hepheastus

but it's not more damage than a ball breath combo...

just like I said. It can't match the power of my primaries and is there fore redundant.

and it roots you.

You're just running yer yap and you have no practical experience playing the set. I have hundreds of hours. been there done that.

besides FSC is one of the few fire secondary powers I did keep. It's my finisher. If ball breath leaves anything TOO finish. it has at least frontloaded damage. unlike the rest of that crap. And all of them require you to enter melee range....AND ROOT YOURSELF. fine set for a TANKER.

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Here's one thing that strikes me odd as hell. why do the put ranged holds in certain blaster primaries?

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Maybe it's because they're -ranged- holds, and the blaster secondaries are *MELEE*?

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Score for the chrono man.

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sorry man. I'd rather take powers that make me effective in ANY team... instead of looking around for a controller just so I can use powers that I have to slot to use situationally. Call me a value shooper. I'd rather have superspeed and stealth so I can get in the first shot. Not going to waste a single slot on backloaded damage that my primary can easily match.

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Oh, in now way did I mean that /fire is good. Just that it can be useful. If you, say, always teamed with friends or had a good SG, than it would be wise to take it, or if you were elec/fire (or to some extent ice/fire) than you'd like it more.

The thing is most people that took fire/fire as a concept thing missed out on a lot of the buffs they probably would have wanted in things like energy or dev.

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no argument there. the funny thing is... I ended up with a fairly decent build becaue I AVOIDED MY SECONDARY LIKE THE PLAGUE.

I ended up With Fire Sword circle, Cosume, Ring of fire, and build up. Left room for phase-shift and 3 of the Epp's. It would have been great to have energy or devices. (they have issues too) I think it's whack that we have just two great secondaries. the rest are really quite situational.

sorry man. I'd rather take powers that make me effective in ANY team... instead of looking around for a controller just so I can use powers that I have to slot to use situationally. Call me a value shooper. I'd rather have superspeed and stealth so I can get in the first shot. Not going to waste a single slot on backloaded damage that my primary can easily match.

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Really, you would have been better off not even mentioning a minor-damage attack with a three minute timer. I was almost agreeing with you until that one.

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Okay, and the next time someone mention Short Circuit, Ball Lightning, Ice Storm, Buck Shot, ignite and Rain of Fire as "Good damaging AoE attacks," I'll make sure to promptly ignore everything else they said.

Someone else covered the other thing you mentioned.

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Here's something else to consider, didn't scrapper get Crits to be more helpful on a team? Why do they need Crits and a higher damage cap?

Also on the Risk thing, as obviously being in melee, reguardless of defences, is more dangerous then being at ranged, why don't tankers have a 500% damage cap? They're obviously in more danger then scrappers, they are required to draw the aggro and take melee beatings for the rest of the team, and not just themselves.

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Don't recall who said it, but someone said "ranged + Control = Overpowered," doesn't that make Controller pets over powered? The pets are ranged damage sources, and the Controller is controlling for the pets. So it's overpowered for Blasters to be able to mass hold and kill everything, but controllers are just fine being able to mass hold and kill everything? And don't give me that "31 levels of hell" crap, it's called a team, if we blasters are required to get in one 35+, you can suffer through the easy [censored] first 31 levels in one. I Have solo'd with controllers, before pets, when nothing is hurting you, it isn't that bad, especially if you slot your single target hold and Immob for damage.

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orochi you don't get to have goodies because you're an evil blaster. no pie for you.

Seriously... you're right. most of those blasters can't have x arguments just fly right out the window.

Thing is I don WANT massive defense. that would ruin the flavor of blasters. I want SOME defense. and SOME utility in blaster secondaries that dosen't involve kiting with electrified fists.

Here's one thing that strikes me odd as hell. why do the put ranged holds in certain blaster primaries? Man those should be ATTACKS... damage only. with some minor after effects. Tesla cage, the Freeze rays.... Heck even Voltaic sentinel belong in SECONDARIES. That NEVER made sense to me to put both a pet
AND a hold in a slow recharging powerset like elec. Freaking ridiculous. Then they just load the elec secondary up with melee attacks. .....BOGGLE. And */Ice which is elemental is of course... just shy of craptabulous.

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Do not be jealous because i know more about your secondary than you do.

You can deal that damage if you choose to, if you dont slot attacks they will do [censored] damage. Gee, wonder why...

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yeah right.

You think it... I've PLAYED IT.

I win. And what makes you think I DIDN'T SLOT THEM. you know what happens when you assume. of course when the epics came along I dropped those wortheless powers for Char, Bonfire, And Fire shield... Now THOSE are good powers. A ranged hold.... oh my god... the utillity of a long ranged hold. definitely worth 6 slots. Bonfire... A field of flame that does what burn was meant to do. keep mobs the hell away from me. I've been able to corner bosses with the thing then just spam attacks and char to my hearts content. boss killing ackshun at last. And of course one of the best anti nemesis tools ever. FireShield. So who the hell needs any of that crap anyways? The best thing about the fire secondary is that it's easily replaced by pools and APP's.

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You can do more damage with your secondary attacks, because they do more damage...

Try Fire Sword Circle on for size, 5 brawl AoE, combined with firball and firebreath and combustion is a complete 4 attack chain that deals about 18 brawls worth of damage and activates in 11 seconds.

That means you can aim, build up and then unleash all of those. That is 2.8 brawls more than inferno, the most damaging nuke, wont drain your end, and you can use cumbustion right after it to get any endo back from the survivors.

You need a tank for that, but you can do it

Yea, fire does not have as much utility as /elec, /ice, /dev, /energy. But it has more damage, a whole hell of a lot more damage.

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you my friend are freaking wrong. that assumption may be true of other sets... but there is nothing in the fire secondary that matches the sheer power of a built up aimed fire breath+fire balll combo.

It's obvious to me that you're no fire fire blaster. I am. In fact fire/fire/fire and fire sword and fire sword circle just don't do that kind of damage. try this argument elsewhere. And burn is no melee attack. neither is combustion, hot feet or the other DoT crud littering the fire secondary. They are weak back loaded powers best fitted to a tanker.

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I'd like to point out two things...

1. Notice how fire was the shortest?

2. Come on about burn. It's near worthless without taunt (or a hold and infinite patience)

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1. Notice how fire has the higest damage AoE attacks?

2. Burn can be used to make enemies stay away from melee if you need to, as they run from it, that was the point of listing it.

Fire is not as good at utility as the rest, i thought i mentioned that, but it is much better in damage. Ice and Elec are not however, energy and devices, and the complaint is that anything other than energy and decives is useless, or just plain not as good, when that assertion is wrong, they are good for different things.

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bullllllll shizzzzzzittttttteeeee.

I've used EVERY power in the fire secondary. that includes burn. it dosen't last long enough to provide any real protection. you have to ROOT yourself to use it. I'd rather be bobbing and weaving... kiting and jumping around like a mad man while lobbing attacks like a paperboy on speed lobbing the daily newspaper. I have had Nemesis walk right up to a burn patch and spear the hell out of me. leaving me dazed well after the fire dies down... then they just gun you down like the idiot you are. No thanks... no more for me sir. And the fact is you can't even slot the damn thing for fear.

burn only has a few applcations.... but honestly I can do way more damage with my PRIMARY attacks. Burn.... is a waste.

A friggin Men.

dosen't matter. first thing this guy does when he enters the discussion is go after me. like i been sitting here screaming for scrapper level defenses. The only Thing I've asked for is a little bit of FAIRNESS. In either case it seems that most of my rage was warranted since statesman thinks that we're safer than scrappers for christs sakes. Far as I'm concerned all bets are out the damn window. Their much vaunted data mining should have put lie to that frame of mind. Unless that datamining is so much crap like I always thought it was.

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You know, thats so obvious it's brilliant! Controllers of our level can't be bother, but those 16s brawling for hour after hour in Steel Canyon would sure love a helpful friend. And they'll be a huge help.

Be a Blaster. Adopt a controller. Hell, maybe after you've helped him get to 32, he'll even let you still hang out with him.

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Shh, not so Loud... One of the Controllers or Tankers I already adopted might hear ya. Even my DA picks up Empaths and Kinetics controllers cuz I never have enough Endurance on my own to Control "Invicible" spawns and attack them at the same time ...I'm even working on adopting a High-Level blapper to help my DA too but he still plays too much WoW right now ...why a Blapper? Oddly enough, Total Focus does just enough damage and Disorient to make up for the Damage and Stunning I'd usually be doing on my own if I had enough Endurance to attack them myself, LoL.

[/ QUOTE ]I hope that was a long post ILR... because I'm ignoring you.

rigggggght....

gambit is a blaster.

like i said. the comics don't fit.

in comics there are no archetypes... there are only heroes.

jesus christ... what personal attack?

and by the way I didn't bring up comicbook superheroes. I never do. not here. the game just dosen't play that way. I found that out the hard way with my "concept" fire/fire blaster. who was good to the last flop. Haven't seen too many ice rock throwing pom pom girls in comic books.

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if you are bored, reply to my counterpoints(2-3 of my posts ago)

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and you are?

Dude I have to maintain 50 servers alone.... I can't even remember what my wife said 2-3 days ago, let along your counterpoints. And honestly man... being the loud mouthed self righteous opinonated type I am.... do you REALLY think I even read them?

hahahahahahaha. I don't know who's more full of themselves. me or you.

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sure they have.... and batman and wolverine are in the backdrop laughing they're [censored] off.



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And everybody knows that the X-Men are constantly going, "We don't need Cyclops, Wolverine does just as much damage. And we don't need to hand hold Wolverine all the time. Cyclops, what a wuss... He can't fire a shot without being faceplanted. Even Jean can't protect him. And what's with him always knocking Colossus's foes away from him?"

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dude... why are you even bringing this crap up. you know and I know that comic book blasters don't translate in coh.

matter of fact most heroes don't translate. what would the bat be? super reflexes, brawling martial artists, with devices? cut the crap. blasters exsist ..... to blast. they use melee attacks about as often as wolverine uses an assault rifle. Hell I haven't seen the Iceman use a melee attack since that ridiculous club he had when he looked like frosty the snowman.

If you just gotta go on fine... I'm bored.

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Blasters are supposed to shine in a team. That means two things. #1 they shouldn't be able to reach their full potential without a team and #2 when on a team, they should be able to.

Sadly, #2 is not true, but that's what needs to be fixed. You seem to want to change #1.

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Sadly is Right! WAY too many posters in this Thread are just crying "GodMode me !!!" like it's the only way they think they can be Balanced. ..Especially Heph who's back for his usual song and dance on the subject. The actual number of people talking specifically about Shining in Team Play can be counted on one hand. It doesn't look like the Devs will be getting much useable unfiltered information from this thread

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oh bull [censored] you [censored] moron. I never asked for godmode. you're just flame baiting. take it elsewhere you dumb [censored]. Failing that show me ONE instance in ANY THREAD where I asked for godmode. or even scrapper level defense.

freaking chump.

I'll support states when he puts down that crack pipe. because the [censored] he's smoking has got him seriously [censored] up.

sure they have.... and batman and wolverine are in the backdrop laughing they're [censored] off.

So I'm right. blasters are comedic relief. the [censored] Clowns of CoH.

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Our role is no longer defined.

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Sure it is. "Debt Sponge" is a role. So is "Concrete Kisser." I'll admit that neither is a particularly attractive option, and they're not a whole lot of fun...but that's the role Blasters currently fill. Tankers shrug off hits that would level a building; Scrappers move through crowds of enemies like the avatar of a death god; Controllers can stop a rampaging elephant in it's tracks without breaking a sweat; Defenders can turn the most powerful blow into a love-tap, or heal critical wounds with a thought; Blasters die, anytime, anywhere, for any reason.

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blasters exsist to take the one shot kill that would have killed a more valuable squishy.

losing disciplines will crush blasters.

"if you use ranged attacks the mobs will use ranged attacks"

That's right buckethead. they'll blast you off your feet with rikti enerigy cannons then cut you in half with a couple sword strikes.

but you didn't know that didja? don't see that down in the data mines.

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I do not choose to ignore it. it's simply laughable.

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No, it requires you to have the initiave. Blaster defences are based on being first(which is why i suggested the activation time decrease, 2 posts before this one), and then using the effects to your best benefit.

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save it for someone who hasen't played to damn near to 50 with 3 archetypes.

For the most part those secondaries are garbage. It's like playing half a freaking archetype. They're not even real secondaries. And they are definitely not equal. even the BEST of them are sorely lacking. Energy is too full of fisticuffs and devices lacks the ommph of build up. them mines are as buggy as a damned roach motel too.

I do not choose to ignore it. it's simply laughable.

First... Starfire is no blaster. she's a ranged scrapper. She has superhuman strenght, and can take a lot of damage.

Next... you rarely EVER see cyclops use a melee attacks. his blasts can penetrate steel, pulverize mountain tops, and crush whole buildings. he has control of his power down to the most minute level. A richocheting blast that can clock enemies from any angle... and he CONTROLS his knockback.

And yeah.... green arrow held his own for about 20 seconds... then that old man made a mockery of him. he could have easily have put him to waste in 3 or 4 shots. hell the black canary could have cleaned his longjohns in the same amount of time.

Blasters in comics "blast" that's all they have to do... hell if you were havock would you bother with an uppercut? super heated cosmic plasma...helllllooooooooo?

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I honestly don't know why it isn't:

Controller: Control/Buff
Defender: Buff/Ranged
Blaster: Ranged/Control

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Because ranged/control is flipping overpowered.

At the moment its ranged/utility, with some sets being utilized better.

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ranged utility?
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA...."wheeze" HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA....

What utility? two sets have it. the rest are crud.