Ninja/Poison guide, no patron allowed (I10)

Bakta_hero · 02-13-2008 02:50 AM

Content :

1) Ninja line
2) Poison line
3) Pool powers :
3.1) Travel power.
3.2) The must have
3.3) Personnal choice
4) Patron Power
5) Build
6) IO and sets
6.1) The unique that we need.
6.2) Those that we do not
7) Tactics
7.1) The BG pull.
7.2) Mujiks!.
7.3) The Hello-Kitty pull

Foreword : While EvilRyu's guide is a recommended reading, I wanted to expand and modernize it, taking into account IOs.

Basic setting : This is one of my many many MMs, me going Pikachu on them, whom I played mostly solo. It's basic theme is : No attack from the primaries, a mostly pve build as I play lean hours, and no patron powers. The last being more due to the fact having a patron would be unbecoming for this MM, based on Sax Rohmer's books. Having no patrons means one has a lot of free slots to spend, and a good deal of pool powers to choose from.

Set pro and cons.

Pro

It's a solo beast. Poison is the best Single Target (ST from now on) debuffer that is; the set has one weak power only. Heroes/EB are putty in your capable hands (with one or two exception)
Ninjas are fast and furious. This is both a blessing and a curse, but no battle ever is boring or tedious. This is the way it should be, I noticed that the longer the fight, the more often it could spin out of control, with much frustration. I can't say the same about my Bot/FF, but I love reading a good book too.

Con

Ninja are high on offence but rely on defence to avoid being hit. Once they're hit, health drops fast, mostly true for genin, Alkaloïd is not the best heal around.

It's not a set for the faint hearted nor control-lazy. One learns very early in life that genins/jonins tends to wanders off faster than the roadrunner; it's not to everybody's taste.

On binds and macros.

I wrote my own macros using Curveball's guide mostly. I have to use macros (family reasons, I never know which of the normal pc or the laptop is free), but binds are better as it'll free up some space on the power bars.

Before we get to the meat of building, slotting and tactics, let's get over the binds. I'll not go over them in depths, there are a lot of good guides on the issue, but will mention some that are ninja specific.

First and foremost. If you haven't done it by now, edit your follow button from Aggressive to Defensive. Bodyguard (BG) is a must for Nin/Pois as you don't have a self heal.

A valid pulling tactic involves you debuffing your mob of choice before heading back to your, out of sight, ninjas. You'll need a bind or macro for them to 'Stay' (stay +passive).

As you as you get Smoke Flash (SF) and jounin/oni, you'll want to reapply it as soon as possible (for something known as crittage, cf. below). And later on, as you'll want to use Noxious Gas optimally. I'd recommend to make one that just 'target' each of jounin/oni nominally so you can use either smoke flash or Nox Gas, or Heal without having to toggle through your pets. I use a macro which has the added advantage in this case that you'll need to hit it twice to apply SF.

Your life change markedly once you get your Oni. I found the following tactic to be especially handy : Send him, on aggro mode, near the mob you want extra-crispy, keeping the rest on BG mode. I'll explain it further in the tactics chapter. Mark one of your jounin for the task, the first one you got, before that for the same purpose.

1) Ninja line

I'll not even consider the various bow powers here, this ninja MM doesn't sully his hands. To keep stuff tidy, I'll not mention set until further below, in the IO section.

Call Genin
Your basic cannon fodder, they serve two purpose. First to saturate the field and take some aggro off you. Second to take hit from you. If anything keep them on BG mode as often as possible. Slot them full as soon as possible, if only for IO down the road.

Slotting : 3dmg, 2 Acc in any order then 1Rch.

Train Ninja
Your first training tool. To be used at the start of a mission. Early on, you don't have enough pets to buff that others will have to cool their heels on you. Once you start to get your 4th, think of using it on the fly, setting up for battle or on the move if you're in a team.

Slotting : It recharges rather quickly compared to Kuji In Zen, only 1 Rch and 1 Rdx if you must are needed.

Titbits : If you want to know the specific bonus/power your ninja gained from each training, just r-click the appropriate icon and read the "info".

Call Jounin
Now we're talking. When they're not using their ù$@!# wan***ing wrist-crossbow, they are an impressive close combat fighting machine. Unlike genins, their function is to be on offence as often as possible. Alas some of them like to play with their crossbows, you can't help it. Smoked, they either go for crits or placate, making it a fast fight. As with Genin, you'll want to slot them as soon as possible

Slotting : 3dmg, 2Acc, 1Rch or 1Conf later on.

Smoke Flash
Is for ninja what fort is from empaths. Use it generously as soon as it recharge. Basically it'll enable a mob to crits on his next attack. As such you'll want to use it either on your Oni, or on a close combat Jounin sometimes.

Slotting : 3Rch, 1Rdx. You may want a range in it.

Oni
The last and most formidable of your pets, some considers it your pocket dominator. It makes more and takes more damage than your other minions. As such he's often the one you'll want to start a fight, to make sure you won't grab aggro if you can't. With Kuji In Zen, he'll be able to hold, breath fire, use AoE fire rain and sword to get thing done. He's your first target for Alkaloid and SF. Please note that the End Redux means both you'll use less stamina summoning him, but that he'll too use less when using his powers.

Slotting : 3dmg, 2Acc, 1Rdx.

[Kuji In Zen]
Your last line of buffs. Unslotted, it has a recharge time of 10s and cost 22,8 per application. More often than not, you'll want to pop a blue once you're done

Slotting : 2rch, 1Rdx

And now, for the treat.

2) Poison line

This line takes quite some time to bloom, not because the nicer powers are far down the line, quite the contrary, but because you'll want to slot your primary line over them. There is one power that you'll both love and hate, the mandatory one. There is no such annoying thing than to activate Alkaloïd and see it land on a dead minion..Let's first cover the one power I chose not to pick.

Poison Trap
Available at 35, this power create a nice looking green ball at your feet. Should a mob pass by, it'll create a cloud which drains 10% of their End and create, unslotted, a mag. 3 sleep for 12s, hold for 4s. While it may be a valid tactic in a group, when or if someone else is doing some herding, it's a bulky tool solo for so little return. It's long animation time, and the fact it's interruptible prevent it's use in a fight where one has so many better things to do instead.

Back to the list :

Alkaloïd

Sigh. This will be your main healing tool, and it's a slow animation one. The end cost/heal isn't that bad though, it's just that until you have started to seriously slot your debuffs, you'll be forced to cycle it over and over during a fight. Writing this, I ponder the benefits of slotting this over the debuffs first. I think that' it's benefits outweighs theirs until one gets SO, but it should be worth doing it the other way around.

Slotting : 3Rch, 3Heal any way you prefer, it'll never prevent your minion to gets it too late.

Evenom
Your first nasty debuff. If you succeed, it'll stick for 30secs and debuff target's res., def., regen. and health. The visible result is a purple downward shield that one may miss. I'll recommend to get a clock and look at your combat log to see if it failed or not.

Slotting : 2Rch, 3 Debuff (def) and 1 Rdx.
As with primary line, I'll discuss sets in the IO section.

Weaken
Your second and very nasty debuff. If you succeed, unslotted it'll reduce mob's To Hit (-11%), Damage (-221%) and all of his special effects by a large share. This is the one tool you must keep on an EB/AV/Hero at all times. As for Evenom it'll stick for 30s.

Slotting : 2Rch, 3 Debuff (to hit) and 1 Rdx.

Those two comes together for me. As with Evenom, make sure you see if you succeeded or failed and when.

Neurotoxic breath

This odd power is available early but will come into force later as you don't have enough cover to use it before you get your Oni. It's another nasty one though, it slows travel powers by 65% on the average (fly being reduced 70%) and mob's Recharge redux by 65% too. It's main issue is it's range 60', taking you within mobs range. Once you get your Oni, who usually has used at least one AoE attack by the time you launch it, the issue happens far less often.

Slotting : 2Rch, 1Rdx, 3Slow

Elixir of Life

A.k.a. "How are we feeling today M. Muller?". This barfing gem is your rezz. It'll resurrect an ally, but after 90s will switch off all his toggles powers with a puking animation. Just make sure your ally is in the know, or if you don't like him just say nothing. It cannot be used on your pets, alas.

Slotting : 1 Rch

Antidote

This is your +Res vs mind powers. While it give a small cold and fair toxic resistance, where it shine is it give a 7,8 mag on stun, immob., sleep, hold, fear and conf for 90secs. There are few EB+ mobs that will require more than one application of this power (Inferno's mom, the tree-hugger in Eden or Sthrenoss (sp) comes to mind). It's cheap and has a fast animation too. It's best used before a fight (Succubi are now your.. naw, I won't say it) and kept on allies at all times whenever you know you'll face status effects mobs.

Slotting : 2 Rch

Paralytic Poison

Your personal single target mag 3 hold. With it, and if your Oni feels like using his, boss can be kept held for a whole fight very early on.

Slotting : 2Acc, 3Rch, 2Hold. It's recharge time is 16s unslotted, so one can use a Rdx or gets another Hold instead.

The last one is :

Noxious Gas

This little gem is pet targeted. When activated its create a small (around 10') AoE debuff zone around your pet of choice, the debuff effect being an overall 20%Def and 30%Res. On humanoid it "may" give a small timed hold. The issues with this power are twofold : First the AoE effect is small, so you will have to use it once your pet is within melee range otherwise it's wasted, but here kicks in the second problem. If you use it on a genin it often won't last long as genin will love nothing less than die for you. Repeatedly.

Slotting : 3Rch, 1Rdx./ It has a very long, 300s, recharge.

3) Pool powers :

This is where I went bargain shopping.

3.1) Travel power.

I went thematically and wanted to be Lagville efficient so I picked up Super Jump. As Hasten is almost a must should one want to chain use Alkaloid, Super Speed is a valid choice too.

3.2) The must have

As stated above : Hasten and the Fitness line. Hasten mostly for the reason mentioned above, but also when fighting and EB/AV where you want to be able to re-apply your debuff as soon as possible once they wear off or fails to hit. Fitness because all these click powers are costly when used (cf Tactic chapter).

3.3) Personnal choice

One line I chose early was going stealthy. The reasoning being simply that if I couldn't heal myself, and I chose not to go Medicine, then let's stack the odds in my favour otherwise. So I picked up : Stealth (always on in a mission map), invisibility (always on outside), and phase shift (a very good "Oh shift!" button).

4) Patron Power
This is a what if as I chose not to go down that road. Should I decide to pick one, my choice would be guided by this PP's shield and maybe one control like power while avoiding picking AoE attacks if possible

A quick review on these lines :
Leviathan Mastery : Needs two powers to get the shield. School of Shark cone has a nice immob which can be used along with Neuro breath. The shield is S/L/C only, making it a weak contender (unless you want to pvp, ice/energy blasters are in fashion currently).
Mace Mastery : The shield can be picked right from the start, it covers S/L and Energy and give a +res to toxic. A solid pve or pvp contender. One can go dowxn this line as Web Cocoon goes well with your own hold too. Strong contender.
Mu Mastery : Charged armour compares with Mace's one, this set can too offers something nice in terms of control (shackles are yummy!). Strong contender too
Soul Mastery : Covers negative instead of energy. I don't see those as often in the high end game. Otherwise decent too.

Bakta_hero · 02-13-2008 02:52 AM

5) Build

Villain Plan by Mids' Villain Designer 1,30
http://www.honourableunited.org.uk/mhd.php

Manchu: Level 50 Natural Mastermind
Primary Power Set: Ninjas
Secondary Power Set: Poison
Power Pool: Concealment
Power Pool: Fitness
Power Pool: Leaping
Power Pool: Speed

Villain Profile:
Level 1: Call Genin <ul type="square">[*] (A) Blood Mandate - Accuracy/Damage: Level 50[*] (3) Blood Mandate - Damage/Endurance: Level 50[*] (3) Blood Mandate - Accuracy/Endurance: Level 50[*] (5) Blood Mandate - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance: Level 50[*] (7) Blood Mandate - Accuracy: Level 50[*] (7) Blood Mandate - Damage: Level 50[/list]Level 1: Alkaloid <ul type="square">[*] (A) Doctored Wounds - Recharge: Level 50[*] (5) Doctored Wounds - Heal: Level 50[*] (9) Doctored Wounds - Heal/Endurance/Recharge: Level 50[*] (11) Doctored Wounds - Heal/Recharge: Level 50[*] (19) Doctored Wounds - Endurance/Recharge: Level 50[*] (37) Doctored Wounds - Heal/Endurance: Level 50[/list]Level 2: Envenom <ul type="square">[*] (A) Touch of Lady Grey - Defense Debuff: Level 50[*] (9) Touch of Lady Grey - Defense Debuff/Recharge: Level 50[*] (19) Touch of Lady Grey - Defense Debuff/Recharge/Endurance: Level 50[*] (33) Touch of Lady Grey - Recharge/Endurance: Level 50[*] (37) Touch of Lady Grey - Defense Debuff/Endurance: Level 50[*] (40) Touch of Lady Grey - Chance for Negative Damage: Level 50[/list]Level 4: Weaken <ul type="square">[*] (A) Dark Watcher's Despair - To Hit Debuff: Level 50[*] (17) Dark Watcher's Despair - To Hit Debuff/Recharge: Level 50[*] (34) Dark Watcher's Despair - Recharge/Endurance: Level 50[*] (36) Dark Watcher's Despair - To Hit Debuff/Endurance: Level 50[*] (37) Accuracy IO: Level 50[*] (40) Recharge Reduction IO: Level 50[/list]Level 6: Stealth <ul type="square">[*] (A) Defense Buff IO: Level 50[/list]Level 8: Train Ninjas <ul type="square">[*] (A) Recharge Reduction IO: Level 50[*] (11) Endurance Reduction IO: Level 50[/list]Level 10: Swift <ul type="square">[*] (A) Run Speed IO: Level 50[*] (50) Run Speed IO: Level 50[/list]Level 12: Call Jounin <ul type="square">[*] (A) Sovereign Right - Accuracy: Level 50[*] (13) Edict of the Master - Defense Bonus: Level 40[*] (13) Sovereign Right - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance: Level 50[*] (15) Sovereign Right - Accuracy/Endurance: Level 50[*] (15) Sovereign Right - Damage/Endurance: Level 50[*] (17) Sovereign Right - Accuracy/Damage: Level 50[/list]Level 14: Invisibility <ul type="square">[*] (A) Recharge Reduction IO: Level 50[/list]Level 16: Combat Jumping <ul type="square">[*] (A) Luck of the Gambler - Recharge Speed: Level 50[/list]Level 18: Health <ul type="square">[*] (A) Miracle - +Recovery: Level 40[*] (46) Miracle - Heal: Level 40[*] (48) Miracle - Heal/Endurance/Recharge: Level 40[*] (48) Miracle - Heal/Recharge: Level 40[*] (50) Miracle - Endurance/Recharge: Level 40[*] (50) Miracle - Heal/Endurance: Level 40[/list]Level 20: Stamina <ul type="square">[*] (A) Performance Shifter - EndMod: Level 50[*] (21) Performance Shifter - EndMod/Recharge: Level 50[*] (21) Performance Shifter - EndMod/Accuracy/Recharge: Level 50[*] (23) Performance Shifter - Accuracy/Recharge: Level 50[*] (42) Performance Shifter - EndMod/Accuracy: Level 50[*] (43) Performance Shifter - Chance for +End: Level 50[/list]Level 22: Smoke Flash <ul type="square">[*] (A) Recharge Reduction IO: Level 50[*] (23) Recharge Reduction IO: Level 50[*] (43) Recharge Reduction IO: Level 50[*] (43) Endurance Reduction IO: Level 50[/list]Level 24: Super Jump <ul type="square">[*] (A) Springfoot - Endurance/Jumping: Level 50[*] (25) Springfoot - Endurance: Level 50[*] (25) Springfoot - Jumping: Level 50[/list]Level 26: Oni <ul type="square">[*] (A) Sovereign Right - Resistance Bonus: Level 50[*] (27) Sovereign Right - Accuracy: Level 50[*] (27) Sovereign Right - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance: Level 50[*] (29) Sovereign Right - Accuracy/Endurance: Level 50[*] (31) Sovereign Right - Damage/Endurance: Level 50[*] (33) Sovereign Right - Accuracy/Damage: Level 50[/list]Level 28: Paralytic Poison <ul type="square">[*] (A) Essence of Curare - Accuracy/Hold/Recharge: Level 50[*] (29) Essence of Curare - Accuracy/Hold: Level 50[*] (34) Essence of Curare - Hold/Range: Level 50[*] (34) Essence of Curare - Accuracy/Endurance: Level 50[*] (42) Essence of Curare - Endurance/Hold: Level 50[*] (45) Essence of Curare - Accuracy/Recharge: Level 50[/list]Level 30: Hasten <ul type="square">[*] (A) Recharge Reduction IO: Level 50[*] (31) Recharge Reduction IO: Level 50[*] (31) Recharge Reduction IO: Level 50[/list]Level 32: Kuji In Zen <ul type="square">[*] (A) Recharge Reduction IO: Level 50[*] (33) Recharge Reduction IO: Level 50[*] (46) Endurance Reduction IO: Level 50[/list]Level 35: Neurotoxic Breath <ul type="square">[*] (A) Pacing of the Turtle - Chance of -Recharge: Level 50[*] (36) Pacing of the Turtle - Endurance/Recharge/Slow: Level 50[*] (36) Pacing of the Turtle - Range/Slow: Level 50[*] (39) Pacing of the Turtle - Accuracy/Endurance: Level 50[*] (40) Pacing of the Turtle - Damage/Slow: Level 50[*] (42) Pacing of the Turtle - Accuracy/Slow: Level 50[/list]Level 38: Phase Shift <ul type="square">[*] (A) Recharge Reduction IO: Level 50[*] (39) Recharge Reduction IO: Level 50[*] (39) Recharge Reduction IO: Level 50[/list]Level 41: Antidote <ul type="square">[*] (A) Endurance Reduction IO: Level 50[*] (48) Recharge Reduction IO: Level 50[/list]Level 44: Noxious Gas <ul type="square">[*] (A) Recharge Reduction IO: Level 50[*] (45) Recharge Reduction IO: Level 50[*] (45) Recharge Reduction IO: Level 50[*] (46) Endurance Reduction IO: Level 50[/list]Level 47: Elixir of Life <ul type="square">[*] (A) Recharge Reduction IO: Level 50[/list]Level 49: Acrobatics <ul type="square">[*] (A) Endurance Reduction IO: Level 50[/list]------------
Level 1: Brawl <ul type="square">[*] (A) Empty[/list]Level 1: Sprint <ul type="square">[*] (A) Run Speed IO: Level 50[/list]Level 2: Rest <ul type="square">[*] (A) Empty[/list]Level 1: Supremacy
------------
[u]Set Bonus Totals:[u]<ul type="square">[*]+4,5% DamageBuff[*]+0,95% Defense(Fire)[*]+0,95% Defense(Cold)[*]+1,88% Defense(Psionic)[*]+3,13% Defense(Melee)[*]+8,75% Defense(Ranged)[*]+8,75% Defense(AoE)[*]+20% Enhancement(Accuracy)[*]+9% Enhancement(Heal)[*]+1,5% Enhancement(Held)[*]+17,5% Enhancement(RechargeTime)[*]+2,5% Enhancement(Slow)[*]+5% FlySpeed[*]+60,2 (7,5%) HitPoints[*]+7% JumpSpeed[*]+MezResist(Confused) (Mag 7,15%)[*]+MezResist(Held) (Mag 8,25%)[*]+MezResist(Sleep) (Mag 8,25%)[*]+MezResist(Stun) (Mag 8,8%)[*]+MezResist(Terrorized) (Mag 3,85%)[*]+11,5% Recovery[*]+8% Regeneration[*]+1,26% Resistance(Fire)[*]+1,26% Resistance(Cold)[*]+1,26% Resistance(Toxic)[*]+1,26% Resistance(Psionic)[*]+5% RunSpeed[*]+PBAoE (20ft) Pet +Def(All) 5%[*]+PBAoE (20ft) Pet +Res(All but Psionic) 10%[/list]

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There are some wasted bonuses here, dmgbuff e.g., that cannot be helped. The choice between filling in a Health set vs. a Def set boiled down to the +rec special and AoE defence that worked well with Performance shifter.

Bakta_hero · 02-13-2008 02:53 AM

6) IO and sets.

You may believe me or not, even though this is a very costly one, my own build is very close to this one and I spent 0 minute farming. There was some luck involved (I found the sovereign Acc unique at the end of a mission) . The rest came from the market. The each non-set IO has been picked up on the way in 45+ missions. I sold the rest of them to a vendor to fund the remaining. The big difference is that I still do not have LotG's unique.

6.1) The unique that we need.

There are two IO that, imho, are needed the rest being gravy. The first I mentioned above : Sovereign Right's +Resist unique, it gives a +20% Res (all but psi) in a 20' radius. The second being Edict of the Master's defence bonus. When your ninja is within range, two shield, one deep purple and one red, appears over him. When I looked at the prices, they were in the 20~30 m range.

As for the rest, I picked mostly sets for +rec and +def whenever possible.

6.2) Those that we do not

Achilles Heel's special (-20 Res. proc) is wasted I think on this kind of build. I have it on mine, yet after doing all the number crunching, and after some field testing with it, it doesn't proc often enough that I feel a difference anyhow.

Although I found two purple IO, there were never a doubt in my mind that those were far too costly to obtain so I never looked into them. If you're interested, I may offer another build including them, do not ask me to compute it's cost though.

Bakta_hero · 02-13-2008 02:54 AM

7) Tactics

There are few simple basic ones, tried and true, that suited my play style on my way to 50. By no mean should they be thought of as alpha and omega. I truly hope someone else got some others to mention.

I keep the pet-all button on the lower bar, that way I can order them in BG, Passive or Attack mode as required very quickly.

Unlike the fire forget and read a book type, (like bots/FF if taken to the extreme), any nin/psn fight is a clickfeist. Do not forget that your powers are mostly ST, there is no need for you to be at close range (unless you want your procs to be enforced)

I use some easy guidelines as reminder :

- Your initial position should be behind your minions at the start of every fight. At the very least behind one minion.
If it moves and it's not as weak as a wet kitten, debuff it.
Re-apply SF whenever possible.
The longer the battle, the more likely you'll have one stray ninja fighting at the other end of the map. Keep your battle short and tidy, regrouping is not a sin.

This one works perfectly well with Murphy''s law applied to pets : Whenever you want your fight not to spread, one of your minion will go exploring on it's own.

To my experience, it's not a good idea to send all of your pets on aggro mode to start a fight. If possible keep as many of them as possible in BG mode. This lead to my first specific macro mentioned above :

7.1) The BG pull.

Basically, you send your chosen pet (pet goto, aggro mode) where selected, SF him on the way if you have it. The pet then opens the battle with a crit, you'll love oni's crittage, whatever hits back will trigger BG mode and the rest of your minions will join the fray. The you join in and start debuffing, whatnots.

This works well solo in most situations. It requires a good idea of the lay of land.

Some boss/EB/etc. fights are too risky for this to work out (bloody Valkyrie). So here comes your dumbest mode :

7.2) Mujiks!.

Park your pets behind, sneak in to target a minion nearby said EB, send your pets to their doom when safely back. Rinse reapeat until your choice EB/etc.. only remains. Whenever I can I try to avoid using it.

In some occasion you'll be able to split or pull only one side of the room, in which case a variant of the above section is used :

7.3) The Hello-Kitty pull

This one requires you has some means to avoid aggro range, be it stealth or a received invisibility. The mechanism are a mix between the two tactics above : Park your pets out of range, but not too far, sneak in and use Weaken on your target, run back like heck while activating BG mode. Even if you're hit, the odds of being even moderately wounded are remote. If your attack miss...just run faster. An advanced form of this pull is to have one of your pet on aggro (usually oni) on the way once BG mode is activated.

As the battle progress you will wish to send your pets against one mob (by using your attack mob), whittling the opposition one member at the time, while you keep the remainder buffed, held etc. This tactic has the advantage to wipe out each pet's aggro list and send them toward your target. In some case the list isn't wiped and you'll have a straggler. Try to avoid them at all cost, the simplest way is to get back your minions on passive mode, then to reinitiate the fight on your term.

Another long winded guide by yours truly.

TumbleweedOfDoom · 02-19-2008 09:36 PM

No acc in envenom? Good luck hitting anything with it. Also, with the slotting for pets, I'd slot the Jounin and Oni with a mix of dmg/mez, acc/mez, acc/dam and maybe a few common IO's over the sets. Gives a better end result IMO.

As for the part of your guide where you're recommending slotting:

[ QUOTE ]
Alkaloïd

Sigh. This will be your main healing tool, and it's a slow animation one. The end cost/heal isn't that bad though, it's just that until you have started to seriously slot your debuffs, you'll be forced to cycle it over and over during a fight. Writing this, I ponder the benefits of slotting this over the debuffs first. I think that' it's benefits outweighs theirs until one gets SO, but it should be worth doing it the other way around.

Slotting : 3Rch, 3Heal any way you prefer, it'll never prevent your minion to gets it too late.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'd go 3 heal, 2 rech and 1 end redux. Otherwise you're gonna be plowing through end very quickly. This is pre-set-slotting of course.

[ QUOTE ]
Evenom
Your first nasty debuff. If you succeed, it'll stick for 30secs and debuff target's res., def., regen. and health. The visible result is a purple downward shield that one may miss. I'll recommend to get a clock and look at your combat log to see if it failed or not.

Slotting : 2Rch, 3 Debuff (def) and 1 Rdx.

[/ QUOTE ]

Again, there really isn't a need for any rech in this power. You want it to hit, spamming it isn't gonna do anything if it doesn't hit. 2 Acc, 3 def debuff, 1end redux/rech.

[quote[ Weaken
Your second and very nasty debuff. If you succeed, unslotted it'll reduce mob's To Hit (-11%), Damage (-221%) and all of his special effects by a large share. This is the one tool you must keep on an EB/AV/Hero at all times. As for Evenom it'll stick for 30s.

Slotting : 2Rch, 3 Debuff (to hit) and 1 Rdx.

[/ QUOTE ]

2 acc, 3 tohit debuff and 1 end redux/rech.

[ QUOTE ]
Neurotoxic breath

This odd power is available early but will come into force later as you don't have enough cover to use it before you get your Oni. It's another nasty one though, it slows travel powers by 65% on the average (fly being reduced 70%) and mob's Recharge redux by 65% too. It's main issue is it's range 60', taking you within mobs range. Once you get your Oni, who usually has used at least one AoE attack by the time you launch it, the issue happens far less often.

Slotting : 2Rch, 1Rdx, 3Slow

[/ QUOTE ]

I seriously don't understand why you aren't slotting acc in powers that need to hit. :S 2 acc, 3 slow, 1 rech.

And basically the same for paralytic poison, needs acc.

As for antidote, why 2 rech? Recharges fast enough with a single Rech IO. Noxious Gas only needs 3 rech, it's not up often enough that it requires an end redux.

The pet upgrades I only have one slot in with a rech IO, I used to have them 2 slotted, but hey, works fine with one. Although I guess that's entirely up to you.

Smoke flash is going to NEED 3 rech, 3 end redux. Seriously, it's just too much of a drain otherwise.

Anyway, that's just my two cents.

Bakta_hero · 02-20-2008 02:19 AM

I realize I forgot to go back and change the basic slotting before writing down my build. Please discard most of it and look at the build instead. One Acc is indeed needed if one use SO

That said. I never slotted 2 acc in any of my ST attacks, that's overkill. Your unslotted to-hit base chance are :

- 75% on a white, down to 48% on a red.

Adding the aggregated Acc from sets, we're already at max on a even critter and up to 68% on a red. With but one Acc in a ST power we're at 96.9%, meaning we're at cap too.

source : Paragon Wiki

Without IO's Acc set we're down to 77% on a red. Im'm happy with that.

Without taking into account some critters's powers vof course.

On Antidote : Where did you found the second rch???.

Envenom : This is one of the few difference between my current build and this one. I do have one Acc in my current one and it's enough to hit red reliably.

Re Alkaloid : You're correct, a +EndRec is needed, my bad.

Spamming your attacks is the best way to get yourself dry. That's why I advised to get them timed in your head, or to make sure you know whether or not you hit or miss. And get a clock. I have one.

The issue is not with minion/lt fights, it's with EB+, we agree?.

Noxious Gas : When it's on I use it right before a fight on a jounin. I found it more useful then not to use that much.

[edit] : Smoke Flash. It's a matter of tactics. Early on, I spammed it as soon as it came up. I find now that I have enough opn my hand to make sure mobs are debuffed that SF goes to the backburner. Beside, the difference sin't that great if you take into account recharge time : From basic 30end, I'm down to 21.1, you'd be around 15. That's about 6 end over a 20sec period. As with Acc, I think you're overslotting, as you think I'm underslotting likely .

TumbleweedOfDoom · 02-20-2008 07:07 AM

Found the second rech in antidote in your basic slotting, but you said to disregard that so ok. :P

[ QUOTE ]

The issue is not with minion/lt fights, it's with EB+, we agree?.

[/ QUOTE ]

If the + encompasses pvp as well, then yes.

[ QUOTE ]
Noxious Gas : When it's on I use it right before a fight on a jounin. I found it more useful then not to use that much.

[/ QUOTE ]

Ah, that explains it then. I don't use mine much, never really see the need outside of pvp or a troublesome boss+. I wipe groups out extremely quickly as it is.

Having said that, I'm going to try your approach and see the difference.

Re: Smoke Flash: Yeah, I don't use mine too much. I'll use it before each group on a large team, or if it's a large group, but other than that I might use it a couple times a mission.

[ QUOTE ]
As with Acc, I think you're overslotting, as you think I'm underslotting likely

[/ QUOTE ]

Heh, having read your rebuttal I think I might be overslotting. But I don't really see much benefit in removing my extra acc, as I pvp a LOT on my ninja/poison, and I'd prefer to be safe than sorry. Although I may change up my slots once I finish with my purple sets.

Ty for the response, it's always interesting to see how other ninja/psn mm's play.

BnT_Again · 02-20-2008 10:06 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Slotting : 2Acc, 3Rch, 2Hold. It's recharge time is 16s unslotted, so one can use a Rdx or gets another Hold instead.

[/ QUOTE ]

Hax, how'd you get seven slots?

Bakta_hero · 02-20-2008 10:07 AM

My build is pve, I'm pretty sure it's written somewhere with attached reason too. My pvp experience is good enough for tied up lemmings, nothin above that level. I'll leave it to others.

Would I go Pvp, it's a different kind of beast. 2 Acc will be required.

Bakta_hero · 02-20-2008 10:12 AM

Same reply as with Tumbleweed . Forgot to go back to check slots before IOs. Disregard it, it's crap.

If you needed a proof of that overslight, here you are.