Aura_Familia

Errr depends if you mean modern mmos or the original ones. For most games you need to preform the raid then go into it.

A public quest in modern mmos, anyone who just walks by can often join in.

That's a HUGE difference.

Unless it's changed recently for raids in the 800 lb gorilla, once a raid starts NO ONE else can join, for a public quest, anyone at anytime can join. And your individual participation is rewarded.

I lol'd.

To get back on topic, I'm glad that once again this dev/community team proves it's better than the rest in taking feedback.

Even when that feedback is as sweet as bucket of lemons.

Looking forward to Freedom, issues 22-infinity, etc.

Yep, but it doesn't have to be raids.

Again see Warhammer or even this game's direct competition: Public Quests.

Warmhammer has something called public quests. They are NOT raids in the traditional sense.

MMORP does not mean raids. No matter how much the 800 lb gorilla wants us to thinks so.

And news flash, casue folks missed when another poster mentioned it before, but the king of raiding endgame and mmos just recently reduced the number of folks required to raid.

If I'm not mistaken you can do such content in teams of 5-8 now.

So no raid does not have to mean 16 or more players. And endgame content does not have to mean bigger than 8.

Yes, but again in no way shape or form had to be linked to being End Game content. How do I know, two words:

Mothership Raid.

TFs, Advanced Crafting, pvp, a BETTER user generated content system, a system surround player housing that everyone can actually get into... you know things this game, and others have been doing since mmos came into existence?

And hence my MAJOR issue with use the Praetorians as the main end game group.

Errr, no.

People asking for endgame content have may or may not been asking for raids.

The only thing we can say 100% they asked for was Endgame content.

That does not in any way shape or form have to be raids.

To play devil's advocate: Someone made up the point earlier that it would be easier to have participants if each trial only required the standard 8 players.

Arguably it MIGHT be easier to design solo content if the current trials didn't require larger numbers of players. Thus if some folks decide to solo, you'd still have plenty for the group content.

Afterall, nearly every ARC in game can be solo;d, but there are tfs being run on every server 24/7.

EDIT: With that said the devs have said they are looking into Incarnate mode for the existing tfs later on. Sooooo . . . there ya go.

I will admit I've stated this before also.

I'd have no issue with an EMP every 7 days. That sounds fair.

Great post and thanks for confirming that we weren't crazy like SOME other posters wanted us to believe.

And as for the bolded. Anyone who actually believed the solo path would be faster was being unrealistic.

Thanks again! And looking forward to issue 21's release!

Really? This makes the choice even easier for me. lol

4x merit rewards here I come.

I think you know what I think of the costumes locked behind the Incarnate system.

I MIGHT have a different opinion if we were talking about getting multiple astrals.

We're talking about ONE.

We'll have to agree to disagree.

I'll bet money now that the rewards just might be increased when the actual arcs are in BETA.

Or I can go for the 4x merits rewards and run a shard tf or sister psyche next.

For my toons that already have tier 3s yeah, I know which I'm going for.

And after 2 days you can only do that if you go and run something that gives you 10 more threads . . . which isn't going to be a signature story arc cause . .. it can't be.

YMMV.

Obviously there are differing on opinions on what is or isn't useful.

EDIT: And none of your comments address the ONE ASTRAL, which is FOUR threads. Using merits is faster to get recipes than it is for astrals. Reward merits drop in MANY more places than Astrals. I would NEVER use Astrals to get something that is stupendoulsy easy to get using Reward Merits or Alignment merits.

The most I've gotten running regular content is 3 shards an hour. Even with the drop rate increase. Shards are sure as hell not something I rely on for anything but the Alpha slot.

Which in turn makes being able to be killed in the hospital (an old possiblity in the old way siren's call was idiotically first designed, why this is now in pve I have no freaking clue) even worse, and yet another reason folks avoid Keyes like the plague.

It takes 20 to craft anything useful. 10 threads are useless. FOUR from an Astral, which we were originally talking about despite your silly change of subject, is even WORSE.

The 4x merits is still a better.

First off it's ONE ASTRAL (4 threads), not 4 astrals. (correcting the poster you quoted). And yes very much so pathethic.

Especially when you can get 40 threads from the WST. Which depending on the tf of the week may or may not be easier than these signature storyarcs. Which is on top of current incarnate rewards.

Some of those WST will probably faster (with folks having perfected speed runs for nearly every tf in game) than running these signature story arcs.

In addition there is a 4x Reward Merits reward.

So again, yes very much so pathethic.

First congrats.

Second, people aren't complaining about the difficulty of the trial.

Read the thread.

For the bolded part: Then you haven't been paying attention to the last 2 years with what's going on with the AE. We don't need to give more reasons for there to be less overall participants in the Incarnate system.

With there slowly being more and more options to get threads, we don't need to give folks reasons to do less trials. And YES folks will do the next harder trials, as after the Underground trial I'm 99.99% certain that the next slots won't be able to be unlocked with anything from the first 5. I can easily see them creating a new currency that you can only get from the new trials beyond the Underground trial, which can only be used to unlock the next two or three slots. Anyone who thinks they'll be able to run BAF/LAM or even Keyes/Underground all the way to Omega slot is naive.

Your suggestion makes no sense.

EDIT: 2 EMP merits makes no sense and will do bubkiss to get folks to run Keyes more when a BETTER (in every sense of the word) trial named the Underground Trial will be launched at the SAME FREAKING TIME. As Uber stated above a BETTER way to get folks to run Keyes more is to up the random roll number to 2 at the end of it. A 2nd chance at a VERY RARE or RARE, OR a SECOND RARE or VERY RARE if your first roll was either, will get more folks to run Keyes.

Funny when I actually suggested such a thing some folks in some parts of these forums looked at me like I was insane.

I'd honestly like to know what the difference is between what you posted above and simply WAITING if it were released in issue 21, till you had the appropriate amount of points.

Maybe it's my age showing, but I never got the whole "gotta have it now" thing that folks have nowadays with DLC or extra content that needs to be paid for.

Uhhh yes, they pretty much did. Or they wouldn't investigate/look into something they never had any intention of doing.

Our devs aren't dumb or words lawyers. Unlike some people who post inanity that I know.




EDIT: And I notice you didn't address anything else I posted. Sooooo done discussing anything serious with you.

Excuse me, a VIABLE small teams path.

And actually if these arcs can be run solo (I assume they can just like every other STORY ARC in the freaking game can) then YES, THIS IS a solo-ish path.

One EMP every 7 days. THAT would have been cool and could be used to actually CRAFT SOMETHING. 4 or ten threads? No.

To put this in perspective, I can run the weekly WST and get MORE threads than running my team through a signature story arc.

I'd choose the 4x merits rewards every time. At least with that the next TF I run I can rack up merits to be able to buy ALIGNMENT MERITS. More chance at big rolls in Fort Trident, that can be used to make inf, to IO out a character.

Sorry GG, but those rewards an unimpressive. (Minus the merits reward).

EDIT: With that said nothing is stopping them from upping the rewards during the actual beta for this. So moving into a wait and see mode. Ohmmmm, Ohhmmm, Ohmmmm.

What the heck were you expecting this close to the release of issue 21?

As others said before PAX, this close to release I didn't expect anything significant to be announced. After Issue 21 releases? Sure.

I lol'd cause it's lolworthy.

I pray that's not the solo path they meant we were getting.