Permasun

Ok the numbers are too embarrasing to share

To be honest, I really don't know what role the dev's have in the input/reponse process. I know there is one but they also spend time coding. To their credit, I'm suggesting that they are so embedded in the work they do to manage CoH that they really have no objective way of knowing how AT's and characters REALLY succeed or fail. Same goes for Statesman.

Regarding anecdotes, I don't think summing up all of the time that leads to getting a character to 50 constitutes one. This is a massive time commitment, perhaps a pathetic one, that has given a number of players a pretty sound foundation upon which to base their observations. I'm no math whiz but I imagine the time it takes to get a character to 50, once added up, would be astounding to those of us that try not to think about it . There are plenty of players that have several 50's. Is it possible that either Statesman or any of the Dev's have played a character from 1-50 via the intended routine? How about several?

Bottome line is, can anyone really claim that the dev's or Statesman know better than serious players how an AT variation is succeeding or failing? Or at least that they know first?

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Statesman has an almost purely theoretical understanding.

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This is unfair and untrue. Statesman plays the game. He's said he plays the game, and he's proven he plays the game. When people won the "Group with Statesman" contest at a con, plenty of people posted that he knew how to play the with a group really well.

Just because the devs use math a lot doesn't mean their knowledge is purely theoretical. That's just the most useful information for them to give us, since that's factual and their individual play sessions are just anecdotes that we could have already had ourselves.

That doesn't mean our input is worthless. They play, sometimes we play differently. I disagree with the devs on this issue, but let's not belittle them. They definitely have more than theoretical knowledge, they play the game.

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You should have read my post more closely. I don't doubt he and the dev's play. But I am positive neither he nor the dev's have enough time to play as much as the diehards who make very informed observations about various aspects of the game, many of which seem to go largely disregarded for enormous lengths of time.

There are probably plenty of examples, but I'll just toss out DA scrappers and their previous endurance problems. Statesman was sure there was nothing wrong with DA in comparison to other sets. Then almost whimsically he decided to listen right before I5 came out. Very strange from what I have read because it seems there are other character sets that have equally troublesome problems that have not been addressed well. To me Archery is to Blasters what DA used to be to scrappers.

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Archery has the highest Accuracy in the game. All powers have an accuracy of 1.16. Ranged shot, the sniper attack, has an accuracy of 1.39.

So that like getting 1 free ACC DO in all Archery powers. Against a target with no defense, thats a 87% chance ToHit.

In comparison, most powers in the game have an accuracy of 1. Most sniper attacks have an accuracy of 1.2. Assault Rifle has an ACC of 1.05 (1.25 for thier sniper attack).

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I wish this were in the Dev's forum but oh well.

I don't know if the Dev's have their own opinions regarding the balancing process but my limited observations are as follows:

Dev's, dealing with what they do, have an almost purely technical understanding of AT's.

Statesman has an almost purely theoretical understanding. Having read a ton of his justifications for recent AT adjustments and subsequent responses, I think there is reasoning at work that "looks good on paper," but for whatever reason does not pan out in practice. I can't imagine that either the dev's or Statesman play enough to have as good a feel for these things as players who put thoughtful and informed posts out here.

My suggestion would be to simply roll two equal level blasters, one an archer, and the other...well whatever. Play for 20 minutes and see how they "feel" in comparison. I'm sure anyone would notice a significant discrepancy, as I have between my Archer & Fire Blaster.

Some things that are bothering me about Archery (at lvl 26)-

- If you fire at a fresh mob from a distance and miss, the mob(s) react before the arrow is even released.

- There is some serious downtime between Ranged Shot and your next attack.

- Quirky graphics bugs - sometimes your character will hold their bow off to the side when they are in fact shooting.

- Fistful of Arrows feels kinda wimpy.

- I've heard this but am too impatient to test it - supposedly Aimed Shot costs a disproportionate amount of endurance.

- The accuracy bonus. Correct me if I'm wrong, but this almost feels like a shortcoming since sacrificing an acc enhancement would leave you with less accuracy than other blasters (75% base + 75*(.33) vs. 85% base) or taking one would leave you with less dmg.

Curious - does anyone know how Archer dmg stacks up against other blasters with 6 dmg enhancements vs. 1 acc & 5 dmg? I know the latter "feels" weak compared to my fire blaster, but I've never done any number crunching.