, while they cant prove there arent aliens either.

Or in school when you had to interpret a poem or a book of an ancient author, and the teacher says your wrong, how does he know ? Did he speak to the author-- most likely not.

Not all my statements are proven false.
In your opinion they are all false while you cant prove why they are false either-
And not everyone disagrees with everything i said.

Well anyway lets see what I14 brings and if the devs dare to change something you think is proven wrong,you might argue with them.

Btw Knight_Errant some of your statements are ver strange too...

Like sets didnt improve chars performance at all. i doubt your opinion on that is shared by many, even on this thread.

Good to know that you cant post your opinions on certain things without ppl making fun of you or attacking you :-)

At least in game several ppl agree with some of my opinions.

Its always the same ppl here anyway who say all is fine nothing needs change.

Have fun, till the next one posts an opinion which isnt yours, then you can start all over again :-)

I do like criticism and i can deal with it, and i am able to admitt when i was proven wrong, what i cant deal with are meaningless irrelevant "fun posts" without any relevace to the topic of ppl only jumping the bandwagon.....

I guess thats why most players cant be bother to post on the forums if they have unpopular opinions....

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No he just proved that they used to be easier and were made harder in i3 and then AVs and GMs were made even harder still that bit that was rolled back was the ridiculus regen some mobs had to the point that they could not be taken down without a lot of dedicated -regen

and I'm sorry but giving a mob or anything for that matter so much regen that it cant be taken down is

a) not fun
b) a waste of time

and you've yet to tell us when this making the mobs easyer actually happened so far you have not given one example.

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Take a look at Sapphic_Neko`s post.
Unfortunately i cant remember everything just that they used to be harder.

AT least Sapphic_Neko shows i am not completely stupid :-)

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There's nothing in Neko's post saying how mobs got boosted, just how the no AOE caps made it easier.

Mobs themselves got boosted since i3, especially bosses.

Some of the spawning rules got changed so you don't get +5s in missions any more but the mobs themselves didn't get any harder, that's the closest thing (I never had it happen to me in i3 mind that I can remember. Had it happen that I spawned +20s on a Villains mish before but that was a bug). A +5 Boss now is tougher than a +5 boss from then though.

GMs and AVs also got heavily boosted (and rewards nerfed) since then too.

You mightn't be stupid, but you aren't the best at reading comprehension either.

Having said all that I will admit that some aspects of the game have been made easier, namely the new Hollows. I sorta miss the old one where you had to run around masses of +7 enemy groups to get to your missions.

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Acc got nerfed for bosses and ltn, they used to have higher acc.

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No he just proved that they used to be easier and were made harder in i3 and then AVs and GMs were made even harder still that bit that was rolled back was the ridiculus regen some mobs had to the point that they could not be taken down without a lot of dedicated -regen

and I'm sorry but giving a mob or anything for that matter so much regen that it cant be taken down is

a) not fun
b) a waste of time

and you've yet to tell us when this making the mobs easyer actually happened so far you have not given one example.

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Take a look at Sapphic_Neko`s post.
Unfortunately i cant remember everything just that they used to be harder.

AT least Sapphic_Neko shows i am not completely stupid :-)

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Cox easier than all other mmorpg is proven wrong.
There are some few easier games but many harder ones.

[/ QUOTE ]I think the number of responses reporting their experiences in other MMOs has generally refuted that claim.

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Mobs used to be stronger cant be proven by me since they deleted old posts from US forum, but every dev can tell you that i am right.

[/ QUOTE ]Wrong! The earliest change to mobs since the game went live, and it's still there on the Developers section of the US Boards, was the change to Bosses, AVs and GMs. In i3 they were made harder. Both Health and Damage were buffed. Damage to the point where an even level Boss could two-shot an unprepared Defender. Bosses also had silly levels of regen (roughly equivalent to an AV before the last increase given to AVs and GMs in i7). This was partially rolled back and bosses ended up at the power level they are now. So no, you're wrong.

Even Emmert acknowledged that he over did it on that one.

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Some ppl said that there are several much harder games out there.
And maybe most ppl didnt play many other games to compare ?


Aehm you do think before posting do you ?
Since you did just prove by yourself that the mobs used to be much harder, so i wonder how you come up to the conclusion that my statement they were harder was wrong ???
I said there were times mobs were harder than now and that is true.

See the post above for some more info on mob changes :-)

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There once was a time when mobs used to be much harder than they are now.

[/ QUOTE ]When was that? Back before ED when tanks could herd an entire map so the rest of the team could blast then to shreds by the door? They certainly haven't changed the power level of standard mobs since issue 6 and I doubt that they have been made easier before then. I certainly haven't found any patch notes that say as much.
Of course if you have some solid proof that what you say is true (not: "a SG mate said...") then maybe you would have a point.

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I've been largely staying out of this thread (and its "Nerf SS/WP!" twin) because trying to pin down Moghedien on an argument is like trying to nail jelly to the wall.

Get close to something that'd force him to concede he was wrong on some specific and he'll shoot off at a tangent, throw something else that's clearly incorrect in (or at best unprovable - e.g. SS/WP "datamining", dxp weekend dual boxing farmers, CoX is easier than other MMOs, only Ill/Rad controllers can solo GMs, mobs used to be much harder...), and off things go in the new direction.

It's impressive in a way, and very entertaining to read, but in the interests of my blood pressure I'll mostly continue to lurk.

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Clearly incorrect cause YOU say so ?

SS/WP just needs to be datamined, before the devs do that, neither mine NOR your statements are right or wrong.

I can remember all the threads about ET not being too good and cant be nerfed without killing the whole set.
Yet the devs decided that those ppl were wrong and it was too good.
Dual accounts cant be proven, neither by you nor by me, i just said what i saw ingame.

Cox easier than all other mmorpg is proven wrong.
There are some few easier games but many harder ones.

Mobs used to be stronger cant be proven by me since they deleted old posts from US forum, but every dev can tell you that i am right.

Fact is neither me, NOR you can prove all of this without devs help.
I might be wrong on some things so might you. :-)

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I very much doubt they were less powerful than they are now.

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At least on this one you are prolly alone.....
Denying chars got stronger with sets leads to the conclusion you never played the game with sets sry.
Or you just disagree without thinking, just because you love to disaagree.

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They certainly haven't changed the power level of standard mobs since issue 6 and I doubt that they have been made easier before then. I certainly haven't found any patch notes that say as much.
Of course if you have some solid proof that what you say is true (not: "a SG mate said...") then maybe you would have a point.

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There arent any patch notes left from the time they buffed or nerfed mob strenghts, but i bet there are still some veteran players out there who can tell you i am right.
Even the moderators could tell you that i am right.
There were several threads on the US forums discussing the new mob strenghts and buffs... shame they deleted the threads.
There have been many changes to the game which never appeared in patch notes... you might have noticed. :-)

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What former power? Mobs weren't really changed at all. Hell CoT behemoths still use their i4 version of the Inv toggle.

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Mobs had much more HP than they have now and some did hit harder than they do now.

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I disagree. Going right back it was dull as ditch-water watching a Tank herd the map or a controller being able to AOE hold every single spawn, with 10 Fire Monkeys trailing behind him. Or watching Regen take on the entire spawn. The game is far more balanced than it ever was.

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Totally agreeing with you there...
The aoe hold and herd all mobs in map and 10 fire monkey issues are long gone now.
But what if buff the mobs to their former power while keeping the system as it i now ?

Shouldnt +2 bosses be an equal match ?
Most of time it needs elite-bosses or AVs to be a match, which is puzzling to me since they were meant to be team only content.

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That's not a difficulty issue, that's a matter of predictability. If you've been through the 1-50 run half a dozen time and paid attention to the mobs then you'll know what they're going to do and when. That allows you to plan your course of action accordingly and the threat that those mobs would pose to a less experience player is partially negated. It's like reading the ending of a novel and it applies to all MMOs.

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True part of it is predictability, but not all.
There once was a time when chars didnt have sets therfore not being as powerfull.
There once was a time when mobs used to be much harder than they are now.
There was a time players actually had to PULL mobs to not get the team whiped.

Still ppl had fun, even or maybe because it was more challenging.

Mabye it the spirit of our time that games get easier and easier, cause the developers think to attract more pll that way , i dont now.

Imo the easier a game gets the faster ppl get bored of it.
Cox counters that with awesome costume designer and a very alt-friendly game design.

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If you're not finding the 'Invincible' difficulty setting a challenge then evidently you're to l33t for us.


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I think many players with more than 9 months vet rewards and several 50 dont find it very challenging anymore even on highest diff setting.

[/ QUOTE ]That's your assumption, without any relevent or even half conceived supportive evidence. Not a fact.

I think that the sky is pink and it rains teddy bears in game, oddly enough the truth says otherwise.

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I am in 2 big, very active SGs and bout 80% of the ppl there are veteran players which are pretty bored cause they miss the challenge.

Maybe its just the ppl in those 2 SGs but i do believe tht at least some others feel the same way.

Since there is no way to determine how many ppl find the game a bit too easy neither for players nor the devs, i am basing my assumption on my ingame experience.

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If you're not finding the 'Invincible' difficulty setting a challenge then evidently you're to l33t for us.


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I think many players with more than 9 months vet rewards and several 50 dont find it very challenging anymore even on highest diff setting.

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Not true. Ambushs, walkers and giant monster spawns like Scrapyards super mob prove you wrong.

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How often do you get ambushes ? Even if there are some rare ambushes, they are predictable and can avoid them most times.

How mayn walking mobs are there ? 1 in 100 and when there is one it moves around in a fixed area of some meters.

Scrapyard is ONE mob in a whole game, a mob you can avoid even if you play half sleeping.

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So you want to be killed by a single patrol? You seem to be a bit masochistic... especially when I remember you saying that dying 30 times against Hamidon is what you call great fun. Hamidon is probably the most boring thing you can do in CoH, with or without the dying.

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I mean if a SOLO player can killa patrol spawned for 8 players.
I said Hami was fun when he was introduced. It was in the days max lvl was 40, team size was 6, no ED no sets etc.
In those days you HAD to kill him with ONE team.
You had to use tactics and it took skill to do it, hell ppl even had to use their brains for once.
Same was true for sewer trial.

These days its all about:
Run in, aoe aoe, maybe an aoe hold,aoe,aoe dead mobs....

Whats so bad about Elite mobs in WoW or elite mobs in AoC ?
There arent supposed to be soloed so players CANT.

What would be so bad about mission with all elite-mobs in cox ?
That would mean ppl for once HAVE to team to do something.
There would be a challenge again.

In CoX it doesnt really matter in a missiojn if 5 ppl in a team of 8 are doorsitting while the other 3 do the mission.
All elite mobs would change that.

Maybe the missions architect allows that, so players who prefer easy mode can continue with normal mission and the ones looking for a challenge can do the elite missions.

Yes we have SF/TF where you need a team, but thats just because you cant START them without a team, not because you cant DO it solo or duo. AT least most can be done olo or duo with the right chars.



As i said earlier i was talking about SWG when i played it which was before they destroyed it, the days when there were 3 times as many professions and there wasnt a bot programm for everything.
No way you could reach max int he professions in one week even with grinding back then.

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Well have just started solo/duoing through EQ2 so will let you know how it goes.

WoW is ludicrously easy but at the same time requires stupid levels of patience. Maybe CoH is just better for people with no attention span (like me)

I also saw no difficulty in AoC but then I got bored before level 30.

LotR was easier than CoH, especially with certain classes (ATs)

DDO was the least "walk through in solo" MMO I've tried and the only one that required though when teaming.

Warhammer sure as hell wasn't difficult in teams as while things were balanced for PvP most things could walk PvE. Everything I tried in Warhammer could solo well, a bit like City Of Villains really

I think more solo farming happens in CoH/V than in other games cause of the nature of rewards. You get much more drops over time soloing in CoH/V. In other games you need a group to get the worthwhile drops

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I found Warhammer harder, like AoC and most other games with mostly outdoor grinds and missions.

MOVING mobs.
A thing Cox totally lacks.
In the other games you can solo ok , but once you agro some romaers which is very easy you die in seconds.
Theres much more tactic involved... can i pull that mobs without agroing the others ? Can i kill those mobs before respawn behind me gets me ?

There is no kill the mob, take a break, make a tea, watch some tv and continue killing like in CoX.
If you need to go afk you have to find a save place or you die.

The occasional patrols in very few missions are no threat when 1 char can kill them in 20 secs.

i didnt say the majority of the players were multiple accounts. I said a good chunk of them.

Its been a while ince i played WoW and SWG so i dont know if the got easier but they were much harder than CoX when i played them.

But even if those follow the CoX easy mode now, i wouldnt go so far to say CoX is harder than the majority of the games.

In Everquest2 it was alomost not possible to play solo at high lvls.

Vanguard is almost dead but it was hard as hell to solo there.

Age of Conan, Warhammer online and Anarchy online are definately much harder than CoX.

I think one thing that makes CoX so easy is the fact, that the outdoor mobs are no threat.

In the other games you often have problems to get to a mission alieve cause the mobs can kill you.

Once you hit 50 in CoX the outdoor mobs are often way below your lvl and no threat at all, at least in GV.

You can lvl a char from 1-50 in one week in CoX too , if you grind and farm, like in most other games.

The mission nature of CoX just makes it easier to farm and grind than the outdoor grinds of other games, where you have to wait for respawns, search for mobs and if your unlucky get killed by patrols or suddenly respawning mobs.

Most of the time i just miss the challenge in CoX, mobs that are very hard to defeat, missions that are almost impossible to do, to figure out how to do something.

I remember when i played CoH on the US server when Hami was introduced.
Max team size was smaller and we were the first on our server to kill Hami as a team.
We died like 30 times each but it prolly was the most fun i had in CoX.

Maybe the Mission Architect with creative and hard mission will bring the feeling back for me and some of the players who miss a challenge as a team.

In most missions the mobs are standing at one spot waiting to get killed, i want mobs that move around, so you cant say wether there is a big spawn comming around the corner while you fight one group.
Mobs that run off to get reinforcments etc.
Buildings that explode if you cant find the bomb in time...

Sure you can gimp your char in order to have a challenge but i want a team challenge.
And since most players wont gimp a char for a challenge the others in the team will be normal chars and you will just be a player which isnt contributing to the team....

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Just for the record 'I think' you're wrong.

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Its not only me who knos players with several accounts and double or even trippel accounts Do make an impact on server population if the population is pretty low in a game, imo.

Name some mmorpgs that are easier than CoX ?
CoX is one of the easiest games to lvl, solo AND teamed and has the easiests endgame content i ever seen (apart from Hami raids)

SWG, Anarchy online, WoW, Warhammer online, Age of Conan, Chronicles of Spellborn, Everquest2, Vanguard, Final Fantasy,...

just to name a few i have played are much harder than CoX, to the point you cant do anything without teams in the high lvls.

Compare the TF/SF to the instances and dungeons in those games or the elite mobs... CoX doesnt even come close to the difficulty of those games.

You must not have played many mmorpgs and done the endgame content or team only content, cause then you wouldnt have made such a false statement.

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I think a good chunk of the chars on dxp weekend were 2nd or 3rd accounts of the same players.
Just for inf farm and powerlvling toons.

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I think that's a made up pile of nonsense. The 'I think' game is fun isn't it.

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You dont think several players have more than 1 account ?
I do know many players who logged in several accounts so i dont "think" i do know that several chars were played by the same player for inf and pl.

But i do "think" you just disagree with everything i say, just because i say it and you like it :-)

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Thirdly, im working on the proposition that the game is too easy, bordering on collapse upon itself easy.

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This is your error.

Clearly, the game is not too easy.

If you would like proof of this, I suggest you look back at last weekend, when the server population doubled while the game was even easier.

I rest my case.

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Lordy. The game wasnt easier or harder. You just doubled the rewards for victory. Easier to get to level 50, not easier to win. .

*Bangs head against wall*

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That's true only if you consider the game as starting at level 50.

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I think a good chunk of the chars on dxp weekend were 2nd or 3rd accounts of the same players.
Just for inf farm and powerlvling toons.

Imbalance in mmorpgs is most obvious if the game has PvP.

Cause players will scream bloody murder if an overpowered class or combo is way outperforming all others.

Its the competition in PvP that makes you see which classes needs adjustment, cause there are simply more ppl who care.
No fun to have no chance at all in PvP.

Now in CoX PvP had never been a big issue, its major part is PvE which is nice.
Ppl dont really care about some overpowered combos or sets cause in PvE they couldnt care less, what other play.

On the other hand the devs did feel some classes and sets were way too good in PvP if they keep the power they have in PvE, while others are way to weak in PvP.

Thats why they revamped PvP to make it more balanced (agreed its not balanced yet but better than before).

In other games the powers are the same in PvE AND PvP.

Imo the devs made powers work different in PvP to close the gap between different sets performance in PvE.

That could mean the devs are aware of certain overpowered sets or combos, but as long as they adjust them for PvP, where players really care how other players chars perform, they leave them as they are in PvE where nobody bothers about the performance of other players chars.

They nerf sets by diminishing returns and buff others by adding resists or more damg to certain powers for balance.

Longer animation time is more damg in PvP, why not in PvE too ?
Spirit shark is crazy damg in PvP but lousy in PvE, why is that ?
A PvE char suffers from long animation times too.

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Why do you think that it is so ridiculous that players use conceptual reasons to create there characters? Most of the people I know in game seam to base there characters on concept instead of playability. Many people that I have talked to in PUGs say that they choose power sets because of the look or because a certain power looked really good. They don't seam to know the best numbers for it. They want to have fun.

Reading the descriptions of SS and Willpower, the too sets seam to fit together very well, conceptually. How can you be so sure that they are all so concerned about the numbers?

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It may be true that some players rol it for concept reasons, but i doubt its the reason for most of them.

I know 12 players using that combo and they all rolled it because its great.
Maybe its only the players i know and all others do it for concept but i doubt it.. but who knows :-)

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*Blink* Then what the heck does "it's not the player, it's the set" actually mean?

By my understanding, it means "no matter what player you put behind it, the set is just as capable", which is utter poppycock, as you have just admitted.

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It means that sets and combos have a bigger impact on a toons performance than player skill.

Do you really believe and ARor Elec/dev blaster performs as well as an Fire/MM blaster if played by a player with the same skill in both sets ?

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No they dont, but WHY DOES THAT BOTHER YOU lol...... AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

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Doesnt bother me at all :-), just wanted to correct something that is false imo.

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28 Pages later and I do struggle to find more than one person swayed by the arguments of the OP, is it just possible there are no WMD to be found in either SS or WP??

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Seems that the ppl playing the game and the ppl posting in this thread have different opinions :-)

Just log in and see how many brutes playing that specific combo compared to other combos and then pls tell them they are all idiots cause that combo isnt any better than all other combos and whatever they feel how good its performance is they are wrong and you know better.....

And pls dont say they all play that combo because of visual effects or concept reason, rofl.

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*Blink* Then what the heck does "it's not the player, it's the set" actually mean?

By my understanding, it means "no matter what player you put behind it, the set is just as capable", which is utter poppycock, as you have just admitted.

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It means that sets and combos have a bigger impact on a toons performance than player skill.

Do you really believe and ARor Elec/dev blaster performs as well as an Fire/MM blaster if played by a player with the same skill in both sets ?

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Aehm you just agreed that its the set not the player :-)

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I sincerely doubt it.

Alright then, I'll get an Ill/Emp up and try the job. Since it's clearly not Rad that's winning, it must be the Illusion Control powerset that's doing it.

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PRAF mentioned in this very same thread that his Illusion/TA has done it. I know Ill/Stormies can do it too, if specced properly.

A Fire/Rad or Fire/Stormie could maybe do it too, depending on the AV I reckon.

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Not denying that at all. And while Illusion control is undoubtedly the best 'troller set for soloing AVs, I cannot believe that player skill has no impact.

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Never said player skill has no impact.
Of course player skill has impact on a toons performance.

All i said is that there are sets and combos which are good no matter how skilled player is.

And there are sets and combos which wont really shine no matter how skilled player is.

Some sets and or combos are very good even if played by a bad player while in the hands of a skilled player they become just awesome.

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Its the set.


The player may think its the player, but it is the set.

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Oh, really?

Okay, I'll go take my Rad/Psi Defender and try soloing Adamastor. My Rad powers are as good as the /Rad powers on an Ill/Rad troller, and the toon can dish out a fair amount of damage. Heck, let's make this even more fair and I'll bring along my Eng/Eng blaster, set up for dual control, and I'll try to Duo Adamastor.

I will fail.

Why? Because Even though an Ill/Rad can defeat him solo, that is a testament to the player's skill, not to the powersets involved. Sorry.

[Edit: No, I'm not saying I'm pathetic. I'm saying I'm not that good. Which, according to the poster quoted has nothing to do with it, because it's the set, not the player.]

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Aehm you just agreed that its the set not the player :-)

Apart from ill/rad there is no other troller combo that can beat an AV solo no matter how skilled the player is.
So its the set that matters.
Of course a good set isnt as good when played by a bad player, it will only be average.
But if the same bad players plays a weak set he will just suck in everything.

It comes down to :

Powerfull sets, combos in the hand of skilled players are very powerfull, while in the hands of bad players they are average.

Bad sets, combos, in the hands of skilled players CAN be average, in the hands of bad players are a joke.