Thug/Dark is truely a wonderful set, a being of absolute divine synergy that can out live and out level just about anything yet concieved beyond a pre-fix /regen scrapper. But I have a few issues here.
We won't go into the debate over whether or not a MM needs any attack as it's well plowed ground. I also won't go into the Howling Twilight debate, though the ability to literally save an entire team by yourself AND stun the enemies at the same time is frankly not a power I'd ever want to be without.
But taking Shadowfall late, Fearsome stare incredibly late and not taking Upgrade Equipment is just boggling to me.
Shadowfall is more then just defense, it allows you the power of position, the time to decide when and where to strike. And once struck it adds a bit of defense on top of that. It also allows a MM to slip into an area of heavy resistance and summon up the troops right in front of the enemies he's about to assault.
Fearsome Stare is your opener. Imagine the scenerio you've set down, where the MM runs in the middle of a group of enemies, goes booga booga and is hit with a stun/hold/sleep or simply more alpha damage then he/she was capable of handling. Now imagine instead he/she stayed at a relative range, safe under his/her shadow fall and opened with Fearsome Stare. Even if only a few succumb to the fear, you've still mitigated damage considerably. And if all are feared? You're now free to drop a pit, pick out your favorite target and send in the boys with an "Attack My Target" (still in defensive so you can hit a quick "follow" if things get dicey)
Now the biggest concern, not taking Upgrade Equipment. How much damage are you really willing to give up just to save a power slot? Not to mention Hurl, Footstomp, double cone ripping from your enforcers... and it just looks great. Trenchcoats and makes, tattoes and bandanas, suddenly you're not ashamed to have your thugs seen in public.
Just my thoughts from playing my own Thug/Dark
I hate to poke holes in the work of others, but you should really qualify your guide somewhat. I see at least 1/2 of the powers you mentioned with not only fairly unpopular slotting choices, but no further explanations.
The lowest tier punks with only ONE ACC?? Tar patch with only one recharge? Almost every power you have I would have serious comments to make. Alas, I haven't the time right now.
At least do the readers a favour and qualify the slotting. I.e. with only one recharge tarpatch won't be available all the time, but you save the slots for ______ else... I don't know. I wouldn't recommend that for anyone.
Please feel free to make your comments. As I stated at the very start of the guide, this is a starting point from which to customize to fit your needs.
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I hate to poke holes in the work of others, but you should really qualify your guide somewhat. I see at least 1/2 of the powers you mentioned with not only fairly unpopular slotting choices, but no further explanations.
The lowest tier punks with only ONE ACC?? Tar patch with only one recharge? Almost every power you have I would have serious comments to make. Alas, I haven't the time right now.
At least do the readers a favour and qualify the slotting. I.e. with only one recharge tarpatch won't be available all the time, but you save the slots for ______ else... I don't know. I wouldn't recommend that for anyone.
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Agreed about the slotting. It's fairly wacky.
I wouldn't think of trying to solo an AV on my various */DM MM's w/o Howling Twilight. If your looking at that power and only seeing a rez your missing the point...I consider the rez almost a side effect to primary effects of the de-buffs.
It is also arguably the most valuable power (next to LR and Vengeance) in the Recluse Strike Force, where I don't give a damn how good your team is, against 8 lvl 54 AV's people are going to die.
My Twilight Grasp slotting suggestion is also 2 ACC, 3 Heal, 1 Recharge. That 1 Recharge allows you to stack the -Regen on AV's (I set TG to auto-cast when solo'ing AV's) to make sure it's always there.
Also if you want to be a true munchkin...take Magic as your Origin to get the Apprentice Charm...used properly you can stack 10-30% extra -Res on top of Tar Patch.
I recommend 3 ACC and 3 Rech for Gang War...they do pitiful damge (even slotted for Dam) and 3 ACC guarantees they maintain aggro (which what they are for...not damage).
And yeah...2 ACC in all henchies...3 in Thugs if not running Tactics.
I like all your suggestions so far. I may just respec into the rez power to see what all the fuss is about.
As for 2 accuracies in the henchman... Pre single origins I would agree. But after you have single origins, if you've taken tactics and you've followed my slotting for enforcers you just don't need it. If you have a 3 slotted SO tactics and at least 1 SO to hit buff in your enforcers, plus your Thugs and Enforcers both have at least 1 defence debuff, the extra Accuracy is simply not needed. Trust me... try out the slotting and you'll see it's not so wacky after all.
Wow....
I have to say, this slotting is all wacky. Different strokes for different folks I know, but I think we can all agree a blaster slotting 6 recharge enhancements in all his blasts is gimp.
And suggesting NOT to take the 32 upgrade?!?! I don't know what to say... it increases all your henchmen's abilities.
Wow....
I can't imagine building a /Dark Mastermind with the slotting the original poster suggests. The hit debuff in Twilight Grasp is a cherry on top of the utility of the heal. Slotting for it isn't going to make much of a difference. Try 2 Acc, 2 Recharge, 2 heal and maybe your bodyguards will even last a little longer.
Tar Patch needs 3 recharges. Again, the slow effect may be gravy; I'd rather have it available for every fight for the -Resist effect.
Shadowfall's Defense is pretty minimal. I'm not sure it's worth putting slots for Defense enhancements, either. I tried 3x defense and 3x damage resistance and got a lot more utility out of the latter.
You can proably find better things to do with slots that DefBuffs in Maneuvers. Maybe put them each of the pets and give them another slot for an Accuracy enhancement. Supremacy or no, you won't always be fighting yellow mobs.
Shouldn't Gang War have a couple more Recharges?
Why not put a slot of Recharge in the Bruiser instead of Disorient Duration?
Shouldn't Call Thugs have six slots at maximum?
I agree with many of the other posters. Slotting is really goofy on some of these things.
Things I hate: Anime. PvP. Lying MMO Developers. Outleveling content. Manga. ED. Comic Store Employees. Anime.
Regarding the DM Portion(I have a 39 Robots/DM)
Twighlight Grasp:-
Slotting should be 2Acc 3 Heals 1End or Rech,
some people prefer 2Acc 2 Heal 2Rech for smaller but having heals more often.
Tar Patch
3 Rech + optional 1-3 Slow- You want this available as often as possible for the -res
Darkest Night is ok
Howling Twighlight- I took this very late.Check DM guides for how to use this power offensively.
Slotting ??
SHadowfall- This should be taken in the 20s at the latest
Slotting 3 Dam Res 1-2 End Red. Def is not worth slotting.
Fearsome Stare. This is a 20s power. It is THE power for neutering an alpha strike.
Slotting 2Rech,2 Fear,2Acc - THis way the power is up as soon as the fear duration finishes
Dark Servant
Slotting 3 Rech is a must the other 3 slots can be filled as preferred. You want DS up as much as possible
Twighlight Grasp: Definitely want to do a 2acc/2heal/2rchg if your not running hasten and what not. Plus if you get Tactics then you can drop an accuracy for another heal. Third recharge is not needed.
Tar Patch - 3 slot Rchg Big Time, That will at the very least make it perma for those long fights w/o Hasten. Slows are completely optional.
Darkest Night - On Darkest Night, I'm a little torn. On my Dark MMs I've always had the experience of ending my fights rather quickly. The only time DN would actually be useful would be toward the end of a villians career. I usually suggest people take it post 30 and not earlier. You got enough end drain as it is.
Howling Twilight - The rez is just a side effect. You really want this power for the autohit disorient AoE that it supplys. Its not going to mez any bosses, but Lts. and Minions will be happily dazed for a good while. 6 Slot this Power: 3 Rchg, 3 Disorient Duration. Also, it's one of the best rez powers in the game.
Shadowfall - For Thugs, this should be a no brainer. It's going to stop a lot of energy attacks and its providing a lower aggro footprint. Even if you just 1 slot End Rdx in there it helps out. I suggest 2 End Rdx, 2 Resist, 2 DefBuff (Optional)
Fearsome Stare - Awesome, Awesome Power. Six slot this baby too. Not to mention the fact that mostly everything in the game has little to no fear protection, you can also use it in PvP to own as well. Slot 2 Acc, 2 Fear, 2 Rchg
Dark Servant - Of course you want Fluffy, he'll add to everything. You can pretty much slot whatever you want after 2 Acc tho. I usually do a mixed slotting of heals, holds, and tohit Debuff.
And please please please take Upgrade Equipment. I can't even comment on not taking it lol.
Goofy guide.
Not equipping your Bruiser because of hand-clap? Man, that's whacked. He's so much better equipped.
Not getting Upgrade Equipment? Lord -- why are you playing an MM -- go out and make a corruptor, because Upgrade Equipment is the DEFINITIVE, MUST HAVE POWER of the Thugs power-set.
I'll write my own guide soon, and you can pick it to bits (no stamina, for one thing), but your guide is really weird.
Ex
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Ex.
Part-Troll, who used to be Excession777, now playing pantomime with people's mindlets.
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Too subjective, offers no alternatives or choice nor discusses the merits of the various choices.
For example, 1 acc in minions will yeild. IF minions are inside supremance, and IF you have 2 enforcers in range, and IF you have tactics 3 slotted and running, and IF minionsare in tactics range, 1 acc will yeild 82% accuracy vs +3 targets, the largest you are likely to naturally face if SOLO. Sufficient.
However, 2 acc, under the same conditions yeilds 102% accuracy, which is over the cap of 95%, and would allow for one of those conditions to not be true and still maintain nearly capped accuracy. It would also allow for minor mitigation of mild tohitdebuffs 7%.
If facing higher level targets +4 and up, in a team enviroment, the additional 2's acc enhancement can become even more important.
If facing lower level targets, and maintaining ruthless or lower difficulty settings SOLO, then 1 accuracy would be sufficient for all targets.
What do you plan to hunt ?
Villainous to Ruthless Solo Only - 1 acc will likely suffice.
Relentless - 2 acc is recomended.
+3 - 2 acc is recomended, the number of +3 vs 2, determining the strength of that recomendation.
+4, +5 - 2 acc is highly recomended, if not required.
PVP - 2 acc is all but a requirement.
Understand, if you team, you are much more likely to face foes +1 or +2 higher than normal, as you will not always be the highest level person on the team.
The penalty for not slotting the extra acc, 10%-20% damage vs those targets that are +3 and up. Less than removing a damage SO, but still significant. Slot 1 acc, then 3 damage, then the 2'nd acc. Damage is a priority over the second acc.
The lack of the 2'nd acc could also be partially mitigated by running assault, but assault costs endurance and we're assuming the mm with 2 acc will NOT run assault.
Last, just a reminder that the 2'nd acc will also have a larger skewing impact when the minions are under tohitdebuff effects.
Discuss each choice with that kind of depth, and we'll have a useful guide. As is, all I see is one persons personal build complete with quirks, not a guide.
This is a good guide, and I got a few extra tactics from this.
My only argument is this.
Taking away Upgrade Equipment is begging to be mauled, ripped, shredded, tortured, then killed. Not neccessarily in that order.
Not giving the bruiser his first upgrade. Hand Clap is a good deal more useful then you make it out to be. I always set my tar patches up ahead of enemies and just let bruiser boy knock them into it. And the disorient portion is just too powerful to ingore when slotted.
But otherwise this is an excelent guide. Good work.
Alrighty, my first Guide. This if my personal suggestions for Thug/Dark Miasma Masterminds. This is, of course, my entirely subjective analysis of Thugs/Dark Misama, and others may feel differently about my choices. I definitely encourage people to take my guide as a mere starting point and customize to fit YOUR needs. This guide is written in water
So I will provide an overview of the primary, secondary, as well as power pool suggestions, and around what level I recommend taking them, and suggested slotting for enhancements. And then my own tips for playing this AT
SECTION 1: Choosing your powers
SECTION 2: Tips on playing the mastermind
THUG PRIMARY
Pistols
Roughly a 2x brawl attack at distance. Slow activation time considering any attack you take should be a purely defensive action. Its damage, without any great effect. Forget it as far as Im concerned.
Call Thugs
These guys are your boyz, this should be the first power you take. They are your offence and defense at the same time. Youre most important power in the early game, and a staple in the late game. Its American Express, dont leave home without your boyz.
Slotting Suggestions: 1 Accuracy, 3 Damage, 2 Defense Debuff, 1 Knockback
Dual Wield
If you plan on taking an attack, and I recommend you have at least one attack as a purely last ditch defensive action, this should be it. Take it early, level 2 if you can because the going will be slow until you get more thugs. This is roughly 2.5 brawl at range with the added bonus of knockback. The knockback is the reason I recommend this power. When the mobs are closing in on you, or running away, knockback is just what you need to give your pets the extra seconds they need to get the job done. You dont want damage, you want knockback. Your pets are your damage
Slotting Suggestions: 1 Accuracy, 2 Knockback
Equip Thugs
Just plain great. Give your thugs more power, more damage, faster This is what its about. Gives your Thugs a second pistol attack. Gives your arsonist (3rd thug) a firebreath attack that can scourge. Gives your enforcers dual machine pistols with a great cone on them, and upgrades their leadership abilities. Gives your Bruiser Hand Clap and knockout blow. Now doubt, you need this power as ASAP.
Slotting Suggestions: 1 Recharge, 1 End Reduction
Empty Clips
Its Dual Wield, but in a cone arc of fire. Youve got your one attack already, let your boyz do their job. Skip this.
Call Enforcer
Oh yeah, now youre starting to look like youre running a gang. These guys have natural leadership power pool abilities. They increase the accuracy and defense of your boyz. They have a great cone attack and provide some great stacking debuffs with your thugs. No doubt, you take Enforcers your first opportunity.
Slotting Suggestions: 1 Accuracy, 1 To Hit Buff, 2 Damage, 1 Defense Buff, 1 Defense Debuff
Gang War
Once youve got Gang War, you own any boss you come across. A single opponent doesnt stand a chance. If youve seen gang war in action you know what Im talking about. Has a very long recharge time on it so you want to save this just for the bosses, elite bosses, Heroes, etc
Slotting Suggestions: 1 Recharge, 1 Accuracy, 2 Damage
Call Bruiser
With the addition of your bruiser, your gang will be complete. Theres no doubt, this man is a tank armed with some really big guns. He generates fury, just like a brute so in a rampage the damage enemies will start dropping like flies. Take him when you can. My one suggestion is to avoid using Equip Thugs on him. Why? Because of the hand clap attack. It completely contradicts the arc of fire that your enforcers have and ruins the compliments of the Dark Miasma secondary that relies on debuffing groups of enemies in an area. If you Equip your Bruiser, be prepaired to never tar patch or Darkest Night, Fearsome Star One Hand Clap will nullify the usefulness of your secondary by spreading out all the mobs.
Slotting Suggestions: 1 Accuracy, 3 Damage, 1 Disorient Duration
Upgrade Equipment
By the time this becomes available to you, you are an unstoppable force. Do you need this power? No. At this point, youre a very well rounded offensive machine. Whether or not you want this is much like Dual Wield, its entirely up to you as far as Im concerned.
Recommended Slotting: 1 End Reduction.
DARK MIASMA
Twilight Grasp
This Area of Effect Heal is reason enough to invest in this secondary. For the most part your team will be staying in a tight nit group (if youre controlling your pets properly), and, properly slotted, this is the primary thing you will be doing while youre boyz are killing everything left right and center. Expect to get the healing badges pretty early.
Recommended Slotting: Without Stamina (1 Accuracy, 1 End Reduction, 1 To Hit Debuff, 3 Heals) With Stamina (1 Accuracy, 2 To Hit Debuff, 3 Heals).
Tar Patch
This should be your level 4 power. This is a great debuffing and defensive power. It slows the movement speed and recharge rate of anyone in the area of effect, as well as bringing down low level fliers. Also, mobs caught in the area of effect take more damage from attacks. Considering your Smashing/Lethal attacks are the most resisted damage type in the game, this alone is reason enough to take it. Foes take about 27% more damage in the field of effect than they would otherwise (adds up in the late game).
Recommended Slotting: 1 Recharge, 3 Slow
Darkest Night
This toggle power is used on a mob. Its an auto-hit, and the targeted mob and any other mob caught in the area of effect get wonderful To Hit DeBuffs and Damage Debuffs. This power is definitely worth taking. Your guys dont have the best resists or defenses, so adding this only helps your survivability. I took this at level 8.
Recommended Slotting: 1 End Reduction, 3 To Hit Debuff
Howling Twilight
Im not really too keen on any power designed to revive my teammate, or pets. If my team worked better together, no one would have died to begin with, and I can just resummon my pets. I didnt take this power. Others may take it up to you.
Shadow Fall
This is a late game power, I didnt take until 32. But it does help out with your squishy thugs. Since your thugs prefer ranged, this will help their ranged defense as well as provide some nice damage resists.
Recommended Slotting: 1 End Reduction, 2 Defense, 3 Damage Resist
Fearsome Stare
If you follow my schedule this power is yours at 35, when youre running into lots of debuffing, and high damage mobs. The cone fear is your friend. Take it, love it.
Recommended Slotting: 1 Accuracy, 3 Fear Duration, 2 To Hit Debuff
Petrifying Gaze
I skipped this power. I dont need a single target hold, thats what gang war does for you, and it damages at the same time. Skip this. Youve got better powers to take.
Black Hole
This is an entirely emergency power. Its highly situational, and as far as Im concerned a waste of a needed power. Skip this unless you find yourself dieing a lot and could use a few seconds to help you out.
Dark Servant
Oh yeah a pocket controller. By now, youre completely unstoppable take the Dark Servant and glide through all that more easily. Because the servant is unpredictable. Slotting is completely up to you. I chose to slot evenly across all aspects of its capabilities rather than focus in one spot.
Suggested Slotting: 1 Accuracy, 1 Heal, 2 Immobilize duration, 1 Hold, 1 To Hit Debuff
POWER POOL SUGGESTIONS
LEADERSHIP
First and foremost, this power pool was made for you. Taking this pool, plus Shadow Fall will most likely require you to take Stamina however in order to keep up with the heals youll need to be spamming on your weak pets, but the extra buffs far outweigh the stamina costs as far as Im concerned.
Maneuvers
Three slotted defense, plus one End Reduction will give you roughly 3% situational defense, plus an additional 3% defense to all damage types except toxic. 6% defense is not much, but so worth it when you add up your enforcers and shadow fall. Trust me.
Assault
Adds an additional 11% damage to your team, on top of all your damage enhancements. Youve breached the 100% damage mark on all your guys. Way to go! Slot and End Reducer and be done with it.
Tactics
Needed so needed. 3 slotting tactics gives you and additional 14% accuracy to your team. This along with your enforcers slotted with additional to hit buffs and youll never miss ever! Plus the addition perception is excellent for seeing those pesky PPD Ghosts in Mayhem Missions.
Vengeance
Not needed. There are better powers to get.
FITNESS
If youve taken the Leadership power pool, youll probably want this to get stamina. Summoning all your pets, plus equipping them, and then all your toggles, can be a huge drain, and slow down the game for you and your team. Having stamina can only help you out.
Swift, or Leaping?
Its up to you. Personally, I find leaping to be more usefully for me, but its all up to you.
Health
Will all the heals youll be spamming, you dont really need this for anything other than its sleep protection. Take it, 3 slot it if you want, or not.
Stamina
The goal of this Power Pool. 3 slot it, and you wont even have to slow down after youve summoned all your pets, with all your toggles on, after teleporting across the zone.
Travel Power
Its all up to you. I took Flight, just so I could have Air Superiority. Its a great control power to use against the early bosses before you get your gang war. Slot it for 1 Accuracy, and maybe a Recharge.
SECTION 2: Tips on playing the mastermind
If youve taken all, or most of my suggestions, theres some subtle playing changes youll need to make in order to maximize your offensive, and defensive capabilities.
First things, first. Learn the abilities of your gang, and how they can compliment each other, or work against each other.
My best recommendation is to never, ever using the Equip Thugs ability on your Bruiser. One hand clap can ruin the best laid offensive plans by spreading out the tightly packed mob and leave you running around, trying to clean up the mess.
Your enforcers have a cone attack. The hand clap works against that.
Your Tar Patch is an area of effect. The hand clap works against that.
Your Darkest Night is an area of effect. The hand clap works against that.
One hand clap will make your 2 simultaneaous cone attacks, and 2 AoE powers have minimal effect. So to reiterate, do not equip your bruiser.
Second tip. Leadership and you!
Youve taken Maneuvers, Assault, and Tactics. Your equipped enforcers have maneuvers and tactics too. All the leadership powers have an effective range of 60 feet. Shadow Fall has an effective range of 40 feet. That leaves you to successfully control your henchman to always be within 40 feet of you, and each other in order to obtain maximum effectiveness of defensive and offensive output. Dont forget about your supremacy range too!
Your bruiser has a tendency to run off, into melee. Your enforcers and thugs prefer range until someone shoots them, then they want vengeance and run into melee. Youre squishy, you want to stay away from melee. How to keep everyone together? Two things you need a bind for target closest target, and you need a shortcut to the defensive follow command, which puts all your pets in bodyguard mode, effectively making you invincible as long as youre healing everyone.
Heres what you need to do. Youve come across a large spawn. You can send your bruiser in, but hell be out of youre Supremacy, Leadership range, as well as your enforcers Leadership range. You need your pets in bodyguard mode and the tactic is this. Run into the middle of the mob. Youll draw an alpha strike from the mob. But that wont matter. Actual damage will be minimal assuming you were the primary target of all the attacks, and you didnt run so fast your pets couldnt stay within supremacy range. You Twilight grasp the weakest enemy, healing everyone to full, drop a Tar Patch right on top of you. Now the entire mob isnt going anywhere, and theyve been debuffed. Leave your pets in bodyguard mode for a few seconds because youre still the primary target after dropping the tar patch. You pets will attack whomever attacked you, drawing agro off you. Now is the time to focus your attacks. Choose your closest target, and send all pets to attack. You target someone else with a Twilight Grasp, keeping you and your closely nit pets healthy, while further debuffing someones accuracy. No point in Twilight Grasping the target your pets are currently attacking, itll be dead soon. Debuff someone else who can actually do some damage to you.
As the mob thins, your bruiser will wander out of heal range. Thats okay, hes tough. Just make sure you dont let his hps drop below half. If you see hes dropping and your thugs and enforcers are cool, run into melee with him and give him a Twilight Grasp. Or drag a heal inspiration from your tray onto him. If you find your thugs and enforcers are spreading out of your heal range, click the defensive follow command. Everyone comes back to body guard you. Maneuver your group closer to the enemy again. Dont worry about taking damage because youre body guarded.
Well thats it. Enjoy!