TheAdlerian

Boys,
I discussed the financial aspects of PLing long ago and how it can affect the game company. In the way I described it can hurt the company and the game.

I don't feel much of an impact from crime as most of the services that go to prevent it are on a budget. Also, being gay is considered immoral rather than unethical. Morality tends to be more in the religious realm and ethics to be in the secular. So, two gay people having sex does not both me but it might both a religious person because its against the rules.

NinjaPirate,
Thanks for that! I'm not well-versed with the system here and did not knowthat you could do that. I knew that that had to be the case!

Miir,
we said many times that its the afk Plers that we are opposed to the most. What more is there to say. Time to think it over now that Statesman weighed in.

Techno,
any player should be able to do what they wish as long as it doesn't negatively affect another player in some form.

This is not true because the designers have rules against cheating. A player can't do what they want in the game. The designers say they will take action against cheaters.
So, I think we have a point that does not stray far from the designers ideas.

Techno

I like your post. I don't know the age of the average person on the boards but sometimes kids or young adults have trouble understanding the notion of fair play and may never have been exposed to ethics and a system of beliefs. I have gone over this many times.
Frankly, I am a psychologist, and the arguments here remind me of the prison inmates that I used to work with. They would constantly use they "how does my behavior affect you" line of reasoning. How did my stealing a car affect you! One does not have to be affected directly by a behavior to not like it. And once again the designers do mention that they do not want people to gain an unfair playing advantage. What more is there to say. The problem is that people that are unethical are either so unethical that they don't know it, or they are rationalizing.
Frankly, at this point I would almost pay to have one of the designers give their opinion.

But the fact of the matter is that it is not possible, given the restraints of the game engine, to accurately quantify someones contribution to a team.

The designers have done this in many ways. A players gets a warning if their sk is too far away. You do not get points if you are in a different zone, etc.
Also, the designers warn you against using bugs, so that implies that they desire fair leveling. So, the constant argument about PLing not affecting me is not in keeping with the designers wishes. They want equal game play for all.
I don't care that other games are full of cheaters. I'm not playing them.
Icarus it seem like you think that you are very deft with the argeuments but frankly you do not address the strange afk leveling ability, and you can't counter NinjaPirate's knowledge of design. Finally, all of the vague stuff about "what is cheating" is silly. Games have rules. It just some happens that computer games have many different factors and are dynamic, so they make cheating easier and sometimes harder to define. I think that being at the mall and Paragon city at the same time makes the issue pretty clear.

V,
The idea of ethics is very important to me. It has alot to do with my job in the medical field.
Ethics is the discipline of dealing with what is good and bad and ones moral obligation and duty. (Websters)
A person does not have to have a deep reason to follow through on the confrontation of unethical behavior. It's a duty.
You and many others attempt to question my motives. I'm a person that does not like cheating and unethical behavior here or anywhere. In life I am a trustworthy person and it is reflected here to. Here we have a game. The game has rules Pling seems to violate some of those rules. Maybe I'm wrong but I can see how Pling isn't an exploit.
Also, why don't you show some guts and tell me how it is that a person could go shopping and still play the game. Put yourself out there brother and answer.

Finally, this is the first post that I have ever made on any kind of board like this. Flamebaiting is not a term that I even know. It sounds like some form of prostitution. As I said before, I was simply enjoying a great game and noticed what I thought was a weird feature. Its a value system thing for me. Not everyone has one so I understand.

Guys its cheating.
NinjaPirate knows what he's talking about. Its clear that the guy has a professional attitude and knowledge base.

To Icarus and the bunch please tell me what is cheating? What more would one have to do? Being afk and still collecting points in a game. If a person is Pling at the station it would be possible for them to be at the supermarket shopping. How is this playing a game?
Its cheating.

Well after all of this I would love to hear what the designers have to say! You can tell by the amount of posts that this topic is of interest to many people.
I'm also amazed at the people that dismiss cheating so evenly. If Pling isn't cheating then it is the most unusual game feature that I have ever seen.
I have to thank all of the great people that supported the topic today--even the cheaters! Thanks for coming out guys!

Well after all of this I would love to here what the designers have to say! You can tell by the amount of posts that this topic is of interest to many people.
I'm also amazed at the people that dismiss cheating so evenly. If Pling isn't cheating then it is the most unusual game feature that I have ever seen.
I have to thank all of the great people that supported the topic today--even the cheaters! Thanks for coming out guys!

Firenuke, using your logic, which is similiar to countless other, there could be any amount of cheats. The game could be like a play station game where you enter codes. How would this affect anyone's game but yours. Clearly, the designers did not create a cheat function, so there you go.
Additionally, I enjoy playing with a wide variety of people. Playing with is the main idea.

You never addressed my suggestion to play on your friend's level. I have done that many time to help people through a mission, so what's different about you?

Buying doughnuts is not a game and there are no rules to the activity.

Firenuke I guess that the developers did not include a list of cheats in their manual. Their mistake I guess.

I'm glad that you don't mind helping people cheat Firenuke. What would be better is to go on their missions and kill the hard ones while getting no ex. That would help your friends develop their skills and would really be a benefit to them. That would be real help. Other times you could do your own thing. Later you would have skilled friends that would know how to help. Now that would be a bond.
Also it is not Nazi-like to want to have a game played by the rules. Did you watch the olympics?

Hey Revolver!

Frankly, I might have been pushing it a bit but really no more that many were pushing it with the rationalizations. I have been quite honest about how I felt. Almost no one has been able to admit that it is a cheat, but many people imply that they know it is, but don’t care. Also, at least two people have invented game encounters with me that did not happen, and these kind of comments have caused me to react by saying the unpleasant truth.

Folks the strange thing is that I did not talk to anyone last night about Pling! I was fighting with a team.
Is this subject causing delusions? What server do you think I'm on?

As I said this game is a simulation and so analogies to the real world seem fine to me.
Strange logic here. Its as if this game is perfect somehow like it could have a fault. PLing is a fault. I don't care what your situation is a character should not be able to stand at the station and earn points it makes no sense in the simulated world of COH.

My point was well made by Feiwrong. Many of you guys are both cheaters and liars. Fei is willing to try to win his point by lying. So he is both a cheater and a liar.
I got annoyed by seeing players level at the station after spending weeks trying to level, which feels good, and supporting my fellow players. My anger is of an innocent nature. Plus I would not want to level that way because I would miss much of the story.
I first learned of Pling after a guy solicited me to sk him and stand in the station while he leveled a character that he was going to sell to someone. I didn't even know what this was. That was two weeks ago and since then my opinion formed and now I believe that is cheating.

Erratic there is nothing wrong with using sound arguments. However, I have to say that I simply don't like cheating and honestly do not feel envy. Sorry if I insulted you but this has been going on all day.

Interesting!
I checked EBay out and there is a level 50 Blaster going for $275! So, if anyone would like to cheat in this way please check it out. After you spend the money you can I guess do nothing and quit. What fun.

Haha! Fei--wrong!
That was great Fei! Slander!

Kazarak, NinjaPirate, Thanks for the support. However, we are now seeing the lying/denial side of the cheaters. This could go on forever and I hope that it does because maybe the designers will see the post and think about it.

To those out there if you did cheat that’s OK, because what can you do about it now. I’m more concerned about stopping it than making people feel badly about what they did in the past. Let’s look toward the future.

Erratic you implied that my post was sinful. So, you got some back momma!

Are you called Erratic because of your thought process? All of the thingngs that you mentioned are part of the game. If standing around collecting points was part of the game then there would probablly be a button to press. Also, if a person soloed their way to 50 I would think that they were cool. Its interesting to learn how different people play the game. I love that. However, I don't think the way that cheaters play the game is interesting.
Also, Sloth is a sin too so work on your lazy thought process.

Because cheater tend to rationalize. I would respect the cheater that openly enjoys his cheating way. In a sense that would be a kind of honorable cheater much like the devil.

Icarus, along with your feelings of humanity you should realize that some people might just be having a bad day. Meanwhile a Pled person would be just plain bad on multiple levels.

Miir that may do it because sks have the need for proximity. Perhaps this from of liar type cheating will no longer be an option for liar cheater types of people that are inclined to lie and then cheat. Wait, or is it cheat and then lie.
Right first you have to cheat, then you have to lie about the quality of your character. So, its officially cheating liars.

I'm getting silly.

Miir

I don't know for sure but I assume that you have to observe someone PLing. Now, how could the developers know?

Frankly, I have a variety of friends in their 40s that could Pl me. I was going to to ask but when I thought about it and saw people leveling at the train station it made me angry. It is a cheat. I like to be an ethical person that is proud of what he does. That's it.