Getting some def/res on my Plant/Rad and other Q's

Hey All,

Before I start I have to ask this, does seeds of confusion ever really lose its usefulness? cause I'm dead without it for the most part.

Now for the question, I play a Plant/Rad duo which allowed me to gain an extra power since only one of the two had to take RI while the other took EF, problem here is that if my Seeds doesn't take hold, even with Vines (which I didn't take yet) I really can't take the punishment that the mobs dish out.

The obvious choice here would be tough/weave but I don't have any pools left (I have flight/Fitness/Speed(hasten)/Leadership (assault/Maneuvers) already, so other then using RI every fight (which really isn't practical sometimes) and 2x Maneuvers am I stuck waiting for my epic shield?

Can anyone suggest any sets perhaps that might help me out that could be slotted into my build, I have a sample (unslotted) build listed bellow. Yes I took both the Single target imob and the group one for extra damage. Also, I will be taking Lingering Radiation on one and Spores burst on the other (cause it resets so fast I don't need 2)

Also, Do I want/need Fly trap? I hear it's not that good of a troller Pet, now to explain my play style, I am totally ranged, I almost never get into melee range unless something comes at me and I'm waiting for Seeds to recharge.


Hero Plan by Mids' Hero Designer 1.401
http://www.cohplanner.com/

[u]Click this DataLink to open the build![u]

Level 48 Science Controller
Primary Power Set: Plant Control
Secondary Power Set: Radiation Emission
Power Pool: Fitness
Power Pool: Flight
Power Pool: Speed
Power Pool: Leadership
Ancillary Pool: Fire Mastery

Hero Profile:
Level 1: Strangler -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Radiant Aura -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Roots -- Empty(A)
Level 4: Accelerate Metabolism -- Empty(A)
Level 6: Swift -- Empty(A)
Level 8: Seeds of Confusion -- Empty(A)
Level 10: Hover -- Empty(A)
Level 12: Radiation Infection or Enervating Field -- Empty(A)
Level 14: Health -- Empty(A)
Level 16: Entangle -- Empty(A)
Level 18: Hasten -- Empty(A)
Level 20: Stamina -- Empty(A)
Level 22: Fly -- Empty(A)
Level 24: Assault -- Empty(A)
Level 26: Carrion Creepers -- Empty(A)
Level 28: Maneuvers -- Empty(A)
Level 30: Vines -- Empty(A)
Level 32: Fly Trap -- Empty(A)
Level 35: Lingering Radiation or Spores Burst -- Empty(A)
Level 38: EM Pulse -- Empty(A)
Level 41: Choking Cloud -- Empty(A)
Level 44: Fire Ball -- Empty(A)
Level 47: Fire Shield -- Empty(A)
Level 49: Tactics -- Empty(A)
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Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Containment



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While you can use sets to create substantial defense, it requires a considerable investment in slots and influence. I would begin by tightening other areas of your build and strategy.

The first thing I would do is take EF on both characters. It has a quick animation so it isn't a problem to set them both up. The additional damage debuffing will provide that extra mitigation for anything that isn't controlled, and the resistance debuff is well worth stacking for quicker defeats. Personally I would take RI on both also for similar reasons.

Seeds is a truly excellent power and will remain useful throughout your career. Make sure it is well slotted for accuracy and recharge (confuse duration is sometimes useful but certainly lower priority) to keep it as consistent as possible. Another option is to combine a stealth IO with SS to provide you with effective invis. If that isn't an option, you could try to work grant invis into the build. This allows you to pick an ideal position from which to activate seeds and get the entire group.

Are you up to creepers yet? Once you are the power will draw a lot of aggro away from you. Make sure to get lots of recharge into it and alternate between the two characters so that one is always up.

A couple of other thoughts. Taking both immobilizers is fine; I have both on my plant/rad. Roots in particular is excellent, doing a lot more damage than equivalent powers in other sets, so it should be well slotted as an aoe damage power.

Not sure if I would take choking cloud. The ability to have two running makes it more tempting as they will overlap nicely, but plant/rad really lends itself to playing from range.

Similarly, stacking assault and tactics is pretty tempting. However I don't see much benefit in taking maneuvers unless you routinely use RI or generate significantly more defense in the build.

As a final suggestion, it may be worth taking a different APP on each. While I remember from your other thread that you like to maintain a consistent power selection it certainly wouldn't hurt to mix up the damage types a little.

[ QUOTE ]


The first thing I would do is take EF on both characters. It has a quick animation so it isn't a problem to set them both up. The additional damage debuffing will provide that extra mitigation for anything that isn't controlled, and the resistance debuff is well worth stacking for quicker defeats. Personally I would take RI on both also for similar reasons.


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Well, I could drop C Cloud for this, there's room that way, other then that I dont see any other powers I can drop.

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Seeds is a truly excellent power and will remain useful throughout your career. Make sure it is well slotted for accuracy and recharge (confuse duration is sometimes useful but certainly lower priority) to keep it as consistent as possible.


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I am currently slotting 3 Acc 3 Recharge in it, so I'm at my max other then running Tatics x2

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Another option is to combine a stealth IO with SS to provide you with effective invis. If that isn't an option, you could try to work grant invis into the build. This allows you to pick an ideal position from which to activate seeds and get the entire group.

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No room for SS, and I really don't like SS anyways, I could drop another slot into Sprint and get the stealth IO in there, would it help a little?

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Are you up to creepers yet? Once you are the power will draw a lot of aggro away from you. Make sure to get lots of recharge into it and alternate between the two characters so that one is always up.

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Nope, 1/2 a level to go to get it, I might have it by the time you read this really looking forward to it.

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Not sure if I would take choking cloud. The ability to have two running makes it more tempting as they will overlap nicely, but plant/rad really lends itself to playing from range.


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yea CC was an Idea but I've read alot of bad stuff about it, same thing with Fly Trap, dunno if the pet is any good.

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Similarly, stacking assault and tactics is pretty tempting. However I don't see much benefit in taking maneuvers unless you routinely use RI or generate significantly more defense in the build.

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Was thinking of getting it cause well, I have nothing else LOL, and I don't have Carrion Crawlers yet, I might change my mind on this whole issue once I see what they do.


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As a final suggestion, it may be worth taking a different APP on each. While I remember from your other thread that you like to maintain a consistent power selection it certainly wouldn't hurt to mix up the damage types a little.

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Fire is my choice simply because the other APP's do not have a tier one AoE damage and I'm all about AoE.

In regards to looking for free power selections, I would absolutely consider maneuvers and choking cloud to be optional.

Maneuvers really does need some additional defense or consistent use of tohit debuffing to make any substantial difference. This could be done with set bonuses or a def-based APP shield. Without those I really wouldn't bother.

Choking cloud can be a very good power under the right circumstances. It is often cited as a critical power in the success of fire/rad, since fire control lacks some of the long-battle control that most other sets have and the cloud combines extremely well with hot feet. Plant/rad is certainly capable of maintaining extended control without cloud and doesn't have much reason to get into melee. As such I consider the power very optional, though I don't see anything wrong with its inclusion if you decide to keep it.

For a travel power, I use SS which effectively saves me a power in the prereq and allows me to stack for invis. While the lack of vertical movement would normally frustrate me to no end, I find the raptor pack from the first safeguard followed by the purchaseable pack from the shard after 40 makes this a non-issue. Without SS I wouldn't expect the stealth proc to do very much for you. If you're set on hover/fly I wouldn't pursue this avenue.

Fly trap isn't fantastic and some people do decide to skip it. I found its main use is helping deal with EB/AVs and other tough single targets. To me it certainly seems to cycle powers better than it did before the pet recharge/power usage changes, so keep in mind it may be a little stronger than older criticisms suggests, but it certainly lags behind other controller pets.

It isn't quite true that no other APP opens an aoe power at 41; stone mastery has fissure, which is quite strong but suffers from a short range. If you find from my earlier suggestions that you can free up a power or two there are some real gems available, such as ice mastery for the pair of aoe powers or psi for mez protection.

If you're interested in seeing my build let me know. Do keep in mind though that it is (a) a level 50 respec build that looks fairly different from what I levelled with; and (b) it cost somewhere in the neighbourhood of 2 billion.

[ QUOTE ]
In regards to looking for free power selections, I would absolutely consider maneuvers and choking cloud to be optional.

Maneuvers really does need some additional defense or consistent use of tohit debuffing to make any substantial difference. This could be done with set bonuses or a def-based APP shield. Without those I really wouldn't bother.

Choking cloud can be a very good power under the right circumstances. It is often cited as a critical power in the success of fire/rad, since fire control lacks some of the long-battle control that most other sets have and the cloud combines extremely well with hot feet. Plant/rad is certainly capable of maintaining extended control without cloud and doesn't have much reason to get into melee. As such I consider the power very optional, though I don't see anything wrong with its inclusion if you decide to keep it.

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I think with your advice I will skip Man and CC, they were just an idea anyways, I think with 2x vines I have all the control I need. I dunno if I will spend the time/inf to buy sets after sets so perhaps going for shielding other then the APP is a waste.


[ QUOTE ]
For a travel power, I use SS which effectively saves me a power in the prereq and allows me to stack for invis. While the lack of vertical movement would normally frustrate me to no end, I find the raptor pack from the first safeguard followed by the purchaseable pack from the shard after 40 makes this a non-issue. Without SS I wouldn't expect the stealth proc to do very much for you. If you're set on hover/fly I wouldn't pursue this avenue.

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I wish I could like/get used to SS or super jump but I can't so Fly it is. I wish I had a power pool open for stealth but I dont


[ QUOTE ]
Fly trap isn't fantastic and some people do decide to skip it. I found its main use is helping deal with EB/AVs and other tough single targets. To me it certainly seems to cycle powers better than it did before the pet recharge/power usage changes, so keep in mind it may be a little stronger than older criticisms suggests, but it certainly lags behind other controller pets.

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Thats what I read, thankfully with dual builds I can give this a go (or the test server) and see if I like them or not.

[ QUOTE ]

It isn't quite true that no other APP opens an aoe power at 41; stone mastery has fissure, which is quite strong but suffers from a short range. If you find from my earlier suggestions that you can free up a power or two there are some real gems available, such as ice mastery for the pair of aoe powers or psi for mez protection.

If you're interested in seeing my build let me know. Do keep in mind though that it is (a) a level 50 respec build that looks fairly different from what I levelled with; and (b) it cost somewhere in the neighbourhood of 2 billion.

[/ QUOTE ]

Humm, I'll have to recheck mids, I don't remember seeing that in Stone Mastery.

Yes, I would like to loojk at your build, ummm, it will be a bit till I have that 2bill however, heh.

Here it is. I mentioned some of the things you should keep in mind when looking at it. A lot of the slotting is based on being level 50; you will notice for example that creepers doesn't have much recharge slotted, which is something I wouldn't have done without all the recharge bonuses making it perma anyway. Squeezing in both tough and mind over body really does help my aggressive play style, though I had neither through most of my levelling and didn't find it to be a problem.

While recharge was my number one priority, I was completely satisfied having enough for permahasten/AM/creepers, so in my second pass at the build I gave up a few percentage points to work in some ranged defense. It's not a lot but it does help, and stacks very nicely with RI when I feel I need it.

Oh, and in case it wasn't clear already, ignore the order the powers are listed in. I just plugged everything in as convenient. I only had to watch the order of the APP powers to get the slotting right.

Edit: I should add that, while this build has a very substantial investment, you can get something fairly close by replacing most of the purples (though I would still use the confuse set as it isn't really that expensive). May not be able to keep some of the buffs permanent, and you may have to adjust the slotting for some powers, notably creepers, but it wouldn't lose a huge amount.

Hero Plan by Mids' Hero Designer 1.401
http://www.cohplanner.com/

[u]Click this DataLink to open the build![u]

Level 50 Magic Controller
Primary Power Set: Plant Control
Secondary Power Set: Radiation Emission
Power Pool: Fighting
Power Pool: Fitness
Power Pool: Speed
Ancillary Pool: Psionic Mastery

Hero Profile:
Level 1: Strangler -- BasGaze-Acc/Hold(A), BasGaze-EndRdx/Rchg/Hold(3), BasGaze-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg/Hold(3), BasGaze-Acc/Rchg(5), UbrkCons-Dam%(5), HO:Perox(7)
Level 1: Radiant Aura -- HO:Golgi(A), HO:Golgi(46)
Level 2: Entangle -- TotHntr-Dam%(A), Decim-Acc/Dmg(34), Decim-Dmg/EndRdx(36), Decim-Dmg/Rchg(36), Decim-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg(37), Decim-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(37)
Level 4: Roots -- Posi-Acc/Dmg(A), TotHntr-Dam%(17), Posi-Dmg/EndRdx(23), Posi-Dmg/Rchg(23), Posi-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(25), Posi-Dam%(25)
Level 6: Radiation Infection -- HO:Enzym(A), HO:Enzym(7), HO:Enzym(9)
Level 8: Seeds of Confusion -- CoPers-Conf(A), CoPers-Conf/Rchg(9), CoPers-Acc/Conf/Rchg(11), CoPers-Acc/Rchg(11), CoPers-Conf/EndRdx(13), CoPers-Conf%(13)
Level 10: Accelerate Metabolism -- RechRdx-I(A), Efficacy-EndMod/Rchg(15), P'Shift-EndMod/Rchg(15), Efficacy-EndMod(17)
Level 12: Enervating Field -- EndRdx-I(A), EndRdx-I(46)
Level 14: Boxing -- Empty(A)
Level 16: Tough -- S'fstPrt-ResDam/Def+(A), HO:Ribo(33), ResDam-I(34)
Level 18: Vines -- BasGaze-Acc/Rchg(A), BasGaze-Rchg/Hold(19), BasGaze-EndRdx/Rchg/Hold(19), BasGaze-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg/Hold(21), HO:Endo(21)
Level 20: Lingering Radiation -- TmpRdns-Acc/EndRdx(A), P'ngTtl-Acc/EndRdx(33), RechRdx-I(34)
Level 22: Swift -- Run-I(A)
Level 24: Health -- Mrcl-Rcvry+(A)
Level 26: Carrion Creepers -- Posi-Acc/Dmg(A), Posi-Dmg/EndRdx(27), Posi-Dmg/Rchg(27), Posi-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(29), Posi-Dam%(29), ExStrk-Dam%(31)
Level 28: Stamina -- EndMod-I(A), EndMod-I(31)
Level 30: Hasten -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(31), RechRdx-I(33)
Level 32: Fly Trap -- ExRmnt-Acc/Rchg(A), ExRmnt-Acc/Dmg(37), ExRmnt-Dmg/EndRdx(40), ExRmnt-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(40), ExRmnt-EndRdx/Dmg/Rchg(43), ExRmnt-+Res(Pets)(43)
Level 35: Super Speed -- Zephyr-ResKB(A), Zephyr-Travel/EndRdx(36)
Level 38: EM Pulse -- BasGaze-Acc/Rchg(A), BasGaze-Rchg/Hold(39), BasGaze-EndRdx/Rchg/Hold(39), BasGaze-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg/Hold(39), HO:Endo(40)
Level 41: Mental Blast -- Apoc-Dmg(A), Apoc-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(42), Apoc-Acc/Rchg(42), Apoc-Dmg/EndRdx(42), Apoc-Dam%(43)
Level 44: Indomitable Will -- LkGmblr-Rchg+(A), LkGmblr-Def/Rchg(45), RechRdx-I(45), RechRdx-I(45), Ksmt-ToHit+(46)
Level 47: Psionic Tornado -- Ragnrk-Dmg(A), Ragnrk-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(48), Ragnrk-Acc/Rchg(48), Ragnrk-Dmg/EndRdx(48), Ragnrk-Dmg/Rchg(50)
Level 49: Mind Over Body -- TtmC'tng-ResDam/EndRdx(A), HO:Ribo(50), ResDam-I(50)
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Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- ULeap-Stlth(A)
Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Containment