Yeah, the main problem with Shadow Punch is opportunity cost, which is now lessened.
Adding a Shadow Punch at the end of the top chain will lower your DPS perhaps 3%. But as long as you're willing to just spam your heal when necessary, and can afford another attack, I think Shadow Punch is a good way of reducing your recharge requirements. Looks like it's just what you need. Midnight Grasp in 5.54 seconds and Smite in 2.24 seconds are your targets. Shouldn't be any problem reaching those.
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Smite is sitting at 1.998s and Dark Blast at 1.798s, guess I should have included that.
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I have to ask, what exactly is slotted into SL and MG? are they both 6 slotted already? because you would likely be better off trying to get more recharge into the both of them and just using MG-Smite-SL-Smite. Your listed Smite recharge is fine for that chain, just need to lower MG to 4.488, or about 4.5 seconds. So you just need to shave 0.35 seconds off your MG recharge and you are good for that attack chain. Heck, depending on Latency, you are likely good as is.
If you are trying to find a way to get less recharge in your build, then SP could work, but really, most of my builds don't have slots to spare, so even with I19, I really can't pick up another attack, generally just going to be adding stuff like LOTG mules or whatnot.
edit: Basically SP does less dps then any of the attacks you said that you had, including Dark Blast. So unless you can't make a solid attack chain out of the attacks you have, adding SP won't help you.
Quote:
What total recharge is needed on Siphon Life for that chain?
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Originally Posted by Vysires
I have to ask, what exactly is slotted into SL and MG? are they both 6 slotted already? because you would likely be better off trying to get more recharge into the both of them and just using MG-Smite-SL-Smite. Your listed Smite recharge is fine for that chain, just need to lower MG to 4.488, or about 4.5 seconds. So you just need to shave 0.35 seconds off your MG recharge and you are good for that attack chain. Heck, depending on Latency, you are likely good as is.
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Quote:
Shadow Punch, Smite, and Siphon Life are all slotted with:|
Originally Posted by Vysires
I have to ask, what exactly is slotted into SL and MG? are they both 6 slotted already?
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- 1)Kinetic Combat: Acc/Dmg
2) Kinetic Combat: Dmg/End
3) Kinetic Combat: Dmg/Rch
4) Kinetic Combat: Dmg/End/Rch
5) Crushing Impact: Acc/Dmg/Rec
6) Empty
Midnight's Grasp is slotted with:
- 1) Hecatomb: Dmg
2) Hecatomb: Dmg/Rch
3) Hecatomb: Acc/Rch
4) Hecatomb: Dmg/End
5) Hecatomb: 33% Chance for Neg Dmg
6) Empty
Quote:
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because you would likely be better off trying to get more recharge into the both of them and just using MG-Smite-SL-Smite. Your listed Smite recharge is fine for that chain, just need to lower MG to 4.488, or about 4.5 seconds. So you just need to shave 0.35 seconds off your MG recharge and you are good for that attack chain. Heck, depending on Latency, you are likely good as is. If you are trying to find a way to get less recharge in your build, then SP could work, but really, most of my builds don't have slots to spare, so even with I19, I really can't pick up another attack, generally just going to be adding stuff like LOTG mules or whatnot. edit: Basically SP does less dps then any of the attacks you said that you had, including Dark Blast. So unless you can't make a solid attack chain out of the attacks you have, adding SP won't help you. |
Guess I'll just pitch Shadow Punch a again and try something else.
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by GavinRuneblade
What total recharge is needed on Siphon Life for that chain?
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Siphon Life actually needs very little recharge in that chain. It's only needs like 117% or so. MG is the bottleneck in the chain, requiring 234% recharge, so if you can get it up to 90% from slotting say, then you need 144% global.
As far as the OP, most of my characters will be picking up LoTG mules or recall friend, or travel powers, stuff that doesn't need slots.
Sorry if I hijack the thread a little bit, but this seemed like the most appropriate place to post regarding Dark Melee attack chains without making a new thread.
So with my Issue 19 build, what kind of attack chain should I be using if I do want to pump out some DPS? I think it has a good amount of Recharge, but I'm guessing it falls pretty far from top tier single target damage.
Thanks in advance for any advice! Open with Leandro's modified Mids':
Hero Plan by Mids' Hero Designer 1.803
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Succubus Kali: Level 50 Magic Scrapper
Primary Power Set: Dark Melee
Secondary Power Set: Invulnerability
Power Pool: Fighting
Power Pool: Speed
Power Pool: Leadership
Power Pool: Leaping
Ancillary Pool: Blaze Mastery
Hero Profile:
Level 1: Shadow Punch
- (A) Kinetic Combat - Accuracy/Damage
- (3) Kinetic Combat - Damage/Endurance
- (3) Kinetic Combat - Damage/Recharge
- (5) Kinetic Combat - Damage/Endurance/Recharge
- (5) Mako's Bite - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance/Recharge
- (43) Siphon Insight - Accuracy/Endurance/Recharge
- (A) Aegis - Resistance/Endurance
- (7) Aegis - Resistance/Recharge
- (7) Aegis - Resistance
- (15) Gladiator's Armor - TP Protection +3% Def (All)
- (A) Kinetic Combat - Accuracy/Damage
- (9) Kinetic Combat - Damage/Endurance
- (11) Kinetic Combat - Damage/Recharge
- (11) Kinetic Combat - Damage/Endurance/Recharge
- (13) Mako's Bite - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance/Recharge
- (40) Siphon Insight - Accuracy/Endurance/Recharge
- (A) Reactive Armor - Resistance/Endurance
- (13) Reactive Armor - Resistance/Endurance/Recharge
- (15) Reactive Armor - Resistance
- (21) Aegis - Resistance/Endurance
- (31) Aegis - Resistance/Endurance/Recharge
- (31) Aegis - Resistance
- (A) Doctored Wounds - Endurance/Recharge
- (9) Doctored Wounds - Heal/Recharge
- (19) Doctored Wounds - Heal/Endurance/Recharge
- (19) Doctored Wounds - Heal
- (21) Doctored Wounds - Recharge
- (A) Kinetic Combat - Accuracy/Damage
- (23) Kinetic Combat - Damage/Endurance
- (23) Kinetic Combat - Damage/Recharge
- (25) Kinetic Combat - Damage/Endurance/Recharge
- (25) Touch of the Nictus - Accuracy/Healing
- (27) Touch of the Nictus - Accuracy/Endurance/Heal/HitPoints/Regeneration
- (A) Steadfast Protection - Resistance/+Def 3%
- (A) Accuracy IO
- (A) Recharge Reduction IO
- (27) Recharge Reduction IO
- (29) Recharge Reduction IO
- (A) Aegis - Resistance/Endurance
- (17) Aegis - Resistance/Endurance/Recharge
- (17) Aegis - Resistance
- (A) Eradication - Accuracy/Recharge
- (33) Eradication - Accuracy/Damage/Recharge
- (33) Eradication - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance/Recharge
- (34) Recharge Reduction IO
- (A) Eradication - Accuracy/Recharge
- (33) Eradication - Accuracy/Damage/Recharge
- (34) Eradication - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance/Recharge
- (A) Aegis - Resistance/Endurance
- (36) Aegis - Resistance/Endurance/Recharge
- (37) Aegis - Resistance
- (A) HamiO:Enzyme Exposure
- (40) HamiO:Enzyme Exposure
- (45) Luck of the Gambler - Recharge Speed
- (A) Eradication - Accuracy/Recharge
- (37) Eradication - Accuracy/Damage/Recharge
- (37) Eradication - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance/Recharge
- (39) Cleaving Blow - Accuracy/Damage
- (39) Cleaving Blow - Damage/Recharge
- (50) Cleaving Blow - Accuracy/Recharge
- (A) HamiO:Enzyme Exposure
- (29) HamiO:Enzyme Exposure
- (34) Kismet - Accuracy +6%
- (50) Luck of the Gambler - Recharge Speed
- (A) HamiO:Enzyme Exposure
- (36) HamiO:Enzyme Exposure
- (40) Luck of the Gambler - Recharge Speed
- (A) Kinetic Combat - Accuracy/Damage
- (36) Kinetic Combat - Damage/Endurance
- (39) Kinetic Combat - Damage/Recharge
- (42) Kinetic Combat - Damage/Endurance/Recharge
- (43) Mako's Bite - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance/Recharge
- (43) Siphon Insight - Accuracy/Endurance/Recharge
- (A) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Endurance
- (45) Luck of the Gambler - Defense
- (45) Luck of the Gambler - Recharge Speed
- (A) Aegis - Resistance/Endurance
- (42) Aegis - Resistance/Recharge
- (42) Aegis - Resistance
- (A) Basilisk's Gaze - Accuracy/Hold
- (46) Basilisk's Gaze - Accuracy/Recharge
- (46) Basilisk's Gaze - Endurance/Recharge/Hold
- (46) Basilisk's Gaze - Accuracy/Endurance/Recharge/Hold
- (A) Accuracy IO
- (A) Ragnarok - Damage
- (48) Ragnarok - Damage/Recharge
- (48) Ragnarok - Accuracy/Damage/Recharge
- (48) Ragnarok - Accuracy/Recharge
- (50) Ragnarok - Damage/Endurance
- (A) Luck of the Gambler - Recharge Speed
Level 1: Brawl
- (A) Accuracy IO
- (A) Run Speed IO
- (A) Recharge Reduction IO
Level 6: Ninja Run
Level 1: Swift
- (A) Run Speed IO
- (A) Jumping IO
- (A) Miracle - +Recovery
- (31) Numina's Convalescence - +Regeneration/+Recovery
- (A) Endurance Modification IO
Code:
| Copy & Paste this data into Mids' Hero Designer to view the build | |-------------------------------------------------------------------| |MxDz;1484;739;1478;HEX;| |78DA8D53EB52525114DE870321775041C51BE0152F246A572BCBAC194B8AA4F157E| |51C71A7A718A40394F6AB07E815FA53D34334BD464D3D43538FD0D0DAEBDBA0FEEB| |CCF07D7B2FBEFDADB5F6A570B41E14E2DDAA30C2B72B56BDBE532A3B56AD261D4FC| |1DAB7CBA152B35C6EEE36EBA9FB56C5F60A2106DA829D82AC48995BB79C9718A63A| |FFACCBE7B25A97B98DEAEB66A52A1D6BD7AED88DE3D846F5403AB2DAC8B507A1E2E| |1612577D7DE3F68D8D57D3FCF4A3529F7223CDC94D69E74EA07762DD89ED748D77D| |A76697736B15EBADDC2958F586748EFBA9B22CFD5EA912F96B79449128235C8F405| |B4CEE12E805515ECC044C452B6A95C1AB4CB160A8D0B93C689929BCC83AC7AB65E4| |6EC0BD0BEE7EB8FBE11E84FB14DCAFD12A13EE1E738406532298660A67987A91726| |4098494D7699507B9DC9E4D0E751598BA1F801E32F516999A24F7EAD2BC282D81D2| |1228AD1FA5F5C7B9A66482E9062DF1A134E1EBA3C1B030281480910824B98F0C854| |208B942B31C4A828640AB2488C0C615413351341345336F4810E3AD6B99B15F2E95| |27F51BF487290DA33AE97A74A69E33BA34742609E23A531C99C690691C996224E8D| |382BE4B446EDA61CD7371961C916400C5780690641C49C69164B2C2C54C5699F287| |4CB768D5A0811606D9D014439AD37F855A9787BF9B94C3BA84619D7A4C2BA720392| |6C9A83EAD519CD6184E6B12A795C569CD9CB9A66BB42AA38D3351369AEB05C1F626| |0926B46002BB93C53DCE62773ED2314E23AF39FD8D9B9DFF0EFA01FAC9F48974B3F| |A12CCE2127CA6504EDFC7DCA24B85CE2F8196411798F217991254CA82BE590BA86E| |C8DD799B42C074F374689E434577E78D0903B762D4DD799E2D5FB4F32CFEE7F39CB| |CEC768273A743D31CF29E840C718FDFE4C8369EDC69718AC55F82ED906FCB4FF858| |4191C0D856A3270A9EAAE93335B2D4685741594D5B5F83ED8E2397555B57145C55B| |0A2204EED89F74AE9558F30A020A820A420AC20A220AAA0474152C10705AD7F1F0E| |DA8A| |-------------------------------------------------------------------|
Playstation 3 - XBox 360 - Wii - PSP
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Quote:
With that build there are a couple things to think about with attack chains. First thing is that hasten is going to have about 20 seconds downtime. |
Originally Posted by bAss_ackwards
Sorry if I hijack the thread a little bit, but this seemed like the most appropriate place to post regarding Dark Melee attack chains without making a new thread.
So with my Issue 19 build, what kind of attack chain should I be using if I do want to pump out some DPS? I think it has a good amount of Recharge, but I'm guessing it falls pretty far from top tier single target damage. |
So for most of the time, you are going to be pretty close to MG- Smite - SL - Smite. With hasten up, your about .35 seconds short in recharge for MG on that chain, so really it's almost enough to be covered by latency, but I would play with it a bit. Try with just that chain, and if you feel there is enough of a gap after the 2nd smite, before MG is back up, then throw in a SP at the end of the chain. Ultimately the order of the chain is flexable, just put Smites inbetween MG and SL.
For the 20 seconds or so that Hasten is down, it's going to be more ugly. With the listed slotting and global recharge, Smite is at 2.5 seconds, which is longer then the animation time on SL and MG. So you will likely need to fit in a couple SP as well, so something like MG-Smite-SP-SL-Smite-SP. The placement of the first SP is somewhat flexable, it could go after SL as well, basically you have about .4 seconds before Smite recharges, but after SL is finished animating. SP will fill in the gap. Plus the total animation time of 2x Smite and 2x SP and SL is 6.6 seconds, which is just enough time for MG to recharge.
In either of those chains, Fireball can sub for a Smite or SP. In fact, if you don't mind the end cost, Fireball can sub for SP completely, it's better dps even on a single target. Of course it's also about 5.8x the end. Well, it can sub for 1 SP every 12 or so seconds
Awesome! Thank you very much for the info! 
Oh! So how much DPS would it be with MG - Smite - SL - Smite? I think it is 164 DPS, but I am unsure with things like ArcanaTime out there.
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Quote:
|
Originally Posted by bAss_ackwards
Awesome! Thank you very much for the info!
Oh! So how much DPS would it be with MG - Smite - SL - Smite? I think it is 164 DPS, but I am unsure with things like ArcanaTime out there. |
So without Soul Drain I'm showing about 138dps, factoring in ArcanaTime and the slight delay in MG recharge we discussed. With a saturated Soul Drain, 224dps. Various levels of Soul Drain are inbetween.
Quote:
call me noobish on this matter, but wouldn't jump kick work out better than SP?|
Originally Posted by Desmodos
Shadow Punch, Smite, and Siphon Life are all slotted with:
Midnight's Grasp is slotted with:
Basically, I was trying to talk my way back into taking Shadow Punch...cause I've kind of run out of things to take. From the looks of things, to make the build work, it needs lots of recharge, which I seem to have plenty of. A 6th slot in each can bring MG down to 4.426s and SL down to 3.006s. Guess I'll just pitch Shadow Punch a again and try something else. |
I'm only asking as I was thinking of taking that and acrobatics in my i19 build - just 1 of the few build ideas I've been toying with mind you. It has higher damage than SP, but is about .5 secs slower calculating cast and recharge.
http://www.scene-and-heard.com/cov/covsig.jpg
Quote:
One of the things you have to consider in attack chains is the length of animation (cast time). Shadow Punch animates in 0.83s. Jump Kick animates in 1.5 seconds. No amount of recharge slotting can overcome this. Before taking other matters into consideration, this makes Shadow Punch superior to Jump Kick. Then factor in SP does mostly negative damage; which is resisted far less frequently than smashing.
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Originally Posted by Scene_EU
call me noobish on this matter, but wouldn't jump kick work out better than SP?
I'm only asking as I was thinking of taking that and acrobatics in my i19 build - just 1 of the few build ideas I've been toying with mind you. It has higher damage than SP, but is about .5 secs slower calculating cast and recharge. |
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Quote:
Ohh! Thanks again for the info! |
Originally Posted by Vysires
So without Soul Drain I'm showing about 138dps, factoring in ArcanaTime and the slight delay in MG recharge we discussed. With a saturated Soul Drain, 224dps. Various levels of Soul Drain are inbetween.
|
Playstation 3 - XBox 360 - Wii - PSP
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I kind of lost track of Shadow Punch's standing with all the changes to attack chain calculations and the effects of Arcanatime.
I stopped taking Shadow Punch from an opportunity cost perspective.
With Fitness being shifted to Inherent status, I've got 3 new power slots. Using Leandro's temporary Mid's patch, I'm fooling about with my new potential Issue 19 builds.
Is Shadow Punch still considered detrimental on an attack chains damage output?
If it's relevant, the build has 143.8% global recharge with 66.25% recharge in MG(4.839s) and 39.15% recharge in SL(3.535s)
Thanks in advance for any input.