Tenryuu

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What if I wanted to "RP" a scenario where I change my allegiance? It goes both ways. I'd go so far as to say that being "locked into a patron" is far more RP-limiting than the reverse.

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I wanted to RP a Science Origin character who went back to normal after the Terra Volta trial and had to then rely on gadgets to perform his previous duties as a hero. I can't just change him to a Tech Origin in the middle of everything. This sorely limits my RP.

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It is like picking kids for kickball: All the patrons standing in a line with their goodies hoping not to be picked last

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Black Scorpion better have something really darn good, because he's looking like the out-of-shape kid in line, to me.

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I'm not sure they'd completely lock us into content, the way this sounds.

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Considering the Story Arcs/Missions, possible badges, titles, and costume options that go with the Patron you choose, it'd be hard to respec out of that. Not that I mind. Just saying.

Even without Dev confirmation, I could tell what he meant... but yeah. It was a little confusing, at first glance.

Off and On-topic, however, Mayhem Missions are sounding better and better as time progresses. I can't wait to bust up some city blocks!

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Ninjitsu also has a version of it, I'm very sure. It's got some crazy name, but it's there.

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Ninjitsu only has a self-heal. EA's final defensive power has a Dull Pain-like function to it, I'm fairly sure.

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A player villain stopped by to observe this marvel of a tiny little Controller unscathed in the middle of certain death for many ATs. I hit them with BoI to warn them to keep away, then went back to slowly taking out the boss, while everything flopped around me.

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Man, I hate when people do that to me. If I'm just watching and someone attacks me? That's an invitation to kill. Sometimes, I'll even turn off Hide, so that they see me. They take that as: OMG A STALKKUR I MUS KILL IT. Nevermind the fact that they may already have their hands full.

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Suddenly, a Stalker trying to AS me appeared behind me. He/she is slowed slightly by Ice Slick and starts back peddling. I hit him/her with Shiver and he/she is slowed to a crawl. Now, there is not anyway I can kill this Stalker with my BoI. I hit him/her once with it anyway and now he/she is probably floored -slow. He/she backs right into a group of hero NPCs who killed him/her. Now, that was crazy.

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Silly Stalkers and their idiocy. ^_^

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Exactly. So you acknowledge that the Blapper playstyle incurs great risk, without status protection? Finally.

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The pure Blapper playstyle is silly, in my opinion. It basically ignores the ATs strengths. That's like saying "I'm going to play a Stalker without ever using Hide." It's possible to do, but it's silly, due to the disadvantages. If you play the Blapper way, then you've noone to blame but yourself. A BLASTER has less to worry about as they don't stupidly put themselves in range of death.

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From what I've seen, a Blaster, by himself, isn't going to be killing much of anybody with ranged attacks alone in PvP.

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I'll try my best to record some PVP videos, then, since it seems so abnormal to you.

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Otherwise, I don't see it. Their ranged attacks just aren't that good generally speaking.

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Then the Stalker AT must really suck to easily fall prey to attacks that just aren't that good.

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That's just silly and goes entirely contrary to the point of being an assassin (stalker).

"Hello, I'm here to kill you. I'm a very strong PvP build so I probably will kill you. You now have the choice to leave or die horribly. (Jeopardy theme music cues up) Decision?"

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"Nice to meet you! I'm an assassin!" - Flonne

I was going to reply in greater detail, but it's all getting fairly repetetive.

From Lvs1-40:
- Stalkers naturally have Hide. Blasters can pick up Stealth, though will always have inferior Stealth to Stalkers.
- Stalkers naturally have lower hp, lower damage, and no range (except for two sets that have one a piece). All of which cannot be compensated with power pools.
- A Stalker's inherent only works in Hidden/Hide-like status or on Held/Slept targets. A Blaster's inherent works whenever they please, though at a risk.
- Stalkers have Placate. Blasters do not.
- Blasters have greater AoE... which can be used to unhide Stalkers or simply prevent AS. [something of a weak point, since not all Blasters do, though most]
- Stalkers have defenses and great mez protection. Blasters do not.
- Blasters have ranged mez and debuffs. Stalkers, once again, do not have range.

What Stalkers get, post-40, we do not know... and until then, the point that Blasters DO get protection is rather irrelevant. So, I won't even bother with it.

There's your built-in advantages/disadvantages. Is there something I'm not seeing? Stalkers have mez protection due to the risk that comes with being in melee range. Blasters do not, because they do not have to be near the target to pose a threat. The only time a decent Blaster is in any real danger is against another ranged opponent, unless they stop moving and leave themselves open to a melee attack.

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Can you honestly say that those Blaster die less often than you do, generally? Because that sounds absurd on its face.

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I can say that MY Blaster dies less than my Stalker, as I can readily monitor it. It's mostly due to the fact that I refuse to move in range of the Stalker (unless I intend on using AoEs). I can also say that the Stalker vs. Blaster fights that I've witnessed were a bit one-sided in the Blaster's favour.

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This isn't about Blasters, though, ultimately. It's about the assertion that somehow Stalkers with blaster-level melee damage would be balanced.

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I'm not looking to win an argument or anything. Just pointing out that not everything is/isn't as everyone says it is/isn't.

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You're telling me it's safer to use Defiance than it is to use AS?

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If this particular Blaster is stealthed and perched out of range of the target, yes. There isn't a way for a Stalker to strike from an undetermined area a second time, if they have to. After the first, they're in the open. You might not be able to target them, but you know they're there. With a Blaster, it's different. They can snipe you and remain out of your view.

If they happen to do this out in the open, in melee range, then they're not fully utilizing what they have and had better be loaded with Lucks or just be good at ambushing opponents.

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If you truly think that a Blapper has less or even comparable risk to a Stalker in "setting up" a kill, then there's nothing more to say.

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It really depends on the powersets. EM is the best example, but there are Blasters that make heavy use of their secondaries and can deal about as much damage as a Stalker, without the need to be hidden or undamaged while attacking.

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How about this....because stalkers do not need to team...

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My Scrapper and Blaster don't need teams. I guess they need a swift kick in the junk, as well!

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Did it ever occur to you that a villain team, where the stalker actually helped the team, might be as capable as a hero team?

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Only if the heroes are mentally incapable.

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What if Stalkers couldn't stack Stealth and AS didn't work if the target moved more than 5 ft?

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Then they'd have to change all melee attacks to be more in-line with that.

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Stalkers might have to rely on corruptors and dominators more to set up their AS's.

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We already do, when faced with hero teams.

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They might need Brutes to disract scrappers and tanks. They might use MM's as bait (which they already do..but not teamed).

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Why would I need a Brute to distract a Tanker and/or Scrapper? The Brutes should go maul the support.

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The way I see it, the CoV AT's could do a great job as a team.

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Just not as well as an equally composed Hero team.

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AS + Scourge for teh win.

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I do have to agree on this, however.

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But stalkers don't need to team. In fact, they force the heroes to team..and they still don't have to team.

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The only times I find myself not needing a team is when there aren't any hero teams. I guess it really depends on the server.

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Corrupter debuffs make a huge difference in PvP...but I guess you might not ever know that as a stalker.

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That's amusing. It's like saying "all asians are perverts."

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Fair enough. And how good do you suppose their kill/death ratio is, in general? I'll bet yours is better.

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I can honestly say that Blasters have killed me more times than I've killed them. Not by much, but the ones I've seen are quite good at killing Stalkers. Good to the point I'm beginning to believe that they're better at hunting down Stalkers than Scrappers are.

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Dent 'em enough? What do you mean?

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Defiance. The lower the Blaster's hp, after a certain point, the more damage they deal. So, imagine a Blaster dropping from a tall building and taking their hp into red (obviously around the safety of their base), going into Stealth, and then sniping/kiting villains. Sometimes, they TP Foe from a building ledge, allowing the villain to drop and unable to return fire as the Blaster... well.... blasts them into oblivion. Valid tactics, but just as painful as AS and safer (most of the time). I found the last one mentioned to be one of the funniest...

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Regardless, that's not the point. THe point is that Stalkers DO have Energy Transfer, and this Dwarflord fellow is advocating blaster-level melee damage for Stalkers. Do the math.

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What about the Stalkers that AREN'T Energy Melee? Would it be so ridiculous of us to ask for that? D: *really does dislike the EM set... maybe out of jealousy or the fact that it gives the rest of us a bad rep*

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That, however, does not speak to this issue of Blasters. Blasters are not the first thing that leaps to mind when I think of Hero ATs' superiority. Blasters are probably the worst PvP archetype, in general, certain powerset combos (Ice/Energy) notwithstanding.

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And... what server are you on? A majority of my deaths are caused by Blasters. None were Electric, Assault Rifle, or Archery, however.

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Secondly, as I pointed out above, Blasters don't have Energy Transfer, which is the single best (PvP) attack in the so-called Energy Melee set. There's a reason for that.

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Not that they need it. If you dent'em enough, they can go on a villain killing spree without much worry. Especially those SS/SJ combo ones.

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I am of the opinion that EM for Stalkers is overpowered,

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Not just for Stalkers. */Energy Blasters are a horrendous pain to even touch.

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and that perhaps AS shouldn't drop toggles. Other than that, I'm fine with Stalkers.

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Tch. Maybe they shouldn't drop TWO toggles, but one? I dunno. I'm kinda attached to that one toggle drop. The second can bite it, for all I care.

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As to other Villain ATs, they could use a boost here and there.

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I'd be pretty happy, if it meant there were more of the other villain ATs in PVP. >_>

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No "Invisible Archetype" should also be given Alphastrik Capeabilities, that's just bad game design.

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And those of us who only have Hide and/or earn our Alpha?

I still think that Hide+Stealth should be taken away... Hide+Grant Invisibility, though? That's more than fine, in my opinion. It's an advantage gained only by another and it's short-lived... but in that aspect (duration), I suppose it'd be annoying.

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lol - you're right, it didn't take long to learn not to stand still....

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rofl

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If I was a stalker and saw someone standing still I think I'd suspect a trap

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I learned my lesson after the first time. I saw a lone Tanker moving back and forth. I assumed he was just trying to avoid multiple ASes. As soon as I landed, BAM! I was greeted by his seven teammates. That's right. The Stalker was ambushed from stealth by HEROES. I didn't see them, at all, until they started attacking. I laughed my rear back to the hospital and congratulated them all on a well-laid trap. Laughed even harder when I heard a Stalker cursing over Broadcast about it. >D

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slap an afk above your head and wait a few minutes... one will be by....

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ROFL I do this on my Regen Scrapper. Silly Stalkers fall for it, quite often.

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I do grab my Katana/SR Scrapper out when I get sick of getting ganked by Stalkers. Even though I can't see them (don't have Tactics), they seem to avoid trying to gank me.

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If you were on Freedom, you'd hear the constant cries of a Stalker named Ake Fena (pronounced ah-kay fay-nuh, for those who, for some reason, think it rhymes with 'cake fiend') about how there are hardly any "meaty targets" in Siren's Call. =P @ Blaster and Controller Population there.

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Another question: can a Stalker without Stealth stacked with Hide succeed and function well? I suspect that they can, but I'm not sure - my Stalker is a measly level 14 and isn't getting up there any time soon.

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Yes.

"Seeing me won't make this hurt any less."

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People say you can see a hidden stalker with some aim inspirations. However my focused Acc with lvl 50 SO acc slotted cant see one....why?

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Do you ONLY have Focused Accuracy? If so, you'll see my Stalker, but you won't see a Stalker with Hide+Stealth. Personally, I think a Stalker should have to earn the right to Hide+Stealth. =P

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I can't even talk to my team without having to use Phase Shift to stop and type because of AS.

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One of many reasons I TRY not to talk in PVP Zones. I find myself yapping, often, though... =/

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If you have Hide + Stealth nobody outside of double stacked Tactics on teammates will see you, unless popping many yellow pills continuously.

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Unless they happen to be a SR Scrapper with Tactics (and even worse when they get Clear Mind slapped on them). The reason I constantly mention SR Scrappers? Because they're the most annoying of the lot.

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My Controllers do not have anti-AS powers. PFF is the closest, yet I have been AS'd inside it. Radiation Infection helps. Both root me and have activation times. I have been AS'd when activating them, and AS'd when I turn them off, yet, I am trying to move around continously (stressfully and sometimes painfully, I might add).

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Yeah. I can see that being a real problem... but then again, personally hating Radiation Infection, I don't pity you. >D But it's okay! I understand your frustration. That's why I don't kill squishies. They're practically AS Bait on their own.

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No risk, no challenge tactics are cheap. But, that is my opinion. I had a teammate that set down a stack of trip mines and caltrops, teleported a villian into it and killed him. I told him that was cheap and quit the team. The villian had no chance. I understand that he was just using the tools the devs gave him, and I told him not to take it personally. It is just a cheap tactic.

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I love when Blasters do that to me, considering that it rarely works. Anything short of 5 mines can't kill my Stalker... but I'd have to say it's a safer bet to use 8 mines, since they miss, rather commonly. If the Blaster doesn't kill me, they find themselves in a rather poor position. *cackles*

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When I see I have someone perma-held, I let them go. It is just my personallity.

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You're not the only one. I'd feel bad, too. I always give my targets a fighting chance (and give squishies the chance to ignore my presence and run). If they don't take that chance, then they've no reason to complain (unless they were typing... in which I give them a chance to redeem themselves).

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Things that need to go away: perma-holds, 1 and 2-shot from melee and range, tp foe into trip mines, invisible foes taking more than half the hp you have left (yes, if you have 10 hp left, a hero/villian that you can't see should only drop you to 5 hp - if they become visible and then hit you, it can be full damage). People need to earn their kills, not get them free and cheap. Just my opinion.

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I don't so much mind getting 2-shotted at melee (though, it IS annoying, at times). It's the "from range" bit that truly agitates me. I have no chance to return fire. Ever. People say they have no warnings when it comes to AS... to which I say: Stick to the water, if you don't have +Perception. Sure, it may not be fun to do so CONSTANTLY, but at least you'll at least know they're there.

The half-hp from invisible enemies? Good concept... sorta. I'd agree to it not being able to deal more than half your max hp, but half your current hp? That's a bit much. I become Hidden for the sole purpose of critting. Not ASing. So, if I can only hit them for as much as half their current hp, then it leaves me in a very difficult position, when finishing people off (which I often do with criticals). With the Half Max Hp thing, it'd save squishies (and tankers? rofl... yeah. I still don't believe the whole 1-shotting a Lv50 Tanker thing that guy was trying to feed us). I'm all for saving squishies (since they can't really do much more than spoil a victory by healing someone), since they're usually the ones doing the complaining (on Freedom, at least).

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If they flew away, they had to have activated it after the port.

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They could easily do so. I get ported into them, all the time, and the best solution is to activate Hover and glide off.

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I think YOU'RE missing the point in that assasin strike is so powerful your other attacks are moot for the poor schmoe licking asphalt.

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Really? I rarely meet people in PVP who sit still long enough to be ASed, to begin with. I rarely meet people in PVP who can't see me. I rarely meet people in PVP who don't have some sort of anti-AS defenses. If someone falls into all three catagories, then they reserve no right to complain. I not only choose to use everything I have, but I'm almost FORCED to. Unless I can get the person to stay still and NOT attack me, I can't AS them.

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Knowing you've been AS'd and knowing where it came from are not exactly the same thing and again unimportant when you're deciding to go to your SG base or to the hospital for recovery. I've spun the camera around on many occasion trying to spot my assailant and seen nothing or maybe a wisp of an invisible nothing (of course, I suck, but that's another post entirely... ha!).

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Tip: Zoom Out in a PVP zone. You won't have to "spin the camera around.

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I will agree though that a defianced up, hopped up on build up and red pills, blaster who's sniping you while stealthed that fades into the shadows while your still trying to get the license plate of the... well, that stinks too - and stinks equally for the victim - but hey, no danger no excitement right?

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They don't even need reds. Just bump it up to two shots.

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He dropped caltrops, and I TP'd. I can say with certainty that there is no -jump to a stalker's caltrops. It was difficult to tell, but I don't think there was -fly either

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There's no -Fly in a Blaster caltrops, either. I don't know why there would be, since Caltrops aren't floor anchors or anything. ANYHOW! You can easily hover/fly over those at full speed.

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Wow, really? your melee? Show me another AT that has a power you get before lvl 10 with a dmg off 100% HP.

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..how does anything you just said change the fact that we're melee? "Melee" means "NOT Ranged" you know. AS isn't ranged and less than half the Stalker sets have ranged attacks. The two that DO only have one attack, each.

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Pheonixxic was trying to tell us that being wooped by a blaster is the same as being ASd. he said if he had a break free he could have escaped, u cant use a break free with a stalker. You guys are missing the point why AS should be nerfed, nothing should be that powerful of an attack should have been created at such a low level and so frequantly used as well. It should have been your last primary power, and used every 10 minutes or more.

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I'll agree to this when:
1. We get Blaster hp.
2. We get Blaster damage in all attacks.
3. We get AoE in all sets.
4. We get range.

I think YOU'RE missing the point where we may have ONE powerful attack, but the rest are pretty mediocre on the damage scale. And I don't mean that all our attacks say "Moderate" or "Low." I mean that our damage is really low for a melee class. That's right. We're M-E-L-E-E; meaning: we can't go around sniping from safe spots with stealth, like a Blaster can. You don't see a mass uprising of the playerbase crying for Blaster nerfs, though. I'm actually quite confused as to WHY. If you get ASed by a Stalker, you sure as hell know where it came from. If you get sniped by a stealthed Blaster who knows how to use their Defiance, how're you going to retaliate? If you let a Stalker get close enough to AS, then that's your fault

As for giving people a chance to fight back? I do it ALL THE TIME And SOLO, too. If I were teamed with someone, I could understand it, but I do make my intentions and the situation quite clear. I've done it since I first stepped into PVP. You know what happens? They: a) call for backup and I get ganged up on, b) run, or c) actually fight back. I listed those in order of rarity, from most common to rare. That's right. Seeing them fight back is EXTREMELY rare. I can only summarize this by saying "the heroes are far more cowardly than I've EVER been."

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I still think Stalkers are incredibly frustrating and ultimately unfun in 1v1 combat. There's just nothing that can stand up to them solo

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*/SR Scrappers, */Regen Scrappers, Broadsword/* Scrappers, */Energy Blasters, */Devices Blasters, Ice/* Blasters, Fire/* Blasters, Invulnerability/* Tankers, Ice/* Tankers, and Stone/* Tankers, MOSTLY. There ARE others that can stand up to'em, 1-on-1. They can all stand up to a Stalker, solo. It just takes a lot of sacrifice, as far as personal choices go, just as it does a Stalker.

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sheesh, lets just have the DEV change all of us into brutes when we enter PVP and problem solve !

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That would be AWESOME. For a short while.

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seriously , if an assassin class cant hide, and cant deal a fatal blow on u, then what good isit?

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They'd still able to achieve Burst damage and aggro management (yes, even in PVP). Just not as well as a Blaster, if they don't have AS.

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I agree getting 1 shotted is irritating, but Stalker arent the only one doing that. plus AS is an interruptable skill, mean u have a chance to knock it away.

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People like to argue that they can't see a Stalker before the AS (which is untrue, entirely, with most PVPers on certain servers).

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the 1% rule seems to even the odds, so if u run away from a stalker when he is doing AS, he cant kill u, n he cant do a follow up hit to kill u either since u ran away.

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Unless they idiotically stand there, refuse to team, or don't take up powers to see Stalkers.

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Mine turned out more like Masataka vs. Nagi (Tenjou Tenge) in which I utterly handed him his rear. If you don't feel like watching the whole video, then skip to 1min 29 sec.


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teehee

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Bunshichi was fricking awesome. *should make a Brute inspired by him...*

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The problem is workable... you can stack perception through say tactics and be able to see any stalker. There are powers that grant perception too I believe.

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Yep. You know what else is nice about that? We'll be getting Recluse's Victory soon, as well, where a good deal of Scrappers and Tankers will have Focused Accuracy.

Tactics + Focused Accuracy would mean ___________ (I'm sure plenty can fill in the rest.

Could you imagine a Super Reflexer with Focused Senses, Tactics, and Focused Accuracy? What if they also had Clear Mind? What would happen?