Another_Fan
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Posts
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Quote:Facts are what they want them to beOriginally Posted by SinergyX_EU
I dont have the exact numbers of the game as of 'cancel date', but there are few out there that had a consirable big playerbase when they shut down. They lost the title 'non-forced cancel of subscribed based', that title seems to be still in hands of Tabula (or maybe original APB, who was sub-based when they closed in 2010 - though got a f2p relaunch by G1).
Apart from that, in the f2p section there are quite a few big titles, like Dragon Sky and localised Rose Online (2 bankrupt, 1 global closure), no idea what their numbers were though but they were considered as games with a rather large playerbase (unlike other f2p games with 10k to 15k players). -
Quote:Originally Posted by Starsman
Fraud is a crime, and also a civil law violation. Defrauding people or entities of money or valuables is a common purpose of fraud.
The fact that he won the civil case pretty much makes them guilty of fraud at the civil level. Does not mean it's an automatic criminal win (no one goes to jail) but they ended up being guilty of it at a level where they had to compensate the affected party (Garriot.)
Not sure if they used the word fraud in the case, but even if the word was not used in the civil case you have to ignore the meaning of the word and the reason of the lawsuit to say NCSoft was not guilty of civil fraud.
In the United States, common law recognizes nine elements constituting fraud:
1. a representation of an existing fact (he was claimed to quit)
2. its materiality (he lost his job, had to execute options way too early)
3. its falsity (he didnt quit)
4. the speaker's knowledge of its falsity (they knew he did not quit)
5. the speaker's intent that it shall be acted upon by the plaintiff (deprive him of his options)
6. the plaintiff's ignorance of its falsity (here is where the PR letter comes into place, it was just for PR but NCSoft used it as a resignation letter)
7. the plaintiff's reliance on the truth of the representation (dont know enough of the case, guess the fact that he simply never quit in any way?)
8. the plaintiff's right to rely upon it; and (dont know enough of the case nor legal system to know how this fit, but I guess his right is the fact that it was the truth.)
9. consequent damages suffered by the plaintiff (lots of millions of dollars lost)
Seeing as I know you commented on the documents that were presented.
I have to ask why are you misrepresenting the matter ?
or Did you comment without actually reading them ? -
Quote:There is only one side. There is no "Legion of Doom" that has supersecret message boards where they gather and plan. There are just random people that are looking at what the Titan people are saying and their reply is "Go on pull the other one"Originally Posted by Thunder Knight
No. Neutral and impartial means not taking a side. In other words, it means not saying "Those who speak words of weal must be prophets, and surely this is the Great Resurgence that was fortold! The game be truly saved!", but also not saying "All those Titan people are, at best, foolish daydreamers, and, at worst, completely insane! Ignore everything they say!"
Both sides are extreme. Neither one is "neutral".
Well if there is they DIDN'T INVITE MEEEEEEEEEEEEE !!!! WAHHH
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Quote:Losing a civil lawsuit doesn't make you guilty of fraud.Originally Posted by Chad Gulzow-Man
They got sued over the Garriot event, lost, then counter-sued and lost again. Whether what they felt they were doing was "legitimate business" or was legal in Korea or not is irrelevant, because it didn't fly at either trial.
Like I said, this whole situation has reeked of them trying to cover their butts to avoid another such lawsuit from day one. But I'm not a lawyer (much less a trans-continental IP lawyer) anyway, so I'm not in a position to really comment on legalese mumbo-jumbo. -
Quote:Sounds about right.Originally Posted by Gangrel_EU
Depends on how you define it...
NC NorCal was set up at the time of CoX purchase from Cryptic (so late 2007). This was later renamed to Paragon Studios in April 2009.
So between 3 and 5 years, depends on which side you want to take. -
Quote:Dark Astoria always had a few people just not very many.Originally Posted by Twisted Toon
I participated in the Incarnate content. You wouldn't find me, or the other players with Incarnated characters I ran with, in the iTrials though. We hung out in Dark Astroia where we could actually have fun with the Incarnate stuff our way and not the not so fun (for us) iTrial way.
I'm fairly sure that we weren't alone in that either. So, you might want to think about the logic (or lack there of) in that argument and try again. -
Quote:Originally Posted by Brillig
Liar liar, Nemesis on fire!In English what he is saying is if you were neutral and impartial you would agree with everything the people he identifies with are saying. Since you don't you are the antichrist.Quote:Originally Posted by TimTheEnchanter
Repeated again, since you apparently missed it the first time.
Were it true that you have no side, your position would be far more neutral. -
Quote:Paragon studios as an entity isn't that old. They got set up as their own entity no more than 3 or 4 years ago. Less I think.Originally Posted by GadgetDon
There are investments that can be set up to generate losses way above the original investment. In the US most of those have been banned, it's conceivable that they may still be legal in Korea.
But you have to set them up from the start. Having an existing business that's been bringing in profit as opposed to losses, and shelving it, won't work for those tricks. -
Quote:Just how much were you paid to astroturf ? I mean it's not like the scoring system did much of anything about custom critters in AE (Looks at all the s/l and fire characters that were made)Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Saying stupid things for free does not automatically grant the moral authority to accuse others of being paid to do so.
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Quote:Damn not using those terms was brought up at the last "Legion of Doom (TM)" meeting and we tabled the idea, they were just too descriptive.Originally Posted by TimTheEnchanter
With the number of times I've seen the word "insane" and other similar psychological terms about mental illness thrown around by your side, your high ground sunk into the depths of the Earth long ago.
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Quote:In other words god forbid anyone hear dissent from the Titan insanity.Originally Posted by TimTheEnchanter
Unfortunately, that's not why there's been all this bickering. The problem is, there are people who use these forums and don't use Titan-network who might be interested in hearing the latest news. Someone posts the news here. The harpies descend on it and try to inject their infinite pessimism into anyone who dares to give CoH even a 1% chance at a rebirth.
So unless EVERYONE ignores them, Titan is pretty much posting news here only to have the threads 'deleted' by the inverse morale police. -
Quote:You must hate the Titan crew then. They all knew this game was healthy and would go on.Originally Posted by TimTheEnchanter
No, only those who act like they're holding the crystal ball.
So not only did they act like they were holding the crystal ball. They were wrong. -
Quote:It turned out that under Korean law his acceptance of the letter could be construed the way NCsoft presented it.Originally Posted by TimTheEnchanter
You saying that in Korean terms, it wasn't fraud?
Here is the weird thing. I am fairly certain I saw you participating in that thread why cant you remember the stuff that contradicted your position but I can remember the stuff that contradicts mine ? -
Quote:You are a Korean Tax Accountant ?Originally Posted by GadgetDon
You do know that the Batman IP may have not appeared in tv or movies but was appearing in print that whole time it was "laying fallow". More importantly, the history of Warner Brothers is such that its reasonable to believe in the future Warner Brothers will be able to make money from a superhero movie or tv show.
As compared to NCSoft, who has no history of ever making anything from the IP of the games it shuts down, and by their failure to promote the game in their primary market makes it unlikely they'd be able to make a profit with that IP in the future.
And there is no accounting trick that makes CoH worth more as a loss to NCSoft than a sale.
Edit: I have seen lots of tricks in the U.S. code where it could be of great benefit to have a loss. Admittedly most tax shelters are gone but they were very good for a very long time. -
Quote:That seems to be the consensus here. Then again most of the people posting it don't run billion dollar gaming companies.Originally Posted by Talionis
Throwing something away and not letting anyone else have it, when you could get something for it, isn't in their best interests either.
Their best interest is having an auction and auctioning it off to the highest bidder. The IP will only be worth even less once the game is completely dead.
Here is a little thought for you. The Batman IP actually became more valuable after laying fallow in terms of television and movies. It needed distance from what it was so it could become something new.
Anyway a simpler explanation is that CoH is worth more as a loss to NCsoft than it is as a sale. -
Quote:Is everyone that disagrees with you an ******* ?Originally Posted by TimTheEnchanter
Supporting my edit.
What do you think that says about you ? -
Quote:Keep repeating that. Maybe you will even believe it's true. Hell I thought so as well before someone dug up the case information and it turned out it was due to differences in Korean and U.S. Law.Originally Posted by Chad Gulzow-Man
On one hand, we've already seen that NCSoft is capable of this as part of the Tabula Rasa scandal.
On the other, they've shown that they're terrified of it happening again (or at least getting caught), so who knows if it's something that any potential buyers of CoH will have to deal with?
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Quote:I started a little less than 5 years ago then.Originally Posted by TimTheEnchanter
That could easily be the intent.
Like feeling a breakup is imminent so you start picking fights with your mate. Then in the end you don't feel so bad about it because, "You weren't getting along anyway." -
Quote:Can you comprehend how hard I am laughing at the assumptions contained in your post ?Originally Posted by GreatRock
Let me ask you something... what do you get from acting the way you have? You aren't convincing anyone, you know. You're actively cutting your ties to this community, one person at a time.
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Quote:If it were still a user option I would change my forum name to Emanuel Goldstein. Shame to spoil the staging.Originally Posted by GreatRock
/em applause
You tell 'em, Tony! -
Quote:The anonymous comments I used to get when we had that were completely off the wall. They made the stuff being tossed around the boards now look completely tame by comparison.Originally Posted by BrandX
I think when we had "Rate this poster" as an option, it showed how cliquish the forum posters could be, buuut, I'd say CoH has had, overall, one of the best forum communities in an MMO.
WoW. TERA. Now there's some lousy forum communities for you.
The in game community was no different.
This community had/has an incredible amount of things that it knows but is absolutely completely wrong and it is amazing how stonewalling they are about it.
A good example is the unwillingness to even rationally discuss the idea that the devs weren't addressing game problems in anything approaching the time frames needed. You had people willing to use the development cycle as an excuse for not getting to bugs until years after they had been found in beta. Every excuse in the world would be made. In the end having problems in the game for such long periods and then fixing them in a way that just aggravated players took its toll. -
Quote:Originally Posted by TonyV
Long post for TonyV just going to shoot for the easy points.So when you agree to the EULA you think your word is worthless and you can set it aside at will ?Quote:
Another steaming pile of BS. I have repeatedly stated that I do not condone any illegal activities--to the point where it's actually been published in interviews with me:
So what specific law do you think we're ignoring? The law against reverse engineering? I hate to jerk you back to the real world like this, but that law doesn't exist because reverse engineering is legal. Not only legal, but it is explicitly a fair use exemption to copyright and patent law. Or is it the law against copyright/trademark infringement? Put up or shut up. You link any reference to me indicating that we're going to infringe on NCsoft's IP. I can tell you ahead of time, you can't because I've consistently said the exact opposite. I've taken very deliberate pains to ensure that none of our planning involves IP infringement. Here's the latest of many times I've addressed the issue specifically.
So yeah, remind me again which law don't I like, which ones I'm ignoring and/or encouraging other people to ignore? How do you think we're robbing people? And be specific, because make no mistake: I'm calling you out on this. Don't give me this "someone said something at some point" BS. I want to know when I have ever asked or encouraged someone to violate the law. -
Quote:I dont doubt that. The problem wasn't generosity with merits it was limits on how you could use them. In a game that only requires 10 or 20 pieces of more or less generic gear it would have been fine. In a game that required 100 pieces of specialized gear that had to fitted together in a particular pattern, not so much.Originally Posted by Starsman
Well, we will have to agree to disagree big time. Without merits I would not be playing this game (they could have been more generous with them, I admit, but was WAY better than the state before.)
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Quote:Overall bad at the very least not good enough.Originally Posted by Starsman
Are you proposing merits were good or bad?
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Quote:It is posts like yours why I could never consider myself part of the forum community. The in game community was wonderful the forum community insular and totalitarian.Originally Posted by MrLiberty
Long set of personal attacks.