QuiJon

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We all pay money every month 15 bucks on up. that money needs to be spent on developing content and fixes for the game as it is now. seem that they just used our money and developed a way to make more money by charging 9.99 for a respec.

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Yes we all pay a monthly fee. But keep in mind this game also needs to stay profitable.

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You lost me there. Of course they game needs to stay profitable. But this is not the way. I go on gaming forums on other websites. When people who don't play this game saw this announcement , do you know what they thought? They get turned off my the microtransactions. I know I would. It's only hurting the reputation of the game.

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I dont see how. I havent heard of many MMOs that dont offer some type of RMT services. Even the biggest MMO out there charges for transfers etc.

I think everyone needs to keep in mind that to date, nothing that has had a real money purchase attached to it was a required purchase to play the game. Just as respecs wouldnt be either.

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We all pay money every month 15 bucks on up. that money needs to be spent on developing content and fixes for the game as it is now. seem that they just used our money and developed a way to make more money by charging 9.99 for a respec.

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Yes we all pay a monthly fee. But keep in mind this game also needs to stay profitable. It would not be good business in ANY business to allow for your profits to all be redirected back into the company and/or service. You would infact then make no profit. NC Soft needs to make a profit. Otherwise why keep the game running at all if your only goal is to break even.

There are certian costs associated with the game that already take from the monthly sub. Server maintaince, bandwidth, GMs and administrators, running these forums etc, long before you even get down to the game devs, and the cost now of running there own studio for devloping content.

I really have no problem with NC Soft looking for ways to increase its profits. I dont mind the in game ads, the extras like server transfer or new slots, and now respecs. I do however wish they would maybe concentrate some of these extras into tangible in game products, like say unique costume sets or new base tile sets or perhaps even to develop as some games have a personal base/hideout system.

I have no problem paying for expanded content. If you look at most MMOs by now would have had several expansions requiring payment. Guildwars has been made for half the time and has 3 boxes to buy(though granted its a free game), think everquest has had 7-8 expansions EQ2 i think atleast 3. FF11 like 4 i believe, and im not even sure on something like dark age of camalot had like 3-4 also i think. COX has had 1 expansion being COV. 10 bucks here or there to get ingame stuff i have no problem with. I just wish they were alittle more fun. My ideas would be like:

1) sell a halloween kit. Doesnt grant badges, but would give you like 25 of the costumes earned from trick or treating each with a 1 hour timer rather then expiring on a set day. Maybe 2 packs covers getting all the costumes. Have it apply to the entire account, and maybe grant a cool ingame like a unique costume peice set to be added into the normal tailor and something like the jingle jet pack as a temp travel power.

2)Obviously i think spending money on new costumes would be a great money maker and could probably support a costume dev team on its own based on how people love the character creator.

3)the ability to purchase a plot for an in game hideout or apartment. Has limited in game use compared to a SG base, but like maybe 1 teleporter covering 2 zones, and rez station and then unique decorations that would be kinda like making a home much like the options to make unique costumes. More over the ability to invite others over, giving it better use then a simple SG base.

4)honestly this is a big one, but i would spend 5-10 bucks to say start like 3 characters at level 14-20. Most of us have spent so much time leveling that it would be nice to start with a travel power and stamina. But if nothing else a base set of travel powers and a temp Geas type power for any new character would be cool and worth the money IMO also.

With so many different options i do just wish they would get creative. Respec is fine, but i do feel will kinda kill the want or desire to run the respec. I would rather these options offer new things that cant currently be done in game, or earned through vet rewards. Just my 2 influence.

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Just a quick follow up:

We have no plans of getting rid of freespecs. Each Issue that brings with it major power changes (which is pretty much every single one, eh?) will bring a freespec with it.

We have no plans of getting rid of the respec trials.

We have no plans of getting rid of the dropped Respec Recipes.

We have no plans of getting rid of the Veteran Respecs that your account earns.

This is simply another way to get a Respec onto your character.

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First off im all for finding ways to generate income. My one real issue with this respec for purchase idea is that I like the respec TFs. IMO there fun to run. But finding a team to run one now, especially at my normal play hours gets tough. When alot of players are sitting on like 5 vet rewards ones by the time there worried about doing it, plus the free ones, the recipes etc. There really is not much point in running the actual TF anymore.

This just seems like it would make it more so. If NC Soft is really wanting to find a way to generate income, i think things like the wedding package is a better idea. Halloween is coming up what if you introduced a costume package at a purchasable temp power. For X dollars you can buy all the costumes that you can get from the event without tricks and treats each costume with like a 1 hour timer on activation. I would probably pay 10 bucks for that.

Or new costume options would be another good one. Like a sims expansion, more base and costume decorations for a set price for download. I would just rather the purchasable content be a worthy value, but not impact game play in a negative way. I think selling things with thebenefit of a resepc is a bad idea. However now i type that, why not sell the ability to get a new "earned" respec by doing the TF again. Done all three earned, no other options by a new earned tf that opens the reward option again at the end of the TF not just a click it and get it from the server?

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the question is why did he have to have 2 hits to kill someone? LOL

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I personally was noticing its amazing he can support attacking and running like 8 toggles at a time.

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Before the Intro to Vanguard patch, Freedom was sending some players to Ouroboros 3.

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During the last day of the double xp weekend, Triumph was getting RWZ3, and I was crashing zoning to either Ouroboros or the RWZ.

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Right. Which is precisely why that arc was patched. Notice: the devs didn't remove talk-to-contact mission bonuses from all Ouroboros arcs -- just the problematic arc, the same way they shouldn't make sweeping changes to all Task Forces simply because soft-spawning to Cap SFs and the STF/RSF are having debatably undesirable consequences.

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Accept if dealing with Soft Spawning, it wasnt just the Farming of the Cap TFs that used it. I have to this day not found a Respec team for villians that didnt require everyone to log out before the thorn tree mission to lower the number of vines needed to kill. And i think they even fixed that didnt they? Yet still the general consensus is "Log out and make it easier". And since have had people do the same thing on Positron, Snapse, the hero respec to make less mobs in the find key rooms etc.

Its not just a farming issue it a apain in the [censored] issue as far as im concerned. I used to play with someone that used to run 3 accounts. She would log them all in to start a TF and either log them out or keep one going on follow to farm xp and drops. Those are rewards that others should have been earning, or had better chance of earning if she wasnt running multiple toons cause she could require the soft loading of tough missions to make up for the fact we were really running 2 men short due to her extra bagage.

So im sorry, im for any change that actually gets people wanting to play the game for the fun of a team, rather then the rewards it might earn them. The rewards are nice, dont get me wrong, but if people actually have to get REAL players involved in the team again, and cant inflate there chances to 3/8 of getting the best rewards running useless toons through a TF im all for it.

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Its really funny sometimes when i recall people crying for end game content and crafting and suchfor so long. And when they get it the first thing they do is work on figuring out how to exploit the system instead of play within it.

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First, most TF's aren't end game content.

Second, if any content, end game or otherwise, is being played primarily for the reward by a significant number of players rather than for the content itself then where does the fault lie?

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First off TF/SF ARE end game content, why they created the Auto-expemt feature for them when before you actually had to find a player to exempt you. Sure you can do them before end game, but they were specificly altered to allow ease fo use for end game play as well.

And secondly i dont say that its wrong for people to want to do a TF for a reward. If you want the reward, find some friends, run the TF have a good time. Unfortunately that is not what was being done. Players were taking Mutliple accounts into a TF, Stacking the Team with up to 8 characters, starting 3-4 TFs with different toons from the accounts. Then each player runs 1 tf to the final mission, then they only play the actaul final mission in mass, after soft loading the mission to assure that its a easy win. So in the matter of the hour and half - two hours it would have normally taken to run one full TF they are getting 3-4 rewards, maybe even up to 8 or so if they have multiple toons in the same TFs.

That is exploiting the system by any definition. All these changes did was stop, or atleast make that more difficult. I fail to see how this is a doom change to anyone that was not exploiting this for personal gain to begin with.

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Or, what if they individually examine the Task Forces they're having issues with (as was done with Katie TFs), and try not to let other Task Forces get caught in the crossfire?

EDIT: In a few words, "fix what's causing problems." Shocking suggestion, I'm sure.

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QFT. Rather than taking a sledgehammer to a house to try and catch a mouse and wrecking the entire house...why not set a simple glue trap to catch him neatly and securely....

So how many people's pms to Posi still remain unread?

*raises hand*

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Unfortunately they cant do that because the very same players that spend all there time farming this or that, would simply then move onto the next most profitable TF v. Time invest to farm. Then the devs would spend more time "fixing" that TF to have the mobs move onto the next one, and the next. Setting a simple, and fully fair set of rules to ALL the TF/SF creates consistancy of the expectations for the system and becomes predictable for players instead of having rules that apply to this one or that one but not others. And saves the Devs time to created wanted new features rather then having to fix TF after TF as players migrate to the new Fast Cap experience.

And if i was Posi i would not be reading any PM that delt with this issue either. Its a fair change, to make a system work "as intended". Im sure the devs never intended you to be able to run 4-5 TFs in a one hour period for the rewards. Multiply that by people running 3-4 accounts in the same TFs with no one at the helm simply just there to get more loot, both the minimum spawn levels and the soft loading changes seem more then fair IMO. They really effect no one that wasnt looking for the easy way to exploit the recipie drop system to begin with.

Its really funny sometimes when i recall people crying for end game content and crafting and suchfor so long. And when they get it the first thing they do is work on figuring out how to exploit the system instead of play within it.

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We know that finding out about this change after the patch is already live is not the ideal way to go about it. It was never our intent to “hide” or “stealth” this change out, it was simply lost in the volume of other changes spanning many months.


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This part I am not buying even for a second. It has happened way too much since the begining of the game, it even happens after Jack left the game. Lighthouse this is a pretty huge change that we should have known about in the patch notes, there is absolutely no excuse that something this big gets missed in the patch notes. I can understand not posting a patch note due to the exploits like the Ouroboros powerlevel exploit but this isnt even on that level and should not have been missed period. This has been a constant thing with us the players having to figure it out whether it was a bug or "Working As Intended". You guys need to do better because this is inexcuseable due to the size of the change.

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Wow overreact much?

First off, this was an exploit. In the same amount of time it would take a team to legit run a TF you could run 4 TFs and get 4 rewards, thats exploitive. TFs were ment to be team content, im willing to assume that due to the time involved in some the ability to have the missions scale as people joined or left was looked at as a favor to the player base. When Inventions got added, the ability to exploit this system was taken and run with to get more rewards and earn more money and recipies.

And to those that say the rewards wanted were recipies therefore not helping the RMT crowd, if a RMT player got a LOTG and earned 150million at the auction house for it, what exactly do you think was happening with that influence.....it became a new wave of tells to buy it for real cash of course.

Overall significant things left off patch notes are few and far between when you think of how many were exploits which they have always said they would not list in patch notes. Then figuring out how much was not, against 11 full issues, the addition of COV, and i dont have a clue how many weekday patches over the course of almost 4 years now, and this doesnt happen with near the frequency that you want to make it out to have happened.

When you think of what was added in this last patch with the real numbers system alone being a huge addition, plus the event info, etc. i dont think its unreasonable to think this may have just been overlooked.

So let me help you out and edit some comments to what it sounds to me like you really ment.
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I can understand not posting a patch note due to the exploits like the Ouroboros powerlevel exploit but I should know if i am going to be unable to exploit the reward drop system and auction house, period.

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You guys need to do better because this is inexcuseable to actually expect us players to play the game "as intended" for only the standard planned reward.




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Whats with all the hate? This system whats not ment to allow you to trasfer inf from one of your toons to another. It was for you to sell an item to another player plain and simple.

Now I do hope they add some sort of bank so that I can give inf to my other toons but this current system was never supposed to be used in that way so I didn't expected it to be.

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Well this game was never intended to have loot farming and a economy like this either. Thing change. In this particular case it could have had a benefit for the player base, that was "with in reason" and the devs have once again decided to not "give the players what they want"

If nothing else this auction system should have allowed for direct sales between servers. Where player A got a salvage or whatever on freedom, and player B in his freedom SG wants it for a character he has on Liberty. The sale system should allow for you to approve or disapprove direct sales between players. So player A can put it up for sale and approve or dissapprove an offer to allow for his own deal to have been brokered, again minus the fees but he chooses who he sells to.

I honestly would just wish the devs dropped the entire system at this point, Inventions, the economy everything. Its ruining what was once a nice simple intuititive game experience. Soon were gonna have some [censored] system that is way over complicated like Star wars galaxies was when it first came out.

LMAO!!!!

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"weak now, powerful later"

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Im sorry, when exactly do Dominators get powerful? I would say thats more "weak now, so so later"

This change still leaves dominators inferior to what every other AT is capable of. Its the problem everyone that has played the AT since the beta has mentioned. To much is given up for a inherent power. What does a brute give up for furry? They are already the highest damage and highest defense in the game? What cost does a corruptor pay for Scourage, it just kinda happens as a nice bonus if i recall correctly? Master Minds buff their own pets, and can play with essentially a nice level of resistances through body guard, and what does that cost them? Even stalkers inherent ablities work atleast in a cooperative arrangement with the ATs purposes. Only Dominators are expected to play the game at inferior levels so that at times they can exceed what a character should be able to do. The base line of what a dominator can and cant do is what needs to be adjusted. This craptastic idea of a inherent ability needs to jsut be ignored until domintors play balanced with out it. Then decide whats a appropriate buff level and how often it should be able to be used.

Oh and for those that think having domination availible more often is a great gain, i actually went back on the servers and tested it. Sure i can get domination going about 6 times during one mission if i was clicking it everytime it came up. However doing so i got to the end of my mission with Mynx and guess what? It wasnt ready.

So essentially we suffer the same problem, That we need domintion so much for one encounter in the mission that if you risk using it to often you wont have it when you need it.

Same problem as before this fix accomplished really nothing.

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...that means being able to solo on Invincible easily...

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I don't think that any AT should be able to solo on Invincible easily...it's Invincible, it's supposed to be difficult!

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But it's not. Not even with Dominators really. It's just slow. It's laughably easy with all melees, most controllers, corrupters, MMs and Defenders. Only Blasters and Dominators should have any problems AT wide and even then it's not so bad for Blasters who can put out some hurt.

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I agree and dont agree. Its not that i think Invinceable settings should be easy, they shouldnt. Unfortunately they are for a great many ATs. Just as i dont think contributing to the fighting of AVs should be something that only 2 ATs excel at, but they do. Just as i dont think any AT or build should be a solo PVP power house, but they are.

The problem with doms that i will admit is that they are probably one of the better balanced ATs in the game. However its like 1 well balanced AT against 8 that are totally outta wack most of the time. And that isnt calling for a nerf, its calling for possibly a "lets try it and see" approach to fixing dominators.

Posi, the biggest call of all on dominators has been damage and end consumption, well that those triangles but i dont totally disagree with those and dont know of a better fix so ill leave them alone.

But we have a test server. I dont get why we are only looking at fixing doms in relation to a 90 second time period. By no buff damage some take the buff of damage from domintion and raise the base dominator values for a month on test. Lets research that and see what happens. Get some feed back, data mine.

Same thing test some abilities to a unresitable hold in PVP. Kinda like a critical. See how that goes. Does it over power us or not? Personally i think it would just make us the AT of choice to have on team for detoggling.

I know youplay a dominator and claim to like the Jeckal and hyde value of them. But the majority of your player base says that is the weakness, or the very reason they wont play one. Im sure you can data mine how many doms are being played at any given time, how many have reached level 50 etc. And im willing to bet its the lowest of any AT, accept maybe kheldians. But were in the "give the players what they want" era and honestly i personally feel that the only player getting what they want out of their doms is a developer. And im not quite sure that fits in with the best goals to be set for your product.

I love my two doms. I however dont play them with closed eyes. I dont feel it takes away from my enjoyment to talk about their problems. They use to much end. They use 5-6 attacks to kill what most other ATs use 3-4 to kill. Control at its current nerfed AOE levels (which i dont complain about mind you) is not the city of statues that it once was. Nor is a active defense that can miss a absolute defense that requires the lowest damage levels. Its been demonstrated over and over how much more effective certian corruptor and defender/controler powers are for defense over that of control sets. Yet my MM was soloing Heros before the regen changes. So apparently that level of play is acceptable since the changes didnt change my MM they changed the enemies. Wich means for anything under a Hero or AV my MM is totally capable of fighting with really no threat whatsoever. Mind you im not asking for that on my doms. That is why i stopped playing my MM. Im asking for a buff to put doms between blaster and corruptor levels of damage. Acceptable i believe because doms or most, dont self buff their damage. And if balance is needed lower or remove the damage buff from domination to off set it.

Over all please STOP looking to domination to fix the dom AT. Its honestly what broke it to begin with.

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Bases are 100% a DESIGN problem. Not a player problem.

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Designed and costed on the assumption players would want bases for PvP while it turned out players wanted them for PvE.

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Funny thing also, sounds like the devs dont care to PVP in the game yet designed bases for pvp rather then PVE.

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Good in theory, not so much in reality.

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Bingo. That pretty much nails our design on bases. We're slowly but surely making additions and changes based on feedback & data. We'll get there...I think bases are a case study where a design didn't mesh well with actual gameplay! For some odd reason, some posters have thought my Serious Games speech blamed the players; heck no! Bases are 100% a DESIGN problem. Not a player problem.

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So basicly were the testing room for bases and so im guessing they will be all ironed out and the good bases will be availible.... in the Marvel MMO?

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I LOVE the idea of a portrait of my character as a decorative base item.

Statues of the high-ranked or high-level members is another great idea.

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Okay. Let's look at what makes a 'personal item' truly personal, and how it integrates with the rest of the base design/editing process.

- Personal items have to be items that only one person CAN place. Currently, crafted items can be placed by anyone who happens to have enough Salvage. They aren't personal at all; quite the reverse, in fact. So, we need the kind of item that Captain Blammo or Goldfinch Girl can look at and say 'That's there because of me. Nobody else could have put that in the base.'

- A personal item has to tie into the character somehow. There are multiple ways of doing this; it's just a question of which are more technically feasible.

- - Character portraits could be done by grabbing the graphic off the character's Hero ID, putting it in a frame (Tech or Arcane style, naturally) and bingo, you have a new wall mounted item.

- - Text plaques could be placed and written on by individual players, thus contributing to the overall base flavour. See my other posts, ad nauseam...

- - Statues of your character, as mentioned before, are very personal.

- - If statues are too old-fashioned, then what about a high-tech hologram of your character?

- - Name plates, which grab your character's name and put it on a decal, could potentially work. These could be used to designate rooms, or chairs (this big chair is for General Nastydeath!) or lockers, or office cubicles...

- - Certain badges could unlock base items. These wouldn't necessarily be totally unique to the player, but they would be personalised. For example, how about certificates, presented when you get your 10-level badge, getting more elaborate each time? What if hitting 50 got you a big wall-mounted fancy certificate, which you could click on and bring up a graphic: 'PRESENTED TO CAPTAIN TUNAFISH ON HIS RECEIPT OF "HERO OF THE CITY" MEDAL, WITH THE THANKS OF A GRATEFUL CITY' and a big wiggly Statesman signature underneath? That's the kind of thing that a SG full of heroes might want to display in the entry room.

- - In fact, certificates could be the new badges! What if completing a Task Force granted the leader a certificate, signed and sealed by the appropriate signature hero, for you to frame and put on your base wall? What if you could unlock special certificates by taking down giant monsters or earning accolades?

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Just a thought on some of your ideas, but what if some of these personal items could be placed at no real cost. As in you upgrade the plot size of your base which allows you to get a new type of room, one that is free say called a Hall of Heroes or something dorky like that.

This room serves one purpose that being to create tributes to your SG members. It cant be destroyed in raids, has no real value in the fights, it cant have weapons etc in it. But it allows for the item placement you talk about.

It could allow for say that Hologram idea, which should be simple enough to just recreate your character in a non-sentient NPC standing on a block or something. maybe have a item or items that allow for use as a "display case". Not that each badge, souvineur, etc is visable from standing in front of it, but you could click on the case or plaque and get the personal info kinda window that allows for that information to be viewed. Maybe also view your bio so you can create a cool story for why that character is in your hall of fame.

Just a thought but it seems that it would be easily do-able with the only real cost to your SG being that you have to afford a plot size that can accomadate the size of the room. Which wouldnt be overly terrible if they made a few different room sizes making it easier on smaller groups to then make a more personal size base.

I also like your certificate idea. It would be intresting to work it into existing mechanics so that when you run a TF or SF with your SG or VG members only that it would award a certificate to your group. But better then certificates i think would be some type of physical item from the TF. Maybe a display case with a piece of Babbage in it from Synapse TF. Or a witch hat for completing Croatao, a nice block of stone from Jurassic, or framed picture of the heroes you resuced in eden etc. It makes it more of a Batcave kinda thing, like in the animated series he has Freezes gun on a pedestool etc.

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Yet a Super Group costume isn’t your creation, either. And yet people wear them. The counterpoint is, of course, that a Super Group costume is in addition to one’s normal costume, not instead of. There’s no such personal property in the base. We thought (on paper) that the “personal items” would do the trick, but it isn’t really the same thing, is it?


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For me that hits the nail on the head. I belong to some SGs, and some have bases. But most of my toons are homeless since the demise of my main SG back about a year ago. And i really just havent hurried to find them homes.

However what is more an intrest to me would be the idea many put forward of a BAT-Cave for lack of a better term. Or perhaps a Fortress of Solitude if your more a fan of that. Yes prestige is nice for a large group. But many people playing since day 1 have had piles of Influence that they would be willing to spend. Hell most of my tons are sitting on 15-20 costume tokens now so i dont even pay to do that anymore.

I dont really want to base raid, nor do i really PVP. But it would be nice to be able to make a Personal space, that i can give access maybe on a "Freinds list" type status, so all my character have access. Dont have to worry about raids, control, power etc. Its just my getaway has some storage options for my stuff. maybe a limited teleport as in like 1 machine so i can personally select 2 zones to port to but no more. (just kinda giving me a option to speed up some of the longer jumps of travel without having to run through pocket D if i choose not to)

But mostly i would be willing to spend influence and infamy on a person space. Or at minimum allowing the currect SG base to have some type of influence use better then that current exchange for buying starter items so people could use the current system to create non raidable spaces for themselves.

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What about the Legends System ???!!!! Posi mentioned a legends system that would give us a reason to play our level 50's again and I have heard nothing about that since it was mentioned.

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About every other issues something is mentioned that will work as a concern for "End game" content. It never quite seems to materialize beyond wanting to get the new badges for older toons.

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I'm not terribly worried about the Marvel deal. The fact that it's going to be made for a gaming console suggests it'll be a faster, shallower game than COH, optimized for a gamepad with what? Eight buttons? I'm pretty sure it'll cater to a different audience than COH either way.

Meanwhile, Cryptic has a big project to work on and train new people on and learn new stuff on etc. One that'll bring in a lump sum of money. One that associates it with 'big names' in the entertainment sector (though I'm not sure being associated with MS is a good thing). These are things that can be used as bargaining chips and credentials in future deals. Once that is done they'll likely go into a follow-up to COH and bring all that experience from the Marvel MMO into the field with them, but this time they have their own properties they can work with.

For Cryptic, I only see good news in this. For the hardcore COH fans, it won't be an issue. The only people who might mind are NCSoft.

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Sorry to say i look at this quite from the opposite. COH is on the way out at cryptic i can say for sure. Though the Devs might say its not, its only probably to prevent a mass exodus from COX before the marvel game is released.

Think of all the growing pains COX went through that the marvel game due to Cryptics experience now will not. Sorry to say that COX just became the guinea pig for MUO. Notice the "Giving players what they want" attitude which is a convient excuse for giving us things that for years we have asked for AKA trench coats, new flight animations etc, that can all be then put into the marvel game once the bugs are worked out here. After all if you cant make a gambit look alike with a trench coat on who will play a marvel game.

Finance wise a small development company like Cryptic that has 1 franchise that keeps it going, and they go into a partnership to make a new game for a new console/MMO company like Microsoft and there 360. And this partnership will be in DIRECT compitition with its previous game releases? To me it is a enormous conflict of intrest. Essentially the same customer base is being draw upon. With COX pretty much past its pinnicle of subscription dont think for a moment that any industry breaking improvments will be seen in COH. Infact im willing to bet that even if the dev team came up with some great new idea for COX that it would be questioned to impliment it in COX or save it for MUO.

Sorry i know its a DOOOOM post but frankly this symbols to me the real begining of the end in a way ED or any other game adjustment of the past, couldnt even have touched.

THought information is scarce about the system. All we know is it has long been put off because it couldnt be done correctly. My only fear now is that since they have been slow to get a "personal lair" idea up and running for our heroes and villians an invention system that is basicly a crafting system is likely to still require use of a SG base. First off requiring you to have COV in order to use it, since as was mentioned before all base stuff is a COV feature that requires both boxes in order to have it in COH, and what about people that dont join SGs?

My only hope would be two things, either finally getting the ability to make the "Qui-Cave" just for my own use, not rquiring hours upon hours of prestige farming to make it useful, or that some kinda of "Public" crafting tables come to pass so that using this ability doesnt require either joining a group you dont care to be in or spending to much time worrying about earning enough prestige to build that table for your SG.

Though they say not to worry i cant help but worry that all of our feature for the next few issues are going to be basicly testing how things will run best in the Marvel MMO. Seems like a huge conflict of intrest for one developer to have 2 competing MMOs in the market place, both dealing with similar content.

Sorry to see you go hope TR turns out fun, unfortunately what i have seen of it so far, i have absolutely no intrest.

Anyway, i thought "GoodBye" posts were forbidden?

Have a good time at TR>

I dont need any post to know what 15 is saying is true. I play in a pretty standard group of friends almost every night when i team. One girl i play with has a high level MM, and a high level dom. She likes to play the dom, when the team is getting overwhelmed she changes to the MM and suddenly were breaking even again.

Time and time again when on teams with 2-3 doms i see problems. Not with control mind you but with damage, buffing, debuffing, all the things that make the game go round. Frankly even in COH you could easily play and have a controler use absolutely none of his primary set powers, accept maybe pets, and only his secondary buffs and debuffs and a team could still run the AV arcs no problem. What matters is mitagating damage, and increasing your teams damage output and accuracy. Dominators dont contribute to that as of now, why i keep calling for some damage boosts. We should atleast be on par with what a Corruptor can dishout for damage. With no self buffing that to me is fair.

But overall i have experienced it time and time again, when im on dom heavey teams, we do very poorly or have to run closer to the lower difficulty, corruptor/MM heavey support and were running on unyeilding all night. There is a reason for that, and it has nothing to do with people not knowing how to play their ATs. Just as you dont see spamming in St M for a sonic team looking for a dominator do you?

edit: and keep in mind im not saying i dont have fun playing my dominators. I have said several times i loved blasters, i liked my controlers, and i HATE what they did with corruptors. To me that AT is no fun. Doms were the best alternative to edge of your seat AT as blasters were. However in the balance to the usefulness of the other COV ATs on a full team doms really just dont measure up to what the others can do. Yes i have a great time soloing with mine, but i do feel alot that on a team im being carried. True or not its how watching a brute take out a +2 boss in 3-4 hits and never taking damage from him makes me feel when I was told my holding a boss would be to complete of damage mitagation and required my having gimped damage. Yes i know different ATs do different things, but the curve is to extreme where doms fall to the other 4 ATs.

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I believe that it's not just a matter of Doms loosing a popularity contest. I believe that the grav powerset has several flawed powers that make that set undesirable for most players and most groups.
So yes, I come here and add comments to topics about dom powers. If you want to call that DOOOOOM that's up to you. But I regularly point out, and discuss, the specific flaws with grav. I believe that is what a forum is for. And yes exaggerations like you saying that I'm crying DOOOOM is also part of the forum, but not a useful part. If you want to, instead of yelling "he's yelling doooooooom!", discuss any of the issues feel free. I may sometimes post "unproductively negative", but maybe you should take a look at your own posts. They seem pretty unproductively negative to me.

Your computer analogy is flawed. Doms, especially grav, being unpopular is because they are flawed not in spite of it. Low popularity is just a symptom of the problems. Grav doms compared to other ATs is more like comparing PC/IBM clones and an abacus. Some people may prefer an abacus. But given choices that are supposed to be "balanced" the 'player base' deserves something better - even if that means a few people lose some of their pet tactics.
It certainly wouldn't be the first time the game was changed for the sake of balance. Maybe this time the change can be a positive one for most players.

To review a few of the major points that I've brought up:
<ul type="square">[*]Propel needs quicker activation.[*]DS needs to be less situational.[*]Wormhole should group mobs rather than scatter them.[*]Control or Damage should to be improved slightly.[/list]If that doesn't give you enough "productive" ideas to discuss then read the dom guild that's been in my signature for several weeks.

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Being i have a level 47 Grav dom and a 36 fire, ill respond somewhat.

Grav doms have some issues, but over all i dont consider them to be nearly as problematic as people say. First off I dont take propel, just like i didnt take a snipe because of the root and the animation time. Its a choice. And sure though its fun to smack a enemy with a forklift in play, since propel does really no more damage then anything else in your assualt pool, then why take it? Sure it can fill in a incomplete attack chain early on, but by later levels i would think most doms are respecing it out.
DS is more of a Oh S* button. Though i dont like it, and got rid of it, i dont think its broken. Single target would be preffered but when your team is getting spanked by a group DS a mob of enemies is probably not gonna be argued much.
Wormhole isnt for herding. No other Sleep/disorient has a "grouping" feature, and in fact powers like flash fire on my fire dom are just as effective and yet the group instantly starts to wander around. Which is why i get my AOE immoblize on both my doms. But if you work with Wormhole, use walls and corners etc, it does a good job of putting people where you want them, and infact its probably the one power i miss most going from grav to fire play.
As to the last one, i say damage. Its what i have been screaming since beta only to be told by the DomBios that i just dont know how to play them. Well i know how to play them just as i do a blaster, or a controler, or any other AT i have played. And they need more consistant abilities. This "god mode" everyone thinks we get with domination is the worst design this game has. Yes as a boost to mag/duration and even the planned mez protection i can get behind it, and think our control outside of dom is adequate. But damage no. That buff should be a full time damage level for us. We as a AT have no real ability to self buff or heal or mitagate damage accept for the active primary. We have the lowest HPs, and from having a higher level Stalker, dom, blasters, tanker, controlers, and even Peacebringer i would say my doms (and yes specifically my grav more so then fire) need the damage increase. And considering how i felt about my Peacebringers damage levels when playing him, that is saying ALOT.

To me remove the damage buff from domination. Grant it on a full time basis, which should place us right around i think 85-90 percent damage levels. With no defiance, scourge, buildup or aims etc. I woudl think that is right about fair where we should be for our defense levels to our damage output to end consumption ratios.

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I just don't understand the whole issue. A) Why they would make the Dominators so dependent on teams early (pre-SO) yet not really that helpful to teams pre-SO...haven't we already seen that with controllers pre containment?

B) Why the Devs didn't 'Smoke Test' the development of Dominators thru all three levels of play (Pre SO/SO/fighting AVs) so they didn't get this whole drama fest fixed before it rolled out of Beta smelling so badly

If you don't want to give them more control, you give them more damage.

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For A, I think that is your own personal experience, and does not reflect most of the people playing dominators.

For B, I do think that the problem is that people do not understand Medium damage and what they expect out of a medium damage AT. When it comes down to it, everyone's problem is with damage. The heart of the issue is not the control, it is not the assault secondary. It is the damage. If this was a high damage AT, we would not have as many complaints coming from people, xcept for their greedy and stupid [censored] saying that they thing they should have control just like a Controller. .

If the Devs do believe in the ease of use of the different ATs, I think they should show that some ATs are more difficult than others to use. But even then, many people are able to gauge what they are to xpect as the level progress.

Most of the drama that comes from this board, comes from morons. . lazy morons who couldn't dominate their way out of a wet paper bag. There are good people who earnestly seek help, and receive it from the good men of this board. But there are others who are obviously never going to learn how to play their toon well, or are never going to get the kinds of changes they want.

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Well Jesus i do think i can play my domiator just fine, and have played about 86 or so levels of play on them combined. And i do agree, they need more damage.

Now before you assume that we are all just uneducated on what Medium damage means, has it ever occured to you that its not that we dont know what medium damage means, but that we dont agree that Doms should be a medium damage AT.

After all Master minds are technically medium damage also, and can solo AVs(or could before regen/hp bumps) the damage they inflict cost them almost no end beyond casting and buffing there pets. There pets take agro and even share damage now so MM get around 40-50 percent walking damage resistance. They heal buff, debuff, etc.

Then we look at corruptors, listed as a high damage AT and why? In COH the defender/team buffer AT was relegated to having medium damage because of there self buffing, yet its all rolled into 1 package here. And again they can debuff there enemies ability to inflict damage, there accuracy, heal, and inflict heavey damage from range.

Yet when we come to the Dominators we have a active defense that being control. It cost continous end to use, we have no self buffing to speak of, or atleast its not widely rampant, no healing, we do 2 things, control and inflict damage. And the damage is piss poor at best. Our assualt sets have a mixture of ranged and melee powers, yet were really not even any better at inflicting melee damage then a corruptor is at inflicting ranged.

The problem isnt a lack of understanding of the term medium, its a lack of agreeing its the proper level of damage for the AT. Quite honestly in my experience those not seeing a issue are probly running fire doms. So far its the only class that seems like it has a well balanced approach, almost like its the only class that was tested. But if my fire dom is medium damage, then my grav dom is low. Point being damage is really the difference maker for the set. Fire/fire plays so differently then Grav/energy, and its all the damage that makes it better. I honestly like the control options in Grav better, but i dont need them on my fire dom since the imps round out a well damaging set.

that and most people posting responses are not saying they want full on blaster level damage and domination. They are saying they want the roll of domination toned down and the normal play buffed up. Yet all the devs seem to be doing is trying to fix domination. What is trying to be said is that is not the right approach. It would be like trying to fix blasters by working on defiance. Defiance wont ever help blasters no matter what is done to it, and neither will domination the problems are when running outside of domination, not while in it.

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Actually, by the numbers, Dominators outdamage Controllers until the controllers can pick up the epic pools. Fire Mastery + Containment = sick damage.

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And even if I were to agree with you, is this a good thing? In my experience Controller &gt; Dominator at pretty much every level - but definitely at 41+.

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I would dare say that you're not slotting your Dominator properly then. Early on (pre-level 10) the Controller wins in the damage. They're scary effective at that point where the Dominator will flounder on damage. Once you get around level 10, though, the Controller's damage doesn't scale very well whereas the Dominator's does. Many controllers can boost their damage a bit (dependent upon their secondary -- kinetics and radiation are great for this) but it still won't outshine the Dominator. At 32 they get the same pets, so that's a wash.

I've said this before and I'll say it again...the key with the Dominators is the melee attacks. The bulk of the damage is there. My dominator, hitting an even level mob with no fire resistance in melee does 85 damage at level 22. The attack recharges quickly and uses little END. With Domination it does about 120. You can not name any single controller attack, even with Containment, that does that much damage at that level.

The biggest mistakes I see with people playing Dominators...

1) They rely too much on their controls and don't slot (or even take) their attacks. At that point you're just a weak controller.

2) They ignore their melee attacks and try to play the class as a Defender with holds. (This was a mistake I was making.)

Now I will agree that I think Controllers begin to shine at 32 with pets (the same pets Doms get) and then again at 41+ when the epics unlock. My Dominator has not hit the late game yet so I can't really do a comparison. I do know that I get 2 high damage attacks in the 30s -- Blazing Bolt at 35 and Blaze at 38. I'll take those over Fireblast (which I already have) and Fireball (great AOE but not the greatest of damage). Especially considering I have Breath of Fire already slotted up.

At 22 I have Stamina, and a travel power.

For controls I have the single target hold, the AOE hold, an AOE Sleep (best used for soloing) and an AOE Confuse (the bread and butter). On top of that I have Flares (unslotted), Fire Blast, Breath of Fire and the fire melee attack (I forget the name). It's an outstanding attack chain when combined with Air Superiority.

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hate to say it but at level 22, your still living large on the fact that Blasters in that level range already did great damage. The fact is yes at that range your probably out damaging a troller because you actaully have damage attacks. However by level 41 that is going to be a different story.

For two years the blaster forums have been full of reports that our damage doesnt scale well into the end game. What exactly do you think then happens to blaster attacks that are at 65 percent of there value? Now sure domination make them bearable, however with a troller they get a bigger buff, and really a buff when ever they want it off containment that a dominator doesnt get. Also factor in those self buffs like Fulcrum shift, or rad buff etc, and your talking a serious difference in the power of even those 1-2 epic attacks. And now also under ED you can slot a couple recharges in those attacks and there up a pretty good rate.

Dominators need a Always-on damage buff. Nothing we get or take buffs our damage, so to me remove buff from domination, apply it to our damage all the time and call it even. We dont have containment, buffs in our sets, defiance, scourge etc. That damage level is all we are going to have, just give it and lets get on with being evil.