JusticeBowler

What he said!

I don't see how. What else is there besides Combat Jumping, Weave, and Maneuvers?

"Critters get the benefits of the system as well."

Straight from the page you reference on Paragon Wiki in your post.

I was thinking about going over the softcap, I think I've worked this out.

Missed it. This violates my perceptions from tanking, but I trust the math more than my anecdotal memory.

Maneuvers is rough, but it would only be on when my attacks would provide little value (8 person teams) and the +Def for the team might. The funny thing about bad End requirements is that the higher the value, the more the discount, discounts. In other words, a EndRed in a power that sucks is more valuable than an EndRed in a power that doesn't use much. That actually makes the slot more valuable, paradoxically (if you have the slot to spare).

See that's what I don't want. I don't want a 300Million+ tank. And I've never needed to spend that sort of cash before. My ice/axe with SOs (even when ice sucked, though you could perma dull pain back then) could handle anything that was thrown at him. Yeah sure, defense streaks, but everything in the game outside of Lord Recluse was fine. He's well below the cap still. Part of the reason he can do this is that he doesn't *just* have defense.

I'm not sure I buy Dechs Kaison's calculations in that thread. I think the clamp causes problems with the analysis, as does the streak breaker. I'll just have to make myself a spreadsheet to check. The streak breaker is a particular problem in some of the "go 12 out of 13 swings without getting hit" stuff.

And maybe the most important is that you say AccMods for level and rank multiply together and don't add. Adding would be much worse for the player when the for values under 2. (1.1 * 1.1 = 1.21, but 1.1 + 1.1 = 2.2 yikes!)

But strangely that page never says which is true. This is critical. But it's also critical that you do some funny business with "number of times you'll get hit out of 5". Over the long haul a 10% chance to hit means 1/5th the damage taken at 50%. Recovery, Resists, and other things have to meet whatever need this poses. You don't "wait" for those hits, they might be the first ones.

The truth is, with all this other AoE mitigation, I may not need anything unless fighting a very high level AV or a Giant Monster (which the Attack Mechanics page on ParagonWiki seems to say is less troublesome than a +1 AV, but in my experience much worse).

The big problem with defense is that all damage is "burst" damage and therefore takes time to react to. When you do take damage it's a big chunk and has a possibility of crossing over certain thresholds (like the amount of HP you have left). Also a Resist tanker's "Recovery" is constantly helping him. A Defense tanker's only getting effective life expectancy assistance after the first hit.

But this isn't about how defense sucks, because there are other reasons like effective mezz protection that mean it doesn't suck.

Sometimes I get lost in the math and the application in play becomes as important. Who knows, for example, what my two teleport/attack powers will do to change the numbers on the ground. I think they favor getting the softcap because of the effective "reset" time for mobs in melee mode, would get chewed up by the fear (in other words, I would have two similar overlapping effects, but the +Def would still effectively stack).

Right now I'm thinking the main problem with fear is that it overlaps, rather than stacks, with other damage mitigation. There's too many ways to get pauses in mobs attack chains that might be in play (including my electric -End effect which seems to be more effective than in the old days).

Seems to me that the terrorize "soft hold" is still too weak.

Now the side question for bonus points is, Maneuvers or Weave or both? Especially considering a possible stack with Grant Cover. I think Dechs Kaison's point about squishies in team play points to Team +Def being more useful that previously considered.

You're assuming that I would slot it that way (I'm not sure I would slot the fear powers at all... and probably not with RecReds) and plan on continuously firing it. There's no point in firing it at all if my bar isn't dropping (except as an alpha to let my AAO charge before my AoEs). Heck, it would be dumb to fire it if I don't need it because it's going to keep me from dealing damage for a few seconds.

That's the key difference in endurance with the fighting power pool. Yes, strictly speaking the math doesn't favor it "spamming" but my brain behind the wheel to use it only when needed and then calculate which used more END over an entire mission, I bet fear would win hands down.

Tough isn't going to add much, but if I get enough IO bonuses, there's a good chance that Weave will put me at the softcap, or even a little over it. But the greater the level difference (+1s vs +3s) that softcap magic dissipates in a cloud of smoke and I'm better off with the pseudo-control of the Presence powers.

At least I think I am. Or the pool is just crap like everyone thinks it is.

I'm not trying to be difficult, I was asking for advice. I'm just pushing this as far as I can argue it. Partly because I'm testing my point and partly because I hate the idea that a power pool is "useless".