GoodHumorMan

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Thank you Posi for posting the numbers, but I think the 130,000 you quoted is light. Assuming these items are craftable, it would require a working Work table. In order to get a work table, the minimum cost is 750,000

Control rom: 100,000
Energy Room: 150,000
Workshop: 100,000
Basic Generator: 225,000
Mainframe: 150,000
Basic Work Table: 25,000
Total: 750,000

So unless all of the new items are 100% bought, not craftable, and require no power or control, the costs would be 780,000. That figure is still prohibitive for a small sg.

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Don't think they are craftable BUT I believe your costs are right if I'm right that the level 2 and level 3 take power and control. So take you 750K and add Lvl 1's 2x15K, Lvl 2's 2x30K, Lvl 3's 2x60K plus one more workshop at 100K for a total of 1.06M prestige

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Oh come on, note the emoticon. Just a gentle "elbow" there. Nudge, nudge. Know what I mean? Know what I mean?

My stomach is churning over the cost of the 8x12 plot.

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Oh I knew you were kidding. That was just my frustrated face. We can empathize as we plan our individual SG's financial futures. Is "Smith Barney" still in the investment business?

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Any people say I'm cynical. Geez.

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I don't "feel" cynical. I just see how they are being specific in their language for a reason. And honestly I REALLY don't want to have to save up for Advanced Mainframes and Advanced Generators. Thinking I might have to do that makes me sick.

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Another HUGE question. If I place my salvage/inspirations/enhancements in the storage station and an SG Base Architect sells the storage station to temporarily free up cash/space/move rooms around, what happens to the salvage/inspirations/enhancements? This is a major question requiring an answer IMO.

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Bump till this question is answered...

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Items. Plural.

[/ QUOTE ]Low-end...items. Last time I checked the low-end empowerment station and salvage rack would count as "items." If you guys go on thinking you will NOT have to pay control or power for the Lvl 2-3 items it is your own fault for failing at reading comprehension, not the Devs.

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One of the Positron interviews, I think. I'm trying to find it now.

[/ QUOTE ]No, he gave the power and control for the "lowest level empowerment station" and the "Salvage storage rack." NOT the lvl 2-3 of either variety.

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Hasn't it been stated that all of these are self-powered and require no control?

[/ QUOTE ]Where did you read THAT?

Another HUGE question. If I place my salvage/inspirations/enhancements in the storage station and an SG Base Architect sells the storage station to temporarily free up cash/space/move rooms around, what happens to the salvage/inspirations/enhancements? This is a major question requiring an answer IMO.

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Here's the current numbers in testing (subject to change):

Base Entry Room: Free
Workshop Room (2x2): 100,000p
Lowest Power Empowerment Station (requires 0 Energy, 0 Control): 15,000p
Salvage Rack (requires 0 Energy, 0 Control): 15,000p

Total Cost for working Salvage storage and a working Empowerment Station: 130,000 Prestige

EDIT: Added in Energy and Control numbers.

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Adds more questions:
1) What is the energy control cost for the Lvl 2 and Lvl 3 empowerment stations and storage units? Do they scale as badly as work stations?
2) You stated there are empowerment slots, how many per 2x2 workshop? 3x4?
3) There are empowerment slots, are there storage slots and how many per 2x2 workshop? 3x4?
4) Are there 2 or 3 storage stations? Lvl 1= Salvage and Lvl 2=Insps/Enhancements OR is it Lvl 1=Salvage, Lvl 2=Inspirations and Lvl 3=Enhancements?
5) How much will the lvl 2 and lvl 3 empowerment stations/storage items cost? (Best guess is they follow the pattern of the work stations as follows: Lvl 1 = 15K, Lvl 2 = 30K, Lvl 3 = 60K)
6) How much would it cost a small SG to have all 3 empowerment stations plus 2-3 storage stations? (Best guess is a minimum 1M prestige for 2 2x2 Workshops, 3 empowerment stations, 2-3 storage stations, basic mainframe w/room, and basic generator w/ room)
7) How much would it cost a small SG to have all 3 empowerment stations plus 2-3 storage stations, AND keep all of their existing 3 work stations, 4 teleporters, and medical facilities? (Best guess is a minimum of 6.5 million prestige for a 8x12 plot, 2-3 2x2 Workshops, 3 work stations, 3 empowerment stations, 2-3 storage stations, advanced mainframe w/room, and advances generator w/ room)

Smallest investment: 130K
Largest investment to add new functionality w/out losing current capabilities: 6.5M

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Wish there was a base portal to/from the Shard.

[/ QUOTE ]Yeah, and I'd gladly pay double my normal monthly COX fee if they would release a portal from my office to my home.

Though "personally" I don't have a lot of prestige to burn.

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It's nothing but a cyclical argumnet that will only end when things are put out there to be tested, so why doesn't everyone just chill and let's get back to PLAYING the game?

[/ QUOTE ]Because...I'm at work you see...

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So where does 3 casual players [probably less than 10hrs/wk each] fit in. I guess you need a fifth level there, puny/miniscule.

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Please don't take this as an insult but less than 4 members is a "club" not a "supergroup". Two players is a Dynamic Duo; three players is a "Superhero X and his amazing friends." To me a Supergroup is four or more players.

(As an aside, how many years would the Fantastic Four have to play COX to afford the functionality in "Freedom Four Plaza"?)

Well to start placing some scale on the table, I personally scale SG size to the following:

Small SG: 4-16 regular players*/1-2 full teams
Medium SG: 17-32 regular players/2-4 full teams
Large SG: 33-48 regular players/4-6 full teams
Huge SG: 49-75 regular players/6-9 full teams

Who agrees/doesn't agree?

*Physical players; not characters or "alts" which can make up the remaining 75 limit.

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Actually, we need to answer the question 'What kind of SG does the development team consider too small to warrant help?'

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Nope, that question does NOT provide a valid data point with which to work. Define "small SG," "level of effort," and "reasonable price." Or "X x Y = Z" where X equals the number of characters in SG mode playing an average 3 hours a night; Y equals number of nights (level of effort); and Z equaling the amount of prestige required to the new items. With data points you can determine the baseline. THEN you can make a subjective determination whether or not it is reasonable.

I think I've now been called "silly", "daft", and a "broody hen" for doubting the developer's definition of "reasonably priced" (to include item, room, power, control, and plot size). Our SG has 6-8 regular players and we have near 3 million prestige since the launch of COV. If we are their target audience AND they want a SG to have to work several weeks before they can afford these new toys (if they were starting fresh) then the total cost to deploy would be in the neighborhood of $400K.

The truth is you only value those things that have a significant (subjective term) cost to you. They have to try to balance cost with value (perceived worth). Looking at the bases now I'd say they value ANY upgrade at X10 the baseline version. This is a ridiculous scaling. If they put too much value on these new toys then their "reasonable cost" will once again be higher than the masses can stomach.

Our group is STILL saving for the 8x12 base. Problem is that we won't be able to make use of it once we get it because we are maxed out on control and power thus needing at least another 2 million (above the cost of the plot) to add the inspiration/enhancement storage device(s). So, that's another 4 months playing every night JUST to add storage. Reasonable?

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And, as I keep repeating, it's unfeasible that they could accidentally make these new features unaffordable for small SGs, which is what people seem to be fretting about. The suggestion that they could somehow have overlooked the cost of the room, or of the upkeep, is silly.

[/ QUOTE ]The problem is you are using subjective terms like "small SGs" and "unaffordable." Is 105K unaffordable to a small SG? How about 250k? How many day/weeks/months do the developers want a SG of 2/5/10 regularly playing members to have to work before they can afford such items? There are a lot of variables, devil in the details if you will, that a number of players are concerned in which the developers might have differing opinions. It is right and proper to express our concerns and expectations. It is also reasonable, not silly, to look at past history to determine future performance.

I admit it, I was wrong about the buffs being PVP only...GOOD!!!

15 minutes from creation seems a bad idea; from activation is better. If from activation, make them cost A LOT of salvage (all common stuff).

I'm not convinced these items will be able to go in just any room. Positron specifically avoided answering that question.

I'd buy a raid teleporter if it allowed the team to use it to go straight to the mission door (or better yet IN the mission door) though this would make ambushes while traveling (Darn you Indigo!!!) less of a threat (Can you call a contact while in your base? Not sure I ever tried that).

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Prepare for battle in your deadly lair.
Get dressed for an interview in your bedroom.
Rehearse for a play in your sitting room.
Read about wild animals in your bed.

Get the idea?

[/ QUOTE ]Sure but it is a preposition at the end of a sentence which can lead to confusion like this. They should have said "Have you ever wished you could throw together in your deadly lair some powerful instant buffs to prep for battle?" That does not limt the word "buffs" to "in your deadly lair" like the current version does.

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Look, you have to be IN your base to USE the crafting tables that are located IN your base.

It doesn't necessarily mean that's where the battle is going to take place.

For the "small SG buffs" to be PvP only would go beyond bad design and enter the realm of sublime anti-logic.

[/ QUOTE ]If you are right, they worded it HORRIBLY. A simple red name coming on saying this will not be PVP only would take all of 10 seconds. But right now the way I read it is just as correct as the way you hope they meant it.

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Assuming that they are geared to PvP is silly at best.

Edit: Re-reading the artical... There was nothing in there at all that said the temp powers would be used only for base PvP encounters.

[/ QUOTE ]Read again...

"Have you ever wished you could throw together some powerful instant buffs to prep for battle in your deadly lair? Now you can prepare for a fight with Empowerment Stations."

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Any chance I7 has a reduction of the bi-weekly "tax" that you nail us with? That would help tremendously.

[/ QUOTE ]pay it every 4 weeks, not when the announcement comes up and you get your extension.

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Mid sized SG's on the lower end, ones that have filled up a 8x8 plot may have trouble fitting everything new into their base, without changing things. But considering what you can fit into a 8x8 plot, there should be no need to upgrade.

You may need to change your base layout some, but there shouldn't be a need to upgrade.

[/ QUOTE ]I disagree. We require 4 teleporters to access 7 zones, 1 room each for medical equipment, power, control, and, if you stay in theme, 3 workbenches. Unless you subscribe to the mini/maxer's belief that simly buy the workbench you need then sell it again you need 2x2x2 or 3x4 (same for telepads). Our SG fits in the lower end of the mid size SGs and we do NOT want to buy/sell/buy/sell/buy/sell to make best use of our space (not very JLA like is it?). It is highly LIKELY that these new items will require new rooms. If that is the case, they should lower the cost of the 8x12 plot to something reasonable. Storage will likely require a room (as pictures indicate). Same with tempt powers (as pictures indicate). There is NO reason to assume it would be otherwise as every other item fits into its own room.

As an aside, you might note that they used specific language that indicated temp powers would ONLY be for in base PVP encounters. Once again, something for a very small subset of players that we then wouldn't need. Storage yes, temp powers for in base PVP encounters...never.

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If you've stuck with the "lots of 2x2 rooms, all alike" model for a small PvE base, you should have a spare place to plunk down a 2x2 room for the storage items.

[/ QUOTE ]Nope, we are have a fully functional PvE base with two 3x4 rooms (workshop and tp). In a perfect world, they'd let me add these new toys to the HUGE room I already have.

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Just so you all realize, the prices Lektrik wrote are completely made up.

Everything in this issue will be "reasonably priced". It doesn't make sense for us to set out to help small supergroups and then charge large supergroup Prestige for the items.

[/ QUOTE ]But, just so you know, unless these items can go into existing rooms supported by the 8x8 plot it WILL cost 1.65M + new room + item. I'm just saying...

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31 Flavors's (Guardian) new Med Unit; now with Auto-Doc:

Med Unit

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That looks great, and the walls look good with those wall cabinets. That must have taken a while--it looks like there are at least a couple hundred!

[/ QUOTE ]Probably close to 120 (good thing they only cost 100 prestige). We wanted a different look that said sterile. I also loved how the cabinets picked up the light. We really had to tone the lighting down to keep it from being overpowering. Also the desks are a little too forward. You can't tell in this picture but there are matching vents on the other wall. The illusion is suppose to be one of the med unit being able to be placed behind a containment field.