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Not to get all hipster, but I was hating Guild Wars before hating it was popular.
I hated the original Guild Wars (working title: Guild Wars: Saga of the Brown), and frankly this one doesn't look any different. I don't hate it because it's NCSoft, I don't hate it because it's part of why CoH got dumped... I hate it because if it's anything like GW1, it's going to be dull.
That said, NCSoft has seen their last dime from me anyhow. -
I haven't responded at all to any of this, not even in the 162-page long megathread that's still going. If anyone that can respond in an official capacity is reading, I urge you to do so:
What is your price? How much are you willing to sell the IP for? You have over 20,000 potential investors, if the petition is any indication. I know that if it could save the game, I would be willing to commit real money to a kickstart designed to buy the IP so we can save the game. If the playerbase (hereafter referred to SaveCoh inc) were to shop around after IP purchase, I am certain we could find a publisher.
Give us that chance. We're not asking for anything for free. We want to know, what is the price tag? If you couldn't find a buyer, you have nothing to lose by telling us. You've seen how dedicated the potential investor pool is. I am not joking when I say we could do this. There is no reason not to sell unless you don't want to see the game survive. I don't care about your reasons for sunsetting CoH right now, I promise you. We are way, way past blame. All I care about is using the time we have constructively, and this is our best hope for saving the franchise.
I am urging you, tell us what it would take. -
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Quote:Four colors vs two is awesome, though.Well, I too was in open beta and at launch, only paid for 1 month and saw plenty. Never bothered me much as was never the target, but saw it.
Yes, we'll have to disagree about the character creator. It did have so much potential, but all the big bulky oversized stuff was just ugly. The power customisation, the stance selector and more control over scaling was great. I didn't even have an issue with the cel shading, It was more that every single toon looked butt ugly. -
Quote:Strangely, I never saw any name conflicts when I played. Either that game or its sci-fi sibling.That other game had so many of it's own issues, and non-unique names were one of them. In my breif tenure there I saw so much greaifing over names. There were the release day nerfs to everything, the disjointed gameplay, the mechanics that discouraged teaming, the absolutely awful character creator. About the only thing I saw over there that I would have liked to have seen there, yet doubt ever will, was the Nemesis system.
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You miss the point entirely. My point was, If there's no common ground between one person and another creatively, then telling someone else that there's plenty of names out there isn't just counter-productive, it's actually a little bit arrogant. The names you (all yous are generic here) like aren't necessarily the names I like, and telling me that because you can find names that you like means that I have plenty of names to choose from is tantamount to declaring that the way you make characters is the only correct way. Your way is not the only way, my way is not the only way.
Yet you have no problem insisting that I stop responding to threads. -
Quote:Or, you could stop reading threads you don't care for.This. There's a reason I tend to just tell Traska to stop when threads like these come up. There were six(!) naming policy threads in the I21 beta forums, and Traska was in each one refusing to accept that the problem was with THEM, not the game or players.
Dead horse, Traska. Stop beating it. -
Quote:Two things, the amusing one first.I don't see why someone else giving their character a silly name has any effect on you. No-one is suggesting you use a silly name, and them doing it doesn't lower your pool of names. You aren't unique in having well writen back stories for each and every character. But having a backstory doesn't marry you to that characters super hero name. Especially in a world where ALL super heros are registered as per the games lore. Just coz your thick-as-bricks only english speaking fire brute came up with the, in his mind, perfect name for himself does not mean that when he registered at the FBSA and gave over the name he wanted to be know by the desk cleark didn't look over her glasses contemtivly and say "sorry dear, that name is taken." Also, a thick-as-bricks brute is unlikely to have a great name that would look good on the front of a comic book in the first place. There could also be a world of difference between what the hero wants to call himself and what the world at large want to call him.
I already gave an example of how I came up with a name for a concept for a character yet when it came to creating in game found, unsuprisingly, that it, and all permutations of it (Flash Fire, Flash-Fire, Flashfire) was taken. A hand full of back up names were taken too, or maybe clashed with a power name (if that is posible) so blazing bolt, for example, was also out. It took me no fewer than 5 minutes to come up with The Blistering Blaze. I name that is not only much better, but also wouldn't look out of place on the front of a comic book.
I have another character where his first choice of names slotted nicely in to his back story. Thus Shock Tactic, was formally the low rent wannabe super Villian Lightning Rod, at least till he crossed The Family and his wife and child paid the price. Other names, for serious heros I have, that you'll no-doubt hate, are
Psi Fire (Appearing in a comic near you soon (tm) ),
Mistique Blade,
Microwave Girl,
Clockwork Kitten, and her praetorian 'twin', Clockwork Kitty,
Kid Ego,
Time Mind (Brought to CoH from an old Marvel RPG campaign I played years ago),
Justin Tyme, (same marvel rpg campaign),
Lolita Lethal and her genetic clone sister Lina Lethal (escaped crey experiments)
St Angelius aka, The Black Angel (First choice name, so went with real name for display name),
Tess Trueshot,
Shadow Smite,
Miss Victory,
Dr Frost,
Cold Chamber,
Perfect Pitch,
Dread Visage,
Trapdoor Spider,
Senior Diablos,
Speedo Sound (former champion Swimmer turned speeder that can't give up his former glory).
Were all of those first choice name, well, for the most part, yes, but not all of them. Could most of them appear in a lagitimate comic book? Hell yes! Even My hero A Cold Spell, a technomance cryo sealed in armour of his own spellcrafting, could. Just because the character had a sense of humour with his own name doesn't make him any less of a lagitimate type hero. Infact, IC wise, he finds all the silly (read as serious) names most of the heroes of Paragon go around calling themselves to be rather childish.
But basicly, as I tried to demonstrate, first choice name doesn't have to mean BEST. I came up with a better name than anything on my short list of names and ended up with The Blistering Blaze, which is far more suitable. I cannot think of any example of a back story where only one name will fit, other than a long established one being ported over, as was demonstrated with the Shepard and Freelance sory a few pages back. I did the same with 2 of my own characters when DP and Time were released and got both. if the names weren't availible, I wouldn't have brought them an and created new stories for new characters with new names instead. I work out my characters backstory before I create them too, but I almost never lock them down to a single posible name, always have a stable of posible names and know which ones I would prefer to have. If that doesn't work, I keep trying, there WILL be something out there that fits without getting silly or lazy.
I have a character I wanted to name Perfect Pitch, and had to go with a different name instead. It's not likely the same server, but it is amusing to me.
Second, someone having a silly name doesn't affect me. But when I see an account full of silly names, and said person says something to the effect of "I always get the name I want quickly, I don't know why you dont", the first thing I think to myself is "well, it's because we go for entirely different names."
Also, to all those who say that the global shouldn't be part of the name... who says it has to be? Title and Supergroup are always visible, but they're not connected to the name. Why couldn't it be:
Title Goes Here
Name of Hero
@Global
Supergroup Name
You could even make the global a smaller font so as not to stick out like a sore thumb. -
Quote:No, I know what an ad hominem is: a personal attack. Tell me, how else am I supposed to take telling me that my argument boils down to a temper tantrum? As a compliment?I don't think you know how to use that term. If you do, you sure don't know how to use it in a sentence.
Thread milestone! Ad Hominem used!
Coming up next: Hyperbole!
Quote:1. People are not attacking YOU. They are attacking your idea.
Quote:3. You have stated this is not an issue of Creativity, but you have failed to negate this assertion with any use of the commonly used terms and application of the word.
cre·a·tive [kree-ey-tiv] Show IPA
adjective
1.
having the quality or power of creating.
2.
resulting from originality of thought, expression, etc.; imaginative: creative writing.
Quote:The current system is based on using creativity. What you are proposing is the exact opposite of creative. You are proposing a plan which would in fact take away one's ability to be an individual...this is NOT creative. Your attitude is not about creativity it is about defeatism. Defeatism is the exact opposite of creativity as it is giving up...not looking for alternatives..not being imaginative.
Quote:You can claim all you want there are no "good" names left, but this is a subjective opinion...one which many people disagree with. Names are themselves a product of creativity and as such are purely subjective...as is all creative forms... think art and music.
Quote:We can agree to disagree. And I will continue to disagree with a change from the current naming system until a NEED arises and a reasonable alternative that does not stifle one's creativity or individuality is proposed....
Quote:I think this is the most amusing post in the thread because the pro-change faction hasn't been able live up to that ideal in this thread or in any other thread on this topic.
Just another example of them demanding that we do as they say and not as they do.
This is the very essence of the problem... some people play this game to play traditional superheroes (that was completely what sold me the first time I heard about the game from G4, back before it was even in beta), and a name like "Your ExGirlfriend" doesn't appeal in the slightest to those players. Which is why we're so skeptical when people say that there are plenty of good names, and you just have to be willing to be creative, and just tweak your character concept a little. In this, yes, I am rigid. Every single character of mine is done as if they could appear in a comic book, because I am a comic book fan. Some would be mere supporting characters, some would be comic headliners, but all could appear in a serious comic like Batman or Captain America. That is the benchmark I strive for, and because of that, the pool of names I would use is limited. Not everyone plays my way, and that's fine. But don't expect me to play your (generic you) way just because you're willing to use a wider selection of names. -
Quote:The problem is that unpaid inactivity used to mean someone who didn't have an active account. There is no such thing as an inactive account now, and so it's likely the concept of name purges is, if not gone, at least scaled down considerably.It's not just a limitation. The advantage is that, when you do come up with a name, the name is uniquely yours on that server. The question that's entirely subjective and at the core of the issue is whether the hassle of having to come up with an unused name is worth having that name, with no modifiers, be yours alone once you do. Personally I think it is, though having names become available again after a year of unpaid inactivity isn't a bad idea (if something like that doesn't happen already).
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For the record, if we're really going to categorize this side of the argument as a temper tantrum, then the other side can easily be similarly mislabeled as a greedy child clutching toys to his chest and screaming "MINE!"
If we really want to cross that line, that is. It's a pity, I asked upthread if we could have just one of these conversations without the pro-status-quo side resorting to attacks. Apparently, it *is* too much to ask.
To those of you who are on the pro-status-quo side who are not behaving in such a shameful manner, please know that I am not speaking about you. -
Quote:It also happens to be their code name. It's the title of the comic, it's what they're called by the Justice League, it's what everyone on Earth knows them as. It wasn't Alan Scott's job title, it was his code name.Sorry but Green Lantern isn't an individual name it's a job title, like Detective, Senator, Governer, Fire Marshal, Federal Agent, etc.
Quote:And two of those guys were sidekick proteges as Kid Flash before grew up to continue the Flash tradition.
Quote:Are you referring to the storylines where Grayson stepped in to pose as Batman when Bruce was presumed dead? Sorry that doesn't count as two separate Batmans. Are you going to try to use the times Superman posed as Batman next?
Quote:Are you referring to the "Reign of Superman" storyline where several imposters tried claiming they were each "superman" after "Funeral For A Friend"? Again doesn't count cuz everyone knew they were imposters, and the real Superman eventually returned from the dead. -
Quote:Then we're going to have to disagree. Because opening up thesaurus.com and using the first word you see isn't creative, it's just applied problem-solving.Not calling you un-creative, but I disagree... renaming a toon based off the examples you gave..is creative in my book.
To me creativity is more than thinking up a simple name...it is taking the challenge and being creative about it. I honestly think Blue Beetle rates pretty low on creativity whereas I think Azure Scarab...pretty frickin creative.
It reminds me of Boggle...where you look for all kinds of words in a puzzle. If you constantly use the same 4-5 letter words...you are not using your creative side as much...and get a lower score....because a lot of people see the same ordinary words in the boggle puzzle and disqualify your choice. I love the challenge of naming toons and would think seeing the same name over and over followed by @Global would be silly....and frankly quite boring. The creative names people come up with this in this game...make me smile. -
Quote:Again, word salad =/= creativity. Using a thesaurus =/= creativity. Google Translate =/= creativity. There is nothing at all creative about calling the Blue Beetle the "Azure Scarab". There is nothing creative about calling Iron Man "The Awesome Armored Avenger". There is nothing creative about calling The Tick "Le Cocher". And there's nothing creative about tearing down a perfectly good character concept just to choose a name that doesn't fit. Many of my characters are easy to fit with the current name system. But many are not.You know, Traska, every time this thread comes up (what is this, #502?), you bring the same argument (creativity is not necessary), you say the same things (redo the naming system) and you're always met with the same response (be more creative). Might be time to learn that you're beating a dead horse with a dead horse, and people are beating YOUR dead horse with THEIR dead horse for doing so. /xzibit
Seriously. This thread, with all the arguments identical to the threads that came before it, and every thread that will be identical to it that come after, need to stop.
What royally peeves me is when my argument for a different naming system gets boiled down repeatedly to the ad hominem of "you lack originality and creativity". Claiming that because my creativity springs from a different direction than your means I have no creativity is the height of elitism, and does nothing to help the discussion. Which is convenient, since it allows you to off-handedly dismiss the discussion. -
Quote:Hal Jordan, Guy Gardner, John Stewart, Kyle Rayner. All known as Green Lantern, all on one world.As i recall they're generally called something more than just Superman or Flash or Batman when there's more than one unless they're deliberately trying to obfuscate who is actually using the name at any given time. Also, in most cases they're actually from or on different Earths when using the same name. Almost like the names were being used on different... shards? servers? dimensions? On the same world at the same time they tend to have other adjectives/identifiers added or be called something else while on the world (server?): Red Superman, Blue Superman, Cyborg Superman, Green Lantern (Earth), Kilowog (Green Lantern Alien). Probably because it would otherwise become incredibly confusing in very short order. Something that is occasionally played with for the sake of drama or humor when more than one character uses the same name...
Jay Garrick, Barry Allen and/or Wally West and/or Bart Allen (At leastBarry and Wally together at the same time), all known simply as Flash, all on one world.
Bruce Wayne, Richard Grayson. Both known at the same time as Batman.
The Eradicator, Hank Henshaw, Conner Kent (at the very beginning), all calling themself Superman at the same time.
And that's just core Justice Leaguers. -
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Oh, don't underestimate the appeal of the Mindripper (from Psycore Industries).
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Quote:It's based on comic book superheroes specifically. Hence why when the game first came out, they published a monthly comic right alongside the game. When you enter the tutorial, it's presented as if in the pages of a comic book.Not to nitpick but CoH is not a comic book. Yes it is based on super heroes; who are mainly in comic books...but it is not a comic book mmo.. it is a super hero mmo...hence the title of the game: City of Heroes - not City of Comic Books.
I'm sorry you can't get THE name you want, but what right do you have to take away my individuality that I have had on a character for 5-6-7-8 years? CoH is a SOCIAL game...and truth be told I do not want Joe Schmoe out there in Broadcast with a duplicate of my name saying things that I would never say. Sure my friends may know it's not me because they know my global... but Player A who sees I BURNT THE TOAST screaming profanity or racial slanders in broadcast.... will probably react negatively to me if they saw me 15 minutes later. I'm sorry but I have little faith that scenarios like this would not be a daily occurrence as there can be quite an immature player base spouting off in various channels. I can see duplicate names being used to harass more well known players in this game...sadly. There is nothing to stop me from creating a new Forbin Project, Arcanaville, etc... and doing my best to ruin their reputation in game.
So no I am not for duplicate names unless their is a clear indicator that the duplicate is just that...with some type of preface such as @OtherGlobal: Duplicate Name .... otherwise... thanks but no thanks.
As for taking away your individuality... if someone wants to do that, there's other ways to duplicate your identity. Your costume for example. Duplicating your costume exactly and then taking a name that's extremely similar (for example, I Burned The Toast, I Burnt The Toast., I Burnt The Taoist, I Brunt The Toast...) will fool a lot of the people a lot of the time.
Now, the duplicate name would presumably be suffixed with @global (so if I were to duplicate you for some strange reason, it would be I Burnt The Toast@traska), but the global wouldn't show up over the hero's head... it would show up in all channels and when you target, and in a different color (just to make it stand out from the actual hero name). And of course, you'd still be the only I Burnt The Toast whose name isn't followed by a global. Heck, color code it a bit, make it so that if they've got the original, gen-u-wine article name the name is colored differently, or italicize the duplicates.
The point is, it would include a way of telling one person from another fairly easily, plus they can check logs and see that the I Burnt The Toast that's disrupting the game isn't you.
I currently play a game with a F2P model and the ability to have any name you want and, frankly, I never see duplication going on, with one exception... my SO and I play characters who are identical in name and appearance, because one is an alternate universe version of the other... the kind of thing that *should* be able to happen in a superhero world, but can't here. -
Quote:The number of heroes per server breaks genre to begin with. Even in Marvel's Manhattan there's not even a tenth the number of heroes as Paragon has, and Manhattan is a BIG place.Personally, I'm against the idea of allowing multiple uses of the same name on a server because doing so would break the genre this game is supposed to be emulating. In comic books, a character's name is their identity. With a few very specific exceptions, there is only one person per comic universe using any given name. When someone says, "I saw Superman today!", everyone knows exactly who they mean. Nobody has to ask, "Which one?"
The simple fact is all the easy and obvious names are in use. Many of the easiest you can't have, period, because they're copyrighted. You need to be flexible with the name when coming up with a character's concept. Don't fixate on a particular name. Let the back story suggest multiple possibilities.
Perhaps this is just me, but I think the game would loose a lot of it's appeal if there were 16 dozen Capt. Incredibles running around.
And there are more duplicate heroes than you may think in comics. There have been as many as three, perhaps four Flashes operating simultaneously. Two Batmen. Two Captain Americas. At least two Spider-Women. Over three thousand Green Lanterns, four on Earth alone. Two Wolverines, Hawkeyes, Spider-Men... all the Avengers in the Dark Avengers storyline. Two Iron Men (before he was War Machine, Rhodey also went by Iron Man, even as Tony was in the suit). There are currently two Hulks (even though one is Red, his name isn't "Red Hulk", it's just "Hulk"). Two She-Hulks. Two Human Torches. Duplicate hero names aren't that big a deal in the comics. -
Quote:Dual policy for the win!I don't mind a system that allows duplicate names IF the person who had the name first sees no alteration of THEIR name.
In other words (not that I think anyone would choose my name but using it as an example)
My main toon is: I Burnt The Toast
If someone else came along and wanted that name I think their name should appear as:
@Global:I Burnt The Toast
If this were the system.. I would make damn sure I never had a name that had @Global:Name because frankly I think that looks about as stupid as it comes
If a new naming system came that made all my current toons have @Global:Name even though I chose the name first... I would be a lil upset. I personally think such naming systems are stupid looking and take away more from the individualization of the game than anything. But hey if Joe Schmoe is happy with @Global:Mecha Man then so be it.
I truly am tired of all these "name" threads though...and wish they would just go away. I see people create toons on a daily basis with some very cool names and a lot of the time I think to myself "Wow... I am surprised no one had that name before...."
I'm not saying people who support new naming procedures are lazy or unimaginative, but I just hope IF something ever happens to allow more "diverse" names that it does not affect me and my already unique names. I take great pride in my names...and if a new policy were to come along that butchered them ala putting @Global in front of them... I'm not sure if that would be the final nail in the coffin for me, but I do know it would push me away from this game.
Seriously... I have a number of characters whose names I like (Blueshifter comes to mind, ad does Organique, and the two separate Skullbusters I have (one on Virtue, one on Exalted, both completely different characters). Also, on Justice, Cat's Eye (who I am never, *never* moving, deleting, or renaming). But I have characters that I would love to rename also. I recently deleted and remade a level 18 character because the name I'd always wanted for her became free and it wasn't worth $10 to save leveling back to 18. -
I'll say it right now: I've barely spent any money on Paragon Store purchases (who needs to, they give you tons of points as a VIP), but I would pump actual cash into this. If $20 would cover all animations, I'd pay it. Tomorrow. Well, actually, the day after tomorrow... Friday is payday and all that. But I'd jump on it.
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Quote:And again, "you're not creative", "you're not original". Condescension grows tiresome.If you're creative enough, no one will ever have the name before you grab it.
If you can't think of the things that could go wrong with having multiple people with the same character name running around, or having large, ugly character names with globals (which some people like to keep to themselves) or server names (still won't solve multiple people wanting the same name), there's no point trying to convince you to think of a different way to come up with character names.
"All the Good names are taken" is never valid. There is no reason to fix the naming system that's worth the effort or the grief it would cause to players who get along just fine with the current model.
Saying things like "If I want to make a Flash character" tells us you're not creative enough. Be more original. -
Quote:Seriously? Superheroes are given their names before they learn to talk? You do realize it's superhero names we're discussing when I talk about only speaking English, right?Most people are GIVEN their names before they have even learned to talk.
So what's your point?
Yes, I don't like that it takes an hour sometimes to find a name that fits my concept. I don't like that we have to "try to find names" at all, when the genre dictates that a name is a very important part of a character's identity. I don't like that new players just coming in may grow disgusted with the naming system and leave before they can see just how great a game it is. It is broken, from a certain viewpoint, because it makes character creation more difficult. Why would *any* game want the first thing a player sees to be more difficult? -
They still convey a certain amount of pretentiousness though... Someone named "Lightning Lord" is completely different from someone named "Lightning Lad".
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Quote:Color adjectives and animal/insect/myth adjectives don't count... I specified that's one of the five "standard" superhero naming tropes earlier in the thread. I was speaking specifically about adjectives like "sassy" and "psycho". Also, in what universe is Captain Britain not pretentious? :PCaptain Britain wasn't a captain (at least originally)
Duke Nukem, Chemical King, Moon Knight say hi!
Green Lantern, Red Hood, Spiderman (Spider modifies Man) say hello!
No offense, but it sounds like you don't want any solution other than having the exact name you pre-selected for your character. Well, that's not likely to happen. The devs could probably force us to append our chat handles to our names, but plenty of people don't want that. If you can get the devs to believe a majority of players want this, you might get your way.
And again, my idea is for a dual naming policy... if you want to have a global-based name, you can, but if you want a name that you know for a fact will be unique on that server, you can go that route as well. Everyone wins.