Well you can tank with it, but you can tank with almost any key powered and decently slotted build anyway. I am going to guess soloing sucks.
On a good note my defenders could focus on blasting for a change but then i have blasters for that.
Dark ring mistresses how do you find them with your build out of interest?
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* No Unstoppable, as Unstoppable only leads to Unstoppable crashing and unnecessary worrying about how long you can tank.
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i am sometimes utterly amazed out how good defender sets can actually be, now that the buff flashes to help especially
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* No Hasten, Invincibility will keep enemies close even if you get hit with -recharge powers.
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i cant see the relationship between haste and invincible, dull pain yes, invincible nope.
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* Stone Prison to keep AVs immobilized while you Taunt them from distance.
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Best way to do an AV imo, although a ranged hold maybe as good or better, but ranged hold is better than the kob melee hold
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* Aid Self for a self-heal (anyone who calls Dull Pain a proper self heal isn't taking enough damage)
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its a +hp and take the alpha heal.
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* KO Blow to help take care of Sappers
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it does help with me, i have 3 hold slots which gives me ample time to slip my attack chain in, and also means i can still be first in on malta unless it misses but then i have unstoppable, a room with 3 sappers close together is just click unstoppable and use a well slotted taunt.
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* Rage to deal with -ToHit
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i took foc acc for that, cos i dont like relying on rage, i dont like "only affecting self" times. The foc acc is +per so when it came to arachnos and them trying to blind me i was fine.
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* Your main protection is your Defense - move into as many enemies as possible and use them to boost your Invincibility.
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quick fly by taunt and hide with team standing 40 yards back is fastest way to herd and instantly gets mob into melee range, i never could understand the run round and effect mobs for 2 secs with taunt and then hide in every situation.
Powerchoices are down to concept and playstyle, slottings important and so is playing to suit build and choosing the right playstyle well enough to suit other peoples build.
My trick archer would love this tank, my empath would be wishing she slotted attacks more.
He will honor his words; he will definitely carry out his actions. What he promises he will fulfill. He does not care about his bodily self, putting his life and death aside to come forward for another's troubled besiegement. He does not boast about his ability, or shamelessly extol his own virtues. - Sima Qian.
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* No Hasten, Invincibility will keep enemies close even if you get hit with -recharge powers.
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i cant see the relationship between haste and invincible, dull pain yes, invincible nope.
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I believe they're talking about the recharge time of taunt, and how speeding it up using hasten is not necessary as invinicible will hold mobs in place until taunt is ready again.
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* No Hasten, Invincibility will keep enemies close even if you get hit with -recharge powers.
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i cant see the relationship between haste and invincible, dull pain yes, invincible nope.
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I believe they're talking about the recharge time of taunt, and how speeding it up using hasten is not necessary as invinicible will hold mobs in place until taunt is ready again.
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invincible does that anyway to 10, taunt could be just for the more than 10 and haste isnt always up in order to be viable as a means of recharge.
He will honor his words; he will definitely carry out his actions. What he promises he will fulfill. He does not care about his bodily self, putting his life and death aside to come forward for another's troubled besiegement. He does not boast about his ability, or shamelessly extol his own virtues. - Sima Qian.
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Well you can tank with it, but you can tank with almost any key powered and decently slotted build anyway. I am going to guess soloing sucks.
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Soloing with it is quite dull yes, but if I want to solo, I have other lower-level characters to do that with. Or my blaster if I really want to be effective solo and for example gather influence/prestige without other people around.
If I am waiting to get an invite to a team, I'm usually at Rikti Crash Site, killing portals, as people find it easier to invite people who are outside missions than those who are indoors.
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Dark ring mistresses how do you find them with your build out of interest?
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I find the whole concept of the carnies a bit painful because of the Psionic damage type, but with a half-decent defender even Darks are bearable. I'm surviving more with this build than I was before I respecced Aid Self into the mix. Actually group with 3 illusionists is more dangerous to me than a group with a Dark Ring, because each Illusionist can fire 2 Psi-typed holds in short succession, leading to 6 stacked holds on me, so I usually opt for taunting them from afar (which means they won't fire their PBAoE Hold at me), even if it means taking more damage. A Dark Ring makes me usually eat a Catch a Breath or two thanks to that annoying Mask effect, but as the build is generally low on the amount of endurance it eats through, it is bearable. With a good support character backing me up, it becomes easier.
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* No Unstoppable
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i am sometimes utterly amazed out how good defender sets can actually be, now that the buff flashes to help especially
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Agree with you there, the blinking made Unstoppable much more usable (before that I used external timer to keep track of it), but it doesn't mean I have to worry less. If fighting enemies who are still half alive, Unstoppable crash will be bad, no matter if you know it 15 seconds beforehand or not.
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* No Hasten, Invincibility will...
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i cant see the relationship between haste and invincible, dull pain yes, invincible nope.
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As Organi pointed out, The only worry I have with this character is keeping aggro. If I had to worry about keeping them close to me with Gauntlet and not Taunt aura (for example if the taunt aura had a tohit probability), Hasten would be more necessary to keep up my attack rate and thus my Gauntlet.
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* Stone Prison to keep AVs immobilized while you Taunt them from distance.
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Best way to do an AV imo, although a ranged hold maybe as good or better, but ranged hold is better than the kob melee hold
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Ranged hold has the problem that it works on AVs only 50% of the time as their hold resistance varies. There are only few AVs out there (Infernal is the first to come to mind) with proper Immob resistance. Thus I chose an Immob over hold.
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..Dull Pain...
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its a +hp and take the alpha heal.
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*nods* And a key power for every Invulnerabilty tank in my mind. But an additional Heal helps surprisingly much as Dull Pain is quite slow-reloading.
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* KO Blow to help take care of Sappers
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it does help with me, i have 3 hold slots which gives me ample time to slip my attack chain in, and also means i can still be first in on malta unless it misses but then i have unstoppable, a room with 3 sappers close together is just click unstoppable and use a well slotted taunt.
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With multiple Sappers I have to resort to using Lucks, but those situations are luckily quite rare. Usually teams (or someone else besides me in a team) know to take down Sappers first, so most of the time I don't need to do much more than jump in and KO Blow the Sapper, and the rest of the team deals enough damage to get rid of it. I can basically take down a +2 Sapper solo by hitting Rage, KO Blow, Footstomp and then Jab/Box/Brawl it until it is down, +3 if I have damage inspirations or support. Usually I don't have to.
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* Rage to deal with -ToHit
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i took foc acc for that, cos i dont like relying on rage, i dont like "only affecting self" times. The foc acc is +per so when it came to arachnos and them trying to blind me i was fine.
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-perception is another fringe case I have to use inspirations with, but even these days the missions where it happens are quite rare.
The only cases where I actually find myself using Rage these days are either against Circle of Thorns, as they use both +Def and -ToHit, or if I want to take down a specific enemy (such as a Sapper) without having to worry about the team doing the same. The 10 second Only Affecting Self is quite nasty, especially as it is a Defense DeBuff and blocks out Invincibility as well, but haven't had a problem of someone dying because of it so-far. Probably one day that too will happen.
Also, taking Focused Accuracy would have meant taking another power for -Fly effect and something to keep the enemy afar. If I wanted FA, I'd most likely switch Superjump for Flight and take Air Superiority for the Tier 1 power from the Pool. But as it would make me lose my ranged Immob, I would most likely not to it anyways.
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* Your main protection is your Defense - move into as many enemies as possible and use them to boost your Invincibility.
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quick fly by taunt and hide with team standing 40 yards back is fastest way to herd and instantly gets mob into melee range, i never could understand the run round and effect mobs for 2 secs with taunt and then hide in every situation.
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The only character I do the run-around-with-aura-running herding dance routine is my AR/Ice Blaster. And that's usually more for fun than real efficient playing.
With this Tanker, the enemies in a spawn are usually so close to each other that jumping in the middle and Foot Stomping is enough to get the main group's attention and then using the ranged Immob and Taunt to keep those further away interested in you. Against more dangerous situations (for example 2 spawns close to each other) or scattered mobs, I too use the taunt-and-hide pulling method.
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Powerchoices are down to concept and playstyle, slottings important and so is playing to suit build and choosing the right playstyle well enough to suit other peoples build.
My trick archer would love this tank, my empath would be wishing she slotted attacks more.
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Yes, once again fully agreeing. As I said in the original post, this build works well for me as I like to keep pushing forward in a mission without pausing. With a big team behind me, doing what they do best.
The build works wonders when there are people doing damage around and spawns that are big enough to pose a threat to someone. If the whole team is based around supporting the tank who is a main damage dealer, things become more tedious.
The build is, as said, a bit slow to solo, and possibly quite annoying to duo as it puts quite much responsibility for the other character as well. It's not as boring to solo as say a "pure empath" build or a controller based on locking down the enemies so other people can do the pounding, but quite slow. (KO Blow, Jab/Box and Foot Stomp are quite good attacks, even if the two bigger ones recharge a bit slowly)
For duo of characters, pretty much anyone who has attack power works, as do characters with good boosts to damage dealing and attack rate (Kinetics, Rads). Worst end of stick would be other support types that are specialized in situations where "the other guys would do the damage", like the Pure Empath mentioned earlier.
[b][color=blue]Coldest War /[color=red]/ Omega Patient[/b]
[url="http://www.the-cow.net/"][color=red]The CoW Network (Blog) /[/url][url="http://www.collegeofwar.com/"][color=blue]/ College of War[/url]
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As Organi pointed out, The only worry I have with this character is keeping aggro. If I had to worry about keeping them close to me with Gauntlet and not Taunt aura (for example if the taunt aura had a tohit probability), Hasten would be more necessary to keep up my attack rate and thus my Gauntlet.
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i seriously dont regard gauntlet as "aggro control" even though it is but its far from enough so never thought about considering haste for attacks also additionally again because haste isnt always there, i use it for long rechg powers, the rest have to be sustainable.
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Ranged hold has the problem that it works on AVs only 50% of the time as their hold resistance varies. There are only few AVs out there (Infernal is the first to come to mind) with proper Immob resistance. Thus I chose an Immob over hold.
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I am thankful for that observation. My stone tank is yet to get earth epics to find out. Very good to know.
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With multiple Sappers I have to resort to using Lucks, but those situations are luckily quite rare. Usually teams (or someone else besides me in a team) know to take down Sappers first, so most of the time I don't need to do much more than jump in and KO Blow the Sapper, and the rest of the team deals enough damage to get rid of it. I can basically take down a +2 Sapper solo by hitting Rage, KO Blow, Footstomp and then Jab/Box/Brawl it until it is down, +3 if I have damage inspirations or support. Usually I don't have to.
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i have knockout blow 2 acc 1 end 3 hold, plus foc acc 2 end 3 tohit plus if i am soloing a malta mission (which id rather with caves) i may use rage. Its alot of acc and tohit, and still the sappers can be missed. I find kob despite all that is my least accurate attack or at least feels like it.
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The 10 second Only Affecting Self is quite nasty, especially as it is a Defense DeBuff and blocks out Invincibility as well, but haven't had a problem of someone dying because of it so-far. Probably one day that too will happen.
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Your taunt control is good, it could happen, but hardly likely. I did the Maria Jenkins arc, all of it once over a few nights, 3 deaths total, 1 where my mate went to get a sneak preview of infernal, he got blattered. Another 1 when Marauder went unstoppable... I was typing "dont do anything until he crashes" and in went aimed shot whilst i was typing and as i also had a rage crash. Other death i cant recall i just keep count. It was good teaming over that arc not necessarily the best of my tanking.
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Also, taking Focused Accuracy would have meant taking another power for -Fly effect and something to keep the enemy afar. If I wanted FA, I'd most likely switch Superjump for Flight and take Air Superiority for the Tier 1 power from the Pool. But as it would make me lose my ranged Immob, I would most likely not to it anyways.
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Was just saying i use it, not you should take it, all epics have a bonus.
He will honor his words; he will definitely carry out his actions. What he promises he will fulfill. He does not care about his bodily self, putting his life and death aside to come forward for another's troubled besiegement. He does not boast about his ability, or shamelessly extol his own virtues. - Sima Qian.
That is an interesting build but I beleive slightly unbalanced as one great damage mitigator is doing damage yourself.
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Ranged hold has the problem that it works on AVs only 50% of the time as their hold resistance varies. There are only few AVs out there (Infernal is the first to come to mind) with proper Immob resistance. Thus I chose an Immob over hold.
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I am thankful for that observation. My stone tank is yet to get earth epics to find out. Very good to know.
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Also find thind this useful to know as when i picked my epics I meant to take the hold and picked an immob by mistake D'OH. I have an unused respec that, when I got round to it, I was going to use to get rid of the immob but I think I may try it out on a few AVs before I do, particularly as it's been consigned to a tray I rarely have visible.
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That is an interesting build but I beleive slightly unbalanced as one great damage mitigator is doing damage yourself.
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Thats partially why i never made one like it, other reasons include concept, forcing me more to see defenders and controllers of a great value and having to play to suit them. Many tanks I have seen do not, rendering some of those ATs with defender sets practically ignored, undervalued and unable to offer as much as they could with safety but i dont think Alvan does that, if i could bring my trick archer to his team on union id probably get to enjoy playing her properly. There are some tanks who may atleast try to attempt to create ideal settings for those with certain less flexible defender sets, but may not get to do so due to the impatientness of teams.
He will honor his words; he will definitely carry out his actions. What he promises he will fulfill. He does not care about his bodily self, putting his life and death aside to come forward for another's troubled besiegement. He does not boast about his ability, or shamelessly extol his own virtues. - Sima Qian.
Hey Alvan
I like the idea of your tank but from what I've read, the build would be slightly different before respec--more attacks for example. Could you, or anyone else for that matter, show me what that build would look like please.
Thanks
BF
Finally pretty much perfected my tanker build to fit my style of play - Full meatshield build for an Inv/SS. This doesn't work for everyone, but thought to share anyways in case someone gets inspired. It is a respec-build of mine from level 47, so before that you might want to have the attacks in a bit earlier if you plan to solo. It's a team-build, but I can do missions on Invincible with it if I really need to.
* No Unstoppable, as Unstoppable only leads to Unstoppable crashing and unnecessary worrying about how long you can tank.
* No Hasten, Invincibility will keep enemies close even if you get hit with -recharge powers.
* Stone Prison to keep AVs immobilized while you Taunt them from distance.
* Aid Self for a self-heal (anyone who calls Dull Pain a proper self heal isn't taking enough damage)
* Tough to bring S/L resistance to cap. Weave to bring Defense up a notch.
* Foot Stomp to get instant attention / ease the Alpha strike by dropping half of the enemies to the ground
* KO Blow to help take care of Sappers
* Rage to deal with -ToHit
* Your main protection is your Defense - move into as many enemies as possible and use them to boost your Invincibility.
* Weak point is still Psi damage and hold stacking, but that's the life of an Inv Tanker.
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Exported from Ver: 1.7.6.0 of the CoH_CoV Character Builder
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Name: Simulacrus
Level: 50
Archetype: Tanker
Primary: Invulnerability
Secondary: Super Strength
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01) --> Temp Invulnerability==> DmgRes(1)DmgRes(3)DmgRes(3)EndRdx(5)EndRdx(5)
01) --> Jab==> Acc(1)
02) --> Dull Pain==> Rechg(2)Rechg(7)Rechg(7)Heal(9)Heal(9)Heal(11)
04) --> Resist Physical Damage==> DmgRes(4)DmgRes(11)DmgRes(13)
06) --> Hurdle==> Jump(6)
08) --> Unyielding==> DmgRes(8)DmgRes(13)DmgRes(15)EndRdx(15)EndRdx(17)EndRdx(23)
10) --> Taunt==> Rechg(10)Rechg(17)Rechg(19)Taunt(19)Taunt(21)Range(50)
12) --> Combat Jumping==> DefBuf(12)DefBuf(21)DefBuf(23)
14) --> Super Jump==> EndRdx(14)
16) --> Health==> Heal(16)Heal(25)Heal(27)
18) --> Invincibility==> DefBuf(18)DefBuf(27)DefBuf(29)Taunt(29)Taunt(31)Taunt(31)
20) --> Stamina==> EndMod(20)EndMod(31)EndMod(33)
22) --> Boxing==> Acc(22)EndRdx(25)
24) --> Aid Other==> IntRdx(24)
26) --> Tough Hide==> DefBuf(26)DefBuf(33)DefBuf(33)
28) --> Aid Self==> Rechg(28)IntRdx(34)IntRdx(34)Heal(34)Heal(36)Heal(36)
30) --> Tough==> DmgRes(30)DmgRes(36)DmgRes(37)EndRdx(37)EndRdx(37)
32) --> Weave==> DefBuf(32)DefBuf(39)DefBuf(39)EndRdx(39)EndRdx(40)EndRdx(40)
35) --> Rage==> Rechg(35)Rechg(40)
38) --> Foot Stomp==> Acc(38)Acc(42)Dmg(42)Dmg(42)Dmg(43)EndRdx(43)
41) --> Stone Prison==> Acc(41)Acc(43)Rechg(45)Rechg(45)
44) --> Knockout Blow==> Acc(44)Acc(45)EndRdx(46)Dmg(46)Dmg(46)Dmg(48)
47) --> Resist Elements==> DmgRes(47)DmgRes(48)DmgRes(48)
49) --> Resist Energies==> DmgRes(49)DmgRes(50)DmgRes(50)
---------------------------------------------
01) --> Sprint==> EndRdx(1)
01) --> Brawl==> Acc(1)
01) --> Gauntlet==> Empty(1)
02) --> Rest==> Rechg(2)
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[b][color=blue]Coldest War /[color=red]/ Omega Patient[/b]
[url="http://www.the-cow.net/"][color=red]The CoW Network (Blog) /[/url][url="http://www.collegeofwar.com/"][color=blue]/ College of War[/url]