DustRaven

Okay, two things here. One: Please don't ever yell using my voice. It seriously creeps me out. If you want to yell (you know, post thing is a large, bold face type), use your own words.

Two: You have most definitely failed. I disagree with you, dude and always have. My arguments have been in favor of the current system the entire time. If you can't tell the difference between an argument in favor or opposed to your own, you might want to reconsider your own position on this. My own suspicion is that you just want something you lack the means to have and instead of doing the work necessary to get it you think you can complain your way to it. That kind of thinking may get you a free meal at Denny's once in awhile but it's not going to work here.

Sorry if I was unclear. It seems you do get the idea, but for whatever reason think things don't age or lose value over time, or at the very least thing for some reason these concepts don't apply to game content in a virtual wold, or maybe just to the T9 VIP costume pieces in general. At the very least, I can be certain we differ in opinion on the value of such things. Let's leave it at that.

How they'll handle it will be almost exactly as I have predicted. My secret here is that there have already been hints as such on the boards, include a statement or two on the subject when the T9VIP rewards were introduced (I'd have to look up the exact posts to quote them, I will if you like but at the moment I'll assume the references to such already in this thread will suffice). It's possible they'll flip and do something else, but based on how successful the current micro-transactions are I doubt adding content they created a year or more ago (from the POV of a year or so from now) will be anything but good for the company. The players who "worked so hard/paid so much" to get access first can still feel special for having done so, and if it doesn't they can still try and feel special by picking up whatever IS at the T9 that only T9 VIPs can get. And if they still can't feel special, then there is no help for them.

Shuuuuh! Don't talk about that! They'll hear...

And the more they build up "behind the wall" the more impossible it is for new players to EVER GET THEM!!! Do you seriously want to deny some players access to things just because they are new players? How many things do you need to build up behind that wall before there's just so much a new player takes one look and give up hope of bothering? No one wants to start out by paying hundred of dollars to gain access to what ends up costs another hundreds of dollars.

No. I said "out of style" not out of style. Huge difference there. In case you still got catch the difference, I mean to say then by the time Celestial Armor comes around again, the majority of people who wanted it bad enough to pay out the nose to get access to it will have done so the last time, and only those who by chance are now at T9 AND actually want it will get it. That's not a large enough incentive for Paragon Studios to even bring it back as a T9 item, unless it's soon.

And from the point of view of those veteran T9ers, what will they do when their options are Celestial Armor and Fire & Ice... again? Nothing. They already bought those. Something ELSE needs to be there... but they still can make some money on the old "out of style" (there it is again) sets by offering them to the general public. Why the general public instead of keeping them gated behind VIP? Because more people will by them. Sure, gating them behind a subscription fee will be incentive enough for some to buy that subscription (for a month) just to then also buy the costume bits, but how many more will buy the costume bits if everyone can? Almost certainly enough to make up for any lost revenue from the premium players who didn't sub that one month.

No they aren't. Not even enough to compare for discussion sake. They are, in fact, the exact opposite of gated incentives.

So, you agree with me that, like the rereleases from the Disney archives, when the rerelase the VIP reward items, they should be released to the general public of the game, and not be held in reserve for VIP only access?

I don't follow the fashion industry, but I see your point. A more geeky comparison would be to special release cards in collector card sets, such as rare foil cards. They aren't intended for everyone, but those who really want them will always buy box after box of common card to get them.

I honestly don't see either of these as a fair comparison, as in these examples, the "VIP" items in question are meant to be owned and displayed but not used. The VIP costume pieces are meant to be used, worn by a character during play. To use your fashion analogy, the common costume pieces available to everyone are like Wrangler jeans, and the VIP stuff is more like Abercrombie & Fitch. The only difference is that for a short time, the high end stuff is only available to those who've dumped enough money into the game (either all at once, or over a significant period of time). Once new stuff is out, the old VIP fashion is "out of style" and dumped into an outlet store to be sold at a discount to the general public.

I applaud you, sir.

It's only contrary to their own best interests if they stop development of new VIP tier 9 costumery. In fact, if they do continue development (which it certainly seems they will), then they must at some point release some of the older items to the open market or there will simply be too much for any one player to afford unless that player has been around since launch or has effectively unlimited financial resources to play a game, and I doubt Paragon Studios wishes to alienate that much of their player base.

Oh, no. I don't want them. I have them. I want other people to have them, provided they've invested in the game as much as I have, or are willing to wait until I've danced around in my exclusive costume pieces for a year or so and have tired of them and picked up whatever new costume pieces are available to me.

Hold it with the sheers there!

Time = Money. Therefore, waiting = money.

I'm talking about a difference in spending a LOT of money now, vs spending a little bit of money later. And before THIS gets confused for some other argument, I'm comparing the difference between spending a lot of money on points (or having already spent a lot of money on subscription time) and receiving access to special costume pieces as a reward for handing over so much money, vs making those same costume pieces available to everyone else a year or more later for just some points (bypassing the need to have already spent hundreds of $ before unlocking access to them). The basis of this being by that time there will be more and newer rewards for those who have spend hundreds of $, and such players can still feel special for having had the other stuff first, if they had already spent that hundreds of $ way back when they were exclusively available to to such players.

Is this thread seriously become so off course it's that difficult to keep track of anyone's point of view?

I think maybe you just want better carrots. A costume set with some glowy bits is a strange bit of incentive in that some people don't really care, but others are willing to rage quit their accounts if they can't have it now. My own opinion is there should be more than just costume pieces as their spent-hundreds-of-dollars-on-top-of-subscribing reward option. But discussion is probably best left for a different thread.

I think you're missing the "wait a year or more" aspect here. You know the saying... good things some to those who wait, while those who put some effort into it can have those things right now.

And they would have fulfilled that purpose while available exclusively to T9 VIPs. A year later the game will have some other carrot to entice players to upgrade to VIP. We don't need a huge basket of carrots.

I think you've completely missed something here. I'm not saying VIP rewards should be made available in the store to everybody from when that reward is first introduced. I'm saying after some amount of time (say a year) items which were exclusively available to veteran/$$$ VIPs such items could be made available to everyone via the store using Paragon Points rather than reward tokens. Because they'd be available via points instead of token, they'd HAVE to be made available to everyone, just like EVERYTHING in the store.

You should only be VIP to receive a few items first, not ever.

Don't the VIPs who select this rewards still have access to them if they drop back to premium? If so, then if available for purchase as points they should be available to everyone, not just VIPs. You know, just like everything that costs points.

That's pretty much what I'm expecting to happen. You know, after they've been in the T9VIP rotation for about a year or so. So all of us who've paid enough to get them before other people who didn't pay enough so can't get them have paid enough and got them, then everyone who didn't pay enough can pay a little and get them, and those who paid enough and didn't can then also get them for a little.

Seems fair to me.

Excellent idea. Already implemented in an ever better way. All the T9VIP rewards will (eventually/potentially) be available directly via the market using points rather than tokens.

I have no real proof of this, but it was mentioned as possibilities on the threads like this one that ran rampant when f2p launched and we got T9VIP rewards first came into view. I have no idea when anything like this will come to be, but I'm expecting it.

I think you're confusing me with someone else. My idea was to keep things as they are. The only difference of opinion I think I have with you is why.

Perhaps, but I think your math is wrong, or at least inapplicable. From they way I see it, everybody's paid the exact amount to pick up any of the T9VIP items. A few, myself included, receive a bit of discount for occasionally receiving free subscription time (multiple month bonus or discount, buddy discount and more recently bonus points), but such discounts are really negligible. The real price cut is turning all that time we all paid in point and/or subscription time into a simple $30 ($15 for one month's sub, plus another $15 for some points or another month of sub and a second reward token).

To some, it would seem this would include yourself, this much of a price drop is just horribly wrong. To others, such as myself, this is just a price drop. Paid for the game 8 years ago? it cost X. Pay for the game now? still costs X but now includes the option to Celestial Armor outta the box. So based on your argument, it is just a price drop, and only someone who feels things should never get less expensive over time would be opposed to it.

I agree. The current way works. Let's not change what's broken and what's apparently best for the company that keeps bringing us everything that's cool in Coh, not just the spiffy costumes.

While I'm also against the idea of making these available outside the current tiers, these reasons are among the most invalid arguments against it. You paid something and got it first. Finding out someone else paid something less than you did you get it much later than you did isn't a betrayal. It's a price drop and nothing more.

I just gotta say, I love your signature comment, and how ironically applicable it is. Kudos to you, sir.

I'd have to reread the applicable bits of it to be sure, but I believe the TOS allows for use/replica/homage/derivative of IP specific to the CoX franchise within the CoX game. If not then the devs and moderators have seriously overlooked my Longbow based SG.

I'm kinda hoping they won't come up or sale. All in all the quality of these items are on par with party favors you'd find in the trash after a birthday party. They're fun when you have them in hand, but not as fun as anything worth paying money for.

Well.... Rularuu um, I guess... also drank from the Well Furies? Or maybe the Well is also known by the lesser known name of "Rularuu's Bathtub".

I'm naming mine Smaltheem.

Eh... I signed up for the newsletter, so knew about this back in Octover/November-ish. I also check the forums a few times a week. Then again, I'm also they guy who is mostly responsible for updating my SG's MotD so I guess not everybody does that.