finally decided to use a planner to plan my brute
I play both of those powersets on my brutes. My suggestions are:
1) Whirling Hands isn't a very good area attack (low damage), so only take it if you're absolutely dead set on having an area attack.
2) You might want to take Dark Regen after Stamina/SOs because it uses up a ton of End. Drop the 2 Heal enhs and put in 2 more EndRdx instead, because it REALLY eats Endurance. If it gets 3 hits then it will fully top up your health anyway, even from almost dead.
3) With your shortage of cheap/fast single-target attacks, even if you put Brawl on auto, you're going to struggle to build up Fury fast yourself. Consider moving Boxing up into the first ten levels, or take Air Superiority (Flight pool) there instead. Levelling will be slow and painful without a decent attack chain with very few gaps, especially if you want to solo - a few seconds more can be a long time to wait for an attack to recharge when enemies are beating on you.
4) One accuracy enh is fine in your attacks if you never go above Vicious difficulty. If you team above your level, or will regularly be fighting AVs/EBs, or want to PvP then you will want 2 Accuracies in your attacks. Also I recommend fully 6-slotting most of your attacks - if you don't put in a second accuracy then I suggest a Recharge SO - that will help your attack chain problems for building Fury (because with your slotting you're going to be spending a lot of time waiting for Bonesmasher to come back up, especially as you're not getting Hasten for ages).
5) Dark Armour's 3 main toggles (Obsidian, Dark Emb and Murky Cloud) are fairly low End cost - they don't need an EndRdx in them, imho, as it wouldn't save enough End to be noticeable. You should probably take Murky Cloud earlier as well - I'd say by 20 if you ever want to do the first strike force, or by 24 if you ever want to PvP in Bloody Bay.
6) Moving Dark Regen post-Stamina/SOs would let you take TF at 18, which you'll want to do as it's one of the two attacks that define your primary (the other is ET which you really should take at 32, as soon as it is available - delay Hasten or whatever til 35 instead).
7) Don't put extra slots in Combat Jumping - the benefits are tiny. And it doesn't need EndRdx as it's probably the lowest cost toggle in the game. I just stick a DefBuff in the main slot to push it up to 3% def (from 2.5% base) but some people prefer a Jump SO for the extra foot or so of height it gives you - not really a big decision either way.
8) Cloak of Fear eats Endurance faster than almost anything. With your slotting if you had all your toggles on you would probably lose End while standing still and not attacking. Personally I'd say dump it and get Oppressive Gloom instead (which hardly costs anything to run), but if you must then stick 3 EndRdx in it and be prepared to switch off other toggles like Death Shroud when you use it. Also consider that against bosses the disorient from Oppressive Gloom will stack well with the disorients from your energy melee attacks, while Cloak of Fear won't (it would stack better if you were Dark Melee primary though, which has a fear attack). Also the damage ticks from Death Shroud will break the cowering "mez" part of the fear effect, letting enemies attack you (but at one quarter of their usual attack rate, and they may run away), so they don't play well together - while Opp Gloom and Death Shroud do.
9) Death Shroud will need 2-3 EndRdx too - put the EndRdx slots from your shields into this and it will save you a ton more End than your current slotting. Death Shroud should also be delayed until after Stamina/SOs (unless you need it to hold aggro for some squishy friends you will be levelling up with) - it eats up a ton of End before you get it SO-slotted and have Stamina.
10) Just one recharge in Soul Transfer, unless you're planning on dying a LOT.
I respect your decision to not take any patron powers - Web Envelope (Black Scorpion) is the only one I rate as much use to a brute. Might be worth considering instead of Super Speed as it really only needs 1-2 Accuracies. Super Speed is a bit excess to requirements when you have Super Jump, imho (though I understand it's handy for jousting in PvP).
thanks, thats a lot of info there that I'll definatly take into account, and i'll repost my second attempt when I chance to.
Also, just with the levelling issues you mentioned, I'm currently level 47, thats why I didn't really put too much stock into worrying about the early power choices. I've already done the virgil SF so wouldn't be planning on ever doing it again with this character.
but then again, the next SF is set at level 25, so some restructering is needed.
with the patron powers: i took captain mako as a patron, and took 3 of his powers at level 41, 44 and 47 (the pet) and found them all useless! as a brute the pet is generally of little use to me against the normal mobs and the only time he's really useful is against bosses or EBs. but in these situations:
1. his damage is negligable
2. he dies. quickly.
and the reason i took superspeed: I couldn't figure out what else to pick! honestly, I ran out of powers to choose so just decided to take SS.
ideally, I would have loved to take: teleport as my main travel power and hover for KB protection. However, i also really want tough, stamina and hasten, which totals 5 pools. so I had to drop teleport, and was left with an extra power slot and I had nothing else I could see that was worth taking.
right, taking into consideration the advice given so far, heres a revised build:
comments?
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Exported from Ver: 1.7.6.0 of the CoH_CoV Character Builder
---------------------------------------------
Name: Captain Pinkbeard
Level: 50
Archetype: Brute
Primary: Energy Melee
Secondary: Dark Armor
---------------------------------------------
01) --> Energy Punch==> EndRdx(1)Acc(3)Dmg(9)Dmg(34)Dmg(42)Acc(43)
01) --> Dark Embrace==> DmgRes(1)DmgRes(3)DmgRes(7)
02) --> Bone Smasher==> EndRdx(2)Acc(5)Dmg(13)Dmg(34)Dmg(40)Acc(42)
04) --> Murky Cloud==> DmgRes(4)DmgRes(5)DmgRes(15)
06) --> Build Up==> Rechg(6)Rechg(7)Rechg(13)
08) --> Boxing==> EndRdx(8)Acc(9)Dmg(11)Dmg(17)Dmg(40)Acc(43)
10) --> Obsidian Shield==> DmgRes(10)DmgRes(11)DmgRes(15)
12) --> Combat Jumping==> DefBuf(12)
14) --> Super Jump==> Jump(14)
16) --> Swift==> Run(16)Run(17)
18) --> Total Focus==> EndRdx(18)Acc(19)Dmg(19)Dmg(31)Dmg(37)Acc(39)
20) --> Health==> Heal(20)Heal(21)Heal(21)
22) --> Stamina==> EndMod(22)EndMod(23)EndMod(23)
24) --> Dark Regeneration==> EndRdx(24)Acc(25)Acc(25)Rechg(34)Acc(37)EndRdx(50)
26) --> Cloak Of Darkness==> EndRdx(26)DefBuf(27)DefBuf(27)DefBuf(31)
28) --> Whirling Hands==> EndRdx(28)Acc(29)Dmg(29)Dmg(36)Dmg(42)Acc(43)
30) --> Acrobatics==> EndRdx(30)EndRdx(31)
32) --> Energy Transfer==> EndRdx(32)Acc(33)Dmg(33)Dmg(33)Dmg(37)Acc(40)
35) --> Hasten==> Rechg(35)Rechg(36)Rechg(36)
38) --> Oppressive Gloom==> EndRdx(38)Acc(39)DisDur(39)Acc(46)DisDur(50)
41) --> Soul Transfer==> Rechg(41)
44) --> Death Shroud==> EndRdx(44)EndRdx(45)Acc(45)Dmg(45)Dmg(46)Dmg(46)
47) --> Tough==> EndRdx(47)EndRdx(48)DmgRes(48)DmgRes(48)DmgRes(50)
49) --> Super Speed==> EndRdx(49)
---------------------------------------------
01) --> Sprint==> Run(1)
01) --> Brawl==> Acc(1)
01) --> Fury==> Empty(1)
02) --> Rest==> Rechg(2)
---------------------------------------------
[ QUOTE ]
5) Dark Armour's 3 main toggles (Obsidian, Dark Emb and Murky Cloud) are fairly low End cost - they don't need an EndRdx in them, imho, as it wouldn't save enough End to be noticeable.
[/ QUOTE ]
Thats not really true
without end reduxs in the first build he'd have a toggle EPS 1.43 with end reduxs his toggle EPS is 1.14 now in attack chains thats half an attack chain less he could do without end reduxs,thus lowering his chain dmg and over all dmg.
or so attack chain planner says. *shrug*
I know ppl who've played em/dark and they've always said its end heavy.
Defiant's GoEH/MILITIS METUS
[ QUOTE ]
Also, just with the levelling issues you mentioned, I'm currently level 47, thats why I didn't really put too much stock into worrying about the early power choices.
[/ QUOTE ]
Fair enough then. Your new build looks fine to me. I probably wouldnt have put that extra slot in Swift, but I realise theres not much else you could really put slots in and get a decent return. Maybe a ToHitBuff in Build Up instead, or an extra EndRdx in a toggle - all very slight boosts, though.
[ QUOTE ]
Thats not really true
without end reduxs in the first build he'd have a toggle EPS 1.43 with end reduxs his toggle EPS is 1.14 now in attack chains thats half an attack chain less he could do without end reduxs,thus lowering his chain dmg and over all dmg.
or so attack chain planner says. *shrug*
I know ppl who've played em/dark and they've always said its end heavy.
[/ QUOTE ]
SherkSilvers planner (supposed to be the most accurate these days) says the 3 /dark toggles are 0.104 EPS each - an EndRdx in each reduces them to 0.078 EPS (about the same as Combat Jumping, probably the cheapest toggle in the game), saving 0.026 each - a total saving of 0.078 EPS if you put 1 EndRdx in all 3 toggles. Not a massive bonus for 3 slots, maths-wise, when toggles like Acro cost over twice as much, or Tough at 3 times as much. (in fact a third EndRdx in Tough will save 0.029 - more than that same EndRdx in any of the 3 /dark resist toggles).
From my own experience I personally havent seen any noticeable difference from slotting secondary resist toggles with EndRdx for /dark, /fire or /elec (actually you can add /EA to that too, from my Stamina-less stalker) - and I did try when End-balancing them. Auras yes, Tough yes, but not the basic resist shields. Of course mathematically it helps, but I found it too little to justify (or even notice) - on a long fight against an AV/GM perhaps /shrug - I dont have too many troubles and believe me I do like to play continuously with my brutes (solo they never need to rest/pause mid-mission - Fury is my god!), so I slot them for that.
Actually my SS/Dark seemed to have less End troubles pre- and post-Stamina than my EM/Elec (3 toggles) did - my Fire/Fire doesnt really count because he was my first character and it didnt occur to me to slot EndRdx in attacks, plus I took Stamina late (L30 heh), so he was a bit of a nightmare Even so when I respecced him I tried him with and without EndRdx in his resist toggles and again it wasnt even noticeable either way.
Now I only use character builders/planners and forum recommendations as guidance - gameplay is where it matters and all my planned builds have changed in some way while playing them. So, Mr_Moot, I recommend you copy your character to Test before doing this respec, so you can test it out in a few newsies before you commit to it - if your playstyle differs from mine then finding out how the changes have affected your build should prove invaluable for last minute tweaks - you can find out where those extra slots are more noticeable.
Admittedly you do have 3 slots spare (the extra slot in Swift and the 2 in Health will hardly be missed), so you could try slotting the toggles as Chelsea suggests and see if you prefer/notice it.
Oh and is that EndRdx in Oppressive Gloom supposed to be another Disorient Duration? OG is supposed to cost the same as your resist shields, so of course I dont think its worth slotting for EndRdx. Others might, though
[ QUOTE ]
SherkSilvers planner (supposed to be the most accurate these days) says the 3 /dark toggles are 0.104 EPS each
[/ QUOTE ]NoFuture states they cost 0.104 EPT (Per tick), and have tick rate of 0.5 sec, thus making them 0.208 EPS.
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
SherkSilvers planner (supposed to be the most accurate these days) says the 3 /dark toggles are 0.104 EPS each
[/ QUOTE ]NoFuture states they cost 0.104 EPT (Per tick), and have tick rate of 0.5 sec, thus making them 0.208 EPS.
[/ QUOTE ]
Interesting - thanks for clearing that up. The /dark resist toggles do cost less than the Electric Armour ones then (which costs the same as the Fiery Aura ones: 0.26 EPS) - I had a feeling they did from playing both sets at L20 and then again when both of my brutes with those sets were L35.
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
SherkSilver’s planner (supposed to be the most accurate these days) says the 3 /dark toggles are 0.104 EPS each
[/ QUOTE ]NoFuture states they cost 0.104 EPT (Per tick), and have tick rate of 0.5 sec, thus making them 0.208 EPS.
[/ QUOTE ]
ah, so that would make and end red in each of the three toggles a viable option? if I did do that then yes I wouldn't add another slot to swift, giving me 1 spare. and that other end red in OG was indeed a mistake, i could also take that one out and get myself another slot.
also you mentioned slots in health wouldn't be missed, I had never even considered not 3-slotting it. would taking away 1 slot from here (giving me the extra 3 I now need for the 3 toggles) be a suitable move?
and yep that test server idea will definatly be done. however I've respecced pinky so many times on test and don't always know what I'm looking for! So i figured the best move would be to get some expert (you guys ) advice and then take my new knowledge to the test server.
[ QUOTE ]
ah, so that would make and end red in each of the three toggles a viable option?
[/ QUOTE ]Definitely
[ QUOTE ]
also you mentioned slots in health wouldn't be missed, I had never even considered not 3-slotting it. would taking away 1 slot from here (giving me the extra 3 I now need for the 3 toggles) be a suitable move?
[/ QUOTE ]You have DR, health is so small survivability boost in comparison that those slots propably won't be missed.
nofuture claim to have got the power info from the game files which is untrue so i wouldn't put alot of stock into what it says max.
As for end reduxs in toggles .. meh .. i suppose its down to taste and play style
Defiant's GoEH/MILITIS METUS
[ QUOTE ]
nofuture claim to have got the power info from the game files which is untrue
[/ QUOTE ]And you know this, how?
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
nofuture claim to have got the power info from the game files which is untrue
[/ QUOTE ]And you know this, how?
[/ QUOTE ]
Because its been discussed on the US forums and the guy who does nofuture said its all from player info and not from the game files.
Defiant's GoEH/MILITIS METUS
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
nofuture claim to have got the power info from the game files which is untrue
[/ QUOTE ]And you know this, how?
[/ QUOTE ]
Because its been discussed on the US forums and the guy who does nofuture said its all from player info and not from the game files.
[/ QUOTE ]All I've seen is him saying that all the other info is from game files, and damage numbers are player recorded.
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
nofuture claim to have got the power info from the game files which is untrue
[/ QUOTE ]And you know this, how?
[/ QUOTE ]
Because its been discussed on the US forums and the guy who does nofuture said its all from player info and not from the game files.
[/ QUOTE ]All I've seen is him saying that all the other info is from game files, and damage numbers are player recorded.
[/ QUOTE ]
Well the Americans found alot of incorrect information on there and thats why it was discussed.
Best to use stuff like that as a guide and not take it for red.
Defiant's GoEH/MILITIS METUS
[ QUOTE ]
ah, so that would make and end red in each of the three toggles a viable option?
[/ QUOTE ]
With your build it probably is viable to slot EndRdx in those shields - I've never had the luxury of spare slots to do so on my brutes (and still not sure I would, even if I could). Honestly anywhere you put those extra 3 slots in your build won't have a massively noticeable effect anyway.
[ QUOTE ]
also you mentioned slots in health wouldn't be missed, I had never even considered not 3-slotting it. would taking away 1 slot from here (giving me the extra 3 I now need for the 3 toggles) be a suitable move?
[/ QUOTE ]
Honestly, like MaX says, you won't even notice the difference losing those 2 slots in Health because you have a good heal. Health is a minimal boost that won't improve survivability much - in fact I've started to go Hurdle/Swift/Stamina on most of my characters. The only character I ever considered 3-slotting Health on is my /regen scrapper, because it was adding a little to his primary method of mitigating damage.
Heres the results of my build, hows it look?
---------------------------------------------
Exported from Ver: 1.7.6.0 of the CoH_CoV Character Builder
---------------------------------------------
Name: Captain Pinkbeard
Level: 50
Archetype: Brute
Primary: Energy Melee
Secondary: Dark Armor
---------------------------------------------
01) --> Energy Punch==> EndRdx(1)Acc(3)Dmg(9)Dmg(37)Dmg(42)
01) --> Dark Embrace==> EndRdx(1)DmgRes(3)DmgRes(7)DmgRes(19)
02) --> Bone Smasher==> EndRdx(2)Acc(5)Dmg(13)Dmg(31)Dmg(42)Acc(50)
04) --> Death Shroud==> EndRdx(4)Acc(5)Dmg(15)Dmg(31)Dmg(43)
06) --> Build Up==> Rechg(6)Rechg(7)Rechg(15)
08) --> Whirling Hands==> EndRdx(8)Acc(9)Dmg(19)Dmg(37)Dmg(43)
10) --> Obsidian Shield==> EndRdx(10)DmgRes(11)DmgRes(11)DmgRes(33)
12) --> Combat Jumping==> EndRdx(12)DefBuf(13)DefBuf(34)DefBuf(40)
14) --> Super Jump==> Jump(14)
16) --> Dark Regeneration==> EndRdx(16)Acc(17)Rechg(17)Acc(46)Heal(46)Heal(50)
18) --> Swift==> Run(18)
20) --> Health==> Heal(20)Heal(21)Heal(21)
22) --> Stamina==> EndMod(22)EndMod(23)EndMod(23)
24) --> Total Focus==> EndRdx(24)Acc(25)Dmg(25)Dmg(31)Dmg(34)Acc(40)
26) --> Cloak Of Darkness==> EndRdx(26)DefBuf(27)DefBuf(27)DefBuf(39)
28) --> Murky Cloud==> EndRdx(28)DmgRes(29)DmgRes(29)DmgRes(33)
30) --> Acrobatics==> EndRdx(30)
32) --> Hasten==> Rechg(32)Rechg(33)Rechg(34)
35) --> Energy Transfer==> EndRdx(35)Acc(36)Dmg(36)Dmg(36)Dmg(37)Acc(40)
38) --> Cloak Of Fear==> EndRdx(38)Acc(39)Fear(39)TH_DeBuf(43)Fear(50)
41) --> Soul Transfer==> Rechg(41)Rechg(42)
44) --> Boxing==> EndRdx(44)Acc(45)Dmg(45)Dmg(45)Dmg(46)
47) --> Tough==> EndRdx(47)DmgRes(48)DmgRes(48)DmgRes(48)
49) --> Super Speed==> EndRdx(49)
---------------------------------------------
01) --> Sprint==> Run(1)
01) --> Brawl==> Acc(1)
01) --> Fury==> Empty(1)
02) --> Rest==> Rechg(2)
---------------------------------------------