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I think they announced it prematurely because they are worried about losing people to DC and Champs. They are trying to give us something BIG to get people to stick around. Unfortunetly I don't think i16 will be out for 4-6 months.

Love to be wrong though.

[/ QUOTE ]I think they "leaked" the announcement simply to quell the uproar of people battling over the MA controversy. It virtually shut all that talk down and got everyone in a tizzy over the new expansion. I have a feeling we won't see Going Rogue this year.

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I think that you're on to something as far as their intent but I don't think it really worked all that well. All the threads about changes to the MA still have a lot of bitterness and vitriol and upset people but they're getting modsmacked so regularly, it may only seem that the talk has died down.

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I like the level cap right where it is, thank you! Don't ever raise it! I also think, though I could be wrong about this, that those who want the level cap raised also secretly still play WoW! I tried WoW, after the Burning Crusade Expansion came out, just to see what all the hype about WoW, at that time, was about, but I grew bored very fast! In fact, none of my characters in that game ever even made it to level 15, before I got bored and deleted WoW from my computer!

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The last thing I would want is for my Level 50s to suddenly not be as super as they were before and raising the cap would do just that. Personally, I like the idea of extra slots you can earn in a post-50 game. I also think it would be cool to allow post-50 players to earn signature powers and a little global resistance as per Hero & Archvillain resistances. While I'm not a big fan of unlocked costume pieces - I like my hero to look how I want him or her to look out of the gate - I wouldn't strongly object to some small collection of special costume pieces that were only available to level 50s as rewards for certain missions or arcs.

Of course, these things would have to be balanced for AT and ultimate effect on the game but I would like it if the goal was not an arbitrary level increase but an increase in raw power. While I realize there might be undesirable elements to making it so just any hero could stand toe-to-toe with an AV and win, would it really be game destroying to opening up that narrow field just a little when people have put the time and energy into their characters to maximize their potential? Considering the comic genre, I always kind of hate it that you have to get a gang of heroes together (if you're not in the AV-slaying elite) to pound a single archvillain into submission. It just never feels very heroic.

And while downgrading AV to EB status is a viable option for solo heroics, apparently there are people and ATs out there that have trouble with this as well. Depending on the EB, I can manage it with most any AT but usually only my scrappers can do it without beaucoup inspirations.

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I think they announced it prematurely because they are worried about losing people to DC and Champs. They are trying to give us something BIG to get people to stick around. Unfortunetly I don't think i16 will be out for 4-6 months.

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Actually, I think that time frame is probably about right and on the early end of that range (4 months) would release about the same time as CO, if that game manages to keep their latest release date.

I know there are some folks who think DCUO is going to make it out this year but I'm thinking CoH has close to another year to worry about that competition. Even with the customization options in CO, I think City of Heroes will survive that hit. I'm not sure they will survive the DCUO if the game is the best of the three.

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3) I hope the moral compass is something that can be utilized from Paragon City or the Rogue Isles without going to Praetoria. A character should be able to make these decisions without interdimensional travel.

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Based on this paragraph from the press release, I think you will only be able to alter your moral compass in Praetoria:

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In the Going Rogue expansion, hero and villain characters will become immersed in the new parallel universe known as Praetoria, which is governed by Tyrant™, the evil incarnation of the game's main protagonist, Statesman™. As gamers search for Tyrant and the rest of his Praetorian guard, implacable foes and fierce resistance will arise to face them from all sides, causing heroes and villains alike to question their loyalties.

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Emphasis mine. It's just simpler for the Devs this way; they don't have to work new contacts/arcs/missions into the existing Cities, and if you're playing purely Blue or Red side you have no chance to Fall or be Redeemed.

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While no specifics are springing to mind (at work, not home), there already are a few missions on both sides that seem to exist in morally gray areas. They could be modified slightly to give or subtract points on the moral compass.

Also, while it is true that AE may not effect the moral compass as it is just a simulation, enabling it to do so would be a good way to facilitate side-switching in the prime dimension. I'd almost have to believe that running villianous mission after villanous mission in a highly realistic virtual environment probably would have some ramifications on the psyche and vice versa. I don't think it would be a huge stretch to have the MA missions have some effect on the moral compass.

All that said, you're probably right that it will work exactly how I fear it will work. Seems to be par for the course.

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Random thoughts based upon minimal information...

1) For the side-switching/moral compass element (which admittedly has never been terribly important to me), I still would have rather seen a "City of Vigilantes" boxed set that added a fully realized third faction to the mix with it's own locations, contacts, and ATs. Sure, Praetoria may serve as a starting location in the game but it's not yet clear and I suspect we're not getting 5 more ATs. So far, it sounds like the line between good and evil will be a thin one.

2) If you can't play a villainous character on the blue side from Level 1 (and vice versa), I sincerely hope this addition doesn't mean an end to power proliferation. While becoming a redeemed villain or fallen hero may work for some character concepts, there are still a number of powers I'd like to see ported over from one side to the other. For example, if I want electric melee and electric armor on blue side, I may not want to have to switch sides to get it there.

3) I hope the moral compass is something that can be utilized from Paragon City or the Rogue Isles without going to Praetoria. A character should be able to make these decisions without interdimensional travel.

4) I really, really hope we're getting a massive graphics upgrade with this expansion. I'd love to see all the "with skin" options get an upgrade to booster pack quality as well as just seeing some depth added to the game and character models. I've been looking at these same city vistas for 5 years. A new place to go is always cool but getting to look at places I've been in a new way is just as cool.

5) Actually, it's probably long overdue for a whole revamp of the character creator with some major upgrades to the costumes and accessories. It'd be nice to see some long requested asymmetrical design choices (like Desdamona's single-garter thing) as well as some separate slots added (like for arms, legs, neck, etc.) added to this mother. While it may be a matter of taste, the coming competition this year and next will likely have some superior elements to their costume creators so there is no reason not to nix that potential edge now.

6) I always suspected that a new paid expansion might be the best time to push forward with some power customization options. As I'd said before, I don't think CO is going to be much in the way of competition but with DCUO on the horizon, I think working it in becomes imperative.

7) A paid expansion shows some commitment to this version of the game and I do like that. Honestly, I hope there never is a City of Heroes 2. I'd much rather see this game evolve as the years go by: Drop some enemy groups and introduce some new ones. Revamp some familiar zones in major ways. Defeat the Rikti once and for all. Kill off Statesman. The existence of Ouroboros could always allow for old missions/task forces from deactivated contacts to continue. Moreover, there could be paths to deactivate zones in Ouroboros, allowing players to visit the RWZ "in the past" if the Rikti were ever ultimately defeated.

Right now, I'm not feeling terribly excited about "Going Rogue" in and of itself but I am excited about the prospect of shaking things up a little. At least this may be a step in that direction.

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Follow up:

Switched to a 3-level tech map even though I hated it for purposes of the story I had planned. The map I'm using has 3 Middle and 2 Back spots for Rescues, Escorts, etc and I have 3 escorts (1 Middle, 2 Back) that I'm setting up to spawn off of a Collection (Wall, Front) on the first floor.

The Wall Collection is spawning fine but I'm still getting Middle and Back spawns for the escorts turning up at the front. I mean, like spitting distance from the entrance. If that isn't the front, then what the [censored] is the front?

Every time this happens, I'm going to bug it. Since it seems to happen like every test I do, I may make a macro.

In all seriousness, I'm getting very, very, very frustrated with the MA. Seems great if you just want to fun some simplified version of the dev-developed missions (mess of enemies, mess of collections, go!) but if you want a progression of events to happen, this is simply NOT working.

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I've never asked for this before but since I've heard a few other people complain about it, I figured it was worth a shot.

I semi-regularly delete my chat tabs and leave channels on accident. I don't know why this happens but usually its in the midst of a battle and I do have most of my movements mapped through my mouse. I prefer this method to free up my left hand for attacking and I've gotten very used to it. I know this may be a little me-centric but I have heard other people say it happens to them as well. It is really annoying.

An optional tab lock and prompt for leaving channels would be really, really nice.

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Not all maps have defined "Front" "Middle" "Back" zones.

Yes its a pain to find the ones that do.

(None of the outdoor maps do, and very few of the single level maps do. Its seems to be somewhat consistant tho that multi level maps have each floor tagged as one of the zones).

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So the issue is that whomever was in charge of breaking down the map areas for the players is just a huge, incompetent tool? Every map I tried this on supposedly had multiple "middle" areas. That means that they didn't just mess up on a map here or there but basically messed up on all of them?

There may be a reason that I don't want to use a multi-level map story-wise so if there is no defined middle area for a single-level map, I need to know so I don't waste my time. Still broken if you ask me.

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I may send the actual suggestion part to that board but the MA is not working as intended with regard to placing bosses and collection items in the middle of the map. I'm using Longbow maps, many of which are pretty straight in their layouts and anything placed in the middle invariably ends up in the last room of the layout. There are middle collection and spawn spots and they apparently can't be used. That says broken to me.

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I've been mostly tinkering with the MA since it came out. I was aware of these problems in beta and logged them there but hoped it wouldn't be rushed out. I just don't find the system all that wonderful when it won't do what it says it will do. I understand that I'm probably not the only one to complain about:

If I pick a map with 15 middle wall collection spots, I want the ONE wall collection item to show up in the middle of the map. Not the front and not the back. I want the middle. I don't want to spend literal hours just trying to find a map where my progression of events will work.

Also, front, back, and middle can be pretty vague. A lot of maps branch out in many directions making it unclear where the middle and back begins and ends. Could these areas be color coded or something? Could the individual spawn spots be marked? Could we actually (gasp) get to pick a spot for our item or boss or what have you?

I know you can work around it and that sometimes working with limitations in an endeavor can make for some ingenious developments. However, this is just broken. It doesn't work and it's starting to feel more grindy than anything else in this game trying to make it work. Please, my kingdom for a fix.

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PS I don't actually have a kingdom.

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Growth Defensive set -- I wanna be 40' tall!
Shrinking Defensive set -- I'm 1/8th of an inch tall!
Mapserver Control
Omnipotence -- Nothing can harm me; one hit defeat for anything!
Wall Crawling
Swing Lines
Super Speed Swimming

EDIT: I should note that at least some of those are available as a Dev, but my live account sure doesn't have 'em!

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Emphasis mine. Serious investigation should be done to move both of those power possibilities out of the unlikely category.

On a Growth power related note: How large of a humanoid structure can be maintained in the game? I know players would never get it - it would be effectively nullified indoor - but I would love to see a time travel mission where we got to see Atlas in action. If the Devs won't do it, give us the power to make GM-sized custom critters when/if GMs get added back to the MA.

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Me thinks you're overreacting.

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Well we each have our opinions. And my opinion is that I'm done. I've already spent $40 on "boosters". There is no real new end game content. There is no real new low level content. Sure you could argue that I14 brings low and high level content, but not really. It's short missions with almost no reward that isn't even created by NCSoft, but other players.

There is practically nothing different from the game now compared to the game I started playing 3 years ago. Yet what has my $40 got me? A few superficial costumes.

My point is that they used to give us new costumes as part of the new content. Now we have to pay for every... single... one...

Death of a thousand papercuts.

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My only real gripe with the booster packs (and it's a small one) is the price. Considering that full expansions for MMOs have traditionally sold in the range of $20-$40, I do balk a little at paying half to a quarter that much for some very narrowly themed costumes, emotes, and a special power. They're cool and all that, but I think something like $3.99 is more reasonable and fair for what you actually get.

Think about it: The booster packs have no store presence so there is no packaging or manufacturing. They're only advertised on the website as far as I know so there is very little outlay for that. Aside from the man hours put into to the design and development of the items, emotes, and powers, I can't really think of what other expenses there are for these booster packs. I have to imagine that the profit margin is pretty sweet.

Again, it's a pretty small gripe and I do have to flatly disagree with your assertion that you're paying for all your costumes. You very clearly are not. I'll likely buy the others coming down the pike as well...but I am aware that I'm being gouged just a little bit.

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The costume changes - an absolute brilliant addition to the game. I love all of them but I have many questions:

1) Since these were all essentially magic-themed, can we get some more themed ones with the additional booster packs? And some tech-themed changes added retroactively for the owners of the cyborg booster pack?

2) Can it be fixed where a weapon draw doesn’t mess up the transition? I have a couple characters where the transformation is supposed to be linked to a magic weapon.

3) Some elemental changes (fire, ice, etc.) would be nifty. Sounds like a good addition for the mutation booster pack.

4) *DELETED* Answer is here!

5) Assuming that (4) is not possible, can it be made so a default can be set per character and will activate if any of the /cc commands are used?

6) Can it be made so that the changes can be set per character? It seems like it carries over on the account and I didn’t like having to change it each time from character to character.

Thanks for listening!

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Will we be able to use Giant Monsters like babbage in our Mission Archs?

[/ QUOTE ] Not at the moment. They're thinking of allowing giant monsters in outdoor maps in version two, which means an update at some point after MA goes live. But at release, there will be no giant monsters.

We'll likely never be able to use GMs on indoor missions.

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A version of Jurassik is encountered in a cave during Numina's Task Force and although it is de-powered to mere monster status, I believe that it is scaled the same as the giant monster version. All a long way to say that if the devs can put giant-sized critters in their indoor missions, then I'd like to be able to do it as well.

If doing so causes something map-breaking or creates an exploit, then I would definitely want to see the kinks worked out first. However, if the problem is merely one of clipping, then I say allow it and let the system work as designed. I know that I'd probably one-star even a decent story arc if a creator were so foolish as to place a GM in small room where it just couldn't realistically fit.

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I'm half-day tomorrow at work so I really need open beta to start today since I can sleep in tomorrow. Okay?

:::holds breath:::

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I very nearly died. Thanks CoH.

All kidding aside, isn't this kind of long for a closed beta? Isn't it usually like "2 weeks closed, 2 weeks open" or am I misremembering? I'm starting to wonder if I14 will be live in March at all...

EDIT: Wow, I was way off. It looks like I13 spent almost two full months getting through the betas before going live. If the schedule is similair, at least next week is looking pretty good.

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I'm half-day tomorrow at work so I really need open beta to start today since I can sleep in tomorrow. Okay?

:::holds breath:::

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Wow. This actually took me by surprise. I wasn't really expecting Beta til around April.

Good job Devs...as always. Contrary to the select few that have beef with ya'll, I think you guys do great work at trying to get us subscribers what we want.

Mmmm, beef sammiches

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Since issue 15 is suppose to be out in April....I think closed beta for issue 14 in April would be a little strange.

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You keep saying April but I really think the focus of most the past anniversary stuff was late April (the game's release) to late May. If they miraculously get I15 live by the end of May, I guarantee they will say they reached their goal of coinciding it with the game's 5 year anniversary.

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Reasons why I should be in the closed beta...by Attache:

1. I'm very tight-lipped.

2. I'm usually on time.

3. I'm really, really, really, really bored with Snaptooth.

Love,

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It all sounds great -- I'm thinking both Shield/SS and MA/Shields as options for alts. Possibly even a Pain Domination villain.

But... conspicuously absent from this announcement is any mention of further powerset proliferation. Does that mean there simply won't be any this time? I hope that's not the case, since the talk leading up to the Issue 12 release definitely made it sound like proliferation would be an every-issue type of thing.

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Originally, PP was not scheduled for 13. Then, it was added as a Stretch Goal ("If you have extra time...") At this point, it isn't terribly likely, but who knows? Maybe there won't be any bugs in Beta!

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Spring 2009, the niche gets a little more crowded. Not saying that it is going to all that and a bag of chips...just saying that you should make the time. Good luck.

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My SG leader over on Virtue is a pretty talented artist and I'd finally worn him down enough to consider taking commissions. I knew I wanted a homage cover and as we are a fairly committed Silver Age super team, something evoking the JLA seemed the best route. After some brief instruction, he came up with this:

Homage Awesomeness!

What a few people have found perplexing is neither of my characters in the SG are in this piece. I really just wanted to do something nice for some of the team members and neither of them seemed to fit in as well as some of the others.

You can find the All Star Sentinels of America over at Guildportal and if you hunt around a bit, you'll see Doc's price list. I think he's easing into this slowly and carefully but if you're interested in a commission, he does quick work and seems to be able to imitate a variety of styles. I highly recommend him.

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Champions Online *is* going to do it. Full power customization better happen really quick for this game's sake. You have competition now.

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Champions Online could end up postphoned or vaporware. I've seen enough games with great potential cancelled that I'm not going to get excited until I see pre-sale box and probably not even then.

And while color changes are a huge enough step in the right direction where I'll gladly give CO a try, I want to see the superhero MMO that gives me some animation selection and firing points for blasts. I want to decide if my fire beam comes out of my character's eyes, hands, mouth, or ray gun. When a MMO delivers that, I'm there.

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Honestly, I'd say don't waste your time on power customization, just keep giving us the awesome stuff you always have been instead of breaking your brain over how to make it work, or stressing over people asking for it all the time.

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While I'm not convinced that the coming competition will be all that and a bag of chips, the fact that it is (likely) coming makes unbaking those powers a priority. There are enough players who want power customization that could cause severe financial problems for this game should they decide to spend their MMO dollar somewhere else. That is a fact that will need to be addressed, sooner rather than later.

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Cause once you figure out how to make every power's color tintable so you can have green energy blasts but black energy fists, it will be accepted just like weapon customization was, but then "those" people will show up. What about the people who want to shoot fireballs out of their eyes? Or the guy who wants to have fly look like he's skating around on ice? Or the girl who wants a swordfish katana that uses fencing animations?

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While there will certainly always be completely ridiculous individualized requests (I remember a few people bemoaning the fact they couldn't recreate their family's personal tartan when kilts were introduced), having a choice of animations, firing points, flying styles should be the ultimate goal of this genre of MMO. In another couple short years, it will be the customer expectation.

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Doug, your stuff gets better and better. I really need to save some nickels and dimes and dollars and put you to work on one of my characters sometime before this game goes the way of the dodo - though I'm hoping that doesn't happen for a long, long time.

Plan B: So, um...do you want to join another SG on Virtue?

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Fantastic guide! Still, I have questions...

I see people perform these flawless power+costume change combos but when I try different ones using guides like this, it always seems like my costume change happens well before the "sweet spot" of the activation and ends up looking kind of lame. Is this one of those things where other players aren't seeing what you're seeing and there is a delay in the costume change when viewed from the 'outside'? Or is there a way to cause a delay in the costume change activation (aside from binding to two different keys) to make it work better with certain powers? My BS scrapper has a delay in her Build Up because she draws her sword before it activates. I'd love to tie the costume change into that power but the only way to do it and have it look "right" is to hit Build Up and then try to time the change to the right moment.

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((QR))

Sorry guys but I'm at a loss. I can say with some degree of authority that it doesn't seem like public posting is helpful either. I can certainly understand wanting something you've earned but I think complaining about it publicly runs the risk of making one seem ungrateful. I just think pursing this via emails and PMs is the way to go. Posting in the forums is essentially useless unless you believe dozens of us are going to take up the cause. I'm sorry but I don't see that happening.

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