Doomlord's Guide the MSTF - 3rd Edition [I12]

The third edtion of my MSTF guide is up and ready to go. Since it weighs in at 4637 words, I've once again decided not to post the full text of the guide on the forums. It is available at the link below as a .pdf file, and in the future may also be available as a webpage (we'll see). Comments and suggestions are always welcome. I'm especially interested in any alternate strategies you've come up with for taking on this TF. Enjoy the guide.

Download the guide as a .pdf here:
Doomlord's MSTF Guide

Changes for 1st revision:
<ul type="square">[*]Added the instructions back in for keeping enough mez resistance on the Tanker during the fight with Ghost Widow. Apologies to anyone who tried to do the MSTF without that. [*]Clarified the mechanics involved in preventing Recluse from spawning his Bane Spiders.[/list]
Changes for the 3rd edition:
<ul type="square">[*]New introduction, complete with shameless rip on a certain other MMO's development team.[*]Reworked powerset recommendations that better outline teams without a Stone/ Tanker and include I12's proliferated sets.[*]Rewritten strategy for Mission 1 to clarify WEB piece strategy.[*]Rewritten vine room strategy in Mission 3 to clarify positioning of squishies.[*]Heavily revised strategy for taking down Recluse.[/list]

Pretty good overview. One thing I didn't see, you didn't mention Ghost Widow's worst aspect, her MAG 100 Cone Hold. The safest method to handle that is to make sure that the Tanker has, AT ALL TIMES, at least 8 Clear Mind/Increase Density mez buffs on him. Absent those stacked mez buffs the tanker has to rely on purple insps and hope that the random number generator doesn't take a dislike to him. You touched on this earlier in the description but it probably bears spelling out in the writeup on GW.

I've been on both sides of that equation with my Stone/Fire tanker and my Mind/Kin controller, a kinetic can keep 15 stacked ID's on the tanker by himself if he does nothing else, or he can keep the 8 the tank needs and still have time if he's attentive to aid in the smackdown on GW. It's easier for an Emp with CM since you've got a longer duration on CM than ID.

On LR, you can prevent his bane spawn (except for the "pet nuke" at 25%) by having one of the debuffers toss a toggle debuff on him, his pet summon is interruptable. The tanker's aura will serve the same purpose (as long as it has an autohit component, sorry Fire &amp; Dark) if he's in melee range, the debuff just makes sure. We generally have the tanker pull LR to the back corner way behind the Green tower, that way we don't have to worry about the Flier if it spawns during the beatdown of LR.

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Pretty good overview. One thing I didn't see, you didn't mention Ghost Widow's worst aspect, her MAG 100 Cone Hold. The safest method to handle that is to make sure that the Tanker has, AT ALL TIMES, at least 8 Clear Mind/Increase Density mez buffs on him. Absent those stacked mez buffs the tanker has to rely on purple insps and hope that the random number generator doesn't take a dislike to him. You touched on this earlier in the description but it probably bears spelling out in the writeup on GW.

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Must have accidentally edited this out - it should have been in there. I'll throw it back in.

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On LR, you can prevent his bane spawn (except for the "pet nuke" at 25%) by having one of the debuffers toss a toggle debuff on him, his pet summon is interruptable. The tanker's aura will serve the same purpose (as long as it has an autohit component, sorry Fire &amp; Dark) if he's in melee range, the debuff just makes sure.

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The thing about this is that debuffing Recluse with a rad toggle generates a LOT of agro. If the Tank hits a lag spike, guess what happens? I left this out based on my experience with him ganking the Rad. It's only happened to me once in all the runs I've made of the TF, but I think if the Tanker aura is sufficient then the Rad is more of a danger than it's worth.

I should probably spell that out a bit in the guide though, if people want to use a Tank without the autohit aura etc.

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We generally have the tanker pull LR to the back corner way behind the Green tower, that way we don't have to worry about the Flier if it spawns during the beatdown of LR.

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The formation I spelled out won't agro the Flier (to the Tanker anyways) and it keeps the Empath within close proximity to the tower team the entire time, meaning buffs can be interchanged. Again, putting the corner-pull formation in as an alternate strategy might not be a bad idea, but I don't like it as much as the one I put in there.

Thanks for the feedback. I'll post an edited version when I have the chance.

EDIT: Revision is up. Let me know what you think.

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On LR, you can prevent his bane spawn (except for the "pet nuke" at 25%) by having one of the debuffers toss a toggle debuff on him, his pet summon is interruptable. The tanker's aura will serve the same purpose (as long as it has an autohit component, sorry Fire &amp; Dark) if he's in melee range, the debuff just makes sure.

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The thing about this is that debuffing Recluse with a rad toggle generates a LOT of agro. If the Tank hits a lag spike, guess what happens? I left this out based on my experience with him ganking the Rad. It's only happened to me once in all the runs I've made of the TF, but I think if the Tanker aura is sufficient then the Rad is more of a danger than it's worth.

I should probably spell that out a bit in the guide though, if people want to use a Tank without the autohit aura etc.

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Hmm, in all the STF's I've tanked I've never lost LR's aggro, although to be safe I always auto taunt for the purpose... and I keep him in melee range as a double whammy with my aura. I've also run several STF's with my Rad/Rad and I've never had him loose interest in the tanker and go after me... but I've had competent tankers I could trust.

Oh, one trick we discovered by accident a couple-three months ago, LR seems to have a maximum altitude that his AI functions... we discovered this by having a Rad anchor him and fly to max altitude. LR hopped up the side of the building behind him to a high ledge... then just stood there and completely ignored us as we took out the towers then pounded on him on the ledge. Undoubtedly a bug, and it may have been fixed since but it was the easiest takedown of LR I've ever had.

We haven't tried to repeat those circumstances to see if the bug's repeatable... interestingly enough the Fire controller's Imps just stood there as well and would not attack.

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On LR, you can prevent his bane spawn (except for the "pet nuke" at 25%) by having one of the debuffers toss a toggle debuff on him, his pet summon is interruptable. The tanker's aura will serve the same purpose (as long as it has an autohit component, sorry Fire &amp; Dark) if he's in melee range, the debuff just makes sure.

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The thing about this is that debuffing Recluse with a rad toggle generates a LOT of agro. If the Tank hits a lag spike, guess what happens? I left this out based on my experience with him ganking the Rad. It's only happened to me once in all the runs I've made of the TF, but I think if the Tanker aura is sufficient then the Rad is more of a danger than it's worth.

I should probably spell that out a bit in the guide though, if people want to use a Tank without the autohit aura etc.

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Hmm, in all the STF's I've tanked I've never lost LR's aggro, although to be safe I always auto taunt for the purpose... and I keep him in melee range as a double whammy with my aura. I've also run several STF's with my Rad/Rad and I've never had him loose interest in the tanker and go after me... but I've had competent tankers I could trust.

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I guess my philosophy on this is basically "if you can guarantee the auto-hit aura will work, why risk the Rad debuff?" But that's been spelled out now, so we're good.

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Oh, one trick we discovered by accident a couple-three months ago, LR seems to have a maximum altitude that his AI functions... we discovered this by having a Rad anchor him and fly to max altitude. LR hopped up the side of the building behind him to a high ledge... then just stood there and completely ignored us as we took out the towers then pounded on him on the ledge. Undoubtedly a bug, and it may have been fixed since but it was the easiest takedown of LR I've ever had.

We haven't tried to repeat those circumstances to see if the bug's repeatable... interestingly enough the Fire controller's Imps just stood there as well and would not attack.

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It's indeed repeatable, but it's a pain in the [censored] to get Recluse up there because of the spastic nature of his AI. The only semi-reliable way I've found is snipe-pulling, but Recluse has a long range, and the puller isn't going to last very long against him. So it's both a bug and a very risky/unreliable maneuver.

Your guide takes too many risks, in my opinion. (particularly with the flier)
Our group always kills the flier twice before engaging recluse to be sure it is at the beginning of its timer.

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Your guide takes too many risks, in my opinion. (particularly with the flier)
Our group always kills the flier twice before engaging recluse to be sure it is at the beginning of its timer.

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Care to elaborate?

The flier is on a timer. If you happen to kill it near the beginning of its timer, you will have plenty of time to kill the towers and recluse. If you catch it near the end of the timer, it will respawn as you are fighting the towers/recluse, and can easily kill one or more people. To avoid the possibility, we kill it once. Then we wait for it to respawn, and kill it again. That way we know we killed it right at the beginning of the timer.

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The flier is on a timer. If you happen to kill it near the beginning of its timer, you will have plenty of time to kill the towers and recluse. If you catch it near the end of the timer, it will respawn as you are fighting the towers/recluse, and can easily kill one or more people. To avoid the possibility, we kill it once. Then we wait for it to respawn, and kill it again. That way we know we killed it right at the beginning of the timer.

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Correct. This is all in the guide on page 12 in the paragraph right below the screenshot of the Inner Circle.

I read it. You never suggested killing it twice before engaging recluse or the towers.

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I read it. You never suggested killing it twice before engaging recluse or the towers.

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Um...
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The Flier spawns once every 20 minutes whether or not it is currently on the map. Be aware that it may come back within seconds of being taken down. If you want to give yourself the maximum available downtime on the flier (recommended if you have the patience), take it down once, let it respawn, and take it down again. You will now have 20 minutes to get Recluse, minus whatever time it took to take out the flier, which is usually sufficient time."

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Apparently I'm an idiot. My apologies.

The flier respawns every 20 minutes from the time the first person enters the mission. I find it very helpful to push a timer as soon as I enter. If after clearing the 4 AVs I look and notice we are near 20 or 40 minutes, we just call a break until the thing respawns. Saves having to beat it down twice, gives a nice leg stretch and beverage refill. Also useful if we catch the flier in the middle of its spawn period and decide to start right away, and then after clearing a tower or two we notice the time is getting close we will pull out and wait for it to respawn in safety.

Vine Room - after clearing the CoT, we move around to a position about 9-10 o'clock on the map near the outer wall (west side, slightly north), there is a nice rock there and it is plenty far from tree aggro. We dole out buffs and then have most of the team move out and kill vines working clockwise, while the Tanker(s) and possibly a tough scrapper move counter-clockwise. This generally avoids squishy tree aggro. Buffers of course need to understand that they cannot go help said tanker(s) and/or scrapper, and those armored characters need to understand they are on their own after the initial buffs (although they can always pull out of the tree area and run around the tree to get rebuffed, but usually the squishy team is already almost all the way around by the time buffs are wearing off). The squishy team needs to be aware of when they hit 3 o'clock and be cautious to avoid tree aggro.

Mission 4: Strategy 1 - its proper name is Door of Doom! (also Happy Fun Time!)

GW - you mention mag 5 immobilize, however, I have noticed that she often still moves, no matter how much immob stacking we have. I think it would be worthwhile to mention in the main section that the tanker needs to STAY at range by backing up as GW occasionally tries to enter melee, instead of it just being a footnote. I also think it is worth mentioning that no one, other than the tanker, should be in front of GW, ever, since her hold power is a cone. Attacking her from behind is preferable. It might also be worth noting that if the tanker gets Black Holed, the rest of the team should probably pull out of melee and they need to be careful in case she turns around. If a second tanker is on the team, it is very helpful if the taunt tanker also has some range attacks, in order to build some damage on top of the taunting, just to make sure gauntlet doesn't get lucky and override the taunter (also the melee tanker should turn off any taunt aura, and scrappers with taunt auras should do likewise). I have seen PA take aggro off a taunting tanker as well, but that is dependent on how well slotted Taunt is and how many range attacks the taunter is using.

Mako - Mako will occasionally go crazy and start running a lot. I recommend the tanker not chase. If you don't chase, Mako always comes back, and the team doesn't have to try to reposition to avoid his cones. It might be worthwhile to mention that just before he Eludes he uses a nuke that stuns for a long time, so status protection after you get him to 50% can be very helpful.

Scirocco - his AoE hold can be killer, and he likes to use it near the beginning of a fight and then if he lasts longe enough, occasionally throughout the fight. I'd recommend a note that while fighting him, status protection buffs (or BFs) are important for the squishies. He also has a tendency to drain End, although most teams can cover that pretty well.

Nice guide, I think it should be helpful.

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The flier respawns every 20 minutes from the time the first person enters the mission. I find it very helpful to push a timer as soon as I enter. If after clearing the 4 AVs I look and notice we are near 20 or 40 minutes, we just call a break until the thing respawns. Saves having to beat it down twice, gives a nice leg stretch and beverage refill. Also useful if we catch the flier in the middle of its spawn period and decide to start right away, and then after clearing a tower or two we notice the time is getting close we will pull out and wait for it to respawn in safety.

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But... but it's so cool to watch when it explodes!

...

It's not a bad idea to keep a timer on it. I'll throw this in at some point.

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Vine Room - after clearing the CoT, we move around to a position about 9-10 o'clock on the map near the outer wall (west side, slightly north), there is a nice rock there and it is plenty far from tree aggro. We dole out buffs and then have most of the team move out and kill vines working clockwise, while the Tanker(s) and possibly a tough scrapper move counter-clockwise. This generally avoids squishy tree aggro. Buffers of course need to understand that they cannot go help said tanker(s) and/or scrapper, and those armored characters need to understand they are on their own after the initial buffs (although they can always pull out of the tree area and run around the tree to get rebuffed, but usually the squishy team is already almost all the way around by the time buffs are wearing off). The squishy team needs to be aware of when they hit 3 o'clock and be cautious to avoid tree aggro.

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This should be covered under Strategy 1.

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Mission 4: Strategy 1 - its proper name is Door of Doom! (also Happy Fun Time!)

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It has an auto-hit Invoke Panic on anyone who's never done it this way before.

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GW - you mention mag 5 immobilize, however, I have noticed that she often still moves, no matter how much immob stacking we have. I think it would be worthwhile to mention in the main section that the tanker needs to STAY at range by backing up as GW occasionally tries to enter melee, instead of it just being a footnote.

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I've never had a problem keeping Ghost Widow in one place with the Immobilize strategy - the Purple Triangles don't effect Immobilize, so she should stay put. Something to test sometime, perhaps?

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I also think it is worth mentioning that no one, other than the tanker, should be in front of GW, ever, since her hold power is a cone. Attacking her from behind is preferable.

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I would think flipping around the AVs is kind of a standard thing for a Tanker, but... I spend a lot of this guide stating the semi-obvious about how to play the game, so it might as well go in somewhere.

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It might also be worth noting that if the tanker gets Black Holed, the rest of the team should probably pull out of melee and they need to be careful in case she turns around.

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This is an ugly little situation, but I would actually advise remaining in melee. Widow might get a heal off on the melee builds, but they'll be beating the [censored] out of her which should (hopefully - grey area here) generate enough threat to keep her on them instead of attacking the squishies (the Rad most likely, in this case) which would in all likelyhood constitute an MSTF failure.

So, basically, I didn't mention it because you don't change anything when the Tanker gets phased.

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If a second tanker is on the team, it is very helpful if the taunt tanker also has some range attacks, in order to build some damage on top of the taunting, just to make sure gauntlet doesn't get lucky and override the taunter (also the melee tanker should turn off any taunt aura, and scrappers with taunt auras should do likewise).

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This is why I don't recommend taking a second Tanker, but you're absolutely correct.

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I have seen PA take aggro off a taunting tanker as well, but that is dependent on how well slotted Taunt is and how many range attacks the taunter is using.

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Never seen this happen, but I suppose it could if the Tanker really screwed up and six-slotted Taunt with End Redux or something. I think the need to use a ranged attack to raise threat is a good thing to put in there, though.

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Mako - Mako will occasionally go crazy and start running a lot. I recommend the tanker not chase. If you don't chase, Mako always comes back, and the team doesn't have to try to reposition to avoid his cones. It might be worthwhile to mention that just before he Eludes he uses a nuke that stuns for a long time, so status protection after you get him to 50% can be very helpful.

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Agreed on the running thing, but he doesn't seem to do it very often for me. Good positioning should also fix the nuke issue... everything in melee of him should have the requisite status protection. I don't need to put an anti-Blapper rant in this thing, do I? *Sigh*

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Scirocco - his AoE hold can be killer, and he likes to use it near the beginning of a fight and then if he lasts longe enough, occasionally throughout the fight. I'd recommend a note that while fighting him, status protection buffs (or BFs) are important for the squishies. He also has a tendency to drain End, although most teams can cover that pretty well.

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Again, these issues get fixed with good team positioning.

Thanks for the feedback.

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I don't need to put an anti-Blapper rant in this thing, do I?

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I hope not, but if you told me to keep my Fire/Fire blaster at range, I'd cry.

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I don't need to put an anti-Blapper rant in this thing, do I?

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I hope not, but if you told me to keep my Fire/Fire blaster at range, I'd cry.

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Keep your Fire/Fire blaster at range.

That's one of the things I constantly try to remind the team to do (not just blasters, everyone except the tank). In any other situation I don't care, but 1 death matters.

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I don't need to put an anti-Blapper rant in this thing, do I?

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I hope not, but if you told me to keep my Fire/Fire blaster at range, I'd cry.

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Keep your Fire/Fire blaster at range.

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A blaster with max HP, great Regen, and as much resist as possible can stand right next to those AVs. I've seen it; I've even done this myself.

jakke, even a scrapper with max HP and great resist can be 2 shotted by Aeon. I would not invite you on a MSTF if you planned on trying to melee him with your blaster.

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I don't need to put an anti-Blapper rant in this thing, do I?

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I hope not, but if you told me to keep my Fire/Fire blaster at range, I'd cry.

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Keep your Fire/Fire blaster at range.

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A blaster with max HP, great Regen, and as much resist as possible can stand right next to those AVs. I've seen it; I've even done this myself.

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They most cetainly can. They're called Scrappers.