Lothic

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I still think they can be made a bit stronger without worry of PVP exploits ( because you know that's what castle is worried about).

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Everything in this game is about balance (or at least tries to be).
If they made these pets less fragile in any way they would likely reduce the buffs they provide too.

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Either the buffs are overpowered to be practically on all the time for a back row character, or they arent overpowered to be on all the time for a front row character.

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Actually if I had to guess the "exploitable" nature Castle is talking about is the fact that these buffs are apparently team oriented. An unkillable team buff would be pretty powerful, obviously too powerful as far as the Devs are concerned. It'd almost be like a Vet based variant of a zero END cost Leadership pool power.

Once again balance is key.
My bet is if they made these pets unkillable they'd make the buffs NON-team oriented at the very least.

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I still think they can be made a bit stronger without worry of PVP exploits ( because you know that's what castle is worried about).

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Everything in this game is about balance (or at least tries to be).
If they made these pets less fragile in any way they would likely reduce the buffs they provide too.

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• March 7th through the 13th
• April 25th through May 1st
• June 13th through June 19th
• August 1st through August 7th
• Sept 26th through Oct 2nd
• November 14th through November 20th

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Isn't it amazing we know so exactly when the Rikti are coming yet we still can't defeat them once and for all?

Just joking.
Thanks for the announcement and thanks for running these mini-events again.
They add a level of 'realism' to the world which makes things more fun to play.

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48 Months: Battle Hardened
<ul type="square">[*] Battle Hardened Badge[*] Summon Pet Power: CHOICE: Light Fairy, Dark Fairy, Blue Wisp, Red Wisp, Shield Oscillator, Power Oscillator, Shield Drone, or Power Drone.[/list]
For the 4 year veteran reward, players receive the Battle Hardened badge and the choice of a Summon Pet Power.

There are 8 different pets the player can choose from: The Light Fairy, the Dark Fairy, the Blue Wisp, the Red Wisp, the Shield Oscillatory, the Power Oscillator, the Shield Drone, and the Power Drone. Each gives a specific bonus to you and your team.

The Veteran Reward will be available after the live update on March 5th, 2008.

Use this thread to discuss the new reward.

Regards,

Ex Libris

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Released with Pics on the EU boards first Why Ex? Why did they get it first?

Awesome pets btw. I am looking forward to them shortly.

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Technically speaking the Devs didn't "officially" release this on the UK boards first. It was just a coincidence that one of the people who got this Vet Award early and decided to talk about it happened to be a UK player this time.

In case you didn't know ever since the Vet Award system was established there have been a few lucky people who have been getting them even MONTHS earlier than any player should be able to. This is some kind of account date bug the Devs either can't or won't fix. What this means is that someone who gets it early typically "leaks" the info about it ASAP just like the guy on the UK board did.

This is why the Devs "decided" to openly announce that the code for this Vet Award has been "released" on the live server months early because the reality of the situation is that people have already received it via bug anyway.

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I mean damn, 10 hp -75% resistance, its a clear slap in the face. With all the AoE heavy enemies end game, whats the use of this pet. Can the pet itself be buffed?? I've also heard rumors it can only be used 3 times.

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Vet Awards, once again, have always followed the "nice-to-have" not "must have" paradigm.

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You've yet to provide how its acceptable to have it "nice to have" for some AT's, and pretty useless for others.

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Not my job to explain the rationale the Devs had for this.
Maybe you should ask them.

But if I had to speculate this pet will help everyone in different ways. Obviously the buffs are more useful to ranged squishies than melee tank-types. But then again that means it actually helps the people who need those buffs more than people who don't really need defensive help so on that level I still don't have a major problem with this. I expect my ranged Blaster will get a lot of use out of her pet, but I also expect my human-form PB will almost always be petless due to melee damage. I'll adapt and move on.

If you don't like it (which you clearly don't) tell the Devs about your displeasure.
All I can do is offer my opinion about it here.

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I mean damn, 10 hp -75% resistance, its a clear slap in the face. With all the AoE heavy enemies end game, whats the use of this pet. Can the pet itself be buffed?? I've also heard rumors it can only be used 3 times.

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Vet Awards, once again, have always followed the "nice-to-have" not "must have" paradigm.
Were this pet made unkillable or generally any better than it already is it would easily become a "must have".
It, almost by definition, is supposed to be trivial.

As to this rumor of yours it's only usable 3 times...
What a complete load of bollocks.
Someone you've talked to has been smoking something strange to have come up with that.
Like the 36 month pet this power has a recharge time but it is a permanent Vet power.

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You do realize how potentially overpowered these buffs would be if they -are- team buffs right?
Certainly possible of course, but to think that all Dev documentation is error free is naive at best.

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You got to wait 48 months for these AND these have 5-10 hp

Not that over powered and I can't wait to get mine!!

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Yep you're right these pets only have 10 HPs AND have a -75% Resistance penalty.

But do you realize how easy it is for a level 50 ranged/sniping Blaster to play for literally hours without taking ANY damage? If I can play the game keeping a squishy completely damage free it'll be relatively easy to keep a pet like this providing TEAM BUFFS alive constantly.

Certainly these pets won't be overpowered in every situation or team.
But for people who know how to work it we'll certainly exploit it to its limits.

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And what benefit do they provide a tank or scrapper? It seems kind of unfair that certain AT's get to make use of the pet while others dont.

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People in this thread have already offered creative ideas for using these pets to absorb alpha strikes. Sure that means melee types might not get the buff advantages from these pets often, but they will gain benefits of their own.

Besides the ATs which already have superior defenses don't really need -more- buffs for that anyway.

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You do realize how potentially overpowered these buffs would be if they -are- team buffs right?
Certainly possible of course, but to think that all Dev documentation is error free is naive at best.

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You got to wait 48 months for these AND these have 5-10 hp

Not that over powered and I can't wait to get mine!!

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Yep you're right these pets only have 10 HPs AND have a -75% Resistance penalty.

But do you realize how easy it is for a level 50 ranged/sniping Blaster to play for literally hours without taking ANY damage? If I can play the game keeping a squishy completely damage free it'll be relatively easy to keep a pet like this providing TEAM BUFFS alive constantly.

Certainly these pets won't be overpowered in every situation or team.
But for people who know how to work it we'll certainly exploit it to its limits.

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... wait. These things give a buff to you AND YOUR TEAM?

So what happens if a team of 8 people get together, all running their buffing pets?

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LFT, 48 Vets only!

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Cry doom much?


There really isn't going to be enough 48 month "vets" in this game to have that happen on a "realistic" and "common" level. I mean honestly...think about it. Something like that just won't happen any time soon, if ever.


Quit worrying. Teams of "8" 48 month veterans will be few and far between as well, I'm sure. It's not like everyone you see running around in this game is a vet. Hell, not even close. I'd say on average most seem to be around the 12-24 month marks at best and may never see even 36 months.


This is an awesome reward though for those of us who will attain it within the next few months.

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As I agreed a few posts ago there probably won't be many 48+ month Vets for a while at least.

But as I also said I'll be testing out the "8 Vet pet" team scenario within a few months from now regardless.
So while it might not be common it'll certainly happen fairly soon.

Will it end up being nerf-worthy? Time will tell of course...

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I'm sure this has been mentioned, but if these are non-stacking team buffs....no worries

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You might be right, but that's a pretty big IF at the moment.

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Zombie_Man made this point by implying we might start seeing chat messages like this: "LFT, 48 Vets only!"

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Doubtful, extremely doubtful.

First, there aren't going to be enough 48 month vets to make this a workable recruitment strategy; I couldn't guess how many hours it might take to get eight 48 month vets together on the lower pop servers, and even the higher pop servers won't see this for a long time to come. That's PUGs, of course.

Now if these pets revive moribund old-timer SGs for a while, then I'm all for that.

Second, these little team buffs are not going to be significant unless the team actually does have a lot of 48 month vets, and pretty much all of the pets would have to have the same buff type.

Third, melee vets will probably lose their pets right away. What seems more likely is a call for seven 48-month-vet ranged squishies all with defense fairies and one newbie tank, so the pets don't get wiped out at the start of each battle.

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I honestly believe these Vet Powers are too powerful as a team buffs regardless of who gets them. If that is in fact the Devs' intention you can bet I'm going to exploit them to their fullest potential before they get nerfed. This thing has nerf-bait written all over it.

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No nerfing is likely as long as the 48 month vet population is very low. And if the 48 month vet population gets very large over time then the pets have done their job as an incentive and they would never, ever nerf a success like that.

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What can I say? Devil's Advocacy happens to be a hobby of mine.

You make a valid point about the numbers of 48 month vets out there... right now. But while there won't be too many out there to start the numbers will always rise. There might be no need to nerf this in the near term, but a year or two from now might be a different story. We all know the Devs have an interesting habit of nerfing things which have been working "as intended" for years.

Obviously I have no way to predict the future. These pets may never be nerfed. But I do know enough people who will be 48+ month vets within the next few months to be able to put the 8 pet team scenario to the test. I expect it'll be quite overpowered... but then again that's what the Devs seem to want from this.

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I'd like to start by saying, the pets look really cool and I even have a couple characters who they'll fit conceptually really well. Plus I'll get it in July, so not that long a wait. Would be shorter if I hadn't had that hiatus.

My only concern, and it's not really a huge deal, is that this pet vastly favors ranged AT's. For my fire tank that pets going to last about 1 second. The moment I go in for the alpha strike it'll poof. Some way to plant the little bugger at the corner of the battlefield and say "Sit, Stay" would be amazingly nice. Otherwise I'll summon it on my blaster/defenders/masterminds, but probably never bother on my tanks.

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So we have on our hands a Vet Award which will likely benefit relatively defenseless ranged squishy types MORE directly than the melee ATs which are already generally better defended naturally? Somehow I don't see a problem with that.

People have already discussed ways to use these pets to absorb alpha strikes. While it's not obvious it seems that melee type ATs will actually get more use from them that way than their "intended" uses.

Seems like everyone will get some kind of benefit from them.

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Should I be upset the Devs 'wasted' effort on a AT I'll never play? I think it would be laughable for me to think that way.

Now don't get me wrong I happen to think there are problems with the way this particular Vet System was implemented. But I have no problem with having Vet Systems in MMOs in general.

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How does that example make any sense here. You have the option. I don't. Most people don't. I'm sure if COX gave us the option to purchase them it would help keep the game alive and increase the income of the COX franchise. Which in turn will keep this game alive.

Afterall veteran rewards don't mean much if this mmo gets canceled.

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Your argument is that you think it's unfair to be paying for content you are not enjoying.
Whether I have the choice to play MMs or not is immaterial.
I'm still paying for content I am not getting any benefit from and I DON'T think that's unfair.

As to whether this MMO dies tomorrow or 10 years from now its fate will not be decided by a few people pre-paying for Vet Awards. Frankly I'd question wanting to continue playing a MMO which could so easily throw away its principles just to make a quick buck.

Obviously if the Vet system in this game was ONLY a matter of money the Devs would've allowed for pre-payment years ago...

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can you make it so these things can't be summoned in pvp zones?

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Dont see why they should disallow them unless the buffs are strong enough to make a noticable impact.
And if they are then just kill the pet.
From what I've read they can be 1 shotted.

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Actually the real question isn't really whether they should be allowed in PvP zones or not.
The real question I have is whether these buffs will really be (or remain) as team buffs.

If these buffs only affect the owners of these pets then I see no reason to limit them from PvP.
But if these are team buffs then I could see a lot of cheesiness with that in PvP zones.

I'd expect to see them nerfed back to being non-team buffs before I'd see them being banned from PvP.

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ok
when can we buy it for a $10 fee
*taps foot*

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You'll have it as soon as that $10 is part of the subscription money you paid for your 48th month.

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You and Cambios need to get together and have mutant idiot hate babies. I'll pay for the hotel room.

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I'm sorry you feel that way. There is no hate coming from me. I just don't feel it's right. If ever 3 months a new set vet rewards are being introduced there is a majority of the population who will never have "all" of them.

And as people leave the game there will be less and less people who will have the latest vet rewards. Yet my subscription money is going to pay for the salaries of the developers who make them. You don't see that as unfair?

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No, I don't.

For example my subscription money helped pay for developing the Mastermind AT. I'm sure they are quite fun to play and I know many people play them but I personally don't care for them so I will likely never seriously try one. Should I be upset the Devs 'wasted' effort on a AT I'll never play? I think it would be laughable for me to think that way.

Now don't get me wrong I happen to think there are problems with the way this particular Vet System was implemented. But I have no problem with having Vet Systems in MMOs in general.

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How to use the pet as Alpha foder even if its summon range is 1 ft...

Have super speed toggled, with a stealth IO in it or in sprint. (or some other power that gives you true Invis)
Summon fast recharge pet.
Run into spawn of critters.
You are invis so pet will grab all the alpha, it dies. All the best powers in the spawn are now recharging.
repeat for every spawn because pet is on a fast recharge.

Great for PBAOE type powers like nukes, holds, stuns, knockdowns, etc.

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Like I said I'm sure someone will use it like this.
I just don't think it's a huge advantage either way.
As a 48 month Vet you've already learned how to handle aggro years ago.
This might be a neat trick if it works but no one will really -need- it.

BTW you do realize it takes like around 3 rooted seconds to cast these pets right?
That might make your idea a little less desireable but it still might work.

Just remember if enough people start successfully using it like this it WILL get nerfed.
Enjoy it while it lasts like that I guess.

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Great another great thing my money has gone to develop that only less than 1% of the population get to use.

Thanks for nothing.

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Well by your own estimation at least that roughly 1% of the population will be thanking the Devs.
There's no law that states "100% of the playerbase MUST experience 100% of the content of a MMO".
Not really sure why this would be much of a problem for anyone...

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Anyone know if these pets draw aggro to themselves or not? If so then alpha strike fodder FTW!!!

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You can't directly control them and most things will kill them in about 0.5 seconds. I'm sure someone will figure out a way to make them effective alpha strike fodder but I honestly don't see that as a big deal one way or the other.

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In reference to getting the 48 month rewards in March instead of April, if I remember right, they count from when your account was created and how much time paid/played. There's still some playing who were in the CoH beta. Even just 1 month in beta would let them get the 48 this month instead of next assuming they kept thier account active this entire time.

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With all due respect I can understand how people might believe it's meant to work that way but you are wrong about this.

When the Devs established the Vet Award system they specifically told us that whether or not you were involved in CoH beta or had an account before CoH Headstart would play NO part in determining your Vet Award status. Basically, according the Devs' own rules detailed in the Vet System FAQ, Vet Award status was supposed to start for EVERYONE the day the game went live.

What that means is that anyone who gets these Vet Awards before the actual proper anniversary date of a given award is in fact getting them via some kind of systemic bug which has been around ever since Vet Awards were introduced. Surprisingly enough this happens to more than just one or two people each time. In fact most of the time people on the forums know about an upcoming Vet Award MONTHS before they are due because there are usually enough people who get them that early to report about them. That's exactly what happened in this case for these Vet pets over a week ago now.

So we are left with the original question: If no one is SUPPOSED to be getting the 48 month Vet Award until the end of April why are the Devs making a big deal about putting the code for this in the game now? To me the reason is sadly obvious. For whatever reason the Devs either can't or won't fix the account problems which are allowing some people to get these things way, way too early. So instead of fighting it this time they decided to go ahead an officially announce/release it because they know it'll be happening anyway. Sort of a 'if you can't beat them, join them' tactic.

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Those people who think I'm simply being negative about this failed to give me credit for that.

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LOL. OK. We give you credit. You are negative!

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Thing is I'll take credit for negativity as long as you all know what I'm being negative about.

People think I'm ragging the Devs for making a mistake in documentation, like that's never happened before.
Actually what concerns me is that they seem to want these buffs to be team buffs.

I happen to think that makes these Vet Powers 'must-haves' instead of 'nice-to-haves'.
I'll certainly exploit that as much as I can, but it won't surprise me to see it nerfed back at some point.

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Pretty sure it was already confirmed the buffs affected only the owner. So the page the Devs wrote up is either wrong or they made them team buffs just in the last few days since they were discovered. Frankly I think the Dev write-up about that is wrong.

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Isn't there a 'live update' before the pets are available? They could be changing them from the way they are now to a team buff.

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Yes I already acknowledged that possibility several times here.
Those people who think I'm simply being negative about this failed to give me credit for that.

Another possibility is that these buffs were ALWAYS intended to be team buffs, but back when they were tested last week that quality was bugged and only provided a personal, non-team buff. Also for all we know these things could still technically be bugged as we speak (i.e. the Devs -want- these things to be team buffs but they are still currently broken).

I will still stand by my belief that if these things turn out to be team buffs that they will end up being either too powerful or change the way people think about teaming. Zombie_Man made this point by implying we might start seeing chat messages like this: "LFT, 48 Vets only!"

I'm going to be getting these pets on May 12th so I'm certainly not concerned about this because it's something I'm years away from. I honestly believe these Vet Powers are too powerful as a team buffs regardless of who gets them. If that is in fact the Devs' intention you can bet I'm going to exploit them to their fullest potential before they get nerfed. This thing has nerf-bait written all over it.

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With 10 hp they sound about as useful as the current pets that do nothing.

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The Devs' paradigm has always been that Vet Powers would be "nice-to-haves" not "must haves".

So while 10 HP pets with minor buffs as the 48 month Vet Award are technically better than hologram, do-nothing pets as the 36 month Vet Award they are still within the realm of "non-significant" as they should be.

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Please let these function in pvp areas. +Recovery and stuff ftw!



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So far there has been no Dev word nor player test that implied these new vet pets would -not- work in the PVP zones or arena.

Then again with only 10 HPs and -75% Resistance the chances these pets will last more than about 2 seconds of any PvP engagement will be roughly 0%. And please be my guest wasting away a few seconds trying to recast them in combat too.

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well I have one question, just how many players can get this reward or can get it in the next say 6 months,while it is nice. in a recent article , it was said that the average COx player only stays 17 months

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All that tells us is that the average player only gets up to the 15 month Vet Award.
Average is exactly that: some play more, some play less.

A 48 month Vet Award is for someone who puts 48 months into this game.
There's no rule that says everyone has to get access the 48 month Vet Award.
I'll have mine on May 12th. *shrugs*